PlaneShift
Support => Complaint Department => Topic started by: Ganamede on May 06, 2007, 06:10:38 pm
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Well i tried out your litte world you have going here and dont get me wrong it looked nice you can tell you guys have done alot of work.
The i dea of a rp game created by players seemed very appealing. sadly though i ran into your players.
I asked a guy a question ...... thats what noobs do he immedietly replied that i was annoying.
So a little advice for you if you want to grow your player base you might want to get rid of some of the "donkey's rear end" you have playing
i for one will not be returning that response alone let me know how the community is.
Too bad it looked nice
[Language warning! --Neko]
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so one person called you "annoying" and that automatically makes other players jerks? Anyway there are those type of people in EVERY game. It's just best to ignore them.
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I agree that most of the players probably arent jerks but if you have players like that running around then it shows a lack of
ability or wanting to get rid of a very bad aspect to the game.
Ive played neverwinter nights for several years on rp persistent worlds and you dont find players like that because it isnt tolerated.
Im not sure what your doing to atract the as i like to call them wow players but if you plan to build a rp world you better do something to stop it.
Thats the thing about a new player there not going to stay around for crap like that. that one player painted a picture of
the entire community. perhaps it is a false picture but 90% of new players will just leave .
The only reason i even bothered to post this was because i thought a game like this was a really awesome idea
but as long as youve got players like that your not going to be getting any new ones
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Personally I've never had any probelms with the PS Community 98% of them are nice people. The 2% who aren't tend to get bored quickly and leave. Of course you have to remember not everyone is roleplaying nice characters :).
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ya forgot some power lvler but they dont really respond anyways.(just ignore em if they try to tell you how good they are) ;D
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Maybe i was wrong ..... i thought this was a rp based game. If so you shouldnt even have powergamers
Do you have in game dm's rules enforcers?
Not sure about here but when someone is OOC or just a general asshat the dm's in nwn can warn them
If they keep it up there gone.
I might give it another try later but if its full of powergaming uberleetdudez its not for me
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Try opening up your eyepatches to see a bit more of the game before judging it. This game is totally free and has no joining pre-requirements .. of course you will have 'WoW-players' joining. The Devs aren't RP Nazi's either .. roleplaying is highly encouraged, not forced upon players. Staying IC in public chat is a rule but there aren't nearly enough GM's to enforce it effectively. Personally I haven't met a better community in any other game yet, sure there are bad apples among the harvest but all in all it's a damn fine harvest.
Not comparable to any WoW community at all.
I'd say maybe you're not the type of player we wan't to encourage to join as well, some tolerance and positive attitude can be better than the ability to RP. Anyone can learn to RP, not anyone can become tolerant. :P
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Ive played neverwinter nights for several years on rp persistent worlds and you dont find players like that because it isnt tolerated.
Im not sure what your doing to atract the as i like to call them wow players but if you plan to build a rp world you better do something to stop it.
Ehm we Kinda have ONE server for ONE world, so everybody is put together ;)
And I myself think it's pretty bad kicking players who don't (IYO) know how to 'RP' I mean, Somebody gotta teach them!
And Maidon is right We also have Evil, selfish and greey chars in game ;)
I'm sure with all ya 'Neverwinter nights experience' you would some kind of 'Mega über leet RPer' And KNOW that characters not always the good intentions have ;)
Do you have in game dm's rules enforcers?
Not sure about here but when someone is OOC or just a general asshat the dm's in nwn can warn them
If they keep it up there gone.
I might give it another try later but if its full of powergaming uberleetdudez its not for me
::) Dm's? We got Gm's :P They act up if someone is really harassing people [trade flood, name calling, shout abuse, text flood ect. ect. Even when someone talks too much OOC without using [], a slip get through but too much is too much.
AlsoMaybe i was wrong ..... i thought this was a rp based game. If so you shouldnt even have powergamers
Ehh... whycan't a rp have power lvlers? EVERYGAME HAS THEM even Single player RPG's!
Maybe 'some' online games don't but they tend to have a very fascist regime about who's gonna play and who doesn't X-/
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power levelers don't tend to stick round for very long either.
They get bored with the lack of things to do and generally they don't like to RP much either giving them even less to do.
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See i was right the "donkey's rear end" are flying out of the woodwork now *points up to zan*
enjoy your low graphic replica of wow
you shouldnt post this as a rp world when it is clearly not
[Language warning! --Neko]
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Bye bye, new pot who calls the kettle black!
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I think you get offended far to easily.
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See i was right the [explicit removed] are flying out of the woodwork now *points up to zan*
enjoy your low graphic replica of wow
you shouldnt post this as a rp world when it is clearly not
Ehmm Now you SOUND annoying, Ktstsch to you, Calling Zan names! That's that's that's just wrong!
EDIT: And calling PS a wow replica? :@#\ :@#\ :@#\ :@#\ :@#\
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well, at least you put your complaint in the right forum section. :)
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So a little advice for you if you want to grow your player base you might want to get rid of some of the "donkey's rear end" you have playing
I guess that's exactly what this thread accomplished. Nice.
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So a little advice for you if you want to grow your player base you might want to get rid of some of the "donkey's rear end" you have playing
I guess that's exactly what this thread accomplished. Nice.
;D See? Our system does work! :P
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Well i tried out your litte world you have going here and dont get me wrong it looked nice you can tell you guys have done alot of work.
The i dea of a rp game created by players seemed very appealing. sadly though i ran into your players.
I asked a guy a question ...... thats what noobs do he immedietly replied that i was annoying.
So a little advice for you if you want to grow your player base you might want to get rid of some of the "donkey's rear end" you have playing
i for one will not be returning that response alone let me know how the community is.
Too bad it looked nice
[Language warning! --Neko]
You can't judge an entire community by a single experience with a single individual.
I agree that most of the players probably arent jerks but if you have players like that running around then it shows a lack of
ability or wanting to get rid of a very bad aspect to the game.
And how would you suggest we go about doing that?
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I agree that most of the players probably arent jerks but if you have players like that running around then it shows a lack of
ability or wanting to get rid of a very bad aspect to the game.
And how would you suggest we go about doing that?
Recruiting Many GMs, giving them nice leather suits and whips *Ktstsch!* xD
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Hmmm. You asked a single person a single question? In what context? Was it in a /tell. Was it in open chat? Was your question asked in an in-character manner? Was the response in-character? What -was- your question? What -was- the response?
You offer very little evidence besides "I was treated bad."
If the response was out of character and in a tell, then you dealt with a rude person. Yes, those exist. There are no laws against being a jerk. Move on and find one of the great many nice people in the game.
If the response was in-character, and in open chat, then you may have run into either a jerk, or a nice person playing a jerk. I can give you examples from my own list of characters.
"<Your question>?"
Hyuken says: Um... I not so sure what you talkin about, but I can try to help.
Grunn says: Yes, goodman, I am glad to serve you. Come this way.
Krook spits at your feet with a sneer. "Git yur smelly hide away from me, ya tefpile."
Janeous says: I have no time for petty nuisances. Take your annoyance elsewhere.
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Who called for more (and more powerful) Game Masters?!
http://www.thenoobcomic.com/daily/strip087.html (http://www.thenoobcomic.com/daily/strip087.html)
http://www.thenoobcomic.com/daily/strip088.html (http://www.thenoobcomic.com/daily/strip088.html)
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The i dea of a rp game created by players seemed very appealing. sadly though i ran into your players.
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I asked a guy a question ...... thats what noobs do he immedietly replied that i was annoying.
No, thats not what new-comers should be doing specially since an RP world implies a context to be aware of. Try reading the FAQ / manual for starters. And since you probably insulted him (as you have done here in this thread), you deserved the reply you got.
The players of this game are collectively beyond reproach because that collective polices itself. Its precisely because it doesn't rely on GMs to do such activities that it is successfull. The fact that you were called 'annoying' by the first and only player you apparently had an exchange with is a testament to that player base you criticize.
If you feel duped because "whats the shortcut to change camera views?" got the response it deserved - then go seek another world. This one is not for you. If you expected an evil character to have sympathy for a frustrated new-comer with a snake's tongue, this world isn't for you either.
Frankly, considering the numerous times i have witnessed busy players take the time to explain, show, give or direct the new-comers, this player base is an amazing group of people. This happens on a daily basis and at all hours. The dedication that prevails in this place is nothing short of outstanding.
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"<Your question>?"
Hyuken says: Um... I not so sure what you talkin about, but I can try to help.
Grunn says: Yes, goodman, I am glad to serve you. Come this way.
Krook spits at your feet with a sneer. "Git yur smelly hide away from me, ya tefpile."
Janeous says: I have no time for petty nuisances. Take your annoyance elsewhere.
you got a player exsample so. so will i! :D
Acro: you will find <subject> around that area.. sorry try askin somebody else..
leroner grins sharply: ahh, yung and unwise! perhaps you should do somthing for me first?
there you go :D
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Honestly I am beggining to believe a good chunk of our players are somewhat intolerant and insular. I have seen the number of active players decline significantly since i was a player. I don't know what to say about it other than to appeal to you all to be a bit more patient and helpful with new players and try to take them in and teach them. If you already do this do not respond, i am not talking to you. If you have been guilty of pushing players away in an off-hand manner however, I ask you to dig deeper, remember what it was to be a new player here how hard it can be to earn your way or even figure out where rats are. Some of the fault lies with us of course and new features for the newbie should be forthcoming i hope. In the mean time the players act as our primary spokespeople. I would hate to think of ps as an ever diminishing pocket of rp leetness. You need the new blood, the smaller the community gets the more at eachother's throats you will be.
Perhaps we can start by holding back on the snarkiness for the first 5-10 posts of a new person?
Perhaps we can tolerate the first 5-10 newbie questions in game without being asshat leet uber rp snobs?
Perhaps the devs can work to provide more training to the new players so they know what to expect?
Maybe we can promote the game to our friends?
Maybe we can take people into group and train them on how to play?
The status quo is way less than ideal. If I were the initial poster in this thread I would have gotten angry too.
I hope you can all see i am not judging our fine players, I am asking them to work on their newbie lovin skills for the long term solvency of the game. Filling a smaller and smaller niche by being more and more exclusive is not wellness.
Put the bully stick down, turn the critical eye inward.
I love planeshift, I am passionate about it. I have a personal relationship with many of the players and there are few including me who have not run people off due to a bad mood or the daftness of the new player. I have caught myself bandying about with the same attitude so don't think that i believe myself to be innocent of this.
All I am saying is players are for better or worse the front line in public relations in planeshift.
So Players, Devs, Gms, try harder . . . :love:
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* claps * ::|
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lol ... I wonder if he asked an NPC ... they call me annoying a LOT
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If that was true ... well, the game GUI would show that almost obviously now, I think. The message windows switches to "NPC" tab when you select the "mouth" icon in the context menu of an NPC, right? And at least you see the command "/tellnpc".
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Actually when I first started (think of your first day) I didn't really notice which tab I was in ... just that they seemed to flash a lot.
Also, the /tellnpc only shows up if you "up arrow" in the text box.
The more I think about it the more funny it gets ... it could have been an NPC
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Well I'm sorry, but I agree, I think you get offended way to easily...and if that's the case this game isn't for you. Many ppl roleplay all the time and very well. If you don't like the fact that you are going to get some attitude once and a while, well sorry I think you need to wake up. This is a free game and the team is doing a great job! They've created a world in wich ppl are able to be basically who they want...there shouldn't be a limit on that...every world has some ppl that make it unique. You need the balance of good/evil...black/white...
I'm pretty new myself...and to tell you the truth...yeah I went around before I found help at first...the first person I asked didn't help me right away or answer any of my questions...I hunted around. It's not the duty of everyone in game to help new comers...it's more of a polite suggestion. However, now I'm lvling up no problem, rping and I've even joined a guild. All within two weeks. So if you want to give the game another try by all means go ahead...but if not...well sorry it's not our lost. :whistling:
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Hmm I havnt been on the server in a long time granted, maybe the playes have changed, but I never ran into anyone who was much like that.
Maybe a couple of jerks fiultered into the community, or you hit a psychotic RP nut who wont answer to anyone unless they are RPing?
I dont know. Try differant people in my experiance the community is pretty good.
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/me strains to move...
AHHHHHHH I'm paralyzed!!
OK, am I the only one this happens to? I'm so struck by being able to see both sides of the issue that I'm not even sure which side of the line to stand on. First I was immediately put on the defensive by Ganamede, then that turned even further south when Zan made a fairly reasonable post (albeit a bit prodding) and was subsequently insulted. Insults directed at people I consider friends, and whom I have a tremendous amount of respect for tend to hit closer to home, and I'm often more angered by someone insulting or attacking a friend than I am when its directed at myself.
This is what I was intending on posting, so I'm posting it anyways as an example of my little temper:
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The i dea of a rp game created by players seemed very appealing. sadly though i ran into your players.
would read better as:
The idea of a rp game created by players seemed very appealing. sadly though I ran into one of your players who wasn't nice so I immediately judged the entire community by this one person and am such a baby that I decided to cry foul and insult the whole player base and the management thereof.
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As you can see not the most kind, helpful, constructive, or level response I've ever designed. Then I thought to myself "OMG I'M BECOMING A DREADED OLDBIE!!" Which scared me because while my ingame experiences were good when I first arrived here almost 3 years ago, I was not treated with a good deal of respect by "oldbies". I was new and therefor my ideas and points were immediately disregarded as invalid. Over time I thought this had improved, however I think that it was simply because I stuck around, my post count grew, and my name was more recognized, so I realize that there is a need for more tolerance, but I understand how easy it is to slip into defensive mode after all these years. Its easy to become cynical about the state of the player base, easy to become defensive of your ideas which you've come to over years of experience, and easy to be a jerk without realizing it. I like to think I do a somewhat better job ingame. I usually keep about 10000 trias on me to dish out to help get people started, or a weapon or so. I often buy mid ranged weapons at auction to give to players just starting out, but in the forums I think I've turned more one sided, and single minded over the years. When you are a part of something for so long you get ideas of how it really should be changed, so when new people with fresh ideas come to challenge things its almost second nature to respond in a dismissive and perhaps even rude method.
The only reason i even bothered to post this was because i thought a game like this was a really awesome idea
but as long as you've got players like that your not going to be getting any new ones
Zanzibar is correct when he asks how you can do this. Its true you can moderate to a certain extent but you can't put everyone through a "jerk test" before they join. I think all you can try to do as a community is encourage positive attitudes towards helping new people get started in a strange world.
Ive played neverwinter nights for several years on rp persistent worlds and you dont find players like that because it isnt tolerated.
Im not sure what your doing to atract the as i like to call them wow players but if you plan to build a rp world you better do something to stop it.
I don't know what servers you were playing on but I quit because of the snobby elitist attitude and accusations that my character was "hacked". Got annoying. I spent hours getting the stuff to craft that halberd! :D Jerks!
Under the Moon also brings up a good point about people who RP jerks. This doesn't mean much other than perhaps you ran into someone who was a very convincing jerk ;)
lol ... I wonder if he asked an NPC ... they call me annoying a LOT
Man if that is what happened I would soooooo die laughing. Just thinking of it brings me enough of a chuckle to clear my head for a moment of all the conflicting emotions this thread brings out.
Maybe i was wrong ..... i thought this was a rp based game. If so you shouldnt even have powergamers
Do you have in game dm's rules enforcers?
Not sure about here but when someone is OOC or just a general asshat the dm's in nwn can warn them
If they keep it up there gone.
I might give it another try later but if its full of powergaming uberleetdudez its not for me
I think most games have a certain percent of these. As long as they aren't bothering anyone's RP there is no reason to kick them out or warn them. Did you consider contacting a GM? DM's in NWN cannot keep tabs on everyone at once, so my guess is that they remove the players or warn them when they receive complaints. You can report people which is a legitimate step depending on the situation.
But back to what I was trying to say before I got distracted like I usually do... the part about seeing both sides. As I said before my initial response was defensive - like most peoples, and I was feeling pretty good about the funny insults flung about as the thread went on, but then I got to Xillix's thread and realized that there were great points there as well... suddenly I didn't know what to think.
When this happens, and you feel both sides of an issue have legit points what does this mean? I'm leaning towards conceding that its the sort of thing that needs to be decided on an individual level, instead of being black and white with one side right and one side wrong. Its too easy to simply pick a viewpoint that is more selfish in nature rather than examine both sides, but is being tooo subjective just as bad? I almost feel wishy washy.
Honestly I am beginning to believe a good chunk of our players are somewhat intolerant and insular. I have seen the number of active players decline significantly since i was a player. I don't know what to say about it other than to appeal to you all to be a bit more patient and helpful with new players and try to take them in and teach them. If you already do this do not respond, i am not talking to you.
Maybe not but you invoked a bit of an emotional response, at least from me. In the end I don't think most are intolerant or insular though. I think some of the more vocal people might be and that makes it seem like its more predominant than it is. I find more people ignore than insult, which if you don't have the energy to deal with a player at that time might be the best choice. If I don't have time, I usually try to explain how I'm on an ore run, and if I don't make my shipment date, I'll lose my client, or some other RP reason so that it doesn't seem quite like I'm brushing people off. I feel bad every time anyways though because I remember what it was like to be new.
I'm not quite as worried about the community as a whole as you Xillix, but then I don't have to be. I believe in it, and many others do as well. If we all keep up the faith the possibilities are never ending.
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This guy has gone, why are people STILL posting??? O.O
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This guy has gone, why are people STILL posting??? O.O
It's nice have have someone who not there to flame on ;)
I can see no other explanation ;D
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This guy has gone, why are people STILL posting??? O.O
It's nice have have someone who not there to flame on ;)
I can see no other explanation ;D
Well, I was using the way this was brought up to do a bit of self examination, and also to be a bit reflexive in general. Sometimes the platform presents and opportunity and I guess I felt like standing on a soap box for a few minutes. Forgive me in this.
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I still say we should have a small application for joining to be approved, perhaps by well-known and talented RPers in the community (so as not to clog up the GMs and such).
All it would require is this on the forums:
Full Name
Description of Character (basic or detailed)
History/Background (not too long, but basic so that we know they intend to RP)
And then we set up some sort of password system that enables a person to put in the password and never have to do so again and it enables their client, and then they can sign in (after registering). The password could change daily so as to keep people from letting their buddies in 'illegally'.
:) Simple :)
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I still say we should have a small application for joining to be approved, perhaps by well-known and talented RPers in the community (so as not to clog up the GMs and such).
All it would require is this on the forums:
Full Name
Description of Character (basic or detailed)
History/Background (not too long, but basic so that we know they intend to RP)
And then we set up some sort of password system that enables a person to put in the password and never have to do so again and it enables their client, and then they can sign in (after registering). The password could change daily so as to keep people from letting their buddies in 'illegally'.
:) Simple :)
Yeah, I don't see any problems with that plan. There isn't even a catch-22 built right into it.
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Eh?? A what???
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Farren, did you not read a word of Xillix's post?
He complains about insular and elitist players and your solution is a "test"?
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Eh?? A what???
It means that you can't go near a swimming pool until you learn how to swim.
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Well i tried out your litte world you have going here and dont get me wrong it looked nice you can tell you guys have done alot of work.
The i dea of a rp game created by players seemed very appealing. sadly though i ran into your players.
I asked a guy a question ...... thats what noobs do he immedietly replied that i was annoying.
So a little advice for you if you want to grow your player base you might want to get rid of some of the "donkey's rear end" you have playing
i for one will not be returning that response alone let me know how the community is.
Too bad it looked nice
[Language warning! --Neko]
Thats sad you feel you must cast judgement on us all because some one (May have been in charitor)
Indeviguality is a main part of PS
btw did you read the players guide?
If it was a question that is in the guide maybe you were being innoying.
I am not saying you were but to judge us in a whole for one persons actions ?
I am actually going to bite my tongue which is rare.
But The developers did make the guide for a reason.
And you have to understand for the others perspective.
I get questions asked at any given time at least 20 times a day.
I am patient some are not as patent.
And OOC takes from the Experence.
Read the rules some time they may help you out
I am sorry that you ran into some one that didnt give you your way.
But again this is a Roll Playing Game And He/She may have been playing his or her charictor
and you may have also intrupted a roll playing event.
better luck in the game
Remember to limit your OOC and use ICC
Want answers ? Find a interesting way to ask in charictor................. thats what i do when something new is avail in PS
if you make it intresting most usually will help
but when we get bombarded with the same questions IE
Where do i get money?
how do i fight?
Can i join a guild ( this one has exseptions to the rule............. but by a 1 day old..... what bugs me about this one is the fact they dont know anything about the guild or what a guild is)
How do i mine?
whats a spell?
can you give me a weapon?
These Questions get old.
Especially when some one is trying to remain in charictor
I am not complaining but if it was a common question that you could have had answered buy reading the guide
I am sad to say you brought it on your self
Good luck in all your endevors
Remeber Dont judge the Village because of one person
It only makes you look like a fool,
Lorac
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;D I was right! people like to flame on other when they are not there anymore, It's like called your enemy names after he left ;D
humans... such an interesting species :P
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;D I was right! people like to flame on other when they are not there anymore, It's like called your enemy names after he left ;D
humans... such an interesting species :P
FYI I didnt get to this point and saw that he/she left
also note
What did you just do to me?
Waited till i left to flame me
so cautious what you do you may make your self look bad
Dont complain about flamers that post when a person is gone and then flame me when i am gone
thats hipacritacle
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For the record, there has been 0 flaming in this thread. I suggest we keep it that way.
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For the record, there has been 0 flaming in this thread. I suggest we keep it that way.
I didnt think I was Flaming
In my statement thatI made before Was Mearly suggestions to the New Player
Then statement was made that I waited for the new player to leave and then flamed him/her
The only reason for my statement was to help he new person in getting more out of planeshift
and its community
We all are so much different in the way we persive things
and this must be accounted for considering each of us come from different lands different cultures
and In a way I can understand the one who started this topic but on the other hand to right us all off for one charictors responces?
this person like i said before was prob in charictor
Which is how it should be unless in /tell
or in ()
now when i wrote what i said it was not to "Flame" this person it was to mearly guide this person to a more sucessful retreval of information that this person requested
Mear sugestion I to was new and being new is not wrong
We all had to start somewhere
and sometimes we forget this
and sometimes we get cought on a bad day too
theres many reasons this player could have made the comment that he/she made
and like i said
Dont judge a village because of one fool?
when you do this you become the fool or you may just miss out on one of the best experiences out there
Besides you never came to me (in game ) or you probebly would have been shown your answer you requested
With this all being said
Good luck
and dont be so quick to right off a good thing because of a minor conflict
Lorac
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My experience was exactly the opposite from this guy. I came ingame and started wandering around. Exploring things etc...
I enter the blacksmith at Oja(I'm a Menki) and two players approach and one notices I have no weapons so he asks me if I need any and gives me
two short swords. The second player gave me 2000trias to get me started with my training. I didn't even have to ask them for anything.
They just gave the stuff to me and wished me a good experience. Then later on when I got some quests and such I came to ask to that
smithy on what I need to create steel stock out of iron and coal I got a reply on 8:2 or 9:1 in iron:coal ratio but of course I read later on I
still need some other stuff to do it so that information alone is not helpful but their attitude sure was. And I've met other players that were
equaly helpful. So there really isn't much I can say aganist the community. It polices itself.
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I was replying in response to the starter of the thread, not later people's posts. :)
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I've played alot of MMO's out there (free, Beta Testing, P2P) and i still play some other ones, but out of all the communities this has to be the best I've seen.