PlaneShift
Gameplay => Wish list => Topic started by: Drey on June 06, 2005, 06:43:33 pm
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i\'m not sure if this has been said, i checked a bit searching proved useless.
what i would like is a message thing when a guild member joins the game, like you get when a member of your buddy list joins the game.
when i think about it it sounds like a lot of work but i don know...
now revision!! \\o/
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Add your guild members to your buddy list silly :p
i have all 40 odd Explorers on mine, active and inactive.
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I, like Drey, am also too lazy to add everyone to my list... :P
I tend to keep only people I actually talk to in my list, so it would be nice to be notified when a guildmember shows up. It would be a nice substitue for smacking the guild button every ten minutes...
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Originally posted by DaveG
I tend to keep only people I actually talk to in my list...
You don\'t talk to your own guildmembers? :P
On a more serious note, I too think that a message announcing guildmembers would be nice.
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Originally posted by Karyuu
Originally posted by DaveG
I tend to keep only people I actually talk to in my list...
You don\'t talk to your own guildmembers? :P
Some guilds are gigantic. (Dragon Council anyone...?) Mine\'s fairly small, but half the people in it are never on when I am...
On a side note, the guild list gives rough locations. It might be nice to see this in the buddy list and notifications as well.
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Locations..? No, I don\'t think so. To me that\'s a bit too much info up for grabs, for random strangers. \"Want to know where someone is? Add them to your buddy list!\" With guilds it works because you\'re supposed to be in a trusted group environment, and guild leaders (or other members) can plan things around each others\' locations.
So I\'m highly against that suggestion, DaveG.
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basically what Karyuu is trying to say is stick to my master plan and i agree.
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I keep anyone, friend or foe, in the buddy lists... so location would be put out the door.
But simply for guildmembers, I think this would be a great idea as I don\'t always add all guildmembers to my buddy list...
Hmm... Next time I\'m back in the realm, I\'m going to have to update that list...
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...didn\'t think of that...
Yeah, universal tracking might have it\'s drawbacks... :rolleyes:
Oh well, back to the drawing board on that one. :P
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Originally posted by Drey
i\'m not sure if this has been said, i checked a bit searching proved useless.
Im sure I already saw such request... but the problem is that there is no good title so... search for \"guild\", \"join\" or \"message\" wont be usefull...
Im in favour of a message which warn you that a member arrived in the game... off course... because it looks so obvious!
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Yeah, and there could be an option for people. With a list, where you could add peoples names, who you wanted to see your location on their buddy list. So you only allow certain people. Yeah I realize thats alot of work...
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Or you could have something in the options that reads: \"Would you like to reveal your location to players on your buddy list?\" with a checkbox, or something similar. Hm.
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Karyuu, it could actually say \'do you want eighteen fanboys chasing you down to akkaio because you showed your cute picture in the forum?\'
:p
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Which is why by default, that box will be unchecked :D
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lucky for me i can find you and chase you neways :3
Personally i p[robably wouldnt take notice of a Guild member notification message, i automatically click on the guild button anyway, see whos on, do a /who to make sure everyone is suitable, and i skip down the road to find my friends, a major part of the fun is the hunt ;)
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How would you explain this roleplay wise? Somehow you\'d know where ALL your guildmates were, at all times...
Magic! Yes, magic is always the answer! ;) :)
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Hi everyone,
Perhaps the guildmembers could be automatically added to the buddylist?
And in the options there could be buttons like
\"show your location to:
- guildmembers
- people in buddylist
- local group
- everyone\"
(so everyone could locate you over a new command like /loc [name])
With this everyone should be happy ;)
For big guilds, it could also be practical to implement a sort-mechanism, with which you can sort after name, location, last login, or even distance from your location.
Bye,
Amogorkon
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It makes no sense to show your location to everyone. Where\'s the RP in that? o_O
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Thats not right.
If there is a merchant or some other person with official interest (a king for example) it is quite easy to find out his location, even in rl.
So why make things more complicated?
Besides, i think that /who also shows to which guild secret guild-members do belong, is much more unlogical.
cu,
Amogorkon
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I\'m against a general location shown to everyone, or even buddies...
I do favor a realistic approach (most of the time), as in life it can be a real pain to find anyone, especially in a world that has no fast method of communication (IC).
Merchant and kings (people who are important to society) are easily found because they often don\'t travel a lot, unlike most of our community.
So... either you get a messenger bird, like my character now has, or something along the lines :)
Guildmates... I\'ll take it halfway there, I\"m indifferent to that. I don\'t mind particulairly, but it does have its advantages.
Now, I realize the necessity of a /who command, or at least, that it is useful. But, I think that the player should have a choice whether to show that they are part of a guild or not (considering assassins and the like, or people who don\'t wish to be associated with another guild temporarily).
As for showing that a member arrived, it would be useful for new members who just joined...
I don\'t see any problem with the guildmember entering the realm notice.
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(Player-) Merchants doesnt travel? Thats new to me ^^
It is wrong, that this world has no fast method of communication (take /tell for example).
So your point is to make the game more realistic. Let me think about it...
What about magic? There could be \"mindstones\" (think of the \"communicators\" in star trek) which could be used to locate other people with activated mindstones. To be visible, the mindstone have to be activated what makes mana drain (really) slowly. When using the stone to locate someone, you have to use a bunch of mana to get the direction and the distance to the specified user.
Later when maps will be available, there could be a magical map where all people with activated mindstones will be shown.
With this method, the user could choose whether he wants to be located by everyone or nobody.
The advantage: It is more realistic and logical then the other proposal. It also could be combined with other spells which uses the mindstone of the victim to locate it over a great distance. Also a magical delivery and much more could be established with it.
The disadvantage: The user cannot choose to be visible only to specific people. But that is realistic too... When you shout, everyone will hear you, foe and friend...
Bye,
amogorkon
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Merchants doesnt travel? Thats new to me ^^
That\'s true, but as far as I know, the majority of merchants prefer to stay in their home town, or wherever they live.
The point being is, that a travelling merchant, people won\'t know where they are often, only a general direction, most of the time.
It is wrong, that this world has no fast method of communication (take /tell for example).
So your point is to make the game more realistic. Let me think about it...
What about magic? There could be \"mindstones\" (think of the \"communicators\" in star trek) which could be used to locate other people with activated mindstones. To be visible, the mindstone have to be activated what makes mana drain (really) slowly. When using the stone to locate someone, you have to use a bunch of mana to get the direction and the distance to the specified user.
I was talking about IC, the only things so far that I\'ve seen are purely roleplaying, involving birds and stones as well. (Not that I have a problem with that ;) )
In regards to your magical stone idea, that\'s a good one, but I\'d still prefer to use my messenger bird instead :)
Each to their own, however :)
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Originally posted by amogorkon
It is wrong, that this world has no fast method of communication (take /tell for example).
Actually it\'s entirely right ;) Fast communication and communication across great distances is illogical unless, as you stated, magic or messengers are involved.
What about magic? There could be \"mindstones\" (think of the \"communicators\" in star trek) which could be used to locate other people with activated mindstones. To be visible, the mindstone have to be activated what makes mana drain (really) slowly.
Later when maps will be available, there could be a magical map where all people with activated mindstones will be shown.
I hope you don\'t think that automaps will be available, as they won\'t. All maps will be player/charactere created, thus the Cartography skill. To see the locations of \"mindstones,\" the maps will have to be drawn with magic along with the usual materials.
The advantage: It is more realistic and logical then the other proposal. It also could be combined with other spells which uses the mindstone of the victim to locate it over a great distance. Also a magical delivery and much more could be established with it.
More realistic..? Magical delivery? Well... :\\ I don\'t know about that. To me it seems but a plan for the player to do less work moving the character around, instead typing mindless commands to automatically find the correct person or give the correct item to a person miles and miles and miles away. I\'m against that, personally, because it eliminates the need to actually travel and explore. You must admit that.
But eh...
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I hope you don\'t think that automaps will be available, as they won\'t. All maps will be player/charactere created, thus the Cartography skill. To see the locations of \"mindstones,\" the maps will have to be drawn with magic along with the usual materials
Thats what i am thinking of. You create a map by using cartography. You can only see the landscape on it.
But later on you can upgrade your map by magic. I dont think at an automap, it`s more like a radar. For locating a single person you need perhaps 5 mana. To use your magic for locate all users of mindstones in a specific range AND write in the map, you need 50 (?) mana. The locations of the people in the map could be written there till the user deletes them (like a screenshot of an automap) or is updating the map with another burst.
To me it seems but a plan for the player to do less work moving the character around, instead typing mindless commands to automatically find the correct person or give the correct item to a person miles and miles and miles away. I\'m against that, personally, because it eliminates the need to actually travel and explore. You must admit that.
Naturally such combinations of spells should be very expensive in mana. Thats an argument against \"typing mindless commands\" because you have to be carefull what you do and when.
And naturally such long-range spells have to be cast really long plus they need a long time to effect.
I think about a hunting snake - spell: The caster have to combine nature magic+animal training+locating magic > a snake which \"search and destroy\" over a long distance. Beeing cast, it`s like a creature which is perhaps twice as fast as a player. The snake will use the mindstone of the victim to find it. Having found it, it will unleash a very nasty venom.
Such a spell is easily interrupted when the victim deactivates (most probably not knowing it is beeing chased) the mindstone, there could be a warning to the victim at a range of ~50m \"You hear people yelling and screaming about a big snake moving\". Then the victim could have enough time to prepare a defense-spell, and so on...
Thats only one idea about combining different ways. With every spell of this category (good and bad for the target) comes the probability that the spell is somehow interrupted (by deactivating the mindstone, other players, a coincident produced by the game)...
I dont think thats a plan for beeing generally lazy. I think, these spells could bring much movement into the game, as the usage of the stones has its pros and cons...
Bye,
amogorkon
Edit: The messenger bird - idea could be combined with the idea of mine. As it is not necessary to deliever messages (because of /tell), there could be a bird to deliever packages of items. The bird also needs something to orientate (the stone). And the delievery could also be interrupted like the snake, all the same...
With this, people have to be really carefull what and when to send...
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i made people talking. all these ideas about maps and stuff and stuff are all good, but then there are the people who make the game and have to work out how to do all this stuff and yeah.
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I didnt say I want it right now ^^
At least there have to exist the basics and after that the combinations. But if the possibilities were not discussed before realizing the basics, such \"big\" proposals could be too late at a certain point in development. Thats why I propose such things too early rather than too late ;)
I hope you understand me :)
bye,
amogorkon
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Proposals of decent ideas would always be welcome, I\'d think, if only for discussion\'s sake ;)
It doesn\'t seem an entirely bad plan if limits are placed on it, as you\'ve stated, with a large mana drain. Heck, there could be characters that specialize in locations and get \"commissioned\" by others who lack such abilities to find this or that. I think that\'s fine.
As for mindstone-chat, I\'m still not as sure. We will always need the /tell command because we need easy ways of contacting individuals OOC, either to ask questions about RP, or to get help, or to give warnings. I don\'t think /tell will disappear, nor should it. It\'s incredibly useful for coordinating between characters: \"/tell someone I\'m at the city gates now, we left off our RP session here last night. Want to meet here once more, or should I \'stumble\' upon your character again somewhere else?\" Or \"/tell someone I\'m playing a character that has a tiny bit of limited telepathy. Can you give me a small trivial piece of information about your own character, so that mine may give it back to yours IC as roleplay \'proof\'?\" RP whispering to someone close to you is another problem. How would you go about doing this if the /tell command is removed?
Good roleplayers already find ways to RP /tells, Kariloy\'s stone suggestion being one. So all in all, /tell will stay. Implementing yet another type of chat that will drain mana seems silly, even if it is done for roleplay\'s sake. People will ignore it and go back to /tell. Thus I think the mindstone-chat idea will not work.
As for giving items to another over great distances using magic, boy should that take away a large chunk of mana. And I mean huge, increasing exponentially with the weight or number of the object, so that only the very skilled or talented can even consider such a thing. But they\'d make great RP messengers, ignoring the fact that they\'d have to get quite a reputation as trustworthy for new patrons ;) So that\'s not a bad idea if it is done correctly, I think.
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Good roleplayers already find ways to RP /tells, Kariloy\'s stone suggestion being one. So all in all, /tell will stay. Implementing yet another type of chat that will drain mana seems silly, even if it is done for roleplay\'s sake. People will ignore it and go back to /tell. Thus I think the mindstone-chat idea will not work.
Mindstone-chat? I wasnt saying I want to abolish the /tell command :)
The mindstone-idea was a more realistic approach about locating other people, not basically to communicate. When you have your (purified) mindstone active, others are able to locate you, for good and bad.
In another thread was an idea about items on which a char could focuse his magic to cast more powerful spells. A mindstone could be counted to this category.
And I mean huge, increasing exponentially with the weight or number of the object, so that only the very skilled or talented can even consider such a thing.
Increasing exponentially? That would be too harsh, I think. When you think about a messenger-creature: You must consider that you need mana to conjure the creature (you need constantly mana to keep it) and you need mana to \"train\", \"hypnotize\" or how do you want to call it. Both should be very mana-consuming. But as the creature is on his own when it is moving, it does not drain more mana from you, or how would you explain an exponential mana-drain?
With my explanation, you need much mana to conjure and to train it. The constant mana-drain results from keeping the creature under control, not from the transport. But when you consider that the spell will fail if the target turns his stone off, the risk to fail cause of random events (messenger-bird flies against a tree or is caught by another creature) and the risk that another player disrupts (to steal) it, transport over big distances is not recommended. You can try but most probably you will fail. And that without an exponential cost.
Hope you understand me now :)
cu,
amogorkon
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Originally posted by amogorkon
The mindstone-idea was a more realistic approach about locating other people, not basically to communicate.
I think someone here mentioned that the /tell command should be removed, but it might\'ve been someone else, or in a somewhat similar thread :D I think I got it mostly from:
It is wrong, that this world has no fast method of communication (take /tell for example).
My main point is that if you implement another type of communication besides /tell that will drain mana, it will not be used at all, I think for rather obvious reasons.
Increasing exponentially? That would be too harsh, I think. When you think about a messenger-creature: You must consider that you need mana to conjure the creature (you need constantly mana to keep it) and you need mana to \"train\", \"hypnotize\" or how do you want to call it. Both should be very mana-consuming. But as the creature is on his own when it is moving, it does not drain more mana from you, or how would you explain an exponential mana-drain?
The more items you need to transport, or the more the weight item(s), the larger the increase in mana required. It\'s simple. A tiny conjured creature is not going to carry five broadswords for you from Hydlaa to Ojaveda - you\'ll need something larger. A lot larger, and thus you\'ll need a lot more mana. Also, you\'ve posted:
The constant mana-drain results from keeping the creature under control, not from the transport.
And the larger the creature, the more mana and will and concentration it would take to keep the creature under control, even during flight. Thus the increasing drain.
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... sigh. :rolleyes: Another browser misshap.
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I think someone here mentioned that the /tell command should be removed, but it might\'ve been someone else, or in a somewhat similar thread :D I think I got it mostly from: Quote: It is wrong, that this world has no fast method of communication (take /tell for example).
Sorry, if I didnt make myself clear. I can only repeat myself: I dont want /tell to be removed and mindstones should only be used to locate and spells related to that. (The statement cited above was in another context, i didnt even thought about removing /tell)
A tiny conjured creature is not going to carry five broadswords for you from Hydlaa to Ojaveda - you\'ll need something larger.
OK, you are right. So... what about different levels of transporting-creatures? Not a linear or exponential increase of the manadrain per weight, but a gradual?
My proposal:
tiny transport: max weight 5 / 5 mana
medium transport: max weight 20 / 40 mana
big transport: max 50 / 150 mana
massive transport: everything the conjurer can carry (perhaps even the conjurer himself could be carried) / 350 mana
cu,
amogorkon
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Not bad! Though boy are we off topic from the original feature request :D I like these last two suggestions though. Hurrah!
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As we now have an acceptable solution (*sweatmoping*), we can go back on topic :D
OK, we have a realistic approach for locating people. How to combine it with the proposal first posted?
There could be an option in the buddylist to (magically)\"listen\" when a specific user turns on his mindstone. You will be notified when this person has turned it on, but to locate her, you have to actively search by using your mindstone. And again there could be sort of counter-spell which notifies the target that it is beeing located...
You could also think of some spells to camouflage yourself or even to make a magical \"dummy\", which will show others a wrong location from you.
These mechanisms will not only prevent foes to find you, but also your friends. So you have to be careful when to use what.
With that, I would also prefer to treat all people the same more or less (online-notifying, locating, ...) . And if one would want to have an advantage in fights or guildcoordination, he would have to use the traditional /tell or to use spells. But as spells are less work then typing and doing-by-yourself, there must be a disadvantage, which I see in their uncertainty (counterspells, and so on).
What do you think of it?
bye,
amogorkon
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Originally posted by amogorkon:
There could be an option in the buddylist to (magically)\"listen\" when a specific user turns on his mindstone.
I agree that the buddy list could use more options ;) Perhaps a glowing stone icon will appear next to someone\'s name if his or her mindstone is turned on? Clicking on that icon will initiate some sort if icon-change (such as the stone \"pulsating\" or perhaps becoming a different color) to let you know that the mana-drain has begun, and the other individual\'s location (though I\'m thinking something general, nothing like /pos) will be shown under/by/next to his or her name. Clicking on the icon again will stop the drain, and the location will disappear from the buddy list.
As for the counter-spell, I don\'t think it\'s really necessary. For one, even though you may carry a mindstone, it will not always be \"activated.\" Second, mindstones will be shared between players, and not automatically given to everyone, including people you haven\'t ever met. I\'m thinking perhaps such a mindstone could be bought from shops of a magical nature and be shown somewhere in your inventory once it is in your possession, though not automatically turned \"on.\" Clicking on the icon in your inventory will activate or deactive it, depending on the circumstance. Thus if you do not want to be tracked, simply turn it off. Then have a command akin to /share_location , that will work only if both parties have the necessary stones. And perhaps the greater the distance between characters, the greater the chance of the mindstones failing to provide an adequate location. I think to find out -who- is doing the tracking should require even more work (and another mana-drain). So it becomes a bit more complicated.
You could also think of some spells to camouflage yourself or even to make a magical \"dummy\", which will show others a wrong location from you.
Initially the mindstone idea was to share between friends or acquaintances, but I see nothing wrong with using it for evil purposes, such as deception. I can\'t think at the moment of a situation in which such a camouflage task might be necessary for a character, but it\'s a reasonable option. As this is becoming rather deep and complex however, it seems that a character might spend all of his or her time just practicing on being a \"location mage\". I\'m not sure how that might interfere with the already-established ways.
And if one would want to have an advantage in fights or guildcoordination, he would have to use the traditional /tell or to use spells.
Agreed, though I think that guildleaders should still be allowed to see the locations of members. A bit OOC, but often necessary.
But as spells are less work then typing and doing-by-yourself, there must be a disadvantage, which I see in their uncertainty (counterspells, and so on).
I\'m no longer sure that it\'s less work :P Considering the amount of time, training, dedication, practice, and failures that a character must endure to become proficient at location magic, it doesn\'t seem quite as easy as using /tell and asking where another is. But it\'s roleplay, and it\'s fun :)
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I fully agree with your proposal about the buddylist :)
As for the counter-spell, I don\'t think it\'s really necessary. For one, even though you may carry a mindstone, it will not always be \"activated.\"
Hm, I thought about camouflage from beeing tracked by chars you dont want to know your position... It wouldnt make much sense to have an extra spell to detain everybody to locate you, since deactivating the mindstone will do that without manadrain ;)
Second, mindstones will be shared between players, and not automatically given to everyone, including people you haven\'t ever met.
I didnt consider the sharing of mindstones... interesting idea :)
I disagree that mindstone wont be given to people you never met. Naturally it wont be an automatic item, but everyone can buy a sword or a glyph, why not a mindstone?
So persons could have you in their buddylist and listens to your mindstone, but you dont even know that they exist...
I think to find out -who- is doing the tracking should require even more work (and another mana-drain). So it becomes a bit more complicated.
Agreed :)
I\'m no longer sure that it\'s less work :P Considering the amount of time, training, dedication, practice, and failures that a character must endure to become proficient at location magic, it doesn\'t seem quite as easy as using /tell and asking where another is. But it\'s roleplay, and it\'s fun :)
You didnt consider that there also can be many items which could help you in training, give you skills...
Take the idea of a magic cap to camouflage for example... Or a magical map which can be used without special knowledge but only with manadrain. There are many possible ways to gain magical advantages without the disadvantages you said... but they should be very hard to get (quests, money...). Considering that all players can be happy, not only professional mages :)
cu,
amogorkon
Edit: An example where a dummy could be useful:
You remember my approach about the hunter-snake? The aggressor uses much energy to locate and attack you... but its the wrong position :D
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Originally posted by Darkblade
I keep anyone, friend or foe, in the buddy lists...
Therefore, I would like to be able to \"flag\" or \"group\" the entries there. I would like to be able to add categories to the entries there.
This may require additional buttons to the buddy list, and a whole \"Edit buddy\" window. Custom categories would probably too much to ask, but a few to chose from should be suitable, like:
- Friend
- Foe
- Guild mate
- Business partner
- Leader
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i thnk this guild join will be a good idea if we move it closer to rping.
what if every guild develop their own way of keeping their member identified and under communication?
mage guilds could develop their own spells for that?
other could get items?, insignias or so..