PlaneShift
Gameplay => General Discussion => Topic started by: drJack on April 22, 2012, 11:23:15 am
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Hey all.
This is drJack from the Setting Team asking for a feedback.
The project
We’re working on a project called Monster Hunt.
The goal is simple and it’s to check the position of the monsters in every part of Yliakum (Planeshift whole implemented world), to decide if the monsters have any motivation to be there.
Two main examples:
A) Monsters near cities (or other type of settlement) could be incongruent. They raise many questions such as: why are they in that position? Why the guard did not slash them away? Why they continue to return there (spawn)?
B) Difficult monsters in a newbye area. It’s more a gameplay issue than a storyline issue, but we’re checking this too, to balance the game challenges.
The feedback
If you think that a monster should not be in a specific area I’d like to know:
1) The position of the monster (game coordinates are better, but also simple indications can be useful).
2) Is the monster aggressive and attack players in a location where it should be peaceful?
3*) Why you think that the monster should not be there.
* The second information is optional.
The solution
We’ll try to delete or to move the monster. In some specific cases we’ll check if we could grant any motivation for the monster’s presence in the location.
Thanks all.
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In dynamic environment monsters can move around and appear in "unexpected places" (some scenarios like monsters escaping the arena come to mind). Nothing really unnatural about it (besides cases when environment settings dictate otherwise, like tlokes going underwater in the lake and etc.).
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Animals not living in an area which would be suitable for their physiology was always a point of criticizm from my side, but nobody was there to listen to it...
I remember times when the new maps were introduced. One prominent example was bdroad2: Opposite the Explorer Outpost is a path up into the hills which looks very dry. Dry and sandy areas are usually a place for insects. Not for big fleshy animals which need a lot of food (either flora or fauna) and water. Tefusang seem to be misplaced there.
Another interesting place is bdouter, there are huge hills with textures which look like little holes leading inside. Ever seen a termite mound? So I would expect (flying?) insects there.
By the way, herbs are not always placed well either, e.g. the "Gobble Fangs" herb field is placed on dark rock - how shall they grow there?
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Another important feedback on monsters is also if the monsters should be aggressive or not at certain locations. If you want you can add this to your suggestions.
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@ Gilrond
We're working on arena too. Thanks for the feedback, Gilrond.
@ LigH
Ok.
broad 2 -> I'll check for Tefusang.
bdouter -> option to add flying insects.
We're working on herbs too. Thanks for the feedback, LigH.
* ------------ I've edited the initial message adding a new type of feedback:
"2) Is the monster aggressive and attack players in a location where it should be peaceful?"
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Nice and much needed project especially for easing new players life from the start ;)
Trepor packs:
Trepors pack in bdroad1 (next to the forest leading to hydlaa) and ojaroad1 (nexto to the road leading to Oja) seems fine to me (speaking about locations) but I suggest not to make them aggressive unless the tribe is attacked (it would cause a lot of trouble to newbie players mining or passing by).
Ulbernaut in ojaroad1 (next to a well known excavation site) should not be there OR they should be quite peaceful or newbie would have too much of a trouble.
Sewers: the sewers entrance next to winch door is the main location where new players have their first experiences fighting monsters so it should be carefully examined. I suggest pushing wrath rats, thunder clackers and maybe Rogue (not easy for untrained char) in the lower levels. Also NPCs there should not be aggressive from the start.
Thanks
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From a naive point of view, undead creatures, such as grendol, toxic grendol, wrath rat and fayed velnishi should be placed mainly in the death realm. Dungeons and burrial wells may be suitable locations, but the placing of such creatures would be more credible if there was a source of magic involved (e.g. summoned to guard an NPC). Mixed packs of regular and fayed velnishi seem a very unnatural occurrence in particular.
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I lack of information about the habits of the Gawert, so it is not easy for me to imagine a suitable place. But I guess they might be a candidate to be introduced near the porous hills in bdouter?
If you want to introduce wild Gorweals, look for a shady groove where groundwater would likely mass. I believe the narrow valley behind Camp Banished (ojaroad1), where Neoten Consumers and Rats used to be, would be a suitable place. Or a bay in the middle of the Leaky Rock river, across the Gobble village. The right side of bdouter (near the chess player campfire) may have such corners too, I guess.
If you were able to make a shy tribe which stays together but avoids players and other NPCs, then I could imagine a Kormi tribe in areas with many trees and hills. If they are wild at all. Possible that you designed them as domestic pack animals only.
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off the top of my head, I think there are arangmas hanging out outside the front gate of Ojaveda, within line of sight of the guards (when they're at their posts). I like the bamboo forest feel of the outskirts of Oja, and perhaps when we're able to create a more realistic forest environment we can populate that area with arangmas... but the area directly outside the gates should realistically be cleared of such vermin.
Another interesting place is bdouter, there are huge hills with textures which look like little holes leading inside. Ever seen a termite mound? So I would expect (flying?) insects there.
Aren't there tlokes loitering around those hills?
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I wasn't there for longer. Sorry, I am not up-to-date everywhere...
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Trepor packs:
Trepors pack in bdroad1 (next to the forest leading to hydlaa) and ojaroad1 (nexto to the road leading to Oja) seems fine to me (speaking about locations) but I suggest not to make them aggressive unless the tribe is attacked (it would cause a lot of trouble to newbie players mining or passing by).
Right now aggressive status is pretty simple. They're individually either aggressive to you or not, and when attacked, they run to you. The tribe behaviors as part of the GSoC are currently being worked on. It will be interesting to see how this effects aggression as a group. To take it one step further, varied aggression would be interesting too: some monsters might run to you, others might run away. Attacks by certain spells which are supposed to cause immobilization (like freeze) to actually see that effect the movement of the NPCs would be nice to see as well. But that is a whole other project in itself.
Step 1 is to get them in the appropriate places, then in the future we can work on the behavior aspect of it.
Also, as drJack suggested, plant and herb spawns are going to be worked on. It'd be nice to have a connection there...to have creatures near plants they might feed on.
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It'd be nice to have a connection there...to have creatures near plants they might feed on.
such as clackers by the clackerweed.
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such as clackers by the clackerweed.
:D
Though it's crackerweed (I've often wondered if that was intentional or a typo) ;D
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From a naive point of view, undead creatures, such as grendol, toxic grendol, wrath rat and fayed velnishi should be placed mainly in the death realm. Dungeons and burrial wells may be suitable locations, but the placing of such creatures would be more credible if there was a source of magic involved (e.g. summoned to guard an NPC). Mixed packs of regular and fayed velnishi seem a very unnatural occurrence in particular.
And not forgetting Charcarass and Poison Charcarass, I always wondered why the poison ones should stay into the sewers only in front of toxic Grendols... and the normal ones only in front of the Derghir's buildings...
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@ Mordaan: This obvious typo in the database has been discussed for years, and was probably still never corrected (or just recently, and I didn't notice). The description of it clearly votes for the L, not the R. (Was it written by an asian developer?!)
@ Jawir: Charkarass; and I would rate the position of the Poison Carkarass close to the sewers collecting tanks rather logical. And Fire Carkarass seem to be supernatural so they will fit best in the Death Realm. But the plain Carkarass might be found elsewhere too.
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@ Eonwind
broad1 and broad2 -> check for Trepors aggressivity
ojaroad1 -> ulbernaut too difficult for newbyes
Added.
Thanks for the feedback Eonwind.
@ Bonifarzia
Yes, undead should definitely have an explaination. For now I'll check only the monster's location, after that, sooner or later, we'll talk about the necromancy in the setting team.
How undead works, how long can they remain and everything else. Just to check if we need some more explaination on this topic.
Thanks Bonifarzia.
@ LigH
For now we're checking mainly which monster to move.
Adding monster somewhere is an option too, but it's a secondary goal for this project. (I'm not arguing, I want only to let you know where we of the set-team will work more on this current step.)
bdouter -> option to add Gawert
Cam Banished (ojaroad1) or Leaky Rock (across Gobble village) -> option to add Gorweals
As explained by Mordaan the tribes are not yet ready.
Thanks again, LigH
@ Aramara Meibi
(this has priority) outside of ojaveda entrance -> arangmas
Thanks Aramara.
@ Jawir
The sewers have many different monster, we'll check them.
Thanks for the feedback, Jawir.
---- Sewers
They're a major topic. We'll check them thoroughly.
grendol, toxic grendol, wrath rat and fayed velnishi to check (here (http://www.hydlaaplaza.com/smf/index.php?topic=40817.msg458320#msg458320)).
Charcarass and Poison Charcarass (here (http://www.hydlaaplaza.com/smf/index.php?topic=40817.msg458334#msg458334))
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(If anyone is asking why I'm repeating your suggestions is to summarize them in a list, so it will be easier for us to review them afterwards. I repeat them also to check if I understand them well, so if I didn't get something I'd ask you for more details.)
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I'm against making everything newbie proof.
If the ulbernauts on oja road are difficult, let it be difficult. Difficulty is not a bad thing, despite the tendency for moden games to lead you by the hand and pet you on the head at every turn... As far as scenery is concerned, I'm fairly certain it makes sense for an Ulbernaut to be aggressive. If someone dies because they didn't know to avoid it, then they know next time. So really the question should be 'does it make logical sense for it to be there?' As there are other Ulbernauts in similar environments I don't see why not.
Don't coddle people.
I suspect, however, this will become a fairly moot point after the mobs have roaming capabilities.
I was always confused, however, as to why the fanatics were sitting around at the sewer entrance - were they waiting to try and run into the plaza or something?
As for aggression, I suppose it depends on setting or behavior mechanics. Maybe you could have a chance to switch between the two. A gobble roaming around might be just going for a stroll or it might be hunting.
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A changing behaviour will require more than just a binary switch, rather a logic as complex as the tribe project. So it may come, but not really soon.
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Where to reply? In this thread?
then I've a clacker in the Arena entrance tunnel close to hycorr1 -102.7 -0.47 -160.97
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Huh? One clacker which does not belong there? ... Not quite the topic here. Such accidents may happen when players attack and then start to flee but are chased by the opponent. But if you believe that the majority of specific lifeforms does not belong where they currently are, then his is the place to argue.