PlaneShift
Gameplay => Wish list => Topic started by: Princess Aelya on December 03, 2002, 02:33:19 am
-
since this game encourages RP, i think instead of displaying a name above someones head it should appear as \"someone\" or \"a male/female \" for example... someone ive never seen before walks up to me in-game. nor have they ever seen me. instead of looking above each others head to immediately identify each other, it would be more realistic to only have the names appear when introductions are made. then the names will appear above our heads. maybe there should be a way to \"request\" a persons name. if the person grants the request he/she will automatically state his/her name to the person who requested their name. and only then would a name appear. i think a system like this would add a significant amount to a more RP expirience.
-
I agree that name shouldn\'t be displayed. I don\'t think that race/sex should be either. Not having names does do a lot for RP, plus it also yields possibilty for disgusing oneself. The only problem with not showing names or anything, would be that the system would need a lot of variety in charecter creation. Like custom faces, height, weight, etc.
-
Originally posted by Aduin
I agree that name shouldn\'t be displayed. I don\'t think that race/sex should be either. Not having names does do a lot for RP, plus it also yields possibilty for disgusing oneself. The only problem with not showing names or anything, would be that the system would need a lot of variety in charecter creation. Like custom faces, height, weight, etc.
well...why not race and sex? realisticly you can look at someone and immediatly be able to tell if they are male or female. unless they are completed covered with robes or something. same thing goes with race.
and please explain why a more advanced character creation system would be needed. I dont see what character descriptions has to do with names.
-
That is the best and most original idea i\'ve heard in a long time. It would definitely encourage roleplay, and add to the experience of walkling through a town full of strangers, as oppose to being in an area full of friends.
I really hope the dev\'s take note of this.
I played a MUD the other day in which, when creating your character, you have to enter a one line description of your characters physical appearance.
eg. A short stout dwarf, with blue eyes and long, dirty blonde hair.
The description was not allowed to contain anything about what you character is wearing or holding, because these things can change over time. The description had to describe your permanent physical appearance. There was also a limit to 120 letters in the description.
Maybe in planeshift, whe you see someone, above their head you see \" \", then when you click on them, you see their description, and then after introductions have been made, you can see their name above their head.
-
You argue my point for me Aelya. If you can look at someone in game and tell their race/gender, why would you need it displayed above their head? Plus, lets say someone, a rogue for example, doesn\'t want their identity to be known. If they wear a hooded cloak, you wouldn\'t know anything about them, and wouldn\'t be able to identify them later.
Also, about the detailed charecter creation. If there is a lot of variety in charecter creation, such as custom facial features, height, weight, hair color, skin tone, etc. Then you will be able to associate peoples names with their faces. This can only work in this system, because in a system like EQ where only a few faces are possible, people could get confused as to who is actually who. By not knowing a name, or anything, you would actually have to introduce yourself. If the other person drops a fake name, you won\'t know, unless you do some investigating. This really opens the door for political intrigue, and espianage and stuff.
-
I like that last version best Silverblade. Not putting up race and sex leaves you with what? \"Hey You\" ,\"Whatsyerface\" or something to that effect ;)
But seriously I like the roleplay aspect of this idea, and I think an \"introduction\" function would be a neat addition to the game. When grouping all characters would have to introduce themselves first.
This is not a required feature in EQ and I have occasionally been invited to a group with no prior conversation. Goes like this : Soanso is inspecting you. Soandso invites you to join a group. Press FOLLOW to agree, DISBAND to cancel. So now I have been inspected without permission which I hate ( an ongoing debate in EQ communities) and someone has decided to trust me with their virtual life based soley on my equipment. This indicates to me that the person probably isnt a good groupmember and I always refuse.
I think introductions would force people to put a little more consideration into gameplay as well as enhance the roleplay aspect.
-
hmm i see your point aduin. so are you saying nothing at all should appear at first.
-
I agree completely Fiere, and by not giving any information out about a person, it really forces people to get in charecter, and make the introductions. A function to do introductions I dislike, because it is too informal. To truely enforce the RP side of things, people should actually talk to eachother.
-
Great idea, Aelya!
This would be another reason for people to actually try to roleplay, and another way you could prevent d00ds from invading.
This could easily allow thieves to go undercover, as they could refuse to let people know their real name, and just tell them their alias.
I think that if the game doesn\'t give us enough graphics to tell whether something is male or female and what race it is, it isn\'t living up to its standards.
-
Great idea, I really like it
...because if anyone can see your name they can immediatly latch onto you and keep bothering you, this way usually only friends will easily recognize you and you can get by in the world a lot more easily and it will be less annoying
As for forcing people into more RP, i\'m sure they\'ll find a way around it, they always do :P
-
At least it\'ll delay the non-RPness for a little while... :D
-
Aduin,
I know absolutely nothing about programming but I had thought in order for the name to appear something more would have to be done than introducing yourself via chat. It does make it informal but I am not sure how else the game would recognize the introduction.
Programmers help me out here?
-
This should remain on the one topic.... Please refur all comments here out to http://www.planeshift3d.com/forum/thread.php?threadid=2038&boardid=11&page=1
-
I don\'t understand Kendaro, what is off-topic and why post in the identification thread?
-
Actually this thread is reguarding individual identification and the other thread is geared more towards organization identification. Related but not quite the same imho.
-
I\'m sorry Fiere, I think i missed your point before. I wasn\'t even thinking of any way of keeping track of charecter name in game. My hope(this is why I said earlier that it would require a ton of charecter customization,) was that people would know eachother by word of mouth alone, and then remeber people by their faces(a little too complex and idealistic i now realise.) The problem with an introduction function is that you wouldn\'t be able to give out a false name or something to someone, and thus go undercover. Unless, the introdction command let you type in what name you told the other person. So for them, they\'ll always see you as your alias, or fake name, which could become a complicated charade for the rogue to keep up in game =).
-
I don\'t think that you should be able to give any other name using a command, but you can by saying your name is something else. After all, you can refuse to give out your identity.
The commands should go something like this:
Inquisitor types: /request ID
Inquisitor targets someone.
On Someone\'s screen a message appearas and notifies them that their ID is being requested.
If Someone agrees, he types: /request accepted
Otherwise, Someone types: /request denied
Or something like that.
The best thing for all this I think, is that you cannot reverse the command, and that you cannot use other names. Perhaps you should be able to reverse it if the other person agrees to it using another command, though.
-
Originally posted by Aruneko
This could easily allow thieves to go undercover, as they could refuse to let people know their real name, and just tell them their alias.
Somehow I doubt any undercover rogue will get very far with the system you\'re proposing. It\'s like \"no, I won\'t tell you my real name, but you can call me such-and-such.\" Anyone that denies giving out their real name clearly has a reason to hide it. Plus then, if you just give someone your alias, not your real name, they will have no way of identifying you in the future. You won\'t have any name above your head for them.
-
Originally posted by Aduin
Somehow I doubt any undercover rogue will get very far with the system you\'re proposing. It\'s like \"no, I won\'t tell you my real name, but you can call me such-and-such.\" Anyone that denies giving out their real name clearly has a reason to hide it. Plus then, if you just give someone your alias, not your real name, they will have no way of identifying you in the future. You won\'t have any name above your head for them.
That is THE whole point! So people that you don\'t want to know you, don\'t. Ok.. Suppose that you are a rogue/thief and you just stole from someone. Would you like that person to see your name flashing above your head? Personally, I wouldn\'t want my name flashing above my head. Then they can get friends after you. I would rather have it go this way:
Thief: *Notices a group of adventurers talking outside of the local bank. He scans over them for awhile and notices that one of the adventurers has a fat sack of gold on him. He stealthfully creeps over to the one that has the fat sack of gold. He quickly and quietly snatches the gold off the fellow adventurer. Begins to walk away at a fast pace*
Adventurer: *He abruptly stops chatting and noticed a slight tug at his belt. He glances down and notices that his sack of gold is gone.* \"Hey! I have been swindled!\"
*He frantically looks around and notices a figure walking away at a fast pace. He notices that the fellow is wearing a brownish colored cape that has a hood on it, and that he is also wearing leather pants.* \"That is the guy that got my stash! Get him!\"
Thief: *Runs away and hides for a moment, only to take off the clothes he was wearing over his other set of clothing. Tosses the old clothes into a nearby bush. Walks back into view for the adventurer to see him.*
Adventurer: *Runs up to the fellow and begins talking to him.* \"Excuse me sir, but did you see a fellow running through here with a brown colored cape with leather leggings on?\"
Thief: \"Yes. He ran that way!\" *Points north toward the mountains*
Adventurer: \"Thanks! Come on boys, let\'s go get us a thief!\" *As he shouts to his buddies behind him*
You see, if he would of had the name above his head, they would have known that it was the same guy. Thus concludes my long ass post. (Sorry it was so long :()
-
Good idea, Aelya!
Having no names shown is very advantageous. Like others said, nobody will be able to start following you, and that it is more realistic. Also, people following you can pose a problem, as I know too well in Runescape, since I\'ve heard people complain about newbies following them and begging for \'free stuff.\' If they don\'t know your name, you can get rid of them easily, like Tarek said(kind of).
I only agree with hiding race and sex if the character is hiding himself completely, as that would be more realistic and that people who don\'t want to be seen not seen. Otherwise, the race and sex should appear.
About the request identity problem, I think that all you have to do is something like right-clicking(or however it\'s done) on the character and click \'request identity.\' The person either accepts or declines, and things will be kept short and simple. However, I\'m not sure if that should also give away your own information...
-
i think that nothing should be written above(or under) the characters. You should be able to request a name, like said above, and the requested character can accept or refuse. If he refuses, the other character shouldn\'t be able to request it anymore, but the requested player should be able, if he wants, to give a name later. If we give a name, the player will see the given name above the requested character each time he\'ll see him, even if it\'s a false name. If the name given is a false, the player should be able, if ha wants, to give his reel identity later.
-
Originally posted by Wormtail_
I only agree with hiding race and sex if the character is hiding himself completely, as that would be more realistic and that people who don\'t want to be seen not seen. Otherwise, the race and sex should appear.
Maybe a player can set an option that will enable him to see the race and gender of others. Race and gender shouldn\'t be able to be a secret, its way too obvious to be hidden. (unless someone is sitting under a blanket.)
About giving fake names to display above your head, I think that is giving way too much power to the players.
-
I agree with you Aruneko, giving people the ability to use aliases creates a dangerous precedent. NO matter how many safeguards you put up people will abuse the system. I think the simple idea of not knowing names until some sort of introduction by commands or right clicking or whatever is best.
Meanwhile for logging purposes players should have an anonymous name that the devs can connect to the player. Lets say Soandso abuses some game aspect and it causes an unfair problems for Whatchamacallit, but Soandso has not yet introduced herself to him so he cannot report her. Unless it was recorded in Whatchamacallit\'s logs as something like Avatar658. When Whatchamacallit reports the problem the devs have a record of Avatar658 being Soandso. All players would have an autmatic anonymous name for this recording purpose so players with issues dont have a total lack of recourse.
Jeez I hope that made sense hehe.
-
Of course theres something that distinguishes your charecter from others. It\'s called your account name Fiere. =P Getting back to the other points though. I think my idea was misunderstood. My whole point, Wormtail, was that nothing should appear above your head for that exact reason. The idea I was countering in that post was the simple yes no abilities of the proposed introduction system. If you were to try to join a guild undercover, you obviously wouldn\'t want them to know your real name. The only way they wouldn\'t know your real name, would be if you declined the introduction feature. No one will trust anyone that declines to give out their real name. Ok. That\'s clarified.
Next, I still think that it\'s pointless to have someones race/sex shown above their head. If you can\'t tell what someone is, it means that either a) they don\'t want you to know, and they\'re covering themself up, or b) the devs did a poor job on charecter graphics. After seeing what they\'ve done so far though, I bet that the charecters are going to be detailed enough, so that you won\'t need their name/gender displayed.
I don\'t see how allowing people to tell different people different names would be a problem though. Anyone you trust(your guild members, friends, etc.) you would give your real name to. People that you don\'t trust, you could give a fake name. Maybe this could be a skill or something to prevent abuse. Maybe you have to give out your real name, but there\'s a skill, like lying or something, that allows you to give a fake name to someone. There could also be a skill to detect people that are lying, or truth spells. I dunno, I think cross-guild espianage, would be virtually impossible without fake names of some sort.
-
But if my name is not displayed how do others know what it is Aduin? My point is that the anonymous status should not allow people to get away with abuse and there should be a some system to prevent that. :P
-
Agreed Fiere. Perhaps some blend of ideas would be most useful here. Ok,
a) there will be an introduction command, where if you introduce yourself to someone else, your name will appear above your head for them.
b) there should be a lie command, where a randomly generated name will appear above your head. This should be risky, and charisma, and some kind of deception skill could play a part in furthering your odds. c) There should also be sense lie abilities. So you can catch someones bluff, and then know that they\'re a spy, or someone that isn\'t to be trusted.
d) The problem then is, you always appear to them as that false name, and that would never change. There needs to be some way that you can forget names. Honestly, will you remember everyones name you meet? Probably not, and you most likely wouldn\'t be able to pick them out of a crowd either if it was several months after you met for the first and only time. Then again, if only people you\'ve met have names displayed, and you run into someone, you could be like \"oh yah! remember the time we slayed that giant thing?\" \"yah!\" \"lets go have a pint at the pub and reminisce old times!\" Clearly there could be some cool RP value there. I concede that having someone be able to give out any name, would be very easily, and very widly exploited. Where\'s the balance? *shrugs* Ya got me, I\'m just brainstorming.
-
A blend of ideas is often proven most useful ;)
-
how about this...
gender/race doesnt appear above the characters head but if you \'observe\' that character, a brief description would pop up somewhere to describe that character. perhaps in the chat box. Also whoever is beinf \'observed\' should recieve a message like \"you are being looked over\" or something.
-
Good call Aelya. That could be a very nifty function. I love these boards, some really good ideas pop up from them. Keep it up everyone! =)
-
yeah but do PS designers read them? Do the ideas launched in these forums serve to anything, or are they only words of hope launched by waiting PS future players?
I like the ideas of the observing system. If you are able to tell a fake name, you should be able to reveal your true name later. People should \"forget\" someone\'s name if he hasn\'t meet him for a long time, but should be able to remember it if he observes him. I think that the problem of the description typed by the player is that make it or a name above the head is more or less the same, as everybody will have a personnal description. I think the \"observing mode\" should give something like a zoom on face, which should gives some personnal details as eye color, and stuff. This way, that\'s the player who recognize or not the observed character. Of course, it asks for a very large panel of face customization at character creating.
-
Originally posted by BaretteDeBeurre
yeah but do PS designers read them? Do the ideas launched in these forums serve to anything, or are they only words of hope launched by waiting PS future players?.
YES they read them, who do you think all those people with the blue stars are?
lets see theres vengeance, kendaro, parasite, acraig, boonet, etc. etc. who read the boards...the devs really want your input
-
Yes we do want your input.
Yes we do read your posts.
As for me personally, I just don\'t feel like a large percentage of the posts require my answering them. I like to see what the fans come up with as solutions to their own problems. It is also fun to see how some of the posters are getting better at anticipating how ideas would cause imbalance or other \"bad\" things unless they were tweaked and modified.
That being said, I really don\'t think this system of introductions is even technically possible. Right now, on our dinky little Atomic Blue server, we have more than 10,000 registered accounts. (And THAT is after acraig accidentally wiped out the database about 2 months ago. :-)
Now to do the schemes you guys want to do, we would have to track which of 10,000 knew which of the other 10,000. This is 100,000,000 possible facts for the system to track, JUST for this dinky feature. Is that worth it?
- Venge
-
8o sorry didn\'t know you were reading our posts(where\'s the blue star, didn\'t see it) and thanks, then. I didn\'t know how to help for the creation of this game, as i can do nothing else than play. Now i feel like i\'m helping a little, and that\'s better than feeling helpless.
-
Venge gets red stars because he is a Admin.
-
how about you click on them and it shows you just click on them and it shows you there name?
if you havent done the introductory thing it could say somthing like A male xacha.
-
Sounds good bbum but according to what Venge is saying its too complicated to manage in any method at least for now.
-
Wow, definately didn\'t think about that one Vengeance. I considered game balance as being an issue but I totally forgot about the raw programming and such behind it.
-
Ok, never mind I guess. But it was a good idea, lets keep it in mind.
-
I don\'t know much of programing Vengeance, but would it be possible to locally store who knows who? So that as someone is introduced to you, it logs it on your own computer, so the system doesn\'t have to track each of those 100,000,000 combinations?
-
your right venge. but remember that all the ideas on the wish list are not neccesarily expected anytime soon. if this idea is ever implemented i would expect it in the far far future.
its just that i think that no matter how difficult something is to program, it should be considered if it is a good idea. and everyone understands a system like this would not come for a long long tme.
-
Yes, we certainly don\'t expect all our ideas to be implemented and certainly not all the ones that are right away. It would be a nice once to keep in mind.
Maybe the file containing all the names one has been introduced to could be kept on client side? I don\'t even know if that would help reduce the complexity but it could be simply a function that made a players existing name appear after introduction and then the name would be stored in the player-character file. Again I know nothing about programming.
-
It\'s not that it\'s difficult to program. It seems quite simple actually. The only problem here is the potentially massive size of the database.
I still feel this feature must be in the game.
Each player, when they register, is given (or chooses) a unique screen name, and if I remember correctly they are also assigned (in the database) a unique user number. So, it is conceivable for each character to have a section in the database called \"Recognized players\" or something where unique names or unique numbers of players are stored. During the lifetime of a player, is it possible that he/she will meet 1,000 players? more? I don\'t know how many a typical player would meet, but the question is: is the database space worth it?
If not, Fiere suggested a perfectly reasonable solution. Storing the list of names client side. How many people play a MMORPG from different PC\'s at different times anyway? Everyone always plays from the same machine. And people are used to single player games storing their saved games and such on their harddrive, so why can\'t we simply tell them that their characters \"memory\" is stored on their harddrive. This might also give people the ability to edit who they want to recognize and who they don\'t. If you must move to a different PC, don\'t forget to take your characters memory with you. We should use client side storage to it\'s fullest. Buddy lists should be stored there as well. Why store anything unnecessary in the servers database?
So now, when another player character is close enough where you should see their name, the client will either (1) check the \"Recognized Players\" database on the server, or (2) check it\'s internal recognized players list/database, and if the player is listed there, then the name shows. No name in the list -> no name in the game.
Option (2) seems like the clear winner to me.
-
This is a GREAT thread ! I don\'t know how i could have missed it...
I hope that people won\'t be able to see every name like that. The permission thing should do fine.
And you should even be able to give a false name. ( Rogue guild, remember ? :P )
-
Indeed a great thread, and a great subject. I would love to see a system like this where you know only people you have properly met.
\"Storing the list of names client side.\"
You said it yourself later, it could be easily edited. What\'s to stop me from editing the file with a list of numbers (which correspond to each player in the database, like you said) from 1 - 1,000,000 or whatever? Then I can know the names of everyone whether they like it or not. It is an essential part of multiplayer games to not let the client tell the server data like this. Would you store the amount of gold or skill levels client side too?! No way! There (unfortunately) will always be people who will misuse things like that. Unless... just thought of something... they had you on their file too. it would only go wrong if everyone did the hack, and I hope that most people wouldn\'t.
I personally hate things like names floating above heads, and speech bubbles and the like. But there should be some sort of display for those of us who are rubbish at remembering names :) (Not to mention they\'re extraordinary fantasy names) Like, if you\'ve met the person and they\'ve told you their name, mouse-over their player would reveal there name to make sure.
Although I would dearly love to see this naming system work, how about a simpler one. Not quite as good, but very simple to have, and a little extra freedom for espionage and such... an option whether to display your name or not. So if you want to walk down the street undercover, you turn your name off, and if you\'re not, you display it. Not perfect, or anywhere near as robust, I know, but it\'s just a simple on-off variable.
As for false names. Sounds really good, but poeple going round impersonating other people or having aliases would get a bit too complicated!!
Definately a discussion to keep alive.
-
Ahem! *Clears her throat* .. Old thread, but I\'ll reply anyways...
As Venge said, it takes up space in the DB. As the players said, we can just store the names locally... The problem still is, 1) Anything stored locally can be modified (haxxed) and 2) If ~100.000 players have to ask the server if they know any of the other ~100.000 players each time they see someone, it would cause massive amounts of traffic, which is bad. VERY bad. :) I don\'t know how much space a couple of packets take, but I definitely know that if ~100.000 people regularly ask and send the server packets as they encounter new players, it\'s one big amount of useless packets. :P
-
I think it can be done.
And Grono you don\'t have to check the whole playerlist anytime anyone sees somebody.
1) encryption? Players of course don\'t have db access, so they can\'t make a pattern. And the data needn\'t be the index of a player... seems nigh perfect to me(only check/get key at connect). And if u add a changing key and a big key...:]
2)
When you talk to someone it\'s simple. The packages he sents surely has his ID, which the client can compare to his known list(using the decryption key) and/or add him to it, if he greeted you correctly - so only the people you really met would be on the list. If he\'s not greeting you and not in your list, he remains Anonymous. At the end of the session the changes to the list would get applied and rencrypted(locally).
So the first package would do the whole stuff. And after you know someone, hm, a boolean could be stored locally to avoid more checks, but that brings back 1)
If there will be bubbles(I think so in CB iirc) or labels and such, the search can be limited like the shout command\'s range or even more.
:S hm hm hm :S
-
Unless I\'m just completely blind and skipped over a message, I\'ve got what I think is a pretty good idea.
While you do give your character a name at creation, that doesn\'t necessarily have to make that name an absolution. I can walk down the street and see a random guy, and remember his face, and know him as Bob. Maybe his name is Bob, maybe it isn\'t; to me he is Bob.
The game application I\'m getting at is that there should be some option to where you can \'mark\' another player... perhaps click on her and enter a name by which to know her (if you meet this character and she gives you a name to know her by, it would be a good place to enter it). This name would only appear on the screen of the character who made the mark. It should remain above the marked character\'s head while she is in range (by range I mean a proximity at which a person could typically be recognized by their facial features; also, the name would disappear when that character went into stealth or wore certain clothes that would hide her identity).
An identification system such as this would hinder no players, as it would only appear on the screen of the person that desired it. Also, it would require no additional graphical programming for faces and the such.
Also, I\'m not saying that the idea of a one-line description when you examine a character shouldn\'t be used-- I like that concept :) . These could coincide very well (an in-game window that could be toggled on and off, listing the \'names\' of all the people you have marked, and also saving their description the last time you saw them).
Invariably there are plenty of aspects that I have left out entirely. I\'ll try to respond to any comments as soon as I can!
-
Nice thread, and it doesn\'t matter that it\'s old, there are some good ideas in this(I don\'t know why people are against bumping old threads so much, it\'s better then making a new one IMHO)
I was thinking, why not let the client identify other clients by an ID number rather then a name.
For example, there is a player whose ID # is 1234, this player meets another player and he asks him for his name, he can now do the command /givename Bob, and the other client writes this info to a locally stored file as the following: 1234 Bob. When the other guy sees this player now, a name tag appears to show his name(if the player ID isn\'t in the file it just shows the race or whatever) This way you can\'t really haxxor the file(or somebody has to make a file with all id numbers and names and put that for download, wich sounds pretty impossible to me, and if somebody else gives you their file it\'s like they tell you other players\' names, so not that bad..).
I don\'t know if anyone else has suggested this already, I don\'t even know if it even makes sense(I really need to sleep now :P), but if it makes sense AND nobody else suggested it, please tell me if this is a good idea or not(an why).
-
It sounds like a good idea (and makes sense =P) to me.. but then again I need sleep too...
-
why did you people revive such an old post. im sure this is almost a done deal for cb anyways *stabs post in the head*
-
Yes it is done for CB. If things haven\'t changed in the month, all names will be public.
-
Originally posted by whemyfield
why did you people revive such an old post. im sure this is almost a done deal for cb anyways *stabs post in the head*
hummm... \"because it is worth bumping an old but interesting thread instead of posting in a new thread which sucks ?\"
-
Very good idea! On the other day when I met a black Menki I said:\"Well, if I didnt knew your name already I would\'ve asked you...\" it\'s indeed better to ask the person his/her name.. :)
-
Also it could be set that if they had a major change to their appearance their name would disappear, such as putting on a full mask or something along those lines...dunno it could get pretty complicated...
-
how about this
everytime you log on you generate a log-in authentictiy, that wasy for security purposes you could \"/catchauth\" and get his number to report to a gm.
name display would wark like MSN where you have an option to change your displayed name, or perhaps even hide it, even if you cant hide it, you can use names like \"tall man\", or \"shadey figure\"
-
ok.. i skipped thru this so forgive me if this has been said already
i like the idea BUT consider this scenario
Player A sees player B breaking a rule and feels obligated to report it... Staff member asks who the perp was.... whats player A gonna say \'a male kran?\'
this is a nice idea but anonymity will open up a door for scammers/rule breakers
-
My idea covers that, you just report the player ID number instead of the name. :)
-
right, as does mine
Edit:hmm must have been a diff thread....
-
I hope nobody flames a poor little newbie because he deceided to bump an old thread, but I have been thinking about this idea for the past year or so (I\'m interested in MMOG theory) and how to implement it.
I came across a book titled \"Emergence\" and it stated that (in RL) humans only have the ability to remember & recognize around 50 or so. This is because facial recognition recoquires a vast amount of brain power to compute (it should, otherwise it would be easily replicable in AI). So:
1. Give each character a linked list of pointers with a maximum of 50 (depends on the intelligence of the character). Whenever a character \"looks\" at a new person, a call is made to the server which goes through the list. If a match is found, the name of the character is sent to the client, and the matched entry is bumped to the top of the list. If no match is found, then the player would have to ask the person for the name and then \"memorize\" it. This would be appended to the top of the list, and the 50th pointer would be culled.
By doing so, only the 50 \"most recent\" people would be remembered, so if you lose contact with a friend for a long time, you would eventually forget how to recognize them (which is how it works in RL). There are plenty of derivatives from this idea, but I\'m tired now, so I\'ll post them up if there is enough demand.
-
Pardon me if this has already been brought up, but how would the chat function if we had no names? Would names show up in the chat but we\'d have no idea who is who? That defeats the point of the realism you\'re suggesting here. Would it just show up as \"Person A shouts: _____\"? That\'s no good either.
If I missed something, I sincerely apologize.
-
Those are some interesting ideas.
However there are a few problems.
Storeing the file on your computer would not work it you use more then one computer, use a cyber cafe, or if you re-format.
It would make shouting and non-private chats impossible (as said above).
Untill there is more customization it will be very hard to find a person (or the right person) if everyone looks the same.
Untill a better solution is found the easiet and best thing would be to have an on/off switch for showing your name (but it would still show up in chat).
You could also have an option not to show your name in private chat. So as long as you don\'t say anything out of private chat your name is hidden.
Maybe have an option to only show your name to people on your friends list or in your guild, since they are already in the database it would not use any other space.
This way people have a choice if they want to show their name or not, but there wouldn\'t be so many problems
-
K I didnt finish reading all the posts but I belive this has been discused b4 with the same principal (the requesting o someones name) ppl were saying it would be hard to do that or thaat it would take a lot of space but, I have seen some new ideas I suggest u go looking for that thread and read it
-
Originally posted by Karyuu
Pardon me if this has already been brought up, but how would the chat function if we had no names? Would names show up in the chat but we\'d have no idea who is who? That defeats the point of the realism you\'re suggesting here. Would it just show up as \"Person A shouts: _____\"? That\'s no good either.
If I missed something, I sincerely apologize.
It infact IS realistic, if you hear someone shouting IRL, do you know his name then? no, only if he told you his name before and you can recognize his voice.
Maybe if someone shouts something he would get a shouting anim. with the text he just said above his head. In the chat window it would just say \"someone shouts: Hello\", so if you wouldn\'t see the person that shouted, and he never told you his name before you wouldn\'t know who said it(very realistic IMO). This would maybe also stop people from shouting all the time but instead they would gather in the temple for example to have normal /say conversations.
I like Siven\'s idea of storing a set number of names server-side, this would also get rid of the problem of reformatting your harddisk.
Waylander: this is an old thread, I think this is the one you are talking about.
-
Originally posted by Axsyrus
It infact IS realistic, if you hear someone shouting IRL, do you know his name then? no, only if he told you his name before and you can recognize his voice.
But IRL peoples voices sound different. So even if a crowd of people you\'ve never met before are talking you can tell who says what.
There is no way to replicate this in game, so you have to display name in chat or you won\'t know who said what.
It\'s really a balance issue.
You could always give everyone name tags, so there is a reason they know everyones name.
Rogues could then take off their name tags to hide their name.
-
I wrote more then just that one line in my post..
-
You can show the name if you are able to know who shoots. Otherwise, just a someone.
You can know who shoots if:
- you see him.
- he\'s in your guild or your buddy list.
- you are skilled in hmm... what skill can fit here?
-
Originally posted by Axsyrus
Maybe if someone shouts something he would get a shouting anim. with the text he just said above his head. In the chat window it would just say \"someone shouts: Hello\", so if you wouldn\'t see the person that shouted, and he never told you his name before you wouldn\'t know who said it(very realistic IMO).
And if that person shouts more than one line, and there are several people shouting as well? How do you distinguish between who shouted what, if everyone becomes \"someone\"? It\'s not an efficient system, because IRL you could nearly aways tell who shouted what, even if you do not know their names. It simply cannot work that way in-game. Unnecessarily complicated.
I also dislike the \"text above the head\" idea. Some problems with this have been stated before. What if you\'re not quick enough to read it? What if you\'re trying to read several bubbles at once? Usually you can hear and comprehend what more than one person is saying - it won\'t work that way in-game, again. Imagine this scenario: you\'re standing in the inn and talking to various people you do not yet know, and trying to keep up with everyone\'s input. You miss what someone is saying, so you reply with: \"Hey you over there, with the green coat and the tail, repeat what you said.\" And three characters turn around. Inefficient, again.
-
I also dislike the \"text above the head\" idea. Some problems with this have been stated before. What if you\'re not quick enough to read it? What if you\'re trying to read several bubbles at once? Usually you can hear and comprehend what more than one person is saying - it won\'t work that way in-game, again. Imagine this scenario: you\'re standing in the inn and talking to various people you do not yet know, and trying to keep up with everyone\'s input. You miss what someone is saying, so you reply with: \"Hey you over there, with the green coat and the tail, repeat what you said.\" And three characters turn around. Inefficient, again.
It would not only appear above their heads, but also in the chatbox. the text above their heads is only there to let you know who exactly said it. You\'d still use the chatwindow to read most of the talk. There could maybe be different colored text for different races/genders too, or anything else to make it easier to follow. I don\'t think it\'s that impossible to implement this.
-
I still believe it would be problematic to keep up with who said what, if more than three people are in a conversation. Especially if they are of the same race and gender (that annihilates your different text color for different races or genders idea).
It would just make the game that much more stressful, and for me, less enjoyable.
-
Okay, so the main chat window could be an OOC discussion at all times where all the player names will always be shown. It would also be the place for any system or status messages and the like.
One should be able to hide the chat window for the full RP experience. Visual queues can be used when another PC is speaking to you or just speaking in general. Perhaps the text can appear above their head when speaking in character, maybe even inside its own mini chat window?
So, to summarize,
The main chat box is for OOC.
The player window is for RP.
The main chat always shows player names.
The player window only shows names after they are given thru RP (and they are remember in the database).
Will some people only use the main chat?
Probably, but only after first introducing their PC to their friends PC\'s through RP so they can see the names above the characters head in game.
In short, I still think this is a really neat feature, and even if it\'s implemented only for the NPC\'s, it still needs to be in this game.
OOC=out of character
RP=roleplay
PC=player character
NPC=non player character
-
Why not have labels like A,B,C,D for players. Player A shouts \"I\'m herere\" player Y shouts \" hello everyone\"
-
Hmm...
I seem to vaguely remember that someone said a long time ago that in CB there will be chat bubbles. So in these chat bubbles there will obviously be only people that you have been introduced with. And if someone wants to talk to you, they would have to introduce themselves before talking to you, and even if not, it will be only one spotted fenki trying to talk to you, not the 30 or so others logged on at the moment.
Also, why couldn\'t the names be stored clientside? After all, to modify the file you would need to know their real name. But you don\'t. The reason you wanted to mod the file in the first place...
NOTE: Acraig accidentally wiped the AB database? Rofl! :D
@Venge: Wouldn\'t it be better to have more dev-wistful player interaction so that you (the devs) have a whole community brainstorming on problems and possible innovations (with the dev input helping to guide to a more realistic)? I.e.:
Dev says: Hey guys, I need some more ideas for spells, any good ideas?
Wistful Player says: Yeah! Here, I\'ll PM you with an idea, tell me if it would require too many glyphs.
Dev recieves PM and says: Good idea, but the way you have the spell said up, it would need about 20 glyphs...etc.
Wistful Player says: Oh, well in that case, maybe we could seperate these two parts and make them into two seperate spells...
Hope I was able to relay my ideas to you!
-
Originally posted by Levski
Hmm...
I seem to vaguely remember that someone said a long time ago that in CB there will be chat bubbles.
? Where did you see that mentioned? I\'ve heard that there will be bubbles with names and guild....
Acraig accidentally wiped the AB database? Rofl! :D
I was under the impression that the server didn\'t record people at all in CB.
-
I apologize if I get anything wrong. I read the entirety of this thread in one sitting, still trying to absorb most into my head.
First off, about the client-side list:
1) It would make sense to list only people that you\'ve met (i.e. Have gotten a name from). It would be a big waste of space to, instead, have a list of everyone registered, not to mention your list would need to be reupdated everytime you log into the world (creating a longer amount of login time). If said list only has the people you\'ve been introduced to, it should also have a line that nullifies every other player. (hope that makes sense, it\'s about 3:30 AM. :-P)
2) Hacking would be essentially unneccessary in all forms with this idea (1). Since you have a list of people you\'ve met and their names, the only thing you could do is rename them, which would do nothing but create an alias to only you. (since it\'s client-side, the effect would only be on the clients...side. Thusly, no one else would see the effects of the change but the client.) This might actually be seen as an advantage for some people. Say you don\'t like someones name, but they don\'t want to change it? Just go into your client-side stored \"Introduction List\" and rename them. Only you will see the rename and hopefully you renamed it to something that you\'ll remember who they were. This could also be seen as more realistic, since people often give nicknames to others to remember a trait, characteristic, look, ect.
3) If you happen to go to a cyber cafe, just email the list to yourself and reintroduce it to your rented computer at your cyber cafe. Not to big of a deal; you\'ll live. :-P
Next, I like the idea of bubbles along with a chat menu. This way you can read the bubbles and if you miss anything just read the chat menu and pick up what you missed. I find this really realistic, as opposed to what the others have said about it. Sure, if there\'s lots of people, you won\'t be able to keep up with all the conversations, but it is my experience that in larger groups, people holding one conversation will form one group, another will form another group and so on. Also, I don\'t think names should be added to the chat menu. For the sake of reality, if you\'re in a big group of people you don\'t know, are you really just going to start blabbing for hours on end without introducing yourself at one point in the conversation? Besides, if this path is taken (the chat with \"person says\") it would force the player to introduce themselves to the people they are talking to in order to follow the conversations. In my opinion, this is as real as it gets. The only downfall would be to those who are anti-social: They\'ll get have to deal with a bunch of conversations that sound like they\'re coming from one person (who is of course, just known as \"a person\"). Also, if we\'re going for realism, the shout command should just be removed. How often do you hear a person yell across a city, only to have the urge to answer him with an equally loud yell? If we\'re basing this entire thread and idea off of reality, then everything these ideas are completely valid (as opposed to your beloved shout command).
To sum up this paragraph in one word: Adaptation. If the massive chat idea is to implimented, people will want to introduce themselves and learn who everyone is, if only to make the chat simpler. Also, if an introduction isn\'t made and conversation splits, the groups will separate to keep their chat understandable. All in all, players will adapt to the circumstances (much in real life) to gain a better, easier way of communicating with those around.
I hope my ideas can be improved upon, by myself and others.
-
The chat thing is missing one important detail: proximity. If you\'re in a real tavern, you are going to speak to the ppl. in your immediate vincinity, and only these will be able to hear / understand you. The bubbles and chat window therfore need to reflect this, so that the ppl. who you can hear _unless_ they shout are only the ones you are very close to. This is an extension to your comment about the \"shout\" command.
I still don\'t know about the bubbles. How about just having tiny bubbles with no text that fade away with time and that maybe have a color associated with them, while the text can be found in the chat window, along with the same color and fade (or some other link)? This way, you could see whop speaks and it would make ppl. less talkative. Along with the short talk range, it might work.
-
GOOD IDEA (keeping it short and simple)
-
Ok I tihnk everything can be done normally if each player is designated a shout name. So whenever you shout that name will appear. People\'s shotu names could be anything from \"Booming Voice\" to \"Strange Echo\" or there own names if they don\'t care about people knowing there names. This shout name would be made 2 character creation. This wouldn\'t effect people finding out who you are cause they can\'t see that you are the one shouting. This shout name could work for say and tell as well and would never be displayed over your head or if someone click ed on you. So say if \"Scary Voice\" said \"Hey you\" to a Character. The character would see \"Scary Voice\" on the chat screen but not know where it is coming from. I tihnk all the suggestions for the name request are good and i thought I might try and solve the problem of chatting but noone knows your name. Forgive me if this is just totle rubbish ^_^
-
Originally posted by Seytra
The chat thing is missing one important detail: proximity. If you\'re in a real tavern, you are going to speak to the ppl. in your immediate vincinity, and only these will be able to hear / understand you. The bubbles and chat window therfore need to reflect this, so that the ppl. who you can hear _unless_ they shout are only the ones you are very close to. This is an extension to your comment about the \"shout\" command.
But you must remember, not everyone speaks in a whisper. And in the tavern right now someone standing next to the bar will be able to here conversations from people standing by the fire. It would be really annoying to have to be standing right next to someone in order to talk. And there should be a shout command, people do have the ability to shout, it should just be limited to a certain range.
I still don\'t know about the bubbles. How about just having tiny bubbles with no text that fade away with time and that maybe have a color associated with them, while the text can be found in the chat window, along with the same color and fade (or some other link)? This way, you could see whop speaks and it would make ppl. less talkative. Along with the short talk range, it might work.
That would just force me to continualy shift my eyes from the screen to the chat box for no apparent reason.
And people seem to be forgetting reality. In reality, I can tell the difference between people\'s voices. If I heard someone say something but don\'t know who said it, I can figure out who said it by listening to their voice, which can\'t be replicated in-game. The closest I could imagine would be custamisable chat with different fonts or colors. But that will still not work because there will always be the \"cool\" font that everyone uses and everyone will use the same 10 colors.
-
I\'m going to stick with one idea. The others are important, but if we\'re going to stress real-ness, I think this is important:
Get rid of the \"Shout\" command. Perhaps instead of using shout as it is (talking to someone across town via \'shout\'), I suggest having a range; just like the say command.
I think the client-side idea is justified enough to let stay as it is (quite simply, it would work).
I also think that the bubble idea is just as justified. That would render this \'bar scene\' possible. If there were just bubbles, people across the bar would still be able to read, depending on how good their eyes are. There still needs to be some sort of identification, and the \'Scary voice\' idea seems plausible. There\'s no real need to make it colored, other than to strain your eyes and confuse yourself. Nor would you need a link between the chat box and the bubbles, as your \'scary voice\' (or other name tag) will be said link.
Basically (assuming that there is no shout command), the bubbles will say the same as the chat box; the chat is just there for those who miss what someone says and have to read it again (also a bit unrealistic when you think about it; maybe we should get rid of the chat box too, lol). The bubbles will have your \'shout tag\' which should be unique, such as \"A Petrifying screach says:\" or something to that extent.
It\'s simple, really.