PlaneShift
Fan Area => The Hydlaa Plaza => Topic started by: lordraleigh on February 13, 2007, 09:28:21 pm
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RPGs lack the interesting action from FPSes, FPSes lack the immersive settings and well developed characters and plots of RPGs, by merging the best elements of such genres many great games were done, and a promissing one will be done as well.
The Excellent Underdogs(And now Classics):
- System Shock (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/System_Shock)
- System Shock 2 (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/System_Shock_2)
Hall of Fame
- Deus Ex (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Deus_Ex)
Future Releases
- Bioshock (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bioshock) (The "Spiritual Successor" of System Shock 2)
What is your opinion on such type of games? This unique hybrid genre is my favourite for example.
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Deus Ex 2 was too open-ended for me. Too much work was put into the "choice" thing, and too little into the actual story. It just struck me as a little dry and uninvolving - none of the characters were particularly interesting, and just seemed to exist to further the plot. At least for me, the 'moral dilemmas' where you have to choose who to follow and who to kill didn't affect me much, because I just wanted to kill everyone for being so bland :P
I should look up SS. I played a demo of it once, but never got around to getting the full game...
Does Oblivion count as a FPSRPG?
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Bloodlines and Oblivion would be FPSRPG, yeah.
And Bioshock looks amazing, to say the least.
It's an interesting idea and looks well done.
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I really liked both Deus Ex's actually. I found the characters and plots of the second good, and the choices were nice. Those were actually the only FPS's i've ever played, unless you count the Wolfenstein 3d demo i played on my macintosh performa in the 7th grade.
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Deus Ex 1 and Bloodlines are pretty much the only video games I've actually completed, they're both amazing games.
Oh, and I finished Deus Ex 2, but it was nowhere near as good. I can't really go into depth why because it was a while ago that I played it.
But yeah, looking forward to Bioshock. Couldn't play system shock 2, the controls were too weird for me or something.
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About System Shock 2:
The home of the Underdogs has a torrent of the full game(Including DivX versions of the cutscenes) for download:
http://www.the-underdogs.info/game.php?gameid=3924 (http://www.the-underdogs.info/game.php?gameid=3924)
And if you want to have an idea, well suffice to say games like Final Fantasy XII still receive bad ratings (http://www.gamefaqs.com/console/ps2/review/459841.html) on a considerable amount of the reviews from GameFAQs, here is the list of reviews for System Shock 2 on the same site:
http://www.gamefaqs.com/computer/doswin/review/185706.html (http://www.gamefaqs.com/computer/doswin/review/185706.html)
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Meh, I generally go by people who actually know what they're talking about. GamesFaq is filled with too many zealous or disgruntled fanboys, and hapless wannabe-critics with no real experience.
There might be a decent reviewer in there, but it's too hard to tell which one's right and which one's wrong when any old thing is posted.
Most of those reviews there just sound too gushing to be objective... and it's an obscure enough game where the only people who'd bother to write a review are the fans, unless they're paid critics.
Still, it sounds like a cool game. I think I'll try it...
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Here some "professional" reviews for it then emeraldfool:
Gamestats Average ( 9.4 ) http://www.gamestats.com/objects/011/011087/ (http://www.gamestats.com/objects/011/011087/)
(some of the links are broken on Gamestats, sadly)
Gamespot( 8.5 ): http://www.gamespot.com/pc/rpg/systemshock2/review.html (http://www.gamespot.com/pc/rpg/systemshock2/review.html)
IGN( 9 - Editors Choice Award ) http://pc.ign.com/articles/161/161087p1.html (http://pc.ign.com/articles/161/161087p1.html)
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It's at 2% ;)
And I already read the GameSpot and IGN reviews... they're in my favourites tab (the sites, not the specific reviews) :P
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Also if you wish a boost on System Shock 2 graphical quality(Note they will raise a little the system requirements, but any nowadays computer will handle it easily), some unnoficial mods were done to improve it:
Rebirth: Replaces most of the clumsy models to high-poly ones http://www.strangebedfellows.de/index.php/topic,8.0.html (http://www.strangebedfellows.de/index.php/topic,8.0.html)
SHTUP: Upgrades textures of the objects in the game(Direct Download Link) http://shtup.home.att.net/files/shtup_beta5.zip (http://shtup.home.att.net/files/shtup_beta5.zip)
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Should I have played SS1 in order to understand what's going down?
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Should I have played SS1 in order to understand what's going down?
I didn't play SS1 and managed to understand the plot pretty well.
Only thing is the references to "Citadel Station", but they are explained in a part of the game plot.
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I think The Two best FPSs storyline-wise are the Halo series and the Half-Life Series. So much awsomeness. Sure they both have some "iffy" places, but what game dosn't?
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I've only ever played the first Halo, but the first couple hours of story and gameplay bored me to the extent that I couldn't fight the urge to stop playing. Nowhere near Deus Ex IMO, despite the newer technology.
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Rayken's right. The Halo story kinda sucked, especially the way all the interesting stuff was barely audible over the wailing death-cries of those little panicky fellas...
It's just typical sci-fi stuff, nothing really new or exciting.
(Although part of that might be stemming from the fact that I always sucked at FPSes, and my brother always pwned.)
(Seriously, somehow I managed to accidentally stick my own grenade onto myself... :P)
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I guess it is just a matter of opinion. But I liked Halo particularly because at the time (2002) it was the best FPS with an actual storyline out there. Thats what drew most of the "fanboys" in. Its ok if you dont like it, as long as you've played it. I hate it when people do nt even play a game and announce that they hate it. Unless, of course its naruto, or something with a commonly known crappy storyline...
HL2 though... It made me want to explode it was so amazing. I mena, alot of people hate it for various reasons, but I thought it was just amazingly well done.
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My brother had HL2 for Xbox (which sadly lacked the amazing multiplayer mode). The whole time he was complaining how much it was overrated and was 'gay'. Which naturally translated to it having an awesome story but not enough sickening violence (yes, he actually thought HL2 wasn't violent enough... ::))
I always meant to play it, but I saw most of it over his shoulder and it didn't look that amazing. Plus the ending was one of the weirdest I've ever seen ('course I didn't really know what was going on...).
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Halo had a pretty average story tbh. Way way overrated :P HL2's wasn't too amazing either, although episode 1 kinda pieced everything together more and now I'm itching to find out what happens next in episode 2 xD
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am I the only one who hasnt noticed much story line?
Ive got HL2 and Halo and i cant remember the story from HL2 because it was kinda uninteresting, I also dont even remember if there was a story in Halo, I thought it was like Doom or Quake where there isnt one.
Infact now I think of it ive got HL2 episode 1 around somewhere I may check that out.
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I thought this topic was FPS+RPG games. Not incredibly overrated, boring FPS games
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I thought this topic was FPS+RPG games. Not incredibly overrated, boring FPS games
Yes, neither Half-Life, HL2 nor Halo are FPS+RPG games, thus slightly offtopic mentioning them here.
Anyway the way the player and character skills are integrated on such games is a nice point to discuss about. In Deus Ex, for example, you would need some patience and luck to hit something armed with a mini-crossbow if you had pistols skill "untrained". Also damages done against your arms would reduce drastically the accuracy of the hit, giving it a small feature of skill-based combat. If you trained JC as "master" with pistols using the Experience points gained through accomplishment of missions(instead of senseless grinding of many CRPGs) you could hit anything easily.
This raise a question: Should we seek puritan RPGs based solely on characters-based skills or merge both player-based and character-based skills to make combats less monotonous but still somewhat loyal to the character skills?
Note: In DX skills like computer and eletronics were fully character-based.
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This raise a question: Should we seek puritan RPGs based solely on characters-based skills or merge both player-based and character-based skills to make combats less monotonous but still somewhat loyal to the character skills?
This is why I generally don't play pure RPGs (or MMORPGs). Not only does it make combat less monotonous to integrate both forms it makes it more realistic, which is important to make a RPG interesting (storyline-wise) in my opinion and I always thought that to be kind of the point to RPGs... Any form of Action-RPG really, though...such as the game Gothic, not a FPS but it has the same concept.
Blending genres in general just makes things better.
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I've always been a fan of things where all the actions are player-based, yet the effect and scope of those actions can be enhanced by character skills.
Kind of like Oblivion, yet even more practical.
For example, a player with lvl 1 hand-to-hand skill has just as much potential to win a hand-to-hand fight as a player with lvl 50 hand-to-hand, but the higher lvl player can use techniques like 'disarms' and 'grapples' and longer combos which the lower-level guy can't. Even still, the lower level guy could employ certain tactics or other skills he's proficient in to win.
There's a strong RPG element, but also a strong action element. All the other 'Action RPGs' seem to favour one or the other (for example, a new character in Oblivion is pwnable by common folk at the start, but untouchable by the end... regardless of player skill.)
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Well, I like both RPGs and FPSs. However, I play RPGs for the story, involvement, etc., while I play FPSs for the fast-paced action. IMO an FPS is best played against other players, so the SP campaign is more or less just to practice. I played HL's SP campaign, but I didn't actually find the story that great. It didn't even take a major part in the game (mostly explained only why you were where you are, and who you need to kill next, and with what). I never viewed FPSs as in need of storyline (to be honest, I don't want to be bothered by it, and find it almost a bit silly if they try to have an in-depth story).
I have, however, also considered more FPS-like combat in PS, especially for ranged weapons and magic. However, while it would certainly be nice to be able to actually snipe, the major problem is that with relying on player skill, you more or less exclude a large portion of possible players. It would be rather sad if we were to lose good RPers just because they can't, for whatever reasons, handle the controls well enough to kill even a rat (even if we assume an equally perfect connection for everyone). We already see this in the so-called "tactics" that used to be employed in duelling. Thus I think the combat of PS should be more or less fully character-based and automated, and overall play a way smaller role than it does ATM (also, in an RPG, I don't like to be bothered by combat, regardless of it's form; it's not even close to realistic, anyway).
Therefore, I don't see much benefit in a mixture of FPS and RPG.
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In a FPS+RPG, you aren't just RPing a character and watching what happens due to it, I regard it, first due to the view point and second to the almost full control of the movements as much more immersive than pointing and clicking and seeing a 3D model in third person view to attack enemies and watch the combat based only on stats and rolls of dices, giving away the feeling that you are the character.
I don't see nothing wrong on merging action with a strong plotline, with the impersonation of a character and with dialogues that makes things clearer and more immersive.
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In a FPS+RPG, you aren't just RPing a character and watching what happens due to it, I regard it, first due to the view point and second to the almost full control of the movements as much more immersive than pointing and clicking and seeing a 3D model in third person view to attack enemies and watch the combat based only on stats and rolls of dices, giving away the feeling that you are the character.
I don't see nothing wrong on merging action with a strong plotline, with the impersonation of a character and with dialogues that makes things clearer and more immersive.
Yeah, nothing should be without a story. I hate things with no story. Which is why I'm usually not big on FPSs...
Though personally I never feel much different whether it's first-person or third-person -- either way I want the character I'm controlling to be a character in its own right. I hate those games where the main character never talks, too...
BTW, I can't get past SS2 training without it crashing. And whenever I try to patch it says something about not finding the install directory...
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In a FPS+RPG, you aren't just RPing a character and watching what happens due to it, I regard it, first due to the view point and second to the almost full control of the movements as much more immersive than pointing and clicking and seeing a 3D model in third person view to attack enemies and watch the combat based only on stats and rolls of dices, giving away the feeling that you are the character.
I don't see nothing wrong on merging action with a strong plotline, with the impersonation of a character and with dialogues that makes things clearer and more immersive.
Yeah, nothing should be without a story. I hate things with no story. Which is why I'm usually not big on FPSs...
Though personally I never feel much different whether it's first-person or third-person -- either way I want the character I'm controlling to be a character in its own right. I hate those games where the main character never talks, too...
BTW, I can't get past SS2 training without it crashing. And whenever I try to patch it says something about not finding the install directory...
There's a patch for making it work better in Windows XP, and here is a post explaining some things:
http://www.the-underdogs.info/forum/viewtopic.php?t=42963&highlight=system+shock++crash (http://www.the-underdogs.info/forum/viewtopic.php?t=42963&highlight=system+shock++crash)