Possible Thieving,PK,PVP solution

[comanighttrain]

Im trying to look at this from both points of view here, its a hard topic.

For someone who doesnt want to be involved, getting killed or mugged can pretty sucky. However for thos who want to be able to PK, PVP or thieve the best time for attack is when the opertunity is there.

I think guild war or atleast some stage between all out war and total serenity would be a good idea. Also for thieve\'s or assasins or other espeonage style classes to not be revealed to the enemy until they commit an offensive action, but as well as risking being killed by the player, some sort of guard system so that if the guild is not offically at war, theiving or attempting to assisnate a player will be difficult.

Anyone think it would work?

[shorty13]

Did you read my post from a long long time ago? It says the same thing just with more details, and yes, It should work.  If I were a thief who was caught, well...theiving, I would hate to be killed by a guard, come out of the death realm, and be immediately shot by magic spells and struck by warriors just to go back.  I think it is a good idea.

[Kythag]

There is also this dynamic: If you are caught looting from a player challenges cannot be refused if they make them.  This makes higher level players, with likely more valuable stuff, a harder and less desirable target(as in real life).

I refer to my other post on the implementation of thievery in PS.

Kythag

[derwoodly]

Including a link to the posts you are refering to helps.  Where you refering to this post Shortly?

http://www.planeshift3d.com/wbboard/thread.php?threadid=16379&boardid=21&styleid=3

[Jakob]

The problem with your reasoning Kythag is that this throws the \"balance\" of PP vs Income way off.  Everyone would be training in awareness and speed and all kinds of things like that just so that they could train their characters with impunity.  For people who aren\'t as interested with focusing on training as they are on RPing this isn\'t quite as bad but it\'s still not completely balanced.  I\'m sure this has occured to you and you have probably mentioned it, but I haven\'t been able to find it.  How would you get around the imbalance in training that this would cause among \"PLers\" and \"RPers\" to a lesser degree, and especially to those who have successfully found that middle ground that makes for a good RPG experience?

[Kythag]

Jakob:

Explain the details of how people could exploit this to train with \"impunity\".  I am not infallible, I simply don\'t see this yet.  With the explanation, we can further this discussion.

[Jakob]

I agree that would be a good idea.  I don\'t frequent the PvP forum, and I can\'t remember exactly what I\'m talking about...  I\'ll try to figure it out and get back to you...

[EDIT]I\'ve looked, but I haven\'t got the foggiest idea what I\'m talking about in that post...  Just ignore it.  If I figure out what that has to do with anything I\'ll come back and tell you.

[EDIT2]It seems possible that I was saying that people would spend a lot of time training in agility and awareness so they could catch people looting them, but that doesn\'t make a lot of sense, especially not the way I said it...

[Kythag]

I actually had been thinking you were discussing the balance between PLers and RPers giving rise to an imbalance, but I didn\'t want to try to read your mind and be wrong.  Since Rpers do not train as hard, the thieving PLers could train past them and make RPers targets for their thievery.  But anyone not training hard would not be a good target for long.  If a looting system were implemented, it would require measure of the value of the loot as a guide for the practice points.

Of course, they could also measure the differences in agility stats as a guide.  It would create the need to \"bite off more than you could chew\", at least from the PLer standpoint.  Thievery as an RP option in this game would have to be relegated to NPCs anyway as I can see the overall disgust in the idea of looting PCs.  There are \"griefers\" that would utilize this as a means to easy money from new players, leaving a rash of \"beggars\".  This would be good RP, but the looted would only feel victimized, cheated, etc.

I am interested in the idea of looting an NPC that is being attacked.  The odds of getting caught are greater because you have a group of PCs and NPCs that could catch you.  If you loot the NPC, it would have to be one that can carry things: mercs, Rogues, etc.  Wouldn\'t it be interesting that the merc you\'re fighting suddenly doesn\'t have a sword and is looking for it.  This would lower the amount of XP you then get from the merc because he just became an easier target(say from 200 to 50).  You then have to sneak away from the PC and NPC or face the consequences.

[derwoodly]

Implementing thieving and PvP is not just a one dementional thing.  All of the verables need to be addressed.  In PS you don\'t really die.  your punishment is going to the death realm. for a few minutes.  This kind of punishment is always harder on the new players than the experienced ones.  In addition to this, stealing from other players is just not fun for the victom.  You say you will be given a chance to kill the thief or that it will be \"hard to do\".  Well, theives will not attack these players.  So your inexperience player will be hit twice.  Once when he victomized and then again when he tries to fight back and gets sent the the death realm.

Part of what makes PvP fun is going head to head with an equally matched oponent.  In a MMORPG this almost never happens.  Even if you have some kind of skill level system that restricts wildly mismatched players from combatting each other you will still get a mismatch because one player will not be at 100% when they are attacked.

Currently what seems to be working is realm vs realm style combat like WoW has and team matches like Guild Wars has.  The free for all attack anyone at any time AO and Shadowbane style have bombed.

[Green_Day123]

Good idea