PlaneShift
Gameplay => Wish list => Topic started by: WizardsRule on February 01, 2005, 02:11:02 am
-
well without a doubt, alchemy is the changing of normal objects into gold. Simple. What i was planning (crafting + housing point of view) was the higher you are in alchemy, the better golden things you could convert the simple ore into. For example, lvl 1 would be about lvl one but you could work your way up to a wooden sculpture or maybe even (for your house of course) golden floring and portraits. LIst simple list:
lvl1 boot
lvl 2 silverware
lvl 5 plates
lvl 8 stool
lvl 11 chair
lvl 14 couch
lvl 16 table
lvl 20 door
lvl 23 window
lvl 26 paintings
lvl 30 sculpture
lvl 33 chandaleir(sry for bad spelling)
lvl 35 home
-
Are you trying to say these are the things that come out in gold after you use alchemy. If so I don\'t care what level you are - Old Boot != Golden House
-
alchemy...the making of potions num nuts
-
he is talking full metal alchemist, incorperating tat show would be great, if you do it right.
just add the chemical makeup of the items to the game, then you get things made out of the same materials and voeala! it could be a dark way skill, or a red way skill ;)
-
its its own skill
-
Everyones confused the heck outta everyone else, better luck with your next thread, lol
-
Definetly against.
1. At this point of development of your idea, it is clear that high-level alchemists will be getting rich insanely fast, which will cause the imbalance among the unofficial classes.
If such a step will be taken, alchemy will be a must-have skill. While the money \"earned\" through the \"gold-making could be used to create d00ds.
2. I would like to stick to opinion that Alchemist is a potion-making class.
You might want to start to include some arguments about why should your idea be considered, or currently it is much easier either to ignore or flame you.
-
if thats the case, then this was just a pitied sketch. THe skill however, should definately be to make different items out of gold. THis is because the literal meaning of alchemy is the converting of normal objects into gold. The thing is, what shape does the gold take. Thats where this version, better alchemy2 is headed. Reasons to support:
1.you can buy potions just about anywhere already
2. it would be more creative than simple potion makeing
3. allows players to rely on one another more
4. this improves roleplaying
5. along with many others
-
the use of alchemy above a certain lvl could be prohibitted until proved in certain quest
-
1. There can be potions better then what shops sell
2. I have to agree on that, but just using gold alone isn\'t fair, and since we can only carry 10 gold anyway it should probably use alot more materials.
3. Players will only rely on those who are useful, if you can make an antidote potion from the local poisonous plants they\'ll be glad to have you along.
4. This really depends.. anything that is good for roleplaying is probably bad for Power Levelers :)
5. There probably can be many more things, and a possible name would be Material Alchemy. Least if you are going to start mixing solid items together.
Full Metal Alchemist is very far off from traditional alchemists which makes various potions. You can\'t turn Coal into Gold for example, but maybe just to be nice, you can turn 6-10 coal into 1 gold ore. If the resulting item is worth more then the materials used to make it then it\'s not really balance/fair anymore.
-
well dont forget this is a fantasy massively multiplayer ROLEPLAYNG game after all.
On the 10 gold issue, for upper lvl alchemy it should take multiple loads of gold. This will stop heavy lvlers and you have until update to use the items, just as long as you dont log out.
-
Originally posted by WizardsRule
if thats the case, then this was just a pitied sketch. THe skill however, should definately be to make different items out of gold. THis is because the literal meaning of alchemy is the converting of normal objects into gold. The thing is, what shape does the gold take. Thats where this version, better alchemy2 is headed. Reasons to support:
1.you can buy potions just about anywhere already
2. it would be more creative than simple potion makeing
3. allows players to rely on one another more
4. this improves roleplaying
5. along with many others
\"Alchemy: the ancient attempt to create the Philosopher\'s Stone and mutable gold. In the West, mainly of Egyptian origin and Arabic elaboration, but also with Gnostic roots, especially in the idea that the world soul was trapped in matter. Beginning with the prima materia, the alchemist heated, cooked, and washed the substance until it passed through the four stages of nigredo, albedo, cinitritas, and rubedo and became the Stone. Jung saw the opus alchymicum, the work of alchemy, as an unconscious projection of the process of individuation, which starts with an unconscious content (prima materia) and end with the realization of the Self symbol (Philosopher\'s Stone).
The alchemical process, which began in the spring and ended in the fall, was an extended act of active imagination (meditatio) fired by awareness and libido. Alchemy also bridged Gnosticism and psychology. Jung saw in it a historical counterpart to his psychology of the collective unconscious. Alchemy finally died out in the eighteenth century. \" (c) http://www.tearsofllorona.com/jungdefs.html
Do you see anything about turning (FURNITURE?!) into gold?
Here is a little history about it if you want... http://www.massagemag.com/2002/issue96/history96.htm
Point of Alchemy was not to specificly transform a substance into gold, as much as to transform it into a noble metal, which included gold, platinum and silver. So, are you sure you want to try to transform siverware?
And now, answers to your reasons.
1. It would be a part of roleplay, more competition among the players, more real it is.
2. How come?
3. How?
4. How does mass making of gold improves roleplaying?
5. Which are pretty much unreasonable as well as those you\'ve just wrote.
Explain what you mean in you double-post, please.
P.S. Why the heck do you mix an anime series with PS?
-
It sais change metals into gold in the shape of the itms not turn the items into gold.
EX:
3 iron + 2platinum+ 3 gold = golden stool
In simple, read next time before you speak
-
Then, I would prefer to simply call it crafting.
P.S. In simple, maybe you should write more apprehensible.
-
a magical crafting if u get my drift.(not really)
-
A question.. why does it HAVE to be a golden item? What if I wanted to make a marble statue of Talad and all I had was iron and platinum?
-
Alchemy is the science of transmuting base metals into gold. Thats all alchemy is. Anything else should have a different name. Go look up alchemy in your favorite dictionary.
-
Quite an improvement here... We started off with \"alchemy\", then switched to \"better alchemy2\" and finally got to \"magical crafting\"...
-
wut that supposed to mean
-
It means you\'ve completely changed your idea :P
-
nothings changed except the wording for different individuals to be able to grasp the concept
-
search button omg4evah
Alchemy is more science then magic, and it shouldnt consist of making golden houses out of nothing.
-
its more or less the concept
p.s. If you payed attention higher lvl spelss had to have done certain quests and needed a large sum of materials to use.
-
I would hate alchemy of this kind, I\'d rather stay to the more fantasy version of potion making... a good system like Morrowind would be nice to see... thats the alchemy I would want to see, it would add some decent role-playing, with the collecting of plants, which depending on the plant type, grows back in about a week to maybe a month for the rarer, good plants...
-
that seems more like a herboligy of some sort rather than alchemy(if thats even a word)
-
Herbology, or Herb Lore.
-
From a gameplay perspective:
Alchemy -> Making gold just doesn\'t make sense, it becomes a \'get rich quick\' method. Even if you work hard to restrain it, it\'ll provide the means to fund it\'s own progression.
Alchemy as potion making is probably what was originally intended, and is the common definition used in a fantasy setting. It\'s a useful (but not overpowered) skill.
For the record, no alchemist ever succeeded in making gold, but what they learned trying was a valuable contribution to human knowledge (Metallurgy, Chemistry).
1. Can create them cheaper yourself, and may be able to create otherwise unavailable potions.
2. How so? All you make is gold.
3. Huh?
4. See above.
5. See above.
-
i dont care what you call it, its still a better alchemy for a fantasy setting then the making of items from gold and stuff... i dont see throwing 3 gold away to make a chair, which would really need wood and iron for nails if you were doing it yourway
potion making alchemy is also a form of alchemy, the creation of something new from other items... it wouldnt really be herb lore, or herbology, since those two only incorporate the knowledge of herbs, not the use and mixture of them...
.. I would really hate to see the alchemy you have in your eyes, because in so many ways it is flawed...
-
Yes, Alchemists did attempt transmutation of metals into gold, but they also worked on life prolonging, the search for ways to heal diseases(espesially they hoped to make a universal cure), and to improve the mind. Pure alchemy tends to involve the use of compounds that is of a non-biological type(though they may be of organic origin, like alcohols and coal).
So, Alchemy does not need to involve the search a way to transmute metals, any kind of study of the ways different compounds and chemicals react and how they may be used would go under alchemy.
-
change one material into another...
-
Originally posted by Altharion
change one material into another...
Was this a response to my post, another post, or a general response to the topic of the thread? If it is a response to a spesific post it is good to quote/name the one you responed to, so that that person can know.
If it was me you responded to:
Transmutation is the art of changing one element into another, but my point was that the attempts to make valuable metals out of less valuable elements was only part of what alchemists was trying to do, and they were never really successful in that either, it would take many centuries before someone succsessfuly transmuted an element, and it is not really something one can do to earn money, its just to expensive in relation to the amount of valuable elements you can make.
They did however lay some foundation for what is now called chemistry. It is perfectly within the scope of an alchemist to make potions. Herbalists would be able to make potions too, but they would be made differently, for example by boiling the plant in water.
-
stricting itself into only potion making is not good.
-
Alchemy is already in the skill list.
It\'s probably safe to assume that the devs have devised, or are in the process of devising a use for the skill that won\'t allow for players with a high level in that skill to make millions in a short time.
Back on topic: Personally, i think that the Alchemy skill should not be limited to potions/medicines, or chemical weapons (possibly at a basic level weapons could be vials of various acids(which the player would have to learn to create) which would shatter on contact and burn the target?).
*It should also cover at the very least a minor form of metallurgy(sp?), as without that knowledge, players wanting to make their own weapons and armour, or set up a business using the weapon/armour making skills would be limited to basic iron weapons and armour, would they not?
(surely it\'s better to have the knowledge and ability to transmute materials, eg: combining iron and coal under the right circumstances to create steel.. bad example, i know)
feel free to point out any problems, or shoot my idea out of the sky :P
* or would that come under the blacksmith skill?
-
alchemists never tried to make boots and chairs from elements, their main goal was to make silver, gold or platinum.. never a boot... with their research came the knowledge of potion making, they mixed different substances in their studies and began making many potions....
they never tried to take 2 iron, 3 gold and 2 coal to make a chair? besides in an alchemists mind that would be worthless , alchemy is not really a magic, but the use of metals, elements and different substances to make items into a valueable metal...
sticking to true alchemy and leaving it at turning metals into more valueable metals and the making of potions... would be best, but the first is just another way of powerleveling and making loads of money, leaving the second which adds role-playing and not a big way of making money...
i just see that several peoples views on alchemy are wrong, the creation of items(chairs, etc.) from elements is not a part of what true alchemy is...
so stop watching full metal alchemist and learn what alchemy really is...
a few good games revolving around alchemy and the philosipher\'s stone are the Zork series, i would recommend Zork: Nemisis, but you\'d never find it anywhere, it being such an old game...
also, alchemists also tried to use the four elements, earth, fire, water and wind, in their searches as well...
-
It would be really iunteresting to see the effect of wizard\'s original alchemy on a free market economy.(which planeshift doesn\'t have yet...). the result would be total economic colapse:gold would become worthless very quickly, but in the time before it did.....
the economic shock would take quite a while to sort out, and in the meantime, you have no economy, which allows takeover by foriegn powers(not that there is any major political power besides the government of Yliakum...)
I would love to see such an alchemy system implemented, perhaps later in the game, when there is a more \"natural\" economic system, just to study the collapse(anyone remember the 1930s?)
-
guess alchemy2(as it will be further known) will just have to wait. Oh well.
-
Originally posted by druke
alchemy...the making of potions num nuts
if only you where right :) its actualy you who comes out dumb on this one.. alchemy is the transmutation of matter and other elemental sciences ;) i would love to see REAL alchemy implemented in PS..
\"Potionmaking by any other name is still potion making\"
PLEASE don\'t tell me you have alchemy in a game if you really just mis-named potionmaking to sound cool :P i have never seen true alchemy in any game ever so
-
why not just transmutation? 8)
-
I never saw a more diametrically opposed posts.
You have historical perspective of an alchemist which is a sort of spiritual pre-chemist. And you have the modern interpretation of an alchemist as a magician of transmutation and immortality.
One thing that alchemist were very involved with was the reformation of the medical professions during the renaissance. At that time western medicine was steeped in mysticism and folklore. Many alchemist were the first to use scientific methods to practice their craft. They worked with minerals and plants to create a variety of restorative drinks. Which sounds to me like a potion.
But we are talking about a game. So let?s talk about what we would like to see come about from the alchemist skill.
Transmutation would work, but as previously posted it would have to be carefully designed so that the economy would not get all whacked.
-
Originally posted by Exaero_Fiero
2. I would like to stick to opinion that Alchemist is a potion-making class.
Umm then what does an Apothacary do :P
-
ALthough I don\'t have any behind-the-scenes knowledge, I would think that an apothecary would deal in poisons and healing concoctions (i.e. a pharmacist), while an Alchemist is closer to what we would call a chemist, someone who focuses their efforts at manipulating the behaviour of substances.
The art of making objects out of gold would definitely be a crafting skill (metalsmith or goldsmith). As for the value of gold, we don\'t really know what role it plays in the economy of Yliakum, do we? It is probably not as valuable there as it is here.
-
When I think of an Alchemist, I think of instantly turning raw ore into weapons...bronze to steel...that sorta thing...not potion making...
-
alchemy means transmuting, wether it be a sword into a steel bar or herbs into a potions . its all alchemy. i think alchemy should be plants to potions...i dont like this ore melting stuff...if you want ore, just mine.
-
Firstly I would like to say that if in WizardsRule\'s idea of alchemy, gold values would come down instantly, gold would be easely made and maybe gold would worth less than 1 tria;
In 2nd place, if you check the the NPCs that sell potion they train Alchemy (hint);
In 3rd place:
1.you can buy potions just about anywhere already
2. it would be more creative than simple potion makeing
3. allows players to rely on one another more
4. this improves roleplaying
5. along with many others
1. That\'s wrong, some day there won\'t be NPC merchants, the Devs are planing to do a world governed by players, just like in RL;
2. Nope, it\'ll be the oposite of creative, everything would be turned to gold;
3. Er... dunno why... why?
4. NO it\'s arruins role playing
5. ???
Ok, this is just what I think... don\'t get pissed or upset WizardsRule... but that idea just doesn\'t fit
-
the whole gold issue, why don\'t we do that whole Full Metal thing, sorta...like it takes a great deal of an item to make a little bit of gold...you know?
-
I have seen other games solve this buy you just getting the gold value of the item that you get at the store. So? In other words instead of going to the store to sell some thing alchemy gives you the amount of coin you would get if you did. Its really only useful when your carrying to much stuff or you have a item not many stores will buy. Dose that sound like some thing that might solve that?
I know what you?re saying about Metals to other Metals being more like alchemy. In real life alchemist had more to do with finding ways to make more steal then on making new herbal remedies. But you have to remember it?s a game and in games stuffs turned upside down and Alchemy starts meaning some thing a bit different.
-
so what is it ganna be full metal or herblaw
-
how about both...couldn\'t hurt...and it would solve alot of problems
-
hmm well to give it an edge perhaps you could make it so that at very high levels you can even get a little more then in the stores ;)
I mean have the amoun of gold be what you would have to pay for it when you buy it or something. Nothing major but just giving someone who spends a lot on it get a little something back for it.
-
not bad at all...now if only everything could be settled this easy. :(