Lets make PlaneShift Unreal

[helios21]

Please do not do this. Planeshift is the best Open Source MMORPG out there. If you switch to the Unreal engine, the support for Linux would be more limited. Also, the Unreal engine guys do not like Open Source or GPL so much.

Of course it seems tempting to switch to a such robust and powerful engine, and it is very popular. You have my fullest understanding if you still want to change engine. I am sure there will be huge improvements. But Unreal is not open source so it kills a bit of the spirit in this game.

This make me a bit sad, but you do as you think is the best.

1.) Epic fully supports games on linux, the editor on the other hand is still not officially supported yet, but runs none the less.
2.) There are tons of 'opensource' projects on github that use UE4, you can not opensource the engines code its self, but you can do what ever you want with your code. If there are changes you want to push upstream for the engine thats different matter. As long as the PS devs follow the EULA there should be no issues, and if they have any questions they can ask them on answers.unrealengine.com (just tag it with the appropriate tag)
3.) Because it does not follow a totalitarian ideology of opensoure dose not mean it will kill the spirit of opensource its self. UE4 is VOSS, virtual open source software, any one can get the source for any reason and only have to pay if they make a certain amount of money per quarter. If you have any legal questions please feel free to read the EULA its self and/or ask them on answers.unrealengine.com

For me you sound a bit like someone from Unreal engine support department.

I share the concerns about Unreal not being free as in freedom:
- If you need to patch it, you need to follow their EULA.
- They could take it away from you anytime.

But Unreal also seems to be a very advanced engine.

[Salamanderrake]

Please do not do this. Planeshift is the best Open Source MMORPG out there. If you switch to the Unreal engine, the support for Linux would be more limited. Also, the Unreal engine guys do not like Open Source or GPL so much.

Of course it seems tempting to switch to a such robust and powerful engine, and it is very popular. You have my fullest understanding if you still want to change engine. I am sure there will be huge improvements. But Unreal is not open source so it kills a bit of the spirit in this game.

This make me a bit sad, but you do as you think is the best.

1.) Epic fully supports games on linux, the editor on the other hand is still not officially supported yet, but runs none the less.
2.) There are tons of 'opensource' projects on github that use UE4, you can not opensource the engines code its self, but you can do what ever you want with your code. If there are changes you want to push upstream for the engine thats different matter. As long as the PS devs follow the EULA there should be no issues, and if they have any questions they can ask them on answers.unrealengine.com (just tag it with the appropriate tag)
3.) Because it does not follow a totalitarian ideology of opensoure dose not mean it will kill the spirit of opensource its self. UE4 is VOSS, virtual open source software, any one can get the source for any reason and only have to pay if they make a certain amount of money per quarter. If you have any legal questions please feel free to read the EULA its self and/or ask them on answers.unrealengine.com

For me you sound a bit like someone from Unreal engine support department.

I share the concerns about Unreal not being free as in freedom:
- If you need to patch it, you need to follow their EULA.
- They could take it away from you anytime.

But Unreal also seems to be a very advanced engine.

And you think that can't happen with OpenSource projects?

[Talad]

Hey Salamanderrake, good to see you are answering some questions on unreal, we will surely need support pretty soon!

Helios about the open source I have the same feelings as you and it's still not a decision taken, but a proof of concept we are doing to validate the feasibility. I would love to have a fully open source engine, but seems these days it's not possible as there is no valid alternative. We could develop it ourselves continuing to expand Crystal Space, but bringing forward two projects can slow down our progress a lot. At the end we are making this project for the enjoyment of the players and we should keep this objective in mind when making any choice.

Keep the discussion going, ... and we need unreal developers!

[Rigwyn]

As long as the license does not inhibit you from using their code/products as required, the consequences of breaching the license agreement should not matter too much. You just don't breach it. The same goes for licensing agreements for commercial software.

Out of curiousity, is there a particular version of ms vc++ that needs to be used or will the one that ms is currently making available for free suitable?

[Tuathanach]

Out of curiousity, is there a particular version of ms vc++ that needs to be used or will the one that ms is currently making available for free suitable?

Microsoft Visual studio 2013 community edition can be found here. It is what is required for Unreal Engine and is free.

[Venalan]

So I've been playing about with UE4's water support and set this up.



I was running a local client in Hydlaa in Full-HD with water rendered in real time and I was maxing at 100fps, which I think is comparable to what I get in PS at 1280*960. The engine also feels much smoother while moving about. I was standing in the small map you get to beyond the lava cave and even in just that tiny room there was more input lag moving the mouse than I was getting in Hydlaa in UE4.

[Roled]

I'll ask again- will this new [what engine? something?] be usable by low grade USA Windows laptops? For people who don't and can't spend money on upgraded hardware and who don't understand nor care to learn all the tech?
RR

[mine is a Toshiba Satellite with AMD A6 but I am actually asking IN GENERAL in the hopes that my particulars and OTHERS can just download or whatever, and play]

[verden]

This is a very, very good thing. But nobody is going to say what it can run on until something is available to run and someone has tried it. Unreal is the best choice. There have been many games using Unreal. Until there is a download available the best you might do is find other current games using the Unreal engine and see how the experience is on that computer. The stock graphic cards in portable computers can be problematic for running many games. But the Unreal engine will scale its output better. And many are familiar with it to some extent or another. Crystal Space has just never really taken off to receive the benefits of having an active, wide community of developers. Good show, best of luck!

[Rigwyn]

Just curious - the specs for building state that the minimum card requirement is an NVIDIA GTX 470.  That's an old card, but high end. I think the earliest models you can get now (new) are in the 700 series.  Would a GTX 750 or 960 be sufficient?

[LigH]

So I've been playing about with UE4's water support and set this up.

http://i61.tinypic.com/hskguu.jpg

^ not available as deep-link image, because tinypic is ad-bloated.

[CheatCat]

I uploaded the same image to imgur, perhaps less ads there.

http://i.imgur.com/PANUHQS.png

[Eonwind]

I'll ask again- will this new [what engine? something?] be usable by low grade USA Windows laptops? For people who don't and can't spend money on upgraded hardware and who don't understand nor care to learn all the tech?

Long story short: we still don't know but I expect the requirements will be higher than now, even if we'll provide options to lower details, eliminate shadows etc. However the engine change project will require at least one or two years and in the meanwhile we'll be able to understand what the min requirements will be.

[steuben]

dang nabbit. now i'm going to have to redo all my postcard pics... again.

[Duec2]

I would like to start this off by thanking our Dev's for looking into advancing this game into a better engine.  This is a needed step so this community can advance and grow in the future.  Also, thank you to all the people that are commenting, this helps everybody understand potential concerns and benefits of this new engine.

With that being said, let me see If I have this straight about unreal:

Advantages from what we have now:
1) Much better visual effects (backgrounds, characters, items, etc.)
2) Much better mechanical movements (smoother and looks more natural)
3) More potential Dev's available due to engine is easier to work with

In other words, this could be a much more appealing game, in the long run attracting more people to play.  Also, with more people working on it, the number of man hours to work an update may be the same as now but the time can be shortened due to having more people working on an update.   

Disadvantages from what we have now:
1) Computer requirements may be slightly more than it is now

In other words, the people that having been looking to play the game or comeback and play the game again but there computers will not play the game, still can not come back.  The people that can barely play the game, will not be able to play the game now.  Short run, we will reduce the amount of people that can play this game.

Unknowns:
1) A cost maybe associated with the new engine

Everything else, we should have roughly the same like; detail of landscape control and sound effects.

Is this right?  Am I missing any significant advantages, disadvantages or unknowns?

[Salamanderrake]

...
Disadvantages from what we have now:
...
Unknowns:
1) A cost maybe associated with the new engine
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Epic's UnrealEngine4 EULA

Code: [Select]

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4. Royalty

You agree to pay Epic a royalty equal to 5% of all worldwide gross revenue actually attributable to each Product, regardless of whether that revenue is received by you or any other person or legal entity, as follows:

a. Gross revenue resulting from any and all sales of a Product to end users through any and all media, including but not limited to digital and retail;
b. Gross revenue resulting from any and all in-app purchases, downloadable content, microtransactions, subscriptions, sale, transfer, or exchange of content created by end users for use with a Product, or redemption of virtual currency, either within a Product or made externally but which directly affect the operation of the Product;
Gross revenue from any Kickstarter or other crowdfunding campaign which is directly associated with Product access or in-Product benefit (e.g., in a multi-tiered campaign, if an amount is established in an early tier solely for Product access, your royalty obligation will apply to that amount for each backer with the same access, but not on additional amounts in higher tiers based on ancillary benefits);
Your revenue from in-app advertising and affiliate programs;
Revenue from advance payments for a Product (from a publisher or otherwise); and
Revenue in any other form actually attributable to a Product (unless excluded below).

However, no royalty is owed on the following forms of revenue:

The first $3,000.00 in gross revenue for each Product per calendar quarter;
Consulting fees or work-for-hire fees which are non-recoupable for services performed using the Licensed Technology (e.g., an architect-created walkthrough simulation or a contractor-developed in-house training simulator);
Revenue from non-interactive linear media (e.g., broadcast or streamed video files, cartoons, or movies) which is Distributed in a form that does not contain or, in order to deliver, rely on servers running the Licensed Technology;
Revenue from a Product which is only Distributed to Engine Licensees (such as through the Marketplace);
Revenue from ancillary products which are not software and which do not contain embedded information (such as QR codes) which affects the operation of the Product (e.g., comic books, soundtracks, apparel);
Financial winnings generated by awards for the Product;
Revenue from donations for a Product which are not tied to Product access or in-Product benefits; and
Revenue from interactive amusement park rides or coin-operated arcade games which use the Licensed Technology.
The royalty is based on gross revenue from end users, regardless of whether you sell your Product to end users directly, self-publish via the App Store or any similar store, or work with a publisher. The following simplified example illustrates the application of the royalty to gross sales: if your Product earns $10 on the App Store, Apple may pay you $7 (having deducted 30% as a distribution fee), but your royalty to Epic would still be 5% of $10 (or $0.50).

Royalties that you pay on an advance payment of revenue for a Product that is recoupable by the payer, such as a publisher, may be credited against future royalty payments that you incur under this Agreement for that Product.

Within 45 days after the end of each calendar quarter in which a Product earns revenue outside of the above-listed royalty exclusions, you must pay to Epic the full amount of the royalty due for that quarter and send Epic a royalty report on a per Product basis. Detailed information on royalty reporting and payment can be found at unrealengine.com/release.

The royalty will be payable under this Agreement with respect to each Product for as long as any Engine Code or Assets (including as modified by you under the License) incorporated in or used to make the Product are protected under copyright or other applicable intellectual property law.
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