PlaneShift
Gameplay => General Discussion => Topic started by: Kelod on June 12, 2007, 09:46:14 am
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Was recently in an RP playing a defenseless person who was threatened and nearly murdered. So I accepted a 'challenge' in case the person was to go through with killing me. Talking my way out of death I was then asked to concede so as not to ruin the other parties Duel Points (or whatever they're called). Now, I ask, why isn't there an option to call a draw or to call off the duel? The lack of this option forced an OOC moment.
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Duel points are silly.
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I agree.
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in RP you don't have to care for duel points.
So the system allows withdraw and doesn't discourage it at all.
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Duel points are just a number, worshipped by those who put dueling and powerleveling over roleplaying.
One of my characters has a very negative score in duel points, mainly because he uses dueling for training purposes with his fellow soldiers. Since training doesn't involve anyone dying one of the parties always has to yield to end the duel. None of his soldiers should make a big deal out of duel points since it has no advantages and would only prevent them from training together.
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Yeah duel points mean nothing really. I'm a firm believer in roleplaying fights etc without planning, so win or lose it shouldnt matter. I mean, if u have a fight IRL you dont decide before the fight who's gonna win. The only thing i ever used duel points for was when me and my friends used to go down to the death realm for some friendly dueling after a long rping session, and I used them to see my own improvement from the last session, the number itself wasnt important, it was the increas/decrease, as we were all pretty even skill wise, so it was quite easy to see how many times you had won/been beaten.
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I don't care about them, either. But apparently the guy who I was RPing with likes to keep his ratio up... the point is that not having a draw option forced an OOC situation.
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Personally I'd rather see them disappear completely and change the /yield command into an /end duel command .. that's as neutral as it can be.
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If DP were to create a system which finds out how much exp for who you get, then there should be draw option, since it sounds weird you get exp, even if the fight ended with a draw.
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IMO, it is near impossible to use the current dueling system in an RP context. It is a work in progress, and it is my hope that someday engine duels will be easily explainable in an RP context. Until that day, however, I advise RP dueling for RP situations and engine dueling for all others, such as testing.
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i don't think its that unuseable, if you havea real fight with swords, u either die or yield, it's the same in game. If people have issues about not wanting to go in the death realm or lose duel points, then dont get in a fight.
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I would think that in many situations, a third possibility occurs: that the victor elects not to kill his/her opponent, satisfied that he has won. This, as well is yielding, I suspect (it has been some time since I've tried either) are difficult to time, so even if you mean to do them, you may not be able to. In these respects, RP duels are more realistic, IMO.
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Very much agreed with what Rayken said. Thing is that with training nowadays it's rather hard to even come to an yield in some situations. Even so when you RP something like this it's very annoying to get a challenge (especially when many players actually care abut their DP ratio.) DP are a bad influence RP-wise since many tend to challenge just to get their quota up. Imho a RP duel is much more suitable to such situations, not to mention much more fun ;) (Whatever happened to RP duels anyway? Everyone seems to be interested just in pvp these days :( )
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As long as it's a proper RP duel with dice rolls i'd agree. This "/me stabs him in the stomach" crap i've seen some people do is just idiotic.
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Duels are made to aid RP and so shouldn't be bypassed completely. The system just needs tweaking is all. But PLEASE get rid of duel points!!!
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As long as it's a proper RP duel with dice rolls i'd agree. This "/me stabs him in the stomach" crap i've seen some people do is just idiotic.
I completely agree with you on this. The totally in your imagination duels are usually pretty much a joke. But I think it is always good to throw in the "/me stabs him in the at his stomach" before the roll. And for Talad's sake please move your on-screen character around a little.
In addition, I'd prefer to base the chance to hit on the character's actual stats and levels. But it appears most people disagree with me. The few I have participated in turned into - who ever rolled higher gets the hit (better than nothing). I guess most people don't want to give out their actual stats and levels, and then agreeing on what each would need to hit/block the other is a whole other set of problems (and probably alot of OOC discussion that would kill the mood).
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In addition, I'd prefer to base the chance to hit on the character's actual stats and levels. But it appears most people disagree with me. The few I have participated in turned into - who ever rolled higher gets the hit (better than nothing). I guess most people don't want to give out their actual stats and levels, and then agreeing on what each would need to hit/block the other is a whole other set of problems (and probably alot of OOC discussion that would kill the mood).
The entire point of having PS on a computer is that the system simulates all this for you, so you don't have to worry about it. Granted, there are some problems with duels at the moment due to very powerful weapons and what not, but if people are still resorting to rolling dice in PS for duels in a few years time, then something has really gone horribly wrong.
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In addition, I'd prefer to base the chance to hit on the character's actual stats and levels. But it appears most people disagree with me. The few I have participated in turned into - who ever rolled higher gets the hit (better than nothing). I guess most people don't want to give out their actual stats and levels, and then agreeing on what each would need to hit/block the other is a whole other set of problems (and probably alot of OOC discussion that would kill the mood).
There does not appear to be a proper system of rules to govern RP duels. If that framework existed, then enforcing it would be another matter. We need a way to roll against a players stats, that does not rely on the player telling others their stats.
A proper RP duel of any kind would involve a large number of die rolls taking into account possibly every stat for every player involved, depending on what actions were called for and what outcomes were possible. Many people do not have the patience or respect required to do this properly, so you see a lot of absolute RP scenarios as RayvenD mentioned. Often it becomes a who-rolls-highest type of situation. Many people will have no bloody idea what I am talking about at all.
Roleplay interaction without a GM is essentially a continuous OOC argument. Unless there are more GMs that are willing to act as DMs for groups of players, then there will be no end to these arguments.
I am curious though: What is the original purpose for duel points, Talad (or Xordan, or Xillix, or whoever)? I know it must be there for a reason, and of course the system is not finished, so how are these going to be used in the future, whats the plan?
Granted, there are some problems with duels at the moment due to very powerful weapons and what not, but if people are still resorting to rolling dice in PS for duels in a few years time, then something has really gone horribly wrong.
Okay, I had me a laugh at that one... *wipes tears from his eyes* ... thank you!
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The problem with RP duels based on player stats is that it still encourages powerleveling for starters .. and that there is no way of knowing what our opponent's stats are. We'll have to believe them on their word. That's why I generally just use a base number (usually 6) and roll with that. It also ensures a faster and more fluent RP .. with less time spent rolling or determining which stats to roll against which and more time spent actually playing your character.
Ideally the game mechanics would completely replace rolling .. but the problem is they don't give you the freedom to fight the way you want. You're stuck letting the game play out a simplified version of the fight. The only possible solution I could think of would be combining RP fighting with dueling into a sort of turn-based combat system. Instead of clicking a button and have the entire fight taken care of by the game mechanics you could have the game mechanics take care of every action. You'd have a button for one attack, a button to defend, a button to counter and a button to escape .. in a simplified version at least. Discussing this has already been done I think so I won't bring it into this thread any further.
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Doesn't the "Nature's Intuition" spell give you that information? Or perhaps there is another spell planned for the future that will.
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No idea, never had that spell but even if it does .. the ones among us who aren't very good at magic still don't have anything to base their opponent's stat-including rolls off.