PlaneShift
Gameplay => Wish list => PvP,PK and Thieving => Topic started by: Toadhead on December 21, 2004, 01:01:44 pm
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Well, I\'m still abit confused about the combat of PS.
Open PvP might not work, I mean in cities etc. it sucks if everybody can just kill everybody, there should be some places were you can feel \"safe\".
But if you can\'t just attack someone outside cities, there is no need to feel safei n a city, you\'re just safe EVERYWERE.
My question is: can you need to be affraid of enemys? Or maybe: Can you even get enemys????
I mean someone hates me and want to kill me, but I\'m weaker so I don\'t want to fight. Than he\'s running to me and shouting: \"YOUR GONNA DIE!\"
I\'m running away and I\'m scared. He\'s nearing closer.... and closer... and than: \"EnemyX duels you, do you want to accept?\".
I mean that suck sucks, if he\'s stronger you\'ll always press on decline. Same for guild wars, if your affraid of a guild and you can choose if you want a guild war or not you\'ll always choose no. and further you can only attack people in arena\'s right? and in some quest places/dungeons and some special events.
Or does this duelling works different? That you can only decline 1 attack / hour or something :S
I mean if this is only in CB, and will be changed in later version I\'ve got no problem with it. But otherwise you can\'t just have enemy\'s or do I see this wrong? I mean maybe some girls like a game were everyone is at peace, but I\'d like to attack someone when I hate him :(
I hope someone can clear this out,
just if I\'m wrong and combat will be different, if right why this is good and if theres another way to attack enemys so you CAN have enemy\'s..
I also like to know who are against and who are for more PvP places if there only a few in the game.
Thanks,
Rob
p.s I hope you understand my post because I\'m from Holland and when I write long posts I\'m going to explain things completely wrong mostly :S
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EDITED:
Ok, heres my idea of changing the PvP rules, to won\'t get people mass pk etc.
but it WILL let you take revange on people you hate.
First we have ofcourse the duels, and guild wars (must also be accepted by both people).
Than you can fight everybody freely in arena\'s, special events etc.
In guess there will be some \"dungeons\" or caves for example for quests, like a cave were you can find a special sword
that you must return for a reward, or you can ofcourse choose to keep the sword. In this cave it should be freely PvP.
BUT.. in caves for newbie quests it WONT be free PvP, becuase it are still newbies and they dont know the danger of it.
In harder caves for more professional fighters and mages, there SHOULD be free (open) PvP.
I mean they are advanced and should know the risks.
Also alot of places around cities far away from the newbie towns should be open PvP. Newbies that cant fight
should stay in the starting cities, non-fighters should hire mercenaries to escort them to a safe location,
or they can ofcourse take the risk to travel alone. They should be warned before they go in a PvP zone, and newbies with a
character that hasn\'t been in game for longer than 50 hours WON\'T BE ABLE TO ENTER THIS AREA! Just for their own safeness :)
OR, newbies will start in a HUGE city, and to leave this city you should first pass a test in a school, this test will
give you various questions about the dangers etc.
What you need to know before you can do the test? Alot of things, and you can get the answer in the school
by reading the books, asking the NPC\'teachers or by asking online-players teachers :)
Please dont understand me wrong, ALOT of places (like all cities and like 1/3 of the world around the new-players start points)
will be NON-PvP (only by duelling, in arena\'s, guildwars and special events).
This way you dont need to fight if you dont want to, just avoid the PvP zones or avoid enemys in the PvP zones (or hire a bodyguard).
I mean people that dont fight wont go to dagnerous places were they dont have to search enemything isnt it?
Only fighters will go to this places to train against mods or do quests.
Further I think killing others should only give you a very little exp, mobs should give more. This will avoid people
killing alot of people just for the exp. People should kill others only if they are bad and like that, or when its his enemy and
want to kill him becuase of that. If you dont have any enemys you should have to worry about getting attacked isnt it?
So what about it>?
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I beleive in true combat open everywhere. However there should be zones where murder and PK are highly illegal and the consequences for your actions would be so severe it would seriously damper anyones thoughts of slaying mass amounts of noobs for exp or revenge. Also you shouldn\'t have too many enemies, don\'t talk the talk and walk the walk if you can\'t back it up :P
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I understand what you mean but the problem is that in these kind of games not only your enemies attack you...
There are some ppl who kills random ppl for fun which is why these functions are there and as i dont like being killed randomly i would like these function to stay, even though i would like a \"free kill society\"...
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I agree with whemyfield you should be able to kill anyone anywhere, but if you do it like in town or something(and get caught) you get a major penalty.
I also agree with Toadhead(getting killed randomly sucks) their could be a system implemented though... for example you have to be within so many levels of the person you want to attack in order to attack them. That way I horde or noob lvl 1s out adventuring don\'t get ambushed and slain by a single lvl 30 who got bored.
Just my opinions...
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What they are most likely going to do is say that every town with walls around it are safe zones and you can?t get attacked but if you leave the town you are open to death.
Secondly I don?t think you have to accept a battle I think they can just start attacking you when ever the want.
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The current implementation does ask for a duel (I forgot which forum it was from), only free challenge free PvP are Guildwars and Arena battles. 2 routes to the same destination might happen, but I won\'t know.
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Not a General Discussion thread. Moved.
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ow sorry about that, but its also not realy a \"wishlist\" post either :/
(However I wish the pvp rules will be changed)
Just wondering what most people think about it, and I\'d like to hear an answer to my question. I mean if you don\'t need to be affraid of having enemy\'s you\'ll get people making alot of enemys just for fun. They will try to irritate everybody they see, becuase they cant be punished by them (only if they WANT to be punished by clicking on \"accept duel\")
I think this is kinda wrong and should be changed. Not PvP everywere, but most places should be free PvP (however you should be marked as criminal or something. And NPC\'s wont sell stuff to criminals, or worse some cities wont even want you in, and people will get more exp killing you than they get when killing other people)
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Ok I edited my first post abit, it now contains from how I think PvP should be in PS :)
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Originally posted by Toadhead
Just wondering what most people think about it, and I\'d like to hear an answer to my question. I mean if you don\'t need to be affraid of having enemy\'s you\'ll get people making alot of enemys just for fun. They will try to irritate everybody they see, becuase they cant be punished by them (only if they WANT to be punished by clicking on \"accept duel\")
If a player wants to make trouble then just report him to your friendly neighborhood GM. You don\'t have to duel him to punish him.;)
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yeah, but i mean what if someone is irritating you Rping if you know what I mean.
for example someone is saying you suck and is telling everybody how you just died by a MOB, than you want to take revange on him right? But if he dont accept a duel you cant do anything.
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i think the simple panalty on murder (in the zones where you should not murder, city, newbie grounds) should be death.
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Originally posted by Madouc
i think the simple panalty on murder (in the zones where you should not murder, city, newbie grounds) should be death.
Death, and lose all your money and items... This would discourage PvP in protected zones greatly ;).
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jep, I think not allowing PK sucks, but most places should need to be protected, and these protected places will handle pkers. when someone PKs, he will be marked a criminal, and all NPC guards will try to kill him. When death youll lose ALOT of exp, some items and you will be moved to the death real, a hard place to get out for criminals. Also other people will be able to kill those criminals without becomeing a criminal themself, and they will also get a reward! (killing criminals always gets you some standard amound of trias, you might also get some extra when there is a bounty on his head placed by another player).
I mean this will stop mass pk, and you dont need to be affraid or something to get PKed, but it will be alot better than just not allowing it. (There will still be duels and guild fight, and arena\'s but when fighting in these you wont get criminal status).
Also, you will be marked criminal EVERYWERE, also in not protected places but there is just nobody to punish you there. They wont let you in towns anymore for A LONG time.. Also you cant juts lose your criminal status by killing some mobs or waiting some time, it will be VERY hard to become a normal person after that so people will watch iut before they PK.
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If you want my opinion.. (Which I imagine you don\'t especially. :D) I like the way Medievia did it. In places frequented by people, (cities, trade roads, woods around trade roads,) you can\'t even attack someone, (penalties make more sense, but I\'m just giving what Medievia uses first).
In fairly out of the way places, (such as the woods around the Labyrinth) there is what\'s called NPK. NPK, for those who didn\'t guess right away, stands for Neutral Player Killing, which basically just means that the law doesn\'t hold much sway. If you are killed in one of these areas, you just get teleported out.
There is also CPK, chaotic player killing, in areas where few tread, (like Haunted Woods,) where if a person is pked, it works the same way as if you killed a creature. Recently they implemented LLCPK, where only a certain number of items can be looted from a corpse.
Of course, I\'m not suggesting that system for PlaneShift, but maybe something like it. The more remote the area you\'re in, the less protection code gives you from attack. I\'m not a fan of pking really, but I like the idea of danger. I was actually playing once, and the person leading our party stopped us, because there was movement ahead, and then proceeded to tromp right on up, because they were Player Characters, and completely harmless.. Personally, in the spirit of rp, I was the last one to follow.. Would YOU tromp on up to a group of people in the sewer? Anyway, I\'m digressing. v.v
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\"I mean maybe some girls like a game were everyone is at peace, but I\'d like to attack someone when I hate him\"
.... i know plenty of girl who would gladly kill another person who pissed them off and plenty of guys would would rather have peace. so i dont get the girl refrence...
but. any way thats a bitoff topic. i see what you mean. it does suck that if you hate somone you have to have them accept you beating them crap outta them. i think that there should be area\'s ( for instance a stretch of the wilderness inbetween odjevada and hyddalla ) where you can pvp freely.
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I have proposed this idea before but perhaps if there was a lvl cap on who you could kill.
For instance, you could only kill someone 10 lvls apart from you.
Plus you wouldnt be able to kill noobs cuz of their low lvl protection?
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Originally posted by Pyrodiver
If you want my opinion.. (Which I imagine you don\'t especially. :D) I like the way Medievia did it. In places frequented by people, (cities, trade roads, woods around trade roads,) you can\'t even attack someone, (penalties make more sense, but I\'m just giving what Medievia uses first).
In fairly out of the way places, (such as the woods around the Labyrinth) there is what\'s called NPK. NPK, for those who didn\'t guess right away, stands for Neutral Player Killing, which basically just means that the law doesn\'t hold much sway. If you are killed in one of these areas, you just get teleported out.
There is also CPK, chaotic player killing, in areas where few tread, (like Haunted Woods,) where if a person is pked, it works the same way as if you killed a creature. Recently they implemented LLCPK, where only a certain number of items can be looted from a corpse.
Of course, I\'m not suggesting that system for PlaneShift, but maybe something like it. The more remote the area you\'re in, the less protection code gives you from attack. I\'m not a fan of pking really, but I like the idea of danger. I was actually playing once, and the person leading our party stopped us, because there was movement ahead, and then proceeded to tromp right on up, because they were Player Characters, and completely harmless.. Personally, in the spirit of rp, I was the last one to follow.. Would YOU tromp on up to a group of people in the sewer? Anyway, I\'m digressing. v.v
Now thats what Im talking about...
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Maybe we can have a mix all of the ideas proposed here,and built a great system for PVP.
Noobs can?t be killed/duel/robed up to level n.
Chars can?t be killed/duel/robed if the difference between then is more than (less say) 10-15 lvls
Some places should be safer, NPC police? or just god eye, and other should be more dangerous, above rules change for a wider level difference, noobs protection is removed...
and finally is somebody really really bothers you , call a honor duel... then none of the above applies, the other character should be forced to fight by the same law that in other circunstances will protect him, or at least put him in jail...(have no idea if there is a jail )
finally, thiefing, should be restricted in same manners, but shouldnt be so regulated that you can?t take a thief profession... and what about assasins?, spies?
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For some reason I always favor a system with as few level restrictions to PvP as possible. This probably comes from my exp with EQ\'s red (Ralos Zek) server. It was PvP if you were within 5 levels (as I remember). And it allowed you to loot all gold and one item off of the killed player. And when you respawned you were at 10% mana and health, and there were no safe zones. and spells worked differently on players than they did mobs.
I did not like it. The level idea sounds good, but in implementation it means low level goon squads can greif newbies without fear of getting killed by higher level bounty hunters. It also does nothing to protect from higher levels helping griefers kill. for example a player can have two accounts. With his high level healer he can keep his lower level assasin style character buffed with high level buffs and heal when player is in trouble.
I prefer newbie zones and safe cities. It is not nessasarily realistic, but it improves the game for newbies and crafters imeasureably. Newbies form your player base. They need an environment to learn the game before they are pitted against the uglyness that is PvP. This being said, Planeshift is not claiming to be the next great PvP game. It will not be the main focus of the game. This puts more presure on the PvE part of the game.
If PS ever gets anything more than the guild war system it has now it will most likely be limited to certain areas of the map. PvP in cities is just ugly. Especially with the free to play cost of the game.
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In EQ there was a npc Called (The Priest of Discord) all you have to do is go up to him and hail him that starts the quest He give your toon a book you read it and hand it back to the POD then apon handing back the book your tag AKA the name above your toons head turns red from blue and Bad bing-Bada boom your tag in now set to PVP status and that means you could openly attack any one else (WITH a red tag ) and thos who wish to remain out of the fray could .It also ment only those with the red tag could heal you you buff you in any way ... I hope this give you some Ideas to work from for a better pVp solutions....
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PoD\'s were exclusive to \"blue\" servers. Ralos Zek was one of the few \"red\" (PvP) servers that EQ had. When I was playing the game I had characters on both kinds of servers. Incidently, the players that chose the PoD were very very few, and most did out of curriosity, only to delete them when they found out they could not undo what the PoD did.