This is a great idea
But, I will be honest. I do train some skills OOCly. So what I mean by this is that I plan on getting Azure way to 80 so I can, see peoples stats if I need to rank them up, and to help new players gain PP by being able to rejuvenate their mana. But then there is always a small simple solution to my problem and that will have to be alt.
PS. No KIC doesn't rank by skills, anyone can rank anywhere with having no change in their stats (but this is very unlikely) we mostly like our members to max out strength just to be able to wear Heavy Armor b'cos it looks kool.
Personally I prefer not to train OOC skills
HA does look awesome though
that system sounds pretty static to be honest
you'll always limit people to make a specific selection of skills that way.
e.g. one may decide to only master magic ways while not training any combat or even job ones. why shouldn't he be able to? (NPC example of this is zhaomal)
also you should reconsider your topic, this isn't a "balance for all", it's mererly a "limitations for skills"
I tend to disagree as I think of the current system is static, the method I proposed allows for things to continually change where as currently once you maxed something it's maxed and that's it.
Also I did explain why they should not be able to, it is simply not realistic. I understand how tempting it is to have a 'superman' character, but when everyone else is 'superman' too does that not defeat the point and take you back to square one? Where is the uniqueness in that?
I know my example was limited to the mastery of 5 skills, but it is only an example and even changing that to 10 would still be more realistic than being able to master all 30+ skills available in the game.
anyway, you may want to have a look at this thread:
http://www.hydlaaplaza.com/smf/index.php?topic=37524.0
in your case especially the proposal of nivm (which came up a few others times before iirc) which is a lot more dynamic than just putting OOC limitations and tackles the same system (jack of all trades)
I did actually read that, thank you, it is a bit more complex than my suggestion and I do agree with what was suggested, but the focus was on stat growth in accordance with specific race and actual training experience etc. which would of course play a role in skill selection where as my suggestion is focused more on the realism behind the trainability of a set number of skills at a time.
To me it simply makes sense that if you do not regularly train a skill your mastery of that skill will degrade with time or that training a different skill will have some impact on it, whether that be negative or positive. The two concepts do however address the same problem if simply in different ways.
Still, I think it is good when people do reason about one of the oldest controversies in planeshifts progression system.
Notice my little idea linked by RlyDontKnow is definitely not enough to address the problem that people can become a master of all trades.
On the other hand, I have the impression that it is one of Planeshifts core concepts that everyone is free what to learn and practice.
Personally, I think the best solution would be to have a system where skills do not directly affect each other in terms of training limits, but where you have some antagonistic and synergistic effects. As an example, training the skill antimagic should give you an overall higher chance to fumble when casting a spell, or some decrease of each spells overall power. Thus, you could train the magic ways and antimagic independently from each other, but your spellcasting abilities will definitely suffer from advanced antimagic lessons. In this sense, people could train everything they like, without any restrictions. But there would not be much of a reason to max out everything, if a reasonably specialized skill build yields much better competences at a fraction of the training effort.
By the way, I like that signature very much. Will you share more art of this kind?
My ideas are simply examples of what could possible be done, I completely agree with there being both antagonistic and synergistic effects to each skill, each skill should have some disadvantage to learning it or at least an effect on opposing skills. In fact this would be ideal but far more complex than my suggestions as each skill would need to be allotted bonuses or disadvantages in relation to every other skill or in the least to opposing skills.
(Also if you are referring to my sig, thank you but it is about 4 years old, I am just to lazy to change it :p )
I think it's a great idea. But what off the oldies that have maxed all six ways? They've spent millions and millions trying to learn it and probably like months, even years. It would be unfair, if this get's implemented, to just drop their skills like that.
Well like mentioned already that will probably happen regardless :p
Also magic is very different from sports. Magic uses your brain. Yes, crystal way and Dark way is highly different, but it doesn't mean you can't/shouldn't be able to max them both. I think you should be allowed to max them both, except that once you have maxed their opposite way, the other one gets tougher and more expensive to train. There are mages in other games, or movies that have almost known knowledge of all the spells, wether they are summoning the dead or curing the ill.
True, magic does require you to use your brain, but it does not alter the fact that it would still require training, albeit the mind instead of the body.
I am not trying to debate whether both dark and crystal way should be used or not, the first example was simply a suggestion at balancing. Following the second example leaves room to learn both after all.
Perhaps you do have a Dr Jekyll and Mr Hyde type character that can learn both, but remember there are four other ways to learn as well. Also let us not stop there since there are still several types of weapons to master as well as armors, and of course numerous types of jobs and other skills. Where do you draw the line before it becomes too much?
They may have knowledge Maisent but they probably don't have experience, so what I am meaning is that they read a book and know it. But have never done it.
You can't be an expert at Crystal way and Dark Way. They are both opposite and no matter who you are you can't think opposite its like telling yourself to rub your bally and tap your head. Crystal Way is looking at the light of the world, and Dark way is looking at the dark of the world. Yes you can know some/little maybe a lot of Crystal way and be an expert at Dark Way but its too impossible to be an expert of both ways.
I would not say it is necessarily impossible, but they would most certainly have some sort of effect on each other seeing as their very natures are at such opposite ends of the spectrum. Either way it would most certainly not be a simply task to master and be able to use both interchangeably.
I agree on the matter with Kiraki and Vakachehk. Talking here purely from the RP perspective I don't see how it's possible to have a character that's skilled in healing people and hurting people and be -perfect- at both. Or better said both good and evil. Most people when they think of their characters backgrounds usually choose a series of settings that will make them take one of the two paths. I for one consider Dark Way and Crystal Way to be mutual exclusive. I can't see both sides of the coin when it comes to necromancy spells and healing spells.
My point is that a balancing is needed both stat wise and magic wise otherwise you're simply inviting god-modding. I'm pretty sure that anyone reading this topic can relate with meeting a "master of the universe" char that can't ever loose a RP duel because they can't understand that having maxed stats has nothing to do with RP.
Agreed but they do not necessarily need to be mutually exclusive, however as I already mentioned there should be some sort of implication for using both.
Using sports as an example wass a bad idea. Sports is physical, magic is mental. Lifter/sprinter would not go together because your body structure has to be exact to be a pro at one of them. Unlike magic, which uses the brain. And i don't think brains can change. Brain is knowledge, if you are smart you can crack most puzzles/spells etc. Anyways you can be a master of both light and dark, as I said many mages from games and/or movies out there have learned spells to cure someone, and some spells to curse someone. My idea is that, once you have learned/ maxed out a way (crystal way for example), the opposite (dark way)should be harder and more costly to train.
As I mentioned already the brain still needs training nonetheless. There are also differences in the brain as there are with the body, an overly simple example perhaps being someone that is more mathematically inclined compared to someone that thinks more abstractly. It is tricky to train the brain to think in two completely opposite ways at the same time.
Making one way harder to train once another is maxed does simply that alone, it makes it harder to train, but with time it will still be possible to max both.