Complaint about Lost Dwarven Histories.

[Under the moon]

Moved the story to here: http://www.hydlaaplaza.com/smf/index.php?topic=37306.msg424596#msg424596

You may continue complaining in this thread.

[LigH]

* Esanor Serich takes a copy of this document to the Hall of the Hammer.

BTW: I have a talent for spotting typos... -- First chapter: Yla<=>ikum

[Mordraugion]

I also am an ex-member of the planeshift settings team and the last couple of posts here sadden me, as a member of the settings team I signed a document assigning copyright for my work for PlaneShift to ABC, I have not and would not even consider trying to remove my work.

Once upon a time there was a rich kid who joined a kindergarten, be brought with him loads of wonderful toys and games that he gave to the school for all the children to enjoy, unfortunately he had a falling out with one of the Teachers, for reasons not needed for this tale, and decided to leave the kindergarten.

This child returned a few days later and decided to take all his toys back all because of the disagreement, and now he has returned once again to hang around outside the kindergarten gates showing off his new toys and calling over the fence "look at these, you'll never be able to play with them"

[Aiwendil]

I don't really get it. As long as those stories stayed buried in the hidden treasure chests of the settings department nobody was able to play with them. And maybe never ever would have been able. Now there are some toys that can be used until settings says something different...so for the next years.

Ahh...maybe I just really get it wrong and you mean the settings members with the kindergarten kids not the players. This picture would at at least explain why they are hoarding everything. But still I don't see anything wrong with taking some toys from a few to offer them a much larger audience. 

Right now Utm offers at least some things to play with ... maybe it gets reverted at some point, but right now it's usable for players. So the "look at these, you'll never be able to play with them" isn't exactly true and for sure better than a "Be patient kids, we will give all kids in the kindergarten toys...just bad that you all will have started with school by then."

[Mordraugion]

I'm not surprised that Aiwendil with your own particular axe to grind would try and put your own spin on it. The only real kindergarten kid is the one having a hissy fit taking his toys away.

... I am retracting it and thus it is no longer official. This, or any other edited version of it may not be used as official game content. ...This history is for you to read and enjoy, not to be used for roleplaying purposes in the game.

[Aiwendil]

Utm made it public and I see no reason to not use it as long as there is nothing from settings that contradicts it. So you are right, he shouldn't have said to not use the texts in game...but it's up to the players if they respect that wish or not. And seeing LigH's comment or the other comments in the A long Journey - my history of the Lemur thread it looks as if they don't respect it. But no sense in talking with you....you have your opinion I have mine. There is no need to convince the other.

[Overtherainbow]

Also, Hoki's opinion is wrong.

[weltall]

as utm said himself the whole thing was automatically made ooc the exact time he asked for removal an posted them here. so no... if you use them you are ooc period.

[bloodedIrishman]

It is not to be used in game as the actual history, but if you asked Under the moon nicely he might let you use it as storytelling material in-game.

If like so many other pieces of work, it was kept in storage, what is the issue?

[Lhaa]

Thy issueth is.... thou shall nay knoweth them PS setteengs, everytheen unofficial be OOC!!
Shut down thy PSwiki! Remove all players that use unofficial infos, BANHAMMER all those sinners because they will fill your head with the wrong ideas. Matters not whether there is or not official data to fill those holes, holes are preferable to indiscriminate falsehood.
Solution: Burn the witches and fill the holes with rats and other mobs so that swords keep in motion.

[Under the moon]

Line fixed.

[Aiwendil]

Aww, thanks Utm. Still using the old quotes here to answer though.

as utm said himself the whole thing was automatically made ooc the exact time he asked for removal an posted them here. so no... if you use them you are ooc period.

Sorry, I can't find where he says this gets OOC.

note from the author- Another history I wrote for the game. As with the Lemur history, I am retracting it and thus it is no longer official. This, or any other edited version of it may not be used as official game content. The contents of this history are completely original by me, and do not reuse any previous official content aside from the dwaven names. Some minor edits have been made by others. This history is for you to read and enjoy, not to be used for roleplaying purposes in the game.

note from the author- These are books that I have written for PlaneShift while on the team. They were intended for (or were) ingame books. I am retracting them from the official game, though, due to issues I will not talk about here. That makes them 'fan' stories, no longer official, and thus go here for you to enjoy. Look for more from my collection soon.

As far as I see he only states the texts became unofficial, in one of his disclaimers he didn't even ask people to not use it in game. And not so sure if I would say unofficial and OOC are equal. All guild histories are unofficial...but forbidding to use them because they are OOC even to people who should know about them isn't much of a support for roleplay. But maybe it's only about stories in this part of the forum and not guild posts...with such perls and diamonds in those forums I guess it is fine if the guild members use those infos ICly. And the not so well written stories must be ignored because they are OOC, even if a character was there when it happened in game.

So sorry...I really see no reason to dismiss anything just because it is not official. Players make their own histories for their chars, create their own background knowledge for them and use this in game. I don't think it's nice to tell everyone their background stories where they made up names, history and maybe even the roles of their parents in the history of a race are invalid when there is no word from settings yet about this. They might become invalid as soon as they contradict the known setting and this can happen if settings releases something about it. But as long as there is no official word of settings contradiction it, I think players should be free to use these posts. These posts are nice to give players an inspiration for their background...not that they could look somewhere else for official inspiration on these topics.

[Xoel]

Yeah, when UtM left, he said a few times in public that he never signed the PlaneShift NDA/licence. Therefore, none of his stuff can be used for the game. Before XilliX's untimely demise, he had everything rewritten.

So if you use these "histories" for your RP, you're likely to be contradicting the stuff that the team has had to work hard to make, delayed by UtM's lack of copyright handover. Let's just say if he had signed the document this would be ingame, but because he never did, it CANNOT, therefore, since you prefer a good pure RP, I wouldn't suggest you use this for the simple fact it sadly can NEVER be official settings.

[Under the moon]

Players can use it how they want, Talad can not profit from it. I am fine with that.

You would be surprised at the number of people that never signed. I am unique in the fact that I admitted it. But, like I said, I would rather dump my stuff in the trash and never have it seen by the light of day than to have Talad even attempt to profit from it.

[bloodedIrishman]

Oh snap!