PlaneShift

Gameplay => General Discussion => Topic started by: Fozzharn on March 26, 2007, 02:53:18 pm

Title: Helmets
Post by: Fozzharn on March 26, 2007, 02:53:18 pm
I know there will be many "experts" coming here calling me and this thread silly, but nevertheless this issue kept my brain busy for a few days.

Let's see:

You're going upstairs at Trasok's ready for your work packed with ore and at the top of the stairs you see that there are many, many people there ... and most of them ...

yes !   Most of them wearing helmets !

Something must have happened, because they're wearing these ... Maybe a fight ?

Oh no ... I see them working ... yeah working ... I see hammers, steel stock ... all are busy in smithing and metallurgy ... some are crafting swords and daggers ... and all that ... wearing a helmet ?


Is there somekind of danger in this building that maybe the ceiling will break ?

Do I also have to wear a helmet not to get hurt there ?


Or is it just impolite and annoying that so much people think their helmet is a trinket ??
Title: Re: Helmets
Post by: Nikodemus on March 26, 2007, 03:00:24 pm
In Yliakum it doesn't matter if you have helmet or not, differently from RL. Action -> Reaction.

Congrats with bringing topic, but since you didn't give any solution, I suppose everyone are doomed on failure there, if the thread starter can't come up with something ;P
Title: Re: Helmets
Post by: peeg on March 26, 2007, 03:02:38 pm
Maybe everyone's wearing a helmet while working because of that mean Rogues (http://hydlaa.com/smf/index.php?topic=28160.0)?  ;)
Title: Re: Helmets
Post by: Idoru on March 26, 2007, 03:04:08 pm
I could not agree more Fozzharn, it has often made me wonder why miners tend to wear such heavy armor when digging gold, or have swords in one hand. I personally remove armor when in safe areas and think that this would be the RL norm. It would get very hot and sweaty to mine all day in a full suit of armor. No doubt when heavy armor is available people will still continue to mine away whilst wearing it.
Title: Re: Helmets
Post by: Fozzharn on March 26, 2007, 03:14:24 pm

Congrats with bringing topic, but since you didn't give any solution, I suppose everyone are doomed on failure there, if the thread starter can't come up with something ;P


Solution ?

Take off hats and helmets when you enter a building .. like any educated beeing would do !

Edit:

... and ... well ... I just started making jokes about these mining warriors ... but who knows ... maybe Ore bites !?
Title: Re: Helmets
Post by: Nikodemus on March 26, 2007, 03:20:59 pm
Solution ?

Take off hats and helmets when you enter a building .. like any educated beeing would do !
Yeah, but those who do know it, already does it ;P Or forget about it, like me, from time to time. Or don't care at all.
You should focus on the last group ;)
Title: Re: Helmets
Post by: Elvicat on March 26, 2007, 03:31:46 pm
i use the helmet as part of my clothing, say i do this "elvi removes his hood" if i do that i actually put away the helmet, it's sorta part of my rp as a mysterious menki  :P hehe
Title: Re: Helmets
Post by: steuben on March 26, 2007, 03:59:59 pm
mind you given how close together everybody is. there will the inevitable miss swings and the like. and people will get hit. and well some people are touchier about that then others.
Title: Re: Helmets
Post by: Jackdaw on March 26, 2007, 05:08:59 pm
I think that part of RP is common sense about armor and helmets.

I don't think you would would normally expect people going in a bar to be in full battle armor with weapons in each hand just to have a drink (though there are a few bars in RL in which that might be a good idea). I think though that you do have to consider the decision to wear some armor and carry a weapon justifed when out mining in the wilds. A tefu crept up and attacked me from behind the other day while I was mining out in the wilderness.
Title: Re: Helmets
Post by: Zan on March 26, 2007, 05:19:36 pm
I do think this is a good point ...

In my roleplays I switch outfits regularly. My characters have an outfit for fighting, one for doing guard duty, one for casual hanging around, one for working (mining or smithing) and of course one for swimming. :P

A blacksmith working with a helmet on is only explainable if said blacksmith is an Ynwnn and is working with gold or silver. anyone ever tried hammering on rocks or steel while wearing armor in reality? Even if it's just thick leather, this is bound to tire you out and cause overheating.

There is a tendency among players to distinguish themselves with their outfits, especially now more and more different combinations are becoming possible. I noticed an extreme form of this last weekend. Players were asked to put down their weapons on a guarded auction, one of them continuously refused because the sickle was part of his outfit.

In my opinion this is not very good RP but it's the player's choice and nothing that can be done about it really.
Title: Re: Helmets
Post by: Proglin on March 26, 2007, 05:30:28 pm
You seem to have terribly misunderstood Fozz. It makes perfect sense the crafters are wearing helmets. Metallurgy , Weapon making and others are still under heavy devellopment, which means some bugs might cause a Gold Stock to fly through the Smithy if Hammered wrongly, thus causing massive Trama's to the heads,even those of Kran. Also, the lack in STR training of some smith causes them to, on a very frequent base, let the hammer slip while taking a swing. The Hammer then might bounce on the anvil, on a wall and hit you on the back of your head via the beams that support the Smithies roof. Then there's the awful noise of 12 Smiths hammering away in one smithie! Imagine That! The Crafters Guilds, however, found a solution by placing substantial amounts of cotton in their helmets. This also prevents the commonly burned beards as well as loss of eyebrows and lashes.

So... As you can see, wearing helmets in a smithie, is just a safety protocol. I highly advice all Crafters to keep wearing their helmets during the dangerous and often misunderstood art of Crafting.

(http://ugo.sinet.it/survivors/uploads/Main/helmets.jpg)
Title: Re: Helmets
Post by: Gharan on March 26, 2007, 05:32:15 pm
I think you just won your own screenshot competition Prog.  ;D
Title: Re: Helmets
Post by: Elvicat on March 26, 2007, 08:19:05 pm
haha that's just great proglin  ;D
Title: Re: Helmets
Post by: Fozzharn on March 26, 2007, 10:30:47 pm

congrats for the screenie, Proglin.

and ... you are right in some of your points ... but

these "horned" helmets ... are ... err ... too big for 10 smiths standing together there.

I wouldn't bother them wearing the mercenary helmet with cotton in it ... great idea ... but not those "horned" ones.

- do you know what a "horned man" in my country means ?
- he's the one which wife "does" other men ....

Title: Re: Helmets
Post by: zanzibar on March 26, 2007, 10:40:20 pm
People just wear helmets as a status symbol.  They'll stop once articles of clothing are available in game.
Title: Re: Helmets
Post by: John80sk on March 26, 2007, 10:57:53 pm
meh, once ingame storage is around you'll probably see less armor and weapons.
Title: Re: Helmets
Post by: lordraleigh on March 27, 2007, 04:16:59 am
People just wear helmets as a status symbol.  They'll stop once articles of clothing are available in game.

I think a well-done character description with details on clothing is a much better "status symbol" as it puts things IC(Specially if you have earned enough REAL tria to back it up).

While wearing a helmet "for status" just because there aren't clothes yet is an OOC action. Other thing people forget to remember: we shouldn't distinguish the oldbie from the n00b based on the armor one is wearing. Not everyone in Yliakum is a fighter, and also some fighters(read: swashbucklers) sacrifice protection in exchange of mobility.

And I think that if crafters wear protective helmets, they would look like medieval versions of these(But this is more suitable for modern "crafters" in my opinion):

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Image:SMAW.welding.af.ncs.jpg (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Image:SMAW.welding.af.ncs.jpg)

I never saw in any medieval movie crafters wearing helmets while not engaged in combat.
Title: Re: Helmets
Post by: zanzibar on March 27, 2007, 07:10:52 am
Wearing rare armour as a symbol of status is OOC?  Ooooooo kaaaaaay then.
Title: Re: Helmets
Post by: Zan on March 27, 2007, 08:37:18 am
If it is done disregarding the situation at hand ... I agree with Lordraleigh completely.

People really should stop taking parts of arguments out of context just so they have an easier time denying them :P
Title: Re: Helmets
Post by: zanzibar on March 27, 2007, 09:02:07 am
If it is done disregarding the situation at hand ... I agree with Lordraleigh completely.

People really should stop taking parts of arguments out of context just so they have an easier time denying them :P


I don't deny the existence of his argument.  I just don't agree with it.
Title: Re: Helmets
Post by: Aseld on March 27, 2007, 09:48:57 am
My two cents: I personally don't see a problem with this practice, as, as previously stated, things do happen, such as Rogues being lured to the mining spot. Also I don't think wearing helmets as status symbols is a bad thing - this could easily be done in character. Just read some fantasy fiction for examples: Gendry wearing his bull helm at all times in A Song of Ice and Fire, knights wear swords to indicate their profession and status...
Title: Re: Helmets
Post by: zanzibar on March 27, 2007, 10:01:37 am
My two cents: I personally don't see a problem with this practice, as, as previously stated, things do happen, such as Rogues being lured to the mining spot. Also I don't think wearing helmets as status symbols is a bad thing - this could easily be done in character. Just read some fantasy fiction for examples: Gendry wearing his bull helm at all times in A Song of Ice and Fire, knights wear swords to indicate their profession and status...


But those guys are warriors and all fighting is OOC so all the tools of fighting are OOC as well.  Clothing is only in character if it's described in your profile.  Be sure to make the clothing of incredibly fine quality and incredibly rare materials and also be sure to include a background story which describes who you got it from.  Don't forget to describe what colour it's glowing.  If you got it while you were outside Yliakum, you get bonus points.
Title: Re: Helmets
Post by: Aseld on March 27, 2007, 10:12:28 am
I protest! Is it not possible for a character to both craft and fight? I again cite Gendry from A Song of Ice and Fire, as well as virtually every dwarf on the Discworld. I can list more if you want?
Title: Re: Helmets
Post by: Idoru on March 27, 2007, 10:14:35 am
Ahhhh, Discworld. That is the benchmark ive used for RP since I started :P

Life is easy for a Kran, we seem to be the only ones not to cause offence by awalking around naked :)
Title: Re: Helmets
Post by: Fozzharn on March 27, 2007, 10:16:26 am

going off topic and right into the B.S.-Line again ?? (I'm sorry for those who seriously try to talk about this issue.)

back to the topic:
It is just annoying and IMO totally OOC if ten crafters with those big-horned-helmets are standing around the furnace ... it is bad enough that the furnace is always overcrowded and there is no need to even more destroy the scene.
Title: Re: Helmets
Post by: Zan on March 27, 2007, 04:47:14 pm
Bottom line of this thing ...

Roleplay includes wearing the appropriate attire for a certain task, if at all possible within the game mechanics.

Nobody can be enforced to roleplay but wearing full suits of armor to mine on a sunny day or still brandishing weapons when guards request you to sheathe them just because they're part of your attire are considered very poor roleplay by most. Zanzi's inconsistent opinions about roleplay not taken into consideration :P
Title: Re: Helmets
Post by: bilbous on March 27, 2007, 05:24:26 pm
For kran wearing anything but nothing (leather is pointless) is to make yourself more vulnerable unless medium armor has become much more trainable than just 20 (haven't looked lately). If I wear one of them helms in combat I take damage to the head I otherwise would not because my light armor skill is significantly better than any other type. I used to wear chain bits but stopped when I reached max skill level. It just was not worthwhile.

I doubt it is much different, generally, for you soft-skins except there is not leather helmet as far as I know so anything would be better than nothing.
Title: Re: Helmets
Post by: Parallo on March 27, 2007, 06:16:30 pm
Players were asked to put down their weapons on a guarded auction, one of them continuously refused because the sickle was part of his outfit.


I've seen that a number of times. I often wonder if they know what a sickle is used for. "No, I must carry this so people can identify me as a farmer!"
Title: Re: Helmets
Post by: Narure on March 27, 2007, 06:26:07 pm
The horned helmets should be used to test the collision detection... That would sort out the problem. And i want leather pirate hats!
Title: Re: Helmets
Post by: Zan on March 27, 2007, 06:47:34 pm
That's actually why I could ignore him, Parallo. Figured he couldn't do that much harm with a farming tool. ;D
Title: Re: Helmets
Post by: zanzibar on March 28, 2007, 12:05:53 am
Oh no everyone, my opinions are "inconsistent" and open to change!  Be careful, I'm open minded and willing to listen to what other people have to say!  And I even change my mind once in a while!  Wow Zan, that's such a horrible thing!
Title: Re: Helmets
Post by: Volund on March 28, 2007, 07:07:30 am
Why doesi t matter? Give people a break. FIGHT THE MAN!!!!!!!!!!!!
Title: Re: Helmets
Post by: Zan on March 28, 2007, 07:13:14 pm
Never said it was a horrible thing .. just a remark ;)
Title: Re: Helmets
Post by: wolfspirit on March 28, 2007, 09:25:34 pm
Yes I wear my helm and armor everywhere...even mining...if you think of how much weight one can carry in the inv...how many ore are you willing to leave behind becuase you unequip yourself to mine or enter a building...I'd rather make some money mining than to make less money due to having to unequip myself and carry everything in inv...duh.
Title: Re: Helmets
Post by: neko kyouran on March 28, 2007, 09:43:34 pm
Last I remember, what you were wearing was still factored into how much you were currently carrying, so your idea about leaving things equiped in order to carry more may be a little off in its correctness, as in, you may be wrong.
Title: Re: Helmets
Post by: zanzibar on March 28, 2007, 10:01:28 pm
Never said it was a horrible thing .. just a remark ;)

A pointless and unnecessary one.
Title: Re: Helmets
Post by: lirucan on March 28, 2007, 10:31:24 pm
Admittedly I do not un-equip anything when mining.

But the way I see it Leather boots and gloves along with a pick are valid minning equipment...

My swords I do de-quip when going off to mine as traditionally speaking a minning pick should be a 2H weapon...
Title: Re: Helmets
Post by: Meren on March 30, 2007, 01:37:06 am
I love to get all garbed out for mining and crafting. Changing outfits for the given situation adds a bit of depth to RP'ing. Really, think about it. Would YOU want to be wearing a full suit of armour with a heavy plate helm while swinging a pick in the heat of the sun for countless hours. I think not. Also The same applies to the furnace and crafting stations. Unfortunately I am, and I'm thinking others might be too, enrolled in a gulid where I must ALWAYS be in uniform and have weapons ready.  Honestly, I personally hate carrying weapons in Hydlaa Plaza. I find it rude and an offensive display of character representation. Again, I am bound to my Higher authorities to be carrying weapons at all time. I always try to keep in mind that these other citizens may be in similar situation as I. ~ Have Fun ~ Role Play to the best of your ability ~ And If you have to be an inconsiderate A-Hole, at least Role Play it so that it reflects your CHARACTER and not YOU. You know who I'm talkin about. }}}}----------------------> Chow!!
Title: Re: Helmets
Post by: Bolad on March 30, 2007, 03:13:23 am
Meren, In joining a guild, you should choose carefully, a family with ways and beliefs which match with those of your character. It seems to me, at least from reading your post, that your character has far more to offer the Planeshift community than it is currently allowed by it's guild. You should seriously seek another family which encourages your character to grow to its fullest potential, not restricts it with overbearing attitudes in conflict to your own.
Also, although not strictly enforced at the moment, fighting in Hydlaa Plaza is illegal. Although allowed, the open carrying of weapons in such areas, I am sure, is discouraged by the powers that be. It is just my opinion, but for a guild rule to demand its members go against these wishes isn't the best RP in this, or any other world.

Sorry if I have gone a little off topic  :P

Bolad

Patriarch to the
Marauders of Boreas
Title: Re: Helmets
Post by: wolfspirit on April 03, 2007, 09:35:40 am
Last I remember, what you were wearing was still factored into how much you were currently carrying, so your idea about leaving things equiped in order to carry more may be a little off in its correctness, as in, you may be wrong.

I foyu hace ever tried to place your pick into inv after getting the ore..you will see that many times you can not due to "no room" in the inv..so you have to leave yourself equiped with whats in your hands