A probably biased view on starting a char in PS

[Aiwendil]

Great...I created a new character who is needed for a RP. No problem so far, quick option "Knight" gave me a char with more than 100 STR so I can even follow the plan to have him wear a chain mail shirt (At least I think so...will see if the STR requirements were changed). No stupid "char creation"  content in my description...looks all fine for a new RP char.

So...here I am with a empty inventory and zero tria, right next to Harnquist. Five minutes for copying the pre-written description in game...everything is ready to start.

Task: Getting leather pants, leather boots, a chain mail torso and a longsword to have the char fit the description at least a bit.

All no problem, should be easy to get in a short time. Lets start with getting a few tria. Can't be arsed to get into the PS combat...especially not if a new char needs 5 minutes to kill a rat so lets go for some quests.

Apples for Harnquist - Balance 120 tria
Healing salve - Cost 100 tria, reward 750 tria, balance: 670 tria
Incompetent guards loosing gauntlets and forgetting to pack launch themselves: Reward: 630 tria, Balance: 1300 tria

Hey...that really looks good so far. Only one or two more and I have enough tria for the basic items I need for this char..and even some pocket-money left for one or two evenings in Kada El's. Lets get to the next quest...Didn't Allelia always wanted opinions about her new drinks. *sigh* Obviously not anymore...seems I need to do some other unknown quest before that. No problem, there are plenty of other easy quests in Hydlaa that don't even need me to leave the town. Let's see if Lucky is still an unlucky bastard...what...the NPC has again nothing to offer. Okay...but I'm sure the Kran on the plaza still wants his book. Oh...he is also quiet? Ah...finally...a quest in the temple. Yeah sure...I run to the ruins now just to figure out I will be send to a sister in BD afterwards...forget it, there must be other easy quest in Hydlaa for starters. If I had enough PPs by now I could get some mining training and do the Harnquist quests now...but first this would waste some of my hard earned money again, second mining is dead boring and third I don't have enough PPs for even the first level of mining yet. So lets continue to look for easy quests. Twenty minutes later: Okay...guess I have to run to Oja for some Falka. Next shock in Ojaveda...3200 tria for a longsword??? Hey...the chain mail torse, leather pants and boots together are not even half as expensive as one longsword. Fine, lets forget the longsword, I won't use it anyway. It's just for the atmosphere. As I probably will never equip it others won't ever see it. So, buying some falka for 200 tria and back to Hydlaa....to get 250 tria as reward!!! 50 tria for a trip to Ojaveda?...Falka my ass.

Fazit:
Screw it...I just login Aiwendil, hide behind a wall and kill monsters with magic then transfer the money to my other char. That's as OOC as questing and will take far less time. Quests always used to be pretty pointless...but with the new prerequisite for almost every quest they aren't even useful for some easy money for RP chars anymore. Do a quest, then check out all NPCs again to see if they have a new one available..and please keep on doing that for the next years. This sounds like real fun. Seriously, at this point it appears to me getting rid of the quest system completely and starting from scratch is a better option than keeping it. Quests were always just used as a poor excuse for being unable to make settings public or as limiting factor for items but now they lost the last right to exist.



But this whole debacle allowed me to see a bit more of Yliakum than just Hydlaa...so a few more impressions:

• The new grass texture in Hydlaa is pretty nice...it hurts my eyes and will probably take weeks to get used to but from an objective point of view it's a great improvement.
• Same for bumpmapping in Ojaveda..needs time to get used to but enhances the gfx for sure. Oh...and good work with the new Dsar Akkaido...really doesn't look bad ;):
• Most of the gfx errors I'm used to are still around...but it seems a lot new ones were added..like transparent floor on maps with fog, Block-trees (missing transparency of the leaves texture) when seen from some distance or the size changing monsters.
• A lot of the quest items got new 2d icons...though all I tried till now have no 3d model. But still it makes them a lot more useful for RP now.
• The portal signpost are still there...but so far I had no problems with changing maps.
• A lot of very useful new options. I really like that I can tag the different sources for the logfiles...makes log-filtering with grep a lot easier. And "Always deny marriage proposals" is great....ability to remove "alliance" and "channels" chat tabs also.
• I think I asked that already once before and never got an answer. What does "Graphics Quality" in "General" options of the launcher do? Does this one overwrite whatever settings I made in "Graphics" if not set to "Custom"?
• Also the ability to turn off weather is great.
• The loading times increased a lot...maybe I should try setting "background Loading" to something other than "off" at some point...but I'm sooo scared of that option.
• The new char creation looks less messy...but haven't seen all of it yet as I used the quick option.
• The sound has some serious problems. I used to have everything turned off except interface sounds in the past (liked the feedback if I clicked something)...but that doesn't seem possible anymore as I probably would run amok at some point just to get the "click" sound stopped again.
• A lot more monsters around...guess that's an advantage for most  people except me.
• Why? How could you? The Gazebo used to be such a romantic place. Now i imagine it like this: "xxx leans against the railing, unfolds the parchment and starts reading his prepared love poem." - "yyy couldn't take her eyes off xxx while listening" - "zzz runs past, greeting the two. "Hope I didn't disturb you two...just on my way to the pterosaur route to get the Amdeneir...just go on with what you were doing."" - "xxx lets out a soft sigh then looks down to the parchment again and after taking  deep breath start again." - "aaa waves to both. "Good that I see you...Want to see the new weapon I got from a blacksmith in Amdeneir?" "Two days later xxx and yyy were sentenced to death by the Octarchy for attacking a valuable Pterosaur and slaying two innocent citizens and the owner of the Pterosaur"

Edit:Typos

[novacadian]

Two days later xxx and yyy were sentenced to death by the Octarchy for attacking a valuable Pterosaur and slaying two innocent citizens and the owner of the Pterosaur"

Venorel cackles gleefully

[bilbous]

You are better off starting with some skills, quick character development is a waste of potential. chainmail is more than 100 st now.
apples sell for 4 tria so set up your /target next item /pickup shortcut and collect a bunch from the orchard around harnies. There are a bunch of new quest groups "introduction to science" and the like, if you had a new account you would have gotten a letter that told you about them as well as a reward for going through the tutorial at the cost of more time getting started. You find those letters on the ground from time to time.

[weltall]

you've a bugged openal. unfortunately openal devs don't adress the problem without a test case we can't provide as it goes through cs.

[Aiwendil]

@bilbous
Sorry..disagreeing there. Quick is really the best way to get a strong char...and STR is the only skill needed for RP char to enable them to carry enough items. Everything else is mostly useless.

And mostly complaining because I always used quests for my RP chars to gather around 5K in two hours...that used to be more than enough money for the whole lifetime of those chars.

@weltall
Ahm...offical gentoo openAL package...works well with all other programs using it. So..yes..it might be a openAL bug...but from the looks it seems everyone else is able to get around it. But the sound is no real problem....really only missing the interface sounds as it is pretty hard to make out at times if you really changed the chat tab.

[bilbous]

I see what you mean. Last time I looked at character creation you go no skills from the quick method. Of course the skills you got from choosing the +40% ST and EN are halfway useless for a starting character. The useful ones were axe and shield handling, the heavy armor requires too much strength and body development is unimplemented. I managed to get 100s in ST and EN with a Lemur character, I imagine that would be nigh on impossible with the custom method. Still I normally choose kran characters to maximize carrying capacity.

[Aiwendil]

True...I would never suggest using the quick option for chars that are meant to be trained. But the quick-knight option is the killer option for every char only needed for some RP. With +40% STR and END those chars can carry enough and still run around for some time without getting exhausted. If you want a main char on the other hand customize is probably the better solution. Especially if you don't want any skills that are not useable in game yet. But as I'm not planing to do any training or using of game mechanics with this char I can deal with the unused body development skills.

Oh..and Kran was no option for this char...needed another race. But a Kran-knight used to be pretty nice according to strength..started with something around 160 STR I think.

[Talad]

There are plenty of available quests in hydlaa, you just need to speak with the right npcs. The 5 minutes rats is something we reviewed few times but never managed to fix it for all possible initial stats. The 'no inventory at startup' is something we should fix by providing at least the basic 'friend letter' object to point new non primary chars in the right direction.

[weltall]

@bilbous
Sorry..disagreeing there. Quick is really the best way to get a strong char...and STR is the only skill needed for RP char to enable them to carry enough items. Everything else is mostly useless.

And mostly complaining because I always used quests for my RP chars to gather around 5K in two hours...that used to be more than enough money for the whole lifetime of those chars.

@weltall
Ahm...offical gentoo openAL package...works well with all other programs using it. So..yes..it might be a openAL bug...but from the looks it seems everyone else is able to get around it. But the sound is no real problem....really only missing the interface sounds as it is pretty hard to make out at times if you really changed the chat tab.

we just use 1.12 when doing builds and there are no issues. It could also be that they don't use the same api as cs.

[Aiwendil]

There are plenty of available quests in hydlaa, you just need to speak with the right npcs.

The point was not that there are no quests in Hydlaa...my point was that a lot quest needing no former skill training, involve no fighting or mining and take only part inside Hydlaa are not available right from the start anymore. Sure..as I said, I found quests that would send me to BD, would make me mine for some ores or want me to get some animal parts, but none of those actions are fun at all. I won't bother to invest any time in game-mechanically "developing" a char with a estimated lifespan of a bit more than a month. (Okay...have to be truthful there...I wouldn't even do that for a char that should last longer)

The 5 minutes rats is something we reviewed few times but never managed to fix it for all possible initial stats.

Probably should be done something about...but that's nothing -I- care about. I can imagine it's very difficult to come up with good starting monsters for chars with strength ranges from 28 to 150...and with some of them already having a weapon right from the start and some not. But as I have no real interest in PS combat at all I leave it to others more caring about it to suggest improvements.

The 'no inventory at startup' is something we should fix by providing at least the basic 'friend letter' object to point new non primary chars in the right direction.

Ah..sorry, I only mentioned the empty inventory to say this is about a newly created char who didn't do the tutorial. An empty inventory is all fine with me. But I already created a bugreport because some quests look pretty inconsistent in case you haven't done the tutorial before...and having people to start with the letter fixes this only for some. But again more interesting for others...I only want a way to create a char, don't have to deal with any game mechanics and get that char ready for some RP.

we just use 1.12 when doing builds and there are no issues. It could also be that they don't use the same api as cs.

That's probably the problem...I'm on 1.13 here. But 1.12.854 is masked unstable in gentoo. The next lower stable release is 1.11.753. And I'm kind of suspicious if a lower version than the current one is masked unstable...usually there is a good reason for it. Maybe I feel like experimenting around with openAL version at some point, but for the moment I can deal with turning sound off.

[weltall]

probably because someone had his own bad day
http://packages.debian.org/squeeze/libopenal-dev
debian squeeze which is current debian stable and debian is bloody stable has 1.12

[Sarva]

By skipping on the Tutorial you missed a lot that makes starting a new character a bit easier, Trias, a weapon, a rock pick, leather pants, a glyph, a couple lumps of iron and a torch.  Some of those items you can sell if they aren't useful to your character for more trias.

As Talad mentioned you also get the introduction letter which directs you to a number of NPCs who offer introduction quests. doing the introduction quests, which mostly involve just standing and reading text, unlocks a number of the low level easy to do quests you are talking about Aiwendil. The introduction quests even give you the names of some NPCs to seek jobs from after you finish the introduction quest.

[Aiwendil]

I did not skip the tutorial on intention. The money from the tutorial would have been a great help already. But to do it I had to create a new email address and a new PS accout..while still having one free char slot on an existing account.

For the introduction quests: Yes..Harnquist unlocks a lot of mining and crafting quests...all need training. The science quests are a bit better there...but some of them need fighting. And it takes a lot time like this as you have to do them all in a specific order. Magic quests the same...need training.

Edit:
But maybe it would be a good idea to have all chars doing the tutorial now again...as it used to be the case when the tutorial was first introduced. Now it's possible to skip the tutorial...so everyone can decide if he/she wants to do it.

[jenideandre]

The problem I found with playing new chars is that pp is extremely limited for all the quests I could do.  So training was really out of the question.  So, in order to get tria, I deleted a char and made a new one with mining parents, so that she could dig from the start.  The new char is still having major problems because no pp, but she's got tria.

If I were a new player, I would not stay in the game at this point.  I'd play for a day or two then quit.  Because it is too hard to have fun on your own, before meeting people and doing any larger rp than behaving properly IC at all times.  The reason for this is that it was just too hard to advance, mainly with pp and secondly with tria.

I am willing to make a bet - that if in a future release, the pp for quests and killing low level mobs is increased significantly and tria rewards also increased but less so, that more players will stay.  Then you wouldn't spend 5 minutes on a rat to get 1 pp, that is an insult and makes you hate the game. 

I bet the number of players would increase exponentially.  Because no matter what kind of char you play - whether you'll rp an archer member of the DoX, so would like to come to them already with some arrows and a bow and some practice (nevermind that they would help you out if you came as a noob), or you want to rp a submissive lemming with violent tendencies and join the Stillwater Peace Corps, or want to be a lawful good with the Warriors - whatever, it is more fun choosing a guild and playing the game if you've sunk into the atmosphere on your own a bit, and you have the chainmail that you imagine makes you look hot, and the sword, and are above a level 2 in using it, so can protect a damsel with a rat wrassling with her skirt hem.

I don't need any response, but just to back up the original post and go beyond it to say it's a drag being a new char as the game stands.  I don't think it's because of the types of rps, I think it's because there is not enough fun/advancement for newbs to get caught by the game (ie intrigued) and stay long enough to meet all of us darlings.

[Talad]

Improving the first hour of gameplay is extremely important. Our reports show that the majority of new players quit after 10-20 minutes. the tutorial has been created to have a smoother experience, but seems we are not yet there. Is the rat killing time the main issue together with difficulty to get tria? What other elements can make the first 20 minutes better?