PlaneShift
Fan Area => The Hydlaa Plaza => Topic started by: Volki on May 06, 2015, 10:04:07 pm
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https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kQbd5W7VKh4&hd=1
THE HORROR
disturbing scenes
sorry for traumatizing some people
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How many times can you kill a dead horse?
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Though I've only heard of this Anita woman in passing, just listening to the amount of times she repeatedly uses "never" in regards to the sexualization and abuse of men tells me she's a narrow-minded ignorant sort of person.
The video was incredibly disturbing.
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Uhm...why wasn't it flagged for 18+ on youtube...? I didn't even get a warning that it contains...content
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Uhm...why wasn't it flagged for 18+ on youtube...? I didn't even get a warning that it contains...content
Men can't be sexualized/objectified/victimized. /s
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And trolls tend to generalize, in general. :whistling:
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And trolls tend to generalize, in general. :whistling:
Not sure if you mean me or Sarkeesian.
Sarkeesian as a troll? I believe it. She makes money on it.
@Demagul, sorry for traumatizing you. :P I was also not prepared when I watched it.
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*Demagul shivers has he tries to get some images out of his head. "B-but...w-why? ...how...?" He shakes the thought out of his head once and for all, but it lasts forever in his nightmares
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Hmm.. I didn't watch that video with sound.. I'm not sure I want to go back and play it again with sound. To be honest, I skimmed as it didn't really look all that interesting to me.
Why do people take objection to this?
It's like this huge knee jerk reaction pro or con to suggestive material. People tend to be on one side of the fence about it or the other, but rarely do they straddle the pickets.
The above is more a question for the individual and in invitation into really looking at the core of what makes one reject or accept it. A very superficial answer would be "I like or hate it because there are things in it that I do or do not like to look at." If you peel the onion a little and ask, "Why do I have these biases, and what purpose do they serve" you get a little closer to what I am poking at. I'm also pointing out here that these likes and dislikes are within the person, not on the canvas. I don't think you can make any form of art that everyone will like.
If I make a game or some work of art, I'm going to make it so that it appeals to some of those biases. If a work of art does not cater to some bias, then wouldn't it be bland and flavorless? It's neither pleasurable nor objectionable. For this reason, I have to lean towards allowing sexuality and hence some unavoidable degree of sexism in art so long as it is effective in pleasing the audience.
On the other hand, while you want to cater to biases, you really don't want to cause harm or unfriendliness towards those who would be biased against it... or is that just an unavoidable opposite side of the coin that just needs to be accepted? I think it raises a question about whether or not art should have boundaries.
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Gaming is sexist...ffs. White under socialized geeky boys develop games and guess what? They don't get laid...and so surprising that the one women who actually speaks up about the sick shit portrayed in gaming gets death threats from the same white geeky boys...sigh... get laid, learn something about oppression or STFU...gaming is f'ing sexist duh... Ask yourself, would I like my daughter to play games that carry these weak objectified, abused role models for women? and how fantastic is it to be a woman who has been raped to have to be triggered by the repeated rape scenario being played out over and over in so many games? ...and the stats say that almost half of the gamers out there are actually women, statistically you can count on a good portion of them having been abused or raped. Even more fun is the reality female programmers and developers have to deal with trying to get work in an industry that does not blink an eye at objectifying women. Good times. End rant.
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Why don't they make games with things that appeal more to them then?
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Gaming is sexist...ffs.
No it isn't.
get laid, learn something about oppression or STFU...
This sentence illustrates perfectly why the West has fallen into ruin.
Ask yourself, would I like my daughter to play games that carry these weak objectified, abused role models for women?
Yes.
and how fantastic is it to be a woman who has been raped to have to be triggered by the repeated rape scenario being played out over and over in so many games? ...
"Triggering" is a myth.
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Society's bored. Do we have nothing better to do than worry about sexism in gaming? Also, I wouldn't let my kids play games. Geez. They should read books and go outside.
In fact, children are best kept off the internet and computers.
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The above is more a question for the individual and in invitation into really looking at the core of what makes one reject or accept it. A very superficial answer would be "I like or hate it because there are things in it that I do or do not like to look at." If you peel the onion a little and ask, "Why do I have these biases, and what purpose do they serve" you get a little closer to what I am poking at. I'm also pointing out here that these likes and dislikes are within the person, not on the canvas. I don't think you can make any form of art that everyone will like.
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On the other hand, while you want to cater to biases, you really don't want to cause harm or unfriendliness towards those who would be biased against it... or is that just an unavoidable opposite side of the coin that just needs to be accepted? I think it raises a question about whether or not art should have boundaries.
You are a wise man, Rigwyn. As for boundaries, see the recent shooting at an art gallery in Texas. Violence/shaming should not suppress freedom of expression.
Gaming is sexist...ffs. White under socialized geeky boys develop games and guess what? They don't get laid...and so surprising that the one women who actually speaks up about the sick shit portrayed in gaming gets death threats from the same white geeky boys...sigh... get laid, learn something about oppression or STFU...
I will never understand your obsession with sex, but I want to ask, why in the world do you think it's insecure, anxiety-ridden geek boys making games? I've been gaming online for a long time. Boys like that do not go on to make games. They become NEETs or work a boring job that doesn't require social interaction.
On death threats, she definitely gets them. But it's not from those boys you are so quick to demonize. False flags, a Brazilian journalist, random trolls.
As a woman, I'm not oppressed. I don't see any of this "sick shit" in games directed at women. I play games with people you would call the worst of the worst, but they are not sexist and do not play sexist games (main reason being that those games don't exist). Even Sarkeesian could not come up with enough content to counter the video I posted in the OP.
would I like my daughter to play games that carry these weak objectified, abused role models for women?
TIL Samus and Lara Croft are weak, objectified, abused role models. I grew up playing Metroid and Zelda. Hell, in Zelda, the princess you have to save isn't weak or objectified. She was secretly a ninja! The reason you're saving her isn't because she's a woman. It's because she's the ruler of a kingdom.
and how fantastic is it to be a woman who has been raped to have to be triggered by the repeated rape scenario being played out over and over in so many games? ...and the stats say that almost half of the gamers out there are actually women, statistically you can count on a good portion of them having been abused or raped. Even more fun is the reality female programmers and developers have to deal with trying to get work in an industry that does not blink an eye at objectifying women. Good times. End rant.
What repeated rape scenarios? Where are you finding these? The only ones I'm aware of are in player-made mods which are for your pleasure. I've hung out a lot with aspiring developers and programmers, some who are already in the industry. Not sure if you're saying the industry is inherently sexist. If so, I doubt that's the case. Gaming is, compared to any other form of entertainment, extremely egalitarian.
children are best kept off the internet and computers.
truth
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Men can't be sexualized/objectified/victimized. /s
This is why I don't take feminists seriously
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Volki, I feel compassion for you feeling horrified about the video you posted.
I also feel anger. I still struggled tomorrow to get some of the images of the video out of my mind.
Please, if you ever post something like this again: Include a BIG FAT warning.
I will do so now:
WARNING: The video Volki posted an URL to contains in game scenes that may not be approbiate for children or sensitive people
I know children are playing PlaneShift and I know sensitive people are playing PlaneShift. Please give them a fair option, not to view the video. And I think the video contains stuff that is clearly not approbiate for this kind of players. It contains scenes of celebrating sexual abuse, physical abuse and torture.
Volki, what were your intentions with posting this link? I didn´t see it to the end, but stopped at the first image that I felt shocked about. But from what I gathered the video is not about healing any of session, but about creating shock and sensation, in victimizing people and creating moral offense. None of this is going to change anything about what you see in the video. From what I have seen I do not believe there is a true intention in healing things with this video. None at all.
Please be more careful in what you invest your energy.
I will report with video as inapprobiate for children and sensitive people with Youtube.
Again I am shocked at how low the treshold is in videos about nudity, even natural nuditiy without any sexism, yet if it is violence the sensitivy seems to be much higher.
And what does it have to PlaneShift? PlaneShift does not contain any of this. I am aware of people playing that their char is being tortured by evil mages and so, yet it is truly opt in.
Please include a warning in your post that give people a clear option to consider whether they want to view the video. Once I had seen the first image of celebrating cruelty in the video, it was not easy for me to get rid of it again.
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Okay, I missed the content warning and the intendet purpose according to the video description is educational, but still: I think this is inapprobiate for children or sensitive people.
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Some people should hang a sign with
WARNING: Going outside contains scenes that may not be approbiate for children or sensitive people
on their front doors. Srsly though. Does that mean certain people can't read about history? OH NOES VIOLENCE AND RAPE AND WAR.
My point of view is that people that feel offended by this need to swallow their feelings and man/woman up. As human beings, we have to deal with life. We can't just cry trigger warning every time something displeases us. Where would we be otherwise?
If there really was something like being "Triggered", most of humanity would be in a state of permanent trauma. It's just now that the internet allows easy withdrawal from real life and integration into online communities allows this bullshit, even. You can't block people in real life when they tell you to suck it up and face reality, that works only on twitter.
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My point of view is that people that feel offended by this need to swallow their feelings and man/woman up. As human beings, we have to deal with life. We can't just cry trigger warning every time something displeases us. Where would we be otherwise?
Have you ever heard about the word context? While watching a TV news or reading a newspaper you may know you're eventually going to face violence, but you may expect the violence is set aside in a different context, like with a gaming forum, or at least you expect to be warned beforehand. In such context expecting a warning can be pretty normal.
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Some people should hang a sign with
WARNING: Going outside contains scenes that may not be approbiate for children or sensitive people
I stand by that I want to choose what I take in.
If I go outside in the country I live, I usually do not see people abusing each other in the way the video depicted. It is sad that human beings at other places do things like this to each other. I know this, I am aware of it, but that doesn´t mean I have to watch it or simulations of it. I even don´t think there is any benefit in me watching it. It won´t help anyone who suffered this.
I am even quite sure that this may be harmful to people who actually experienced a trauma like this, up to the point where it could even activate memories that may be healthier to keep at bay until the person in question built up resources to deal with what he or she experienced. Trauma therapist have shown that it is not necessarily beneficial to re-experience the trauma one experienced.
I may be quite sensitive to it, cause of having faced some abuse in my personal history. So now either take into account my oppinion that I think videos are this can be unsuitable for children or sensitive people or not.
I claim my right to be sensitive either way. Its not an illness to feel deeply.
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So we'll need to put a warning label on every cat video (you know, those with cat-phobia)? Fact is we don't know what everyone might possibly upset with. And every day life things most certainly shouldn't require that.
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I think that video link should have had a warning as a matter of courtesy.
ie. Tag it with NSFW (Not Safe For Work) so people don't accidentally open it at work or school and get grief.
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I would advise caution against forming a community too much to your shape. You might find yourself alone one day.
This link alone warrants for a ‘parental control rule’ IMHO and distasteful at best. I do wonder however if there are forums better suited for this part of reality.
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context[/u]? While watching a TV news or reading a newspaper you may know you're eventually going to face violence, but you may expect the violence is set aside in a different context, like with a gaming forum
What a bizarre expectation. Why would you decontextualize one area of human social life and not another? If Greek tragedy or Shakespeare teaches us nothing else, it is that tragedy and calamity can occur at any moment. We equip ourselves both morally and intellectually for such eventualities. That is the context within which human life unfolds. We have perfectly good descriptors for this passage of social life, such as "growing up", "being an adult", "not being childish" etc etc.
This contemporary desire to signpost the obvious and suspend our critical, moral and intellectual apparatus is a request to stop engaging with the world, to stop being adult. It is in essence a call for the infantalisation of social life.
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I always try to take into account that the one on the other side of the net sometimes he/she is being childish because actually he/she is a child. If possible, some arguments must be introduced with proper care, they're unavoidable anyway. But that doesn't mean we are entitled in any way to put equal weight on all the material we find on line. Frankly, the net often is so free (decontextualized) that's scary.
(bonsaikitten.com is an example. I you think it's real, then you must cease to use the net, your computer and your car. You're a danger for everyone. And please, don't grow kids.)
With great anonymity comes great responsibility.
I have the feeling I'm a bit off topic, but who really cares ;D
PS:
A consequence of Internet freedom is that every DIY Bothisattva on Earth it's indexed in search engines or forums.
Let's say it all together now: "No, you're not!".
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For the record, I posted the video because
1) this is a forum for a game, so I thought gamers would be interested
2) many gamers have lately been feeling targeted by their own media and people like Sarkeesian who accuse them of misogyny
3) the violence against men in games is far worse than the violence against women, yet people like Sarkeesian focus only on the women
4) there are many people who play games that do not involve themselves in a great many number of games or the larger gaming community, so they may have misconceptions about other gamers if they see the contemptible articles written by unethical websites
For the record, I thought the content warning in the video description would have been enough, but I forgot that videos on YT play by default (I have a very customized browsing experience). I've already edited the OP.
I have no issue with violence in video games. Here is why: https://techraptor.net/content/study-shows-high-skill-gamers-less-aggressive-perceive-less-violence
As for sexual violence, that's what the ESRB is for.