PlaneShift
Fan Area => The Hydlaa Plaza => Topic started by: snow_RAveN on October 28, 2004, 04:48:12 am
-
clearly something strange, this is not a joke but it sure is funny and the worshiper dosent belive that iraq war is all satan\'s fault :lol:
Royal Navy to allow devil worship (http://www.cnn.com/2004/WORLD/europe/10/24/uk.devilworship/index.html)
-
How can you have a satan worshiper in your ranks? When you are trying to rid such ideals from a nation..like they are in IRAQ :P (Don\'t mean rid IRAQ of devil worship but of terrorism)
-
Well, you can\'t persecute someone for a religion when it isn\'t hurting anyone. It does seem odd, but it is freedom of religion. Once he starts slaughtering officers for rituals, then we use him as fish bait.
-
It isn\'t suppose to matter what \"ideals\" you worship. As long as it does not interfer with the tasks at hand, you can worship any religion, as it should be.
If anything, the wars on Iraq are, ironically, God\'s fault (although some call it Allah) because there are different sides trying to reach heaven by eliminating \"the wrong guys\". Everyone\'s just doing what they think is best, and it turns out to be a war.
-
From a Atheists point of view (note no person is meant to take personal offence to this) It is ironic that a being created for belif is the cause of so much strife.
-
Quite interesting... I did some research on the satanism (I don\'t like to talk about different religions without getting to know them first) and I must point out that all you people who consider this event \"odd\" did the 1st satanic sin :P
1. Stupidity: The top of the list for Satanic Sins. The Cardinal Sin of Satanism. It\'s too bad that stupidity isn\'t painful. Ignorance is one thing, but our society thrives increasingly on stupidity. It depends on people going along with whatever they are told. The media promotes a cultivated stupidity as a posture that is not only acceptable but laudable. Satanists must learn to see through the tricks and cannot afford to be stupid.
Why? Because it is christians going for war that is weird, not satanists. Satanism doesn\'t mean you\'ll go around sacrificing children and stuff (actually hurting children is against satanic rules). Sure it advices you to use violence, but only if someone intrudes your territory and does everything to annoy you [hint]terrorism[/hint]. The mass picture of satanism was created by media and the-religion-that-shall-not-be-named.
It\'s sad that not denying belonging to nature is considered \"wrong\" nowadays... sad and stupid :rolleyes:
- Swords
-
Well, I\'m a Christian, so you can all probably figure out my stand on this.
-
Well according to some \"Christian\" beliefs, and I do mean some not all, 67% of the world are Satanists.
So if that is the case I am sure he isn\'t the only Satanist in the Armed Forces. Buddhists, Muslims, NeoPagans, Druids all religions or belief systems like that are considered Satanists or Satanistic to some.
IMO as long as your beliefs do not effect your performance or the safety of yourself or others around you then you should be free to practice your beliefs.
-
According to a satanist on another forum real satanism isnt about worshipping the devil or evil. Its about being strongly atheistic. Sort of kicking against religion in general and christianity in particular.
But there are probably different groups with different thoughts.
-
Yeah, the first form of satanism was opposite to the-religion-that-shall-not-be-named, so also contained disbelief for God and satan. Considered satan not as divine being, but a force that is in every one of us... or something like that... now satanism can be either the old form of it or the devil worshipping... if I remember it correctly.
Of course the-religion-that-shall-not-be-named won\'t stop at calling everyone around \"satanists\", it\'ll also lie about what it stands for...
- Swords
-
The man who is now the first registered Satanist in the Royal Navy is a follower of the Church of Satan. The Church of Satan was founded by Anton Szandor LaVey and it\'s basic beliefs are...
1. Satan represents indulgence instead of abstinence.
2. Satan represents vital existence instead of spiritual pipe dreams.
3. Satan represents undefiled wisdom instead of hypocritical self-deceit.
4. Satan represents kindness to those who deserve it instead of love wasted on ingrates.
5. Satan represents vengeance instead of turning the other cheek.
6. Satan represents responsibility to the responsible instead of concern for psychic vampires.
7. Satan represents man as just another animal sometimes better, more often worse than those that walk on all-fours -- who, because of his divine spiritual and intellectual development, has become the most vicious animal of all.
8. Satan represents all of the so-called sins, as they all lead to physical, mental, or emotional gratification.
9. Satan has been the best friend the Church has ever had, as He has kept it in business all these years.
This post is in no way for or against these beliefs I just thought it would be intresting to show exactly what this persons beliefs were that the whole article is about,
-
Originally posted by Draklar
Of course the-religion-that-shall-not-be-named won\'t stop at calling everyone around \"satanists\", it\'ll also lie about what it stands for...
You almost sound like a satanist yourself :). The christians (i believe your referring to) not all lie, many like other people probably are confused by the name satanism and just have the wrong image of it.
Im not sure what to make of satanism either btw.
Boldstorm, Interesting seems like its very much about individuality. One does as one feels like.
-
*applauds for Boldstorm* :D
I myself have a copy of LaVey\'s Satanic Bible, and it\'s an excellent work. It\'s amazing how people often refuse to do their own research and jump to conclusions on Satanism, which has nothing to do with drawing pentagrams on the floor, summoning demons, or slaughtering animals or people. That\'s the Hollywood take on the path.
Why allow Christians on the job but not Satanists? About time Her Majesty got some up-right people in her navy ;)
-
Originally posted by Ionas
Originally posted by Draklar
Of course the-religion-that-shall-not-be-named won\'t stop at calling everyone around \"satanists\", it\'ll also lie about what it stands for...
You almost sound like a satanist yourself :).
Well actually I\'m Wiccan (NeoPagan). And I don\'t mean christians, but Christianity in all. Since the burning times, it was always the same. Back then Christianity declared pagans \"devil worshippers\" and started hanging/burning them for worshipping something they don\'t even believe in. It never stopped, just changed the methods. Now you can see christian websites telling lies about other religions. And what are results? If you say you\'re a pagan, you can get fired from job for worshipping satan.
However, I agree with what satanism stands for much more than christianity... We are who we are, we are part of nature... and no one will convince me that following our natural instincts is \"wrong\" or sin or whatever...
- Swords
-
Bleh, everyone is entitled to their opinion, and AFAIK, christianity has caused more death and violence than satanism, so I see nothing wrong with following it. I\'m the same as Draklar on that I agree more with satanism than christianity.
\"There is no such thing as sin, moral or anything like it, survival is what matters at the end of the day, it is how we\'ve evolved in this world, like all other creatures\"
;)
-
Ok, I am a Christian. Though, if you\'d ask me if I believe in God, I would answer \"yes\" and \"no\". Even so, I am not an atheist, though \"I believe when I see\", being more into science & tech.
But if you\'d think well, you\'ll see that all religions are mostly the same, all have the same ideals. There is a God? If yes, of course there is a Satan too. If god is an ideal that you wish to achieve, there must be something at the other side as well.
Religions are ok, because they keep order in the world, but as all things, they have their bad sides. I think you\'ve kinda noticed that most wars are started because of the religions.
My conclusion: Everyone is free to have their \"own\" religion, everyone can believe in whatever they want, of course, without becoming obsessed.
Tip: try to be kinda realistic, and don\'t take things as they are, make some researches & stuff ...
-
err Annah, not all religions have same ideals...
Ideals of christianity are opposite to satanistic ones.
And not all religions have the \"evil\" being.
Also not all religions have the bad sides... sure there are religions which want to be the only ones (Christianity). But there are also religions which take completely different stance: \"The only \"Ture\" path is the one that works best for you. All paths are valid as long as they Harm None.\" (Wicca). Some aknowledge only one pantheon of gods, while Wicca will let you believe in Lady, Greek gods, gods of Valhalla or whatever you want to.
Religions in no way are mostly the same.
And being more into science & tech is heresy in the eyes of Christianity methinks.
- Swords
-
\"And being more into science & tech is heresy in the eyes of Christianity methinks.\"
-> err, I rather believe in what I think, I don\'t like to follow others nor their believes & ideals. But still, I am a Christian. Don\'t ask :P
\"err Annah, not all religions have same ideals...\"
-> yea you\'re right, sorry I didn\'t type well. I wanted to say that they kinda have the same ideals, I meant they have some common points of view.
Didn\'t we have this talk some time ago? It was fun then, ah and live :D
Of course, it can\'t take nowhere, because we\'ll keep supporting our points of view :)
-
just gimme one thing that all Christianity, Satanism and Wicca have in common when it comes to points of view :P
- Swords
-
Originally posted by Annah
There is a God? If yes, of course there is a Satan too.
No, not always. Take Pantheism, for example. There is no Satan, or \'evil\' force, in that religion, while there is a \'God.\'
-
Originally posted by Draklar
just gimme one thing that all Christianity, Satanism and Wicca have in common when it comes to points of view :P
- Swords
There is a God :P
-
nope, the oldest form of satanism denies existance of God. Also there are Wiccan traditions which will say there\'s only goddess :P
or that there is no god at all...
- Swords
-
I checked out the CoS website and a lot of other Satanic resources last year, and I noticed that most people are actually a cross between Christian, Satanist, and Islamic. Mostly leaning towards Islamic and Satanist.
What can I say? Islam and Satanism are at the top of the list of Very Bad Things, in many people\'s eyes. I recently attended a baptist ceremony and I was amazed at the ignorance towards other religions that was displayed. In fact, I tried to correct the pastor and nearly got kicked out. Ffft, so much for universal acceptance and love, eh?
I have more morally Satanist and Islamic friends than I do Christian ones, though I\'m a Christian. And instead of basing this figure on what they say, I base this on what they do.
I guess the bottom line is; don\'t judge someone by their religion, and don\'t judge someone\'s religion by what they say it is.
All of that was incoherent, and had no overall point, but this is a subject that I\'ve put a lot of thought into, and I could write a novel on it.
-
Draklar, want something in common? err, they all believe in something :P
I for the other hand, also believe in ME! :]
* EDIT *
Karyuu my fav. 2D Artist :P How\'re ya? ;) I think you should enter MSN more often :P
-
believe in what? Just \"believing in something\" isn\'t a view.
In fact, I tried to correct the pastor and nearly got kicked out.
haha! You did what? You\'re crazy! :P
- Swords
-
I hope and long for the day when ignorants and blasphemers like christians, muslims, satanists, buddists and any other such crazy society of hypocrites out there seizes to exist and harmony can come to the world through a common will for good, and not countless idiotic dogma\'s from lame religions that no longer act as anything but pacifiers for the weakminded, and the occasional disturber of peace through moronic actions intended to inflict harm on others, such as the muslim suicide bombers who are so coveted by the various medias.
Even though I know that this removal of stupidity in extension of the removal of religion will probably never happen, it\'s still a refreshing thought.
And I still say that satanism in the form where you worship the human body is more interesting and logical than christianity which has withered away to a shell of its former self, instead of just dying as it should have done a long time ago.
/rant end.
-
Originally posted by Xalthar
I hope and long for the day when ignorants and blasphemers like christians, muslims, satanists, buddists and any other such crazy society of hypocrites out there seizes to exist and harmony can come to the world through a common will for good, and not countless idiotic dogma\'s from lame religions that no longer act as anything but pacifiers for the weakminded, and the occasional disturber of peace through moronic actions intended to inflict harm on others, such as the muslim suicide bombers who are so coveted by the various medias.
Even though I know that this removal of stupidity in extension of the removal of religion will probably never happen, it\'s still a refreshing thought.
*Wipes a tear from his eye*
I agree with what I think you said. When people rant, they seem to just jumble things together. :P Well, I took from it that you don\'t like Religion(if you do, then just ignore that) and I don\'t either. I mean, I don\'t think I should believe in something because people tell me to(Christians) and I don\'t want to believe in something I don\'t even know exist. (gods/godesses) A lot of people try to tell me to come to their Church or whatever, and I always say, \"No.\" But,(I know, this will get a bit off-topic, but it is Hydlaa, no) I don\'t know why most Christians are Christians. Most just believe in it, because their parents make them when they are young like 3 or 4 and they just stick with it, and everyone around here(US) thinks that Christianiity is the only true Religion and all othes are false. Yea, isn\'t it odd how the \"false\" Religions are older than Christianity itself? Heh, it just makes you laugh. In conclusion to this paragraph,(semi-rant) I don\'t like Religion and I think it is stupid(personally) to believe in something that may not be true. Err...
Back to the Semi-Topic, I did have the wrong view on Satanism due to, you guessed it, Christians. I never thought to do research, because I don\'t think about Religion much, and I am glad that I am finally a bit informed about the traditonal Satanistic ways.
Back on the Original topic, I don\'t think people should be held from jobs because of what they believe in.(or lack of belief) That is lame discrimination, and mostly Christians do it, no? So...yea.
-
Woah woah woah. I don\'t like where this thread is headed, especially with posts that bash other religions, or being religious at all.
I myself am not religious, but many churches around my area help out into the community more than I ever have. In fact, our local Buhhdists are the friendliest people I\'ve met, they don\'t care what religion you are. They even let anyone tour their huge local temple.
You got to understand that its not the religions that are to blame for violent actions in the name of god, its the people. Those same people would probably bomb a building for another god if they were born in a different area. Most people suck, but there are always exceptions.
Lets not get into who\'s right and who\'s wrong, thats how most wars start in the first place.
-
I\'m not bashing Religions or telling people not to believe in a Religion. I just stated the reasons why I am not religious at all. Well, the Churches helping people is nice, but some people do it to make themselves look better, while some do it because of boredom. I mean, with everything there is, be it Religion, Sports, Games, whatever, the Human nature just doesn\'t allow everyone to agree...never.
I also didn\'t want to start any wars, but just thought I should add my input as everyone else did. :P
EDIT: Damn typos...
-
Let\'s just say that I\'d go to hell if I did believe in it. :D
I\'m fine with this satanist guy.
-
Originally posted by Olig
You got to understand that its not the religions that are to blame for violent actions in the name of god,
Heh... you mean that religion where God states that he\'s the only god and only one by who you can go to paradise and that if you believe in other gods you\'re a sinner and will end up in hell, isn\'t to blame? :P
People take a lot from their religions so yes, I will blame some religions as much as I blame some people...
- Swords
-
Originally posted by Draklar
Originally posted by Olig
You got to understand that its not the religions that are to blame for violent actions in the name of god,
Heh... you mean that religion where God states that he\'s the only god and only one by who you can go to paradise and that if you believe in other gods you\'re a sinner and will end up in hell, isn\'t to blame? :P
People take a lot from their religions so yes, I will blame some religions as much as I blame some people...
- Swords
In my eyes, god did not say that, a man with a pen said he did. I blame it all on the people, because thats where religion came from in the first place, IMO. Most religions are supposed to be good in heart, but those who change the laws to their own benefit, like kings, are the ones I have trouble with. Its a mass brainwashing on the people, by the people, particularly the wealthy.
-
Originally posted by Olig
You got to understand that its not the religions that are to blame for violent actions in the name of god, its the people. Those same people would probably bomb a building for another god if they were born in a different area. Most people suck, but there are always exceptions.
The religions have it\'s part of the blame too. It shouldn\'t allow violent actions in the name of god because when people talk about religion they don\'t agree with logical arguments. The whole point to having a religion is to explain the unexplained and all of it\'s theories are based on belief. Belief is bad as sometimes excludes understanding. To get back on religion\'s fault I must say that religious fanatism is mostly based on stupidity and ignorance of people and it\'s common knowledge that hydrogen and stupidity are the most common things in universe :). So there will always be religious leaders wich will make ppl do what they want having a really strong argument on their side: belief. I must say that belief is the ultimate argument. Another thing I observed is that all priests are trained in psychology.... good thing to know is they don\'t learn only about their religion, but about others too. A priest\'s welfare is based on ripping off a bunch of ppl in the name of belief. The funny thing is that ppl know this but they give things willingly and the religion underlines this. So the religious system is really a very old and effective tool for manipulating the masses.
I\'ve been talking mainly about christian like religions but one must be carefull what he belives in because you never know what the preacher really wants from his belivers. I don\'t say religion is bad, but one should be carefull about it not to push things too far. Religion si kindof like fire usefull and destructive in the same time.
-
1-14 u believe in what your parents tell you to
15-18 Heraotic
19- rest of your life thir u go back with \"god\" or what ever religon your parents taught you.
Hey it dont bother me none there practicing devil crap as long as it dont effect me
-
Originally posted by Isolis
1-14 u believe in what your parents tell you to
15-18 Heraotic
19- rest of your life thir u go back with \"god\" or what ever religon your parents taught you.
Hey it dont bother me none there practicing devil crap as long as it dont effect me
Hmm I am over 19 years old and I still denounce everything my parents taught me and pretty much believe in much of the opposite. ?(
-
Originally posted by Olig
In my eyes, god did not say that, a man with a pen said he did. I blame it all on the people, because thats where religion came from in the first place, IMO. Most religions are supposed to be good in heart, but those who change the laws to their own benefit, like kings, are the ones I have trouble with. Its a mass brainwashing on the people, by the people, particularly the wealthy.
But in the eyes of Christianity he said that (Holy Ghost passing God\'s word to man). Nuff said :P
The religions have it\'s part of the blame too. It shouldn\'t allow violent actions in the name of god because when people talk about religion they don\'t agree with logical arguments.
Christianity doesn\'t allow it, yet it happens. The violence can be caused by highly non-tolerant religions.
1-14 u believe in what your parents tell you to
15-18 Heraotic
19- rest of your life thir u go back with \"god\" or what ever religon your parents taught you.
replace Heraotic (Heretic?) with \'Poser\' and it\'ll be true for some people.
- Swords
-
bashing Religions
wow, ... i started the 1st religon bashing thread in these fourms :] :P
Note ive got nothing aginst any religions because generaly more religions = more holidays :D (you know its ture)
If satanisum was called something eals it wouldn\'t be so \"targeted\". Calling your self a satanist is like calling your self a \"screw christianityian\" and with the general populace worshiping God ... you get the point
besides to my knowledge, religons tell us to \"love\" or respect one another and \"no war, war bad\", and it really pisses me off when i see people mistreating some one cause of belife or race.
really it does
-
Originally posted by snow_RAveN
besides to my knowledge, religons tell us to \"love\" or respect one another and \"no war, war bad\", and it really pisses me off when i see people mistreating some one cause of belife or race.
really it does
to my knowledge Christianity was the first religion with morals :P
Now it\'s Christianity and Wicca (perhaps more, but I don\'t know any) which tell you to be \"good\" to others.
If you take Odinism, the paradise will be the hall of the slain (Valhalla), which is the palace of immortality, inhabited by the souls of heroes slain in battle.
So it doesn\'t say \"no war, war bad\"
- Swords
-
If you take Odinism, the paradise will be the hall of the slain (Valhalla), which is the palace of immortality, inhabited by the souls of heroes slain in battle.
Lies ! ( sunday school teachings/brain washing:P )
Now it\'s Christianity and Wicca (perhaps more, but I don\'t know any) which tell you to be \"good\" to others.
theres taoisium, budhisum(sp), hinduisum(sp), zen ?, confuses(sp ?) just to name a few ...
i know theres a after life. No, i didn\'t have a near death exp. its a long true ghost story. but their ghost storys and you can\'t trust me can you ?
-
Yeah, I thought there might be something on the east, but I\'m not interested in those religions...
I don\'t believe in the afterlife... well not the way most of the religions show it. Imo there should be reincarnation or if there really is afterlife, it would be rather something like state of nirvana. Just because world where everyone are happy isn\'t possible to come true. Everyone have different view on happiness, so only one paradise isn\'t quite possible.
Pagans would roam the summerland, while brave warriors would spend their time in Valhalla laughing at the Christians who are now close to their cruel Father God :P
But if our views on \"happiness\" are too different, then paradise would mean something different for each of us, thus we would all end up in different realities. But that means loneliness and that means sadness.
but this is going way off-topic :P
- Swords
-
Hmm Christianity tells you to be good to people???
Oops I forgot about the Crusades and the Holy Inquisitors. 8o
A couple of quotes from Adolf Hitler
Hence today I believe that I am acting in accordance with the will of the Almighty Creator:
My feelings as a Christian points me to my Lord and Savior as a fighter.
The way I see it is the main problem with most religions though really isn\'t the religion and it\'s beliefs it is how us as humans choose to use and abuse these beliefs.
-
Christianity itself was against Crusades and Burning Times. The only problem is that it is full of bs like \"all who don\'t believe in The One God will be thrown into hell\" or forcing children to be Christians before they are able to say \"no\" (heh, can you imagine what would happen if a baby would actually say \"no\" on christening? The Church would call it antichrist or possessed xD).
- Swords
-
I\'m going from the start of this topic.
The fact is that most of the time (big) arimes were the most belief-tolerant in the whole society.
Take the Roman empire for example. In the era when the whole society had a belief in the roman (=romanized greek) gods and any other religion was banished or looked down upon, their army was a melting pot of many religions (with a legal background). It was even recommended that the warriors were followers of the Cult of Mithras (a version of the Persian sun-god Mitra), which was waaaaaaay different then the Roman religion. If not for anything else - it was monotheistic and it was a cult.
more info:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mithraism
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mithras
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mithra
-
Originally posted by Draklar
to my knowledge Christianity was the first religion with morals :P
You mean it was the first religion with Christian morals. Morals are subjective, and each religion (even each person) has their own. Even so, many of the beliefs and practices of Christianity existed long before the \'official\' foundation of the Judeo-Christian-Islamic branch, with Mithraism and Zoroastrianism. Not to mention that their \'Golden Rule\' is an ancient ancient thing.
-
Bleh, I meant it was first religion with \"do good\" thing.
But not all religions have their own morals. Simply believing in some gods won\'t give you any morality rules... for example if you believe your sock is a god and that\'s your whole religion then it won\'t have any morals...
- Swords
-
Indeed, I was talking more about the widely-known and already established religions :P As for Christianity being the first to tell people to \"do good,\" you\'re a bit off there. Look at Zoroastrianism: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Zoroastrianism#Principles_of_Zoroastrianism
-
Originally posted by Karyuu
Indeed, I was talking more about the widely-known and already established religions :P As for Christianity being the first to tell people to \"do good,\" you\'re a bit off there. Look at Zoroastrianism: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Zoroastrianism#Principles_of_Zoroastrianism
...from which later on Mithraism developed ;)