PlaneShift
Gameplay => General Discussion => Topic started by: bilbous on November 24, 2006, 01:25:19 am
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Laanx can't be a beautiful Goddess anymore so she decides to be come male!? Why didn't she just become a cruel cold-hearted crone? S/he must be a very minor god to be unable to at least regain the semblance of her lost looks. Her consort,supposedly more powerful cannot be much better or he would be able to use the crystal to give her back what she lost but he just simply disappears from the story. These beings are at best powerful mages and not gods. Perhaps the crystal is a bigger god than the three newcomers combined if it has such power to warp even the gods.
Are we to assume that the history is in the same condition as the rest of the game as in a preliminary form that is subject to change?
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Greetings! I have to admit that I, too, was more than a bit thrown by the sudden change in Laanx's gender in the middle of Her story. I have since, playing a follower of Laanx as I do, reasoned out the discrepancy to mean that Laanx has become more...androgynous. By this I refer of course to the fact that She hides away Her face behind a mask and has not been seen by many others at all in the succeeding centuries/millinea (sp?).
I choose to see Laanx's worship as focusing on Her fragmented aspects. Those who view Laanx as an angry male God and those (a minority, I'm sure) who still choose to see Laanx as She once was...a powerful and beautiful Goddess. Her anger and self-pity have driven Her away from those She once loved. *shrugs* Perhaps one day She will become whole again :)
I know I'm not a dev or staff writer or anything, which are the ones you were trying to reach, bilbous, but your post looked so lonely I thought that I might reply to provide a slightly alternate theory. It is quite possible that the story of Laanx is...incomplete and/or not as fleshed out as it could be but this is what we have so far and I have seen fit to play it this way.
Please, take it only for what it is: just one woman's humble thoughts :D
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My character has actually met Laanx (in game). She was female and very intense.
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She chose to resemble a Male. The magic scarred _her_ deeply, not just a physical image. The Gods can change their physical form in whatever way they want. Stop thinking like a mortal ;)
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Well then that is all fine but then why is she always refered to as he, his, et cetera. I found it uneccessarily confusing. Also there is a typo on the page that should be fixed: "workship" instead of worship in the last section.
column and discovering a rocky niche
should be "discovered" to make the tense match the rest. A similar problem occurs at enlarge the niche and created the
create should have no d as it is being used in the infinitive sense not the past tense.
courses of the underground rivers
should probably be "course of underground rivers".
to feed the fertile and rich land that they had placed on the rock to make it suitable for life
this seems aukward and might benefit from an edit. If it is rich and fertile it is already suitable for life. Perhaps something like "to provide water for the future inhabitants" would suffice.
Everything was made to host the people
could perhaps be changed to "made ready for"
Shall I go on? I'm just trying to help not unjustly criticise.
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That story has needed a good proofread in a long time. I remember offering at one point...
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I haven't read it for years so I'd forgotten about the typo's :) Will get them fixed up....
As for the 'he', that's because Laanx switched bodily genders to male. Gods themselves in spirit have no gender. Like Kran don't :P
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I do have to agree though that some parts of the setting seem rather confusing.
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What about the style points? It reads like it was written by an inexperienced writer whose first language is not English. I can't say I am an experienced writer but I am a very experienced reader. I did not think it important to point out all the British spellings as to my mind they are as valid as American spellings.
Maybe we should have a rewrite contest to see who can relate the story most elegantly.
And personally I would keep refering to her in the feminine regardless or else try to use her name more often instead of any pronoun.
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That's because it was written by an inexperienced writer whose first language is not English, Talad :P And the British spelling are more correct than the American ones, because British English is the International standard for English (hence the option of US English or International English on programs).
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Hey I'm Canadian. We spell things either way as the feeling takes us. But don't you know the yanks own the intar-thingy and we must bow to their ways >o)
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Hey I'm Canadian. We spell things either way as the feeling takes us. But don't you know the yanks own the intar-thingy and we must bow to their ways >o)
I'll challenge that and say the American spellings are not considered correct here, even though they are often used in ignorance.
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Well as far as I know there is no law specifying usage here but at least one university would disagree with you. I did a search for "Canadian style guide" and came upon this link from the University of Waterloo (http://www.ucalendar.uwaterloo.ca/nextcalendar/styleguide.html#spelling) I also came across ads for a book with that title but it does not seem to be online. A search (http://www.google.ca/search?hl=en&q=inurl%3Agc.ca+%22color%22&btnG=Search&meta=cr%3DcountryCA) for the American spelling of color on Government of Canada websites returns "Results 1 - 10 of about 218,000 for inurl:gc.ca "color"."
it has little to do with the topic and a post that was clearly for light entertainment purposes unless perhaps you are quibbling with me just for fun.
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I'm not quibbling with you for fun. American spellings are becoming more popular because of American word processing programs and spell checkers on our computers, American programs on TV, and even American textbooks in our schools. That doesn't make them correct however. Tolerable, in some instances, but not correct. If you use American spellings, you will risk being seen as ignorant.
*edit*
I just read the link from that UofW website and it seems to support my position, not oppose it. They say that their students should use the Canadian Oxford dictionary and they give a list of spellings that they want students to use - all of which are British spellings. The website says to use centre and not center, rumour and not rumor.
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Back on-topic, folks. I think Xordan explained well concerning Laanx's gender change - are there any other curiosities that you'd like an explanation for? :]
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Well I was hoping to go through the whole thing and get it fixed up but there doesn't seem to much interest for that. I guess if I feel ambitious I will rewrite it and submit it to someone. Who would that be I wonder.
If I feel super ambitious ... nah that'll never happen.
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Wouldn't take much to go through the Settings and tie everything together in a more cohesive manner. There have been far too many things that have to be 'explained' away, and leave a great gaping hole for massive interpretations.
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Well, such as? :]
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Well, such as? :]
Oh no... You didn't actually just ask Under for his opinion on the settings, did you?
/me plugs ears for the next three days.
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Well one thing I find at odds with the server policy is that the history page seems to indicate somewhat less than harmonius relations between the races.
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/me glances at Phinehas' earplugs with disdain, and gets a helmet.
(http://img147.imageshack.us/img147/6632/grinby0.gif)
I'm curious about this part:
There have been far too many things that have to be 'explained' away, and leave a great gaping hole for massive interpretations.
Bilbous - can you be more specific?
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On the first level, the stolid Ylians claimed the absolute ownership of the ground that they were farming, refusing to share with other races. They built fences and walls, and began to look at books about armies and armed defense. The Enkidukai that lived in the same area were driven away and this was considered an intrusion in their freedom. The tension between the two races increased, and some of them clashed, but Talad was able to control their anger and to bring back the stability.
Stability does not mean harmony. So these two are not fond of each other.
This section implies that the klyros are chaotic and don't get along with anyone.
Laanx saw inside them a splinter of the delirium that had taken possession of him and, even though he hated them for their indifference, he did not utterly destroy their race. Before leaving them to their destiny, he taught them the way to Yliakum, sure that they would create some troubles to Talad, whom he now considered an enemy.
Generally speaking Laanx has forwarded on several races to Yliakum he though would disrupt things.
Oh I found another thing in need of correction: avatars to lead lure them into a cave
Either lead or lure should be removed, having both is redundant.
EDIT
Here Laanx is given a feminine pronoun and a masculine pronoun in the same sentence.Laanx spoke, showing completely his true essence. - I'm Laanx - she said - and I'm your god.-
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Stability does not mean harmony. So these two are not fond of each other.
That they might not have lived in harmony does not mean that the same still stands today. That is the sort of stuff for history books - and while things can flare up on an individual basis, the Enkidukai and Ylian races have put the past behind them.
This section implies that the klyros are chaotic and don't get along with anyone.
Chaotic doesn't necessarily mean they don't get along with anyone. Besides, the racial beginnings are not the absolutes for the rest of the centuries.
*edit*
One more time: back on topic! I don't like removing posts.
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Does that mean that Laanx and Talad have made up and are best buddies now or is Laanx still trying to undermine Talad and the tensions are more religious than racial? I realise the server policy is good and proper. I am just trying to work out the implications of the specified setting.
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I would like to add something to this discussion in regards to the setting and description.
First, regarding the Laanx gender change. Having undergone the change and being referred to as a "he", "his", and "himself", we suddenly have this:
"Laanx spoke, showing completely his true essence. - I'm Laanx - she said - and I'm your god."
And then back to the "he", "him", and "himself" again...
Now regarding the glyphs.
"Laanx, young and very pretty, had fascinated the ancient Vodùl and he'd taught her that the energy of the crystal could be used to create life. She wanted to make Talad happy, for he was more restless and found the wait more unbearable then she did. To surprise and amaze him, she drew the incommensurable power of the azure crystal as much as she could and, in secret, mimicked the rituals of Vodùl to give life to some creatures reproduced in her image."
"Talad gave up any hope to be reconciled with the old friend and, now alone, turned his thoughts to the people left in the town they had created. He called it "Hydlaa", the name of the most powerful glyph, that Vodùl had revealed to Laanx and that led Talad to ignore prudence to satisfy his pride. Waiting for the day when the other peoples would come, he forged magical power into many shapes, suitable to be used by the mortals to help them to survive underground: he created the Glyphs."
If Vodul only revealed the existence and name of the "Hydlaa" glyph to Laanx, how would Talad know its name and even its existence to name a city with it, especially if Laanx used the power of that glyph in secret? There was no indication that Laanx has ever revealed it to Talad, since those actions were quickly followed by Talad's foolish creation of his own. Keep in mind that the colonizers have only translated the name "Yliuakum" and not "Hydlaa" from an inscription. It seems unlikely that Talad would be aware of the glyph's existence when he wasn't even aware of the Stone Labyrinths with other creatures already in them.
Also, strange that it says "he created the Glyphs", when other glyphs like "Hydlaa" have already existed before. Perhaps, "he created his own glyphs" would be more appropriate.
Now to add to the "conflict between some races" discussion. From Stonebreakers and dwarves description:
"They have a strong pride that sometimes develops into feuds with other clans or other races. They tend to be suspicious and quarrelsome towards other races that are taller than they are."
"Their pride an temper often gets them into fierce fights. This may be the explanation for the legendary stubbornness of the "short people"."
So, they even have problems with other clans, let alone other races, the obvious other clan being the Hammerwielders.
And now regarding the origins of Lemurs. This is from the Lermurs description:
"Everyone knows that the Lemurs were the first of all races to settle in Yliakum, and they are proud of it. The legends tell that their origins of the Lemurs are connected to a huge city located in the depths of earth, abandoned from a widespread disease. No one knows how to reach this city or if anyone still lives there. All lemurs share a sense of loss for their mysterious, distant homeland."
This is obviously referring to Kadaikos. However, the history tells us this:
"Blinded by the possibility of creating a new world, the young gods Laanx and Talad didn't ask any other details, or pay much attention to the warnings. Therefore, they used their powers to enlarge the niche and created the huge cave comprised of eight levels."
"To surprise and amaze him, she drew the incommensurable power of the azure crystal as much as she could and, in secret, mimicked the rituals of Vodùl to give life to some creatures reproduced in her image. The new people matured and reproduced, they were nice-looking and had a quiet behavior, like their creator, and they called themselves "Lemurs"."
That means Lemurs have lived in Yliakum for a while, maturing and reproducing.
"She retired to wander in the Stone Labyrinths, and many Lemurs went with her."
"After many generations of the Lemur had passed, Laanx wandered into a cave that was hundreds of times bigger than the one he created, where beings without a name dwelt. At the top he spied a huge stalactite that occupied one third of the vault, and which produced a thin rain of clear water. It was the conic block of rock that held Yliakum."
This means that Lemurs not only lived in Yliakum for a while originally but also in the Stone Labyrinths.
"At the middle of the cave, he saw a deep lake full of life, whose shores were a fertile soil. The Lemurs believed that their god had led them to a new home. Their praises and thanks to Laanx echoed in the cave and many sacrifices were made. In that moment Laanx became aware of the presence of his followers, and he was stricken by their faith and ingenuity. His heart became a little softer, and he gave his people many powerful and useful things to brighten the cave and make the lake and its shores a place to live. The Lemurs multiplied rapidly, built the ten towns of Kadaikos, and they became a prosperous and numerous populations."
This clearly states that Kadaikos was Lemurs' new home and not their origin as their description states. Unless, of course, Lemurs have somehow completely lost history of their origin and rely on inaccurate legends that only go as far as Kadaikos.
Also, the history states:
"After many generations of the Lemur had passed, Laanx wandered into a cave that was hundreds of times bigger than the one he created..."
If this is in reference to Yliakum, then it wasn't solely created by Laanx but by both, Talad and Laanx, as it states here:
"Therefore, they used their powers to enlarge the niche and created the huge cave comprised of eight levels."
Unless it's in reference to some other cave that Laanx created while traveling from Yliakum to Kadaikos. But why would Laanx do that, if he wasn't even aware that some Lemurs followed him until they all arrived to Kadaikos?
Not trying to nitpick, just contributing to an interesting discussion. ;)
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Very good post witchking :thumbup:
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That would be one minor place I would start, Witchking. The Settings are a puzzle that you have to sometimes cut off some corners to get the pieces to fit, not to mention all the pieces that are simply missing. I have discussed with Talad many of the things I found problems with, but have grown tired of seeing "I see no problem with that." Not to be insulting, but Talad is not proficient in creating a well woven History, Story, or Cultural Heritage, nor supporting them with the details that would make them work or give them cause. He sees things in a simpler form than many people wish for.
I will bow down to Phinehas in agreement. I wrote a 40,000 word 'backstory' on a single character I have yet to use ingame. You do not have the time to read my issues and explanations to all the things I see as flaws in the Settings, as it would likely be ten times longer than all you can find written in public concerning it already. Nor would I wish to write such a thing, as it would be a waste of effort on both sides. It would be much easier to just start over from scratch, only using and expanding on the issues that do mesh well, or at least forming a bridge between parts that don't.
Though...that would be ten times longer as well. Just to start.
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/me wonders why Under's bowing to him, but is enjoying it all the same.
Just for the record Under's always right. I have spoken.
Also, Witchking a lot of what you said about the Lemurs I agree with. You do get the feeling that the Lemur's have no clear histories of their past, but I am of the opinion, as a Lemur, that we as a race are entirely too well bred to simply let our past dwindle into vague myths. We would have kept accurate records, if not quite as zealoously as the Xacha, still entirely accurately.