PlaneShift
Gameplay => Newbie Help (Start Here) => Topic started by: Nivm on May 16, 2010, 01:54:48 am
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(To Abelia)
Can I start the tutorial?
I'd like to start the tutorial, please.
May I start the tutorial?
Could I please begin the tutorial?
May I begin the tutorial?
Can I begin the tutorial?
Could I please start the tutorial? (And Abelia Aruine finally responsed apporpriately!)
(To Abelia)
I'm ready.
Alright.
Fine.
Yes! Curse you. (There we go.)
(Ditto.)
Yes.
(Ditto.)
I'm ready.
I'm ready, please start.
I am ready!
Ready.
Ready, curse you. (I can hope.)
I let you know I am ready. (I'm now trying to quote the character better.)
I have let you know I am ready.
I did that.
It is done.
It is done, please continue.
Just yes, demonspawn! (I can do this to things without feelings, it worked.)
(Ditto.)
I'm ready? Please? (Awesome! It worked first time.)
(To Neave.)
Lady Abelia sent me.
Abelia sent me.
ABelia Aruine sent me. (Does it care where caps are? It could use that to determine what's a name.)
Miss Abelia sent me. (Went back and read it again.)
(Back to Abelia; may she be rewritten.)
Could you please give me your tainted blacksmithing book? (Yes, I deserved failure that time.)
Could you please give me the blacksmithing book?
Could you please give me your blacksmithing book? (Nar!)
Give me your book.
Give me your blacksmithing book. (Arg!)
Do you have a book for me?
Neave wants her blacksmithing book.
I am fetching Neave's blacksmithing book.
Do you have a blacksmithing book?
Do you have Neave's blacksmithing book?
You have a book I'm supposed to get; give it to me.
May your mind experience a swift explosion followed by being built from the ground up.
Give me Neave's book.
Give me Neave's blacksmithing book.
May I have Neave's blacksmithing book?
Am I supposed to murder you?
It seems plausible.
Could you please give me Neave's blacksmithing book?
Book of blacksmithing; I want it. Now.
I just now discovered I can walk through you at will.
Do you know, that you have Neave's blacksmithing book?
Neave wants her blacksmithing book back. So do I.
As you are a teacher; how do I kick you in the shins?
I would like you to give me the blacksmithing book, please?
(Then my father kicked me off; no success.)
Anywho, it would be nice if the NPC incomprehension messages were condensed after the first time. Although my main problem here is the fact that I don't know what the NPC is looking for.
What I'm saying is if a person does not have the facilities to get though this simple tutorial then they should not be let in - the game will be too difficult for them and most likely unpleasant for both them and those who encounter them.
So apparently I do not have simple facilities?
Had to work a bit with failed keybindings and a left-right distinction problem; but that system is very good. Why doesn't the keybinding page on the main client display anything?
The FAQ thread says that mental stamina is used for mining and fighting, but wouldn't it be more important for a stressful ritual spell or getting through a 20 page math test? Just a typo?
Why is there no mention of the wiki in the manual, the FAQ, or the starting guides? It's useful for dispelling confusion, and it seems to be of general knowledge; the stuff your character is supposed to know.
Edit: Oh, and...
Right click on the NPC and you will see a list things that you can say.
Click the choice that you want from the list.
Easy squeezy :)
Never. I'm going to get it right without cheating.
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When I first went through the tutorial I was lucky to have a friend who knew PS sitting next to me translating..
the most useful command I was taught- that I would never have thought of on my own most likely- is the /about command
/about blacksmithing book
/about book
/give book
/give me book
/about Windowless tower
/about Xiosia
it has saved me many a time... Good luck friend!
Yers,
Roled Rolak
not the sharpest time-teller in the Dome
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What I'm saying is if a person does not have the facilities to get though this simple tutorial then they should not be let in - the game will be too difficult for them and most likely unpleasant for both them and those who encounter them.
So apparently I do not have simple facilities?
Had to work a bit with failed keybindings and a left-right distinction problem; but that system is very good. Why doesn't the keybinding page on the main client display anything?
The FAQ thread says that mental stamina is used for mining and fighting, but wouldn't it be more important for a stressful ritual spell or getting through a 20 page math test? Just a typo?
Why is there no mention of the wiki in the manual, the FAQ, or the starting guides? It's useful for dispelling confusion, and it seems to be of general knowledge; the stuff your character is supposed to know.
Edit: Oh, and...
Right click on the NPC and you will see a list things that you can say.
Click the choice that you want from the list.
Easy squeezy :)
Never. I'm going to get it right without cheating.
I stand firmly behind everything I said. This tutorial is very easy to get though unless of course you have legitimate technical issues that prevent the client from working as it should. Trust me when I say this. The tutorial is a small sample of what the rest of the game is like. If you find the tutorial to be so hard that you need a manual to tell you what to do, or if the level of difficulty frustrates you to tears, then rest assured, the rest of the game will be the same but worse.
By the way, right clicking the npc and clicking on the quest responses is not cheating. This is the new way to do quests. The old way ( typing in the npc dialog ) may not work. Save yourself some time and use the new system .Right click the npc, and then on the mouth. There are a few occasions where you need to type something in like yes or no.
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you are doing it wrong.
quest are all menu driven now so right click on the npc and select the mouth, plus your complicated phrases are difficult to be parsed by a computer. due to a bug being fixed the old questing way could be readded but still won't be able to understand most of your elaborated phrases.
as for roled you don't use / in front of those :)
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Its amazing how in all those phrases, very basic combinations were not listed. Nor was there apparently any logical procedure to identify what worked and build upon a known lexicon. That is exactly why we have a menu-driven quest system now.
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How sad. I thought they were simple statements, but I guess people aren't extraordinarily better at parsers than I am. I've never managed to get one to work, so I can't help when I read it.
Do you know how high a priority enabling all the NPCs chat parsing is?
@ Rigwyn: I guess I goaded a sharp response with that quote'n'jibe, but what I inferred from (http://www.hydlaaplaza.com/smf/index.php?topic=31231.0) these (http://www.hydlaaplaza.com/smf/index.php?topic=35714.0) places (http://www.planeshift.it/guide/en/guide-npcs.html) (especially that part about treating them like players) made it sound as though one was supposed to use the chat system almost exclusively for NPCs. I was very annoyed when I thought I was unable to figure out the right phrases.
My speed should improve significantly now that I know the conversation is broken.
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Do you know how high a priority enabling all the NPCs chat parsing is?
No one has ever programmed a plain text parser that works very well. After 30 years, there is very little available that is better than the old Infocomm engine. People also do not take to them well, as you have to know how to spell. So, to answer your question: Not very much of a priority at all. That is why we have a menu-driven quest system now. Conversation is not broken however, I generally just talk to the NPCs myself.
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even restoring all the text which was removed to let a menu bug don't give trouble won't bring you a full fledged whatever i say text parser. it's computers even neural networks can't do much else than spit some nonsense after all. if they are well taught upon maybe they can work as database but nothing more.
anyway the source is there if you have a better way to implement it show us :)
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I'm still trying to get to the source, apparently the guide is flawed, and with partially outdated links.
I've never managed to get one [parser] to work, so I can't help when I read it [the source code].
Oddly enough, I was certain that extremely good parsers were around today; the kinds that are made for the Turing Test and can dismantle complex sentences.
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usually msvc is used for windows and gcc for linux/macosx so no one knows how to update the mingw guide.
Parser are still the most complex things to write even something as basic as a plain text config file parser or a compiler parser. both of which don't work with incorrect or evolving syntax and grammar rules that real language has, letting alone logic meaning (a word can have various meaning, a printf can have only one meaning). (just look at English it has at least 4 or 5 main variants, this excluding detection of wrong rule usage which is standard)
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I'm still trying to get to the source, apparently the guide is flawed, and with partially outdated links.
I've never managed to get one [parser] to work, so I can't help when I read it [the source code].
Oddly enough, I was certain that extremely good parsers were around today; the kinds that are made for the Turing Test and can dismantle complex sentences.
Do you even know C/C++ Nivm ?
From your posts you don't sound very technical. Either you deliberately tried to trip up the npc with phrases that were not as simple as they could be so that you would have something to jabber about on the forum, or else you don't really have any insight into how a program would parse a line of text. It should be obvious that you should use a simplified sentence with as few words as possible.
Forgive me if I have my head way up my ass, but you don't sound like a programmer to me.
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Oddly enough, I was certain that extremely good parsers were around today; the kinds that are made for the Turing Test and can dismantle complex sentences.
Even if you see a project that *claims* these sorts of things, it only counts if the parser works. None of them do. Processing of natural language ideas and sentences is an immensely complex undertaking. Another one of those things that seems like it would be simple to most people, but then it becomes very complex during implementation. The Infocomm engine still rules (lol).
Forgive me if I have my head way up my ass, but you don't sound like a programmer to me.
In the software business *everyone* is an *idea person*.
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Just assume that I know nothing at all about C++ or any other programming language, since I'm not going to show anyone the evidence of such. The best I was able to do was a two-word parser; a verb and a noun. And keeping a list of synonyms that the user could define.
I expected that most of my sentences would be simplified by a system of synonyms. For instance;
Lady Abelia sent me.
Abelia sent me.
ABelia Aruine sent me.
Miss Abelia sent me. (Success.)
I expected that it would take any number of synonyms for Abelia's name, and it did not. Or;
Can I start the tutorial?
I'd like to start the tutorial, please.
May I start the tutorial?
Could I please begin the tutorial?
May I begin the tutorial?
Can I begin the tutorial?
Could I please start the tutorial?
I expected each of these to be simplified to "[querySelf] [verb] [noun]." I was searching for which synonyms it would have stored. I was also checking whether it really did require a "please" in a specific place.
However, as I went on, I really did start to just mess with it for my own entertainment. I was hoping they were programmed to respond to my insults.
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nivm can i ask a rather silly question.. what did the npc say to you prior to you trying to talk to it?
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(Not silly, but) I answer your question with a question; how do I access the logs when they aren't in the folder spoken of in the in-game help? I assume it's the same thing everyone has to listen to in the tutorial, all in order of the conversations I had.
Anyway, I lost the document when my computer crashed (it's that computer, not the game, always has been) but I recorded a few more oddities:
When you return Neave's book, it start a conversation during which she asks a question, then another. I answer both, and discovered that she was speaking two different dialogs at the same time, repeating points and asking more questions. It was very confusing.
The pick Neave gives you appears in your inventory far before when the dialog actually says she gives it.
After accepting the fighting teacher's quest (I don't recall his name), he doesn't prompt you to say you're ready or anything. I waited about 7 seconds, then checked for lag or a disconnect.
Now to add them to the bugtracker.
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for windows it is %appdata%\planeshift\logs
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Well, it looks like it wasn't logging the messages until I opened the options screen, so I only have this. It doesn't seem to match up with what I recorded before.
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Sat 15-May-2010 14:45:09 Nivm Manerey
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(14:45:09) Lilonius says: hello
(14:45:18) Nivm says: Hello.
(14:45:41) Nivm says: Still figuring out camera movement; I had it right before, now I don;t.
(14:49:30) [NPC] Nivm says: Do you have a book for me?
(14:49:31) [NPC] Abelia Aruine says: I'm sorry, I don't quite understand you, or you may have mistyped something. Please don't get frustrated, and try asking your question in a more simple way, or check your spelling. Generally you can refer back to what an npc has said last to pick up from where you left off with them. Make sure you have targeted any npc you wish to speak to.
(14:51:05) [NPC] Nivm says: Neave wants her blacksmithing book.
(14:51:07) [NPC] Abelia Aruine says: I'm sorry, I don't quite understand you, or you may have mistyped something. Please don't get frustrated, and try asking your question in a more simple way, or check your spelling. Generally you can refer back to what an npc has said last to pick up from where you left off with them. Make sure you have targeted any npc you wish to speak to.
(14:52:26) [NPC] Nivm says: I am fetching Neave's blacksmithing book. (NPC wasn't selected.)
(14:52:42) [NPC] Nivm says: I am fetching Neave's blacksmithing book.
(14:52:44) [NPC] Abelia Aruine says: I'm sorry, I don't quite understand you, or you may have mistyped something. Please don't get frustrated, and try asking your question in a more simple way, or check your spelling. Generally you can refer back to what an npc has said last to pick up from where you left off with them. Make sure you have targeted any npc you wish to speak to.
(14:53:33) [NPC] Nivm says: Book?
(14:53:34) [NPC] Neave Besetun says: I'm sorry, I don't quite understand you, or you may have mistyped something. Please don't get frustrated, and try asking your question in a more simple way, or check your spelling. Generally you can refer back to what an npc has said last to pick up from where you left off with them. Make sure you have targeted any npc you wish to speak to.
(14:53:42) [NPC] Nivm says: Help.
(14:53:43) [NPC] Neave Besetun says: It sounds like you're asking for help. Is there anything specific you need help with?
(14:53:48) [NPC] Nivm says: Help book
(14:53:50) [NPC] Neave Besetun says: It sounds like you're asking for help. Is there anything specific you need help with?
(14:54:04) [NPC] Nivm says: Could you tell me about your book?
(14:54:05) [NPC] Neave Besetun says: I'm sorry, I don't quite understand you, or you may have mistyped something. Please don't get frustrated, and try asking your question in a more simple way, or check your spelling. Generally you can refer back to what an npc has said last to pick up from where you left off with them. Make sure you have targeted any npc you wish to speak to.
(14:54:14) [NPC] Nivm says: Miss Abelia sent me. (I returned to Neave so I might be able to read what she said.)
(14:54:15) [NPC] Neave Besetun says: I'm sorry, I don't quite understand you, or you may have mistyped something. Please don't get frustrated, and try asking your question in a more simple way, or check your spelling. Generally you can refer back to what an npc has said last to pick up from where you left off with them. Make sure you have targeted any npc you wish to speak to.
(14:55:21) Nivm says: "A women whose only mode of transportation is the MC Hammer shuffle." - xkcd
(14:55:30) Nivm says: It will be sad when I get into the game and can't do that.
(14:55:45) [NPC] Nivm says: Die.
(14:55:47) [NPC] Abelia Aruine says: I'm sorry, I don't quite understand you, or you may have mistyped something. Please don't get frustrated, and try asking your question in a more simple way, or check your spelling. Generally you can refer back to what an npc has said last to pick up from where you left off with them. Make sure you have targeted any npc you wish to speak to.
(14:56:17) [NPC] Nivm says: Do you have a blacksmithing book? (I didn't remember what I had done before.)
(14:56:18) [NPC] Abelia Aruine says: I'm sorry, I don't quite understand you, or you may have mistyped something. Please don't get frustrated, and try asking your question in a more simple way, or check your spelling. Generally you can refer back to what an npc has said last to pick up from where you left off with them. Make sure you have targeted any npc you wish to speak to.
(14:56:29) [NPC] Nivm says: Do you have Neave's blacksmithing book?
(14:56:31) [NPC] Abelia Aruine says: I'm sorry, I don't quite understand you, or you may have mistyped something. Please don't get frustrated, and try asking your question in a more simple way, or check your spelling. Generally you can refer back to what an npc has said last to pick up from where you left off with them. Make sure you have targeted any npc you wish to speak to.
(14:57:00) [NPC] Nivm says: You have a book I need, give it to me.
(14:57:02) [NPC] Abelia Aruine says: I'm sorry, I don't quite understand you, or you may have mistyped something. Please don't get frustrated, and try asking your question in a more simple way, or check your spelling. Generally you can refer back to what an npc has said last to pick up from where you left off with them. Make sure you have targeted any npc you wish to speak to.
(14:58:17) [NPC] Nivm says: May your mind experience a swift explosion followed by being built from the ground up.
(14:58:19) [NPC] Abelia Aruine says: I'm sorry, I don't quite understand you, or you may have mistyped something. Please don't get frustrated, and try asking your question in a more simple way, or check your spelling. Generally you can refer back to what an npc has said last to pick up from where you left off with them. Make sure you have targeted any npc you wish to speak to.
(14:59:02) [NPC] Nivm says: Give me Neave's book.
(14:59:03) [NPC] Abelia Aruine says: I'm sorry, I don't quite understand you, or you may have mistyped something. Please don't get frustrated, and try asking your question in a more simple way, or check your spelling. Generally you can refer back to what an npc has said last to pick up from where you left off with them. Make sure you have targeted any npc you wish to speak to.
(14:59:11) [NPC] Nivm says: Give me Neave's blacksmithing book.
(14:59:12) [NPC] Abelia Aruine says: I'm sorry, I don't quite understand you, or you may have mistyped something. Please don't get frustrated, and try asking your question in a more simple way, or check your spelling. Generally you can refer back to what an npc has said last to pick up from where you left off with them. Make sure you have targeted any npc you wish to speak to.
(15:02:09) [NPC] Nivm says: May I have Neave's blacksmithing book.
(15:02:11) [NPC] Abelia Aruine says: I'm sorry, I don't quite understand you, or you may have mistyped something. Please don't get frustrated, and try asking your question in a more simple way, or check your spelling. Generally you can refer back to what an npc has said last to pick up from where you left off with them. Make sure you have targeted any npc you wish to speak to.
(15:03:22) [NPC] Nivm says: Am I supposed to murder you?
(15:03:24) [NPC] Abelia Aruine says: I'm sorry, I don't quite understand you, or you may have mistyped something. Please don't get frustrated, and try asking your question in a more simple way, or check your spelling. Generally you can refer back to what an npc has said last to pick up from where you left off with them. Make sure you have targeted any npc you wish to speak to.
(15:03:29) [NPC] Nivm says: It seems plausible.
(15:03:30) [NPC] Abelia Aruine says: I'm sorry, I don't quite understand you, or you may have mistyped something. Please don't get frustrated, and try asking your question in a more simple way, or check your spelling. Generally you can refer back to what an npc has said last to pick up from where you left off with them. Make sure you have targeted any npc you wish to speak to.
(15:04:31) [NPC] Nivm says: Could you please give me Neave's blacksmithing book?
(15:04:32) [NPC] Abelia Aruine says: I'm sorry, I don't quite understand you, or you may have mistyped something. Please don't get frustrated, and try asking your question in a more simple way, or check your spelling. Generally you can refer back to what an npc has said last to pick up from where you left off with them. Make sure you have targeted any npc you wish to speak to.
(15:05:06) [NPC] Nivm says: Book of blacksmithing; I want it. Now.
(15:05:07) [NPC] Abelia Aruine says: I'm sorry, I don't quite understand you, or you may have mistyped something. Please don't get frustrated, and try asking your question in a more simple way, or check your spelling. Generally you can refer back to what an npc has said last to pick up from where you left off with them. Make sure you have targeted any npc you wish to speak to.
(15:06:03) [NPC] Nivm says: I just now discovered I can walk through you at will.
(15:06:04) [NPC] Abelia Aruine says: I'm sorry, I don't quite understand you, or you may have mistyped something. Please don't get frustrated, and try asking your question in a more simple way, or check your spelling. Generally you can refer back to what an npc has said last to pick up from where you left off with them. Make sure you have targeted any npc you wish to speak to.
(15:08:44) [NPC] Nivm says: Do you know, that you have Neave's blacksmithing book?
(15:08:46) [NPC] Abelia Aruine says: I'm sorry, I don't quite understand you, or you may have mistyped something. Please don't get frustrated, and try asking your question in a more simple way, or check your spelling. Generally you can refer back to what an npc has said last to pick up from where you left off with them. Make sure you have targeted any npc you wish to speak to.
(15:09:16) [NPC] Nivm says: Neave wants her blacksmithing book back.So do I.
(15:09:17) [NPC] Abelia Aruine says: I'm sorry, I don't quite understand you, or you may have mistyped something. Please don't get frustrated, and try asking your question in a more simple way, or check your spelling. Generally you can refer back to what an npc has said last to pick up from where you left off with them. Make sure you have targeted any npc you wish to speak to.
(15:11:23) [NPC] Nivm says: As a teacher; how do I kick you in the shins?
(15:11:24) [NPC] Abelia Aruine says: I'm sorry, I don't quite understand you, or you may have mistyped something. Please don't get frustrated, and try asking your question in a more simple way, or check your spelling. Generally you can refer back to what an npc has said last to pick up from where you left off with them. Make sure you have targeted any npc you wish to speak to.
(15:17:15) [NPC] Nivm says: I would like you to give me the blacksmithing book, please?
(15:17:26) [NPC] Nivm says: I would like you to give me the blacksmithing book, please?
(15:17:27) [NPC] Abelia Aruine says: I'm sorry, I don't quite understand you, or you may have mistyped something. Please don't get frustrated, and try asking your question in a more simple way, or check your spelling. Generally you can refer back to what an npc has said last to pick up from where you left off with them. Make sure you have targeted any npc you wish to speak to.
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Sun 16-May-2010 19:22:41 Nivm Manerey
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(19:22:41) [Channel] [1: gossip] Oralon: Wait...No one untied Oralon >_<
(19:23:05) [NPC] Nivm says: about book (I'm taking Roled's suggestion.)
(19:23:06) [NPC] Abelia Aruine says: I'm sorry, I don't quite understand you, or you may have mistyped something. Please don't get frustrated, and try asking your question in a more simple way, or check your spelling. Generally you can refer back to what an npc has said last to pick up from where you left off with them. Make sure you have targeted any npc you wish to speak to.
(19:23:10) [Channel] [1: gossip] Lilura: good
(19:23:11) [NPC] Nivm says: about blacksmithing book
(19:23:13) [NPC] Abelia Aruine says: I'm sorry, I don't quite understand you, or you may have mistyped something. Please don't get frustrated, and try asking your question in a more simple way, or check your spelling. Generally you can refer back to what an npc has said last to pick up from where you left off with them. Make sure you have targeted any npc you wish to speak to.
(19:23:17) [NPC] Nivm says: give me book
(19:23:18) [NPC] Abelia Aruine says: I'm sorry, I don't quite understand you, or you may have mistyped something. Please don't get frustrated, and try asking your question in a more simple way, or check your spelling. Generally you can refer back to what an npc has said last to pick up from where you left off with them. Make sure you have targeted any npc you wish to speak to.
(19:23:30) [NPC] Nivm says: Neave wants her blacksmithing book. (I used the option this time, although I recall typing this exact thing earlier. This is rage inducing.)
(19:23:31) [NPC] Abelia Aruine says: Oh!
(19:23:33) [NPC] Abelia Aruine says: I should have given that back to her days ago.
(19:23:34) [Channel] [1: gossip] Esorono laughs at Oralon.
(19:23:37) [NPC] Abelia Aruine smiles and gives you a small book smudged with sooty marks.
(19:23:40) [NPC] Abelia Aruine says: In order to give it to her right-click on her, or control click if you're a mac user.
(19:23:45) [Channel] [1: gossip] Oralon: I'll kill you both >:[
(19:23:46) [NPC] Abelia Aruine says: Then choose the 'Give' icon.
(19:23:50) [NPC] Abelia Aruine says: It is the one with the hand.
(19:23:53) [NPC] Abelia Aruine says: You will see a panel on the left labelled 'Exchange' and one on the right labelled 'Inventory'.
(19:24:00) [NPC] Abelia Aruine says: Click on the book to pick it up from the right panel, and then click in the left panel to give it to her.
(19:24:04) [Channel] [1: gossip] Esorono pokes the kitty in the cell with a stick.
(19:24:07) [NPC] Abelia Aruine says: Push the 'Accept Trade' button in the lower left portion of the Exchange panel.
(19:24:13) [NPC] Abelia Aruine says: I am certain that she will be happy to get her book back!
(19:24:46) [NPC] Neave Besetun grins as she accepts the trade and gives you a few blue six-sided coins, and an iron ore.
(19:24:50) [NPC] Neave Besetun says: Thank you very much, my good Sir, and there are some hexa for you.
(19:24:55) [NPC] Neave Besetun says: You have completed your first quest!
(19:24:59) [NPC] Neave Besetun says: If you wish to learn more, just right click on me again to see what quests I have to offer.
(19:25:07) [NPC] Nivm says: Give me a quest
(19:25:09) [NPC] Neave Besetun says: I'm sorry, I don't quite understand you, or you may have mistyped something. Please don't get frustrated, and try asking your question in a more simple way, or check your spelling. Generally you can refer back to what an npc has said last to pick up from where you left off with them. Make sure you have targeted any npc you wish to speak to.
(19:25:15) [NPC] Nivm says: I would like a quest.
(19:25:16) [NPC] Neave Besetun says: I'm sorry, I don't quite understand you, or you may have mistyped something. Please don't get frustrated, and try asking your question in a more simple way, or check your spelling. Generally you can refer back to what an npc has said last to pick up from where you left off with them. Make sure you have targeted any npc you wish to speak to.
(19:25:34) [NPC] Nivm says: Tell me about blacksmithing
(19:25:35) [NPC] Neave Besetun says: I'm sorry, I don't quite understand you, or you may have mistyped something. Please don't get frustrated, and try asking your question in a more simple way, or check your spelling. Generally you can refer back to what an npc has said last to pick up from where you left off with them. Make sure you have targeted any npc you wish to speak to.
(19:25:41) [NPC] Nivm says: Do you have training for me?
(19:25:42) [NPC] Neave Besetun says: I'm sorry, I don't quite understand you, or you may have mistyped something. Please don't get frustrated, and try asking your question in a more simple way, or check your spelling. Generally you can refer back to what an npc has said last to pick up from where you left off with them. Make sure you have targeted any npc you wish to speak to.
(19:25:50) [NPC] Nivm says: Hello, I believe you have some training for me. (Used the option.)
(19:25:51) [NPC] Neave Besetun says: I may have.
(19:25:54) [NPC] Neave Besetun looks you up and down
(19:25:55) [NPC] Neave Besetun says: You're Nivm right?
(19:25:58) [NPC] Neave Besetun says: Yes, I remember you.
(19:25:59) [NPC] Nivm says: Yes. (I think I started a second conversation on top of the first one here.)
(19:26:01) [NPC] Neave Besetun says: Ah, I thought so.
(19:26:01) [NPC] Neave Besetun says: Aren't you the one who brought my book back?
(19:26:04) [NPC] Neave Besetun says: Good to see you again.
(19:26:07) [NPC] Neave Besetun says: I am Neave, but you knew that already, eh?
(19:26:11) [NPC] Neave Besetun chuckles.
(19:26:12) [NPC] Neave Besetun says: All right, Let's get this little quest going.
(19:26:14) [Channel] [1: gossip] Oralon rawrs at Esorono trying to move.
(19:26:15) [NPC] Nivm says: Yes, I did.
(19:26:16) [NPC] Neave Besetun says: Now, for any skill or craft in PlaneShift, you will need training to gain experience and skill points.
(19:26:16) [NPC] Neave Besetun says: Well lucky you!
(19:26:18) [Channel] [1: gossip] Oralon: T-T
(19:26:19) [NPC] Neave Besetun says: Either way, your character will be able to learn many skills in the game.
(19:26:23) [NPC] Neave Besetun says: This can be seen in your Skills and Stats window, the keyboard shortcut is the P key.
(19:26:25) [NPC] Neave Besetun says: Let's see if I can teach you something about blacksmithing and tools in general.
(19:26:30) [NPC] Neave Besetun says: Now me, I am a blacksmith.
(19:26:31) [NPC] Neave Besetun says: Now, behind me, is a furnace used for refining metals.
(19:26:33) [NPC] Neave Besetun says: You'll discover that there are many other kinds of craftspeople as well, all hard at work making various things that a civilization needs!
(19:26:36) [NPC] Neave Besetun says: Go ahead and right-click on it and choose the Examine icon.
(19:26:40) [NPC] Neave Besetun says: It looks like and eye, so it would be an eye-con.
(19:26:42) [NPC] Neave Besetun says: I wonder...do you have some skill in mining or blacksmithing under Jobs in your Skills panel?
(19:26:45) [NPC] Neave Besetun smiles.
(19:26:46) [NPC] Neave Besetun says: A panel will appear and show you what is in the furnace.
(19:26:51) [NPC] Neave Besetun says: Now you need to open your inventory with the icon found in the middle of the furnace window, or with the I key on your keyboard.
(19:26:59) [NPC] Neave Besetun says: Feel free to drag that panel around until you can see both your inventory and the furnace panel.
(19:27:06) [NPC] Neave Besetun says: Then please come back here and tell me when you are ready, my good Sir.
(19:29:28) [Channel] [1: gossip] Halbor puts a sign up next to the cell "don't feed the animals"
(19:30:04) [Channel] [1: gossip] Oralon wiggles toward Halbor and tries to bite him.
(19:30:46) [NPC] Nivm says: I am ready.
(19:30:47) [NPC] Neave Besetun says: Good work!
(19:30:50) [NPC] Neave Besetun says: Now I will explain how it all works.
(19:30:54) [NPC] Neave Besetun says: If you were going to actually use the furnace you would take the ore from your inventory and drop it in the open furnace window.
(19:31:02) [NPC] Neave Besetun says: Be careful not to miss or your item will end up on the ground!
(19:31:07) [NPC] Neave Besetun says: Now, you should always keep a close eye on your items when they are in the furnace.
(19:31:13) [NPC] Neave Besetun points to her eye and grins.
(19:31:15) [NPC] Neave Besetun says: Iron ore for instance, will turn into molten iron after a minute or two in the furnace, just watch and be patient.
(19:31:23) [NPC] Neave Besetun says: But don't wait too long or your items will eventually burn away to nothing.
(19:31:29) [NPC] Neave Besetun says: Now, feel free to have a play, but don't actually melt anything will you.
(19:31:34) [NPC] Neave Besetun says: In case you do want to play, here is an iron ore.
(19:31:39) [NPC] Neave Besetun says: Either way, just tell me when you are ready to move on.
(19:32:13) [NPC] Nivm says: Ready.
(19:32:14) [NPC] Neave Besetun says: Ah, great!
(19:32:17) [NPC] Neave Besetun says: Nice work, Nivm.
(19:32:20) [NPC] Neave Besetun says: Now, let's see, what else was I supposed to tell you about...
(19:32:25) [NPC] Neave Besetun rubs the side of her head gently with her hammer.
(19:32:27) [NPC] Neave Besetun says: ...oh yes, mining!
(19:32:30) [NPC] Neave Besetun says: That iron was dug from the ground by a hard-working miner.
(19:32:35) [NPC] Neave Besetun says: Miners take their rock pick out to places where they know they can find a certain ore or mineral.
(19:32:42) [NPC] Neave Besetun says: Miners can dig up all kinds of things - iron, coal, silver, crystals, and even gold.
(19:32:48) [NPC] Neave Besetun says: If your character has skill in mining and a rock pick, you can type things like /dig iron, or /dig ruby, and if you are in the right place, you may find some! (Mining is significantly more complicated than this. You people seem to be copying runescape with the evergrowing ore veins above ground.)
(19:32:58) [NPC] Neave Besetun chuckles.
(19:32:59) [NPC] Neave Besetun says: That can be kind of exciting.
(19:33:03) [NPC] Neave Besetun says: All right, now you know a lot more than when you first got here, eh?
(19:33:07) [NPC] Nivm says: Yes.
(19:33:08) [NPC] Neave Besetun says: Are you ready for more?
(19:33:09) [NPC] Neave Besetun says: Excellent, I like the attitude, but I think I have taught you all I can for now.
(19:33:15) [NPC] Neave Besetun says: May I suggest you pay a visit to Ibhaar for a bit of instruction in fighting.
(19:33:21) [NPC] Neave Besetun says: 'All citizens must be always prepared to protect themselves and defend their property.' That's what the law says, you know.
(19:33:29) [NPC] Neave Besetun nods with a serious expression.
(19:33:31) [NPC] Neave Besetun says: Yliakum has many dangers, Nivm.
(19:33:34) [NPC] Neave Besetun says: It will be good for you to be sure that you can protect yourself.
(19:33:40) [NPC] Neave Besetun says: Also, since you are so eager to learn I have a special gift for you as well, one rock pick.
(19:33:46) [NPC] Neave Besetun hands you a rock pick.
(19:33:48) [NPC] Neave Besetun says: Ibhaar is just down the way a little.
(19:33:52) [NPC] Neave Besetun says: Then again, if you have learnt all you wish to for today you may leave the tutorial, just head over to Xenak and he will show you the way out.
(19:34:01) [NPC] Neave Besetun says: Anyway, good luck with the crafting and don't forget to have fun!
================================================
Sun 16-May-2010 19:44:07 Nivm Manerey
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(19:44:07) [NPC] Nivm says: Are you the one who can teach me how to fight?
(19:44:08) [NPC] Ibhaar Senad says: Yes indeed, you have come to the right place.
(19:44:12) [NPC] Ibhaar Senad says: I am here to teach you how to fight.
(19:44:16) [NPC] Ibhaar Senad looks at you with a glazed expression.
(19:44:18) [NPC] Ibhaar Senad says: So shall we get started?
(19:44:22) Nivm says: Yes.
(19:47:53) [Channel] [1: gossip] Oralon: Anyone with a guard account want to help Oralon? He woke up and is now yelling inside the jail cell XD
(19:48:12) [Channel] [1: gossip] Lilura: no forget about oralon...
(19:48:19) [Channel] [1: gossip] Lilura: THE STONEHEAD IS OPEN
(19:48:23) [Channel] [1: gossip] Lilura: pie!!!!!!!
(19:48:26) [Channel] [1: gossip] Lilura: food!!!!
(19:48:32) [Channel] [1: gossip] Lilura: beer!!
(19:48:45) [Channel] [1: gossip] Oralon brakes through the bars and ropes, steal the pies, runs back and ties himself up again.
(19:48:58) [Channel] [1: gossip] Lilura: D:
(19:49:42) [Channel] [1: gossip] Esorono: Don't underestimate the power of pie :p
(19:51:09) [Channel] [1: gossip] Halbor puts a sandwich board over lilura so kra can be a walking advertisment for the stonehead
(19:51:24) [Channel] [1: gossip] Lilura puts it on lady P
(19:52:09) [Channel] [1: gossip] Halbor: lol
(19:52:40) [Channel] [1: gossip] Halbor: lady P never leaves the stonehead though, always busying guarding her egg
(19:52:55) [Channel] [1: gossip] Esorono steals it! >8D
(19:52:59) [Channel] [1: gossip] Lilura: =O
(19:53:10) [NPC] Nivm says: yes.
(19:53:11) [NPC] Ibhaar Senad says: Excellent!
(19:53:13) [Channel] [1: gossip] Lilura picks up eso and hands him to the guards
(19:53:14) [NPC] Ibhaar Senad says: Warriors fight with a variety of different weapons, but we are going to start you out simply, defeating your opponent with your bare hands.
(19:53:23) [NPC] Ibhaar Senad says: Now, when you have won a fight, you have the opportunity to take loot from the body.
(19:53:29) [NPC] Ibhaar Senad says: Right-click the corpse and choose the Loot icon.
(19:53:33) [NPC] Ibhaar Senad says: Anything they may have that's worth something will display in a panel, and you can choose to loot it or leave it.
(19:53:41) [NPC] Ibhaar Senad says: Any questions?
(19:53:44) [NPC] Ibhaar Senad chuckles and taps his weapons together.
(19:53:46) [NPC] Ibhaar Senad says: I didn't think so...now let's get you into a fight!
(19:53:50) [NPC] Ibhaar Senad says: Are you ready, my Lemur?
(19:53:53) [Channel] [1: gossip] Lilura: eso i killed the guy that kidnapped lady P...imagin what i'll do to the guy that steals her baby..
(19:54:06) [Channel] [1: gossip] Halbor: i think stealing lady P's egg is punishable by true death
(19:54:08) [NPC] Nivm says: Yes.
(19:54:10) [NPC] Ibhaar Senad grins.
(19:54:10) [NPC] Ibhaar Senad says: Ready or not, it's your time to prove your mettle.
(19:54:15) [NPC] Ibhaar Senad says: There are some large rats over there.
(19:54:19) [NPC] Ibhaar Senad points to his right at a brownish one-eyed rat with his hammer.
(19:54:22) [NPC] Ibhaar Senad says: I want you to go over to it, right-click on it, then choose the Attack icon.
(19:54:27) [NPC] Ibhaar Senad says: Don't give me any guff about loving all animals; this one will attack our children if we just let it remain here in the city.
(19:54:36) [NPC] Ibhaar Senad says: Kill one and bring me its hide afterwards as proof!
(19:54:40) [NPC] Ibhaar Senad says: If you don't find anything worth keeping on the first try, find another one to kill and loot it again.
(19:54:47) [NPC] Ibhaar Senad says: You won't pass this test until I get that rat hide.
(19:54:52) [NPC] Ibhaar Senad says: Go on, fight!
(19:54:55) [NPC] Ibhaar Senad stands and watches you depart.
(19:54:57) [NPC] Ibhaar Senad says: If it gets to hurting you too much, don't forget that you can run!
(19:55:02) [NPC] -If the rat isn't there or you find it's unkillable because of issues related to the game, tell Ibhaar of the situation to move on.-
By gods that's long.
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the menu options are not the same as the text that you would type in. so naturally the system didn't recognize it.
but regardless you were talking to the npc like a real person. you have to keep it simple. as a rule the system will ignore anymore than 5 words, after it trims out the extra stuff like please, and, a, it, etc.
but basically simpler is better, no contractions, no possessives, don't use npc names unless told to by the npc. don't expect the system to the work for you. and if all else fails. try the menu options that's why they are there.
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Weltall already told you, typing in the npc window is the wrong way.
Weltall is a dev, listen to him.
Trivializing about npc text communication is pointless, this old way of communicating with npcs has been replaced.
I don't know why its still possible.
What happens if you do it the right way and right click her ?
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...stuffs gonna haappen maaaan....
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Part of this log was from right after Roled's post, the other part was after this post (http://www.hydlaaplaza.com/smf/index.php?topic=37351.msg425119#msg425119). I did already start using the menu method at that point, but I was asked to post the log.
I expect that the parser would be re-enabled once it can understand english grammar. And although no one else might be, I am completely sure this is possible and manageable, simply because there are a limited number of rules defining said grammar.
I usually have trouble understanding the existence of attitude, but this communities attitude confuses me. Or I'm missing references.
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In order to parse natural language data, researchers must first agree on the grammar to be used.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Parsing#Human_languages
Do you honestly think that you are the first person to have that opinion about parsing raw user input?
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Yes.
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it probably will be restored with time but it won't allow that level approached above, it relies on the setting writer to think all possible combinations which isn't an easy thing. plus as said english isn't easy to parse at all, it's grammar isn't even entirely rigid, but this is just with any living language.
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Yes.
No, but I didn't think, that time.
I don't expect such a parser to interpret correctly until the user understands what it wants, but I do expect there to be enough valid sentences that the player doesn't have to spend five minutes on one tutorial response.
So, as the developers and the players would be our "researchers" we can expect to eventually find an agreement (cease your laughter, illusory or not). Once the basic system is back, the entire community can use the bug tracker list (or something more coherent) to build upon that system. Could you point me to which files in the trunk handle parsing?
Also, what is OSfP? Depending, why isn't it on the abbreviation list?
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because it's OSP not OSfP octarchal society for progress.
as for the parsing dictionary questmanager psnpcdialog and the work of people adding the possible variations to the quest scripts.
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Now I'm having trouble understanding your grammar, although I think I get the geist of it. What does KA stand for? Sounds obvious, but it doesn't come to mind.
What appears to be a sharp steel pickaxe does equal or less damage to a one eyed rat than my fists (1.5-3.5, 1.5-4.3). The rat is also capable of blocking something made to go through solid rock. I have 43 strength, but that should at least mean I get to use the weight of the pick in my favor.
I found that the NPCs in Gugrontid defaulted to directions that should only be given in Hydlaa. Since I couldn't find a player, I used the help channel to get past this bug, and they told me that said directions are a spoiler. This is of course after being told in the tutorial that's what the channel is for. It crashed again (~9 times that session), then someone else needed to use the computer more than me.
Are either of these bugs I should stick on the tracker?
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rockpick aren't an attack item, and please don't bring up the "i should be able to attack with books discussion" it increases rules burden. so if you use a rockpick on an hand you half your attack power.
crash update your video card drivers and if possible build your own client.
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Why cant I combine axe + torch and make a flaming axe ?
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"I should be able to attack with any object I can lift." That's disappointing. Shouldn't the system be design to allow all the thousands of items to each have appropriate data? (Metal type, stone type, wood type, weight, edge, elasticity, magic type, magic energy, magic effect, chemical type, product or raw material, dimensions, decay time, wearable, )
It's annoying, but I never found a way to keep it from happening. That computer, although the only one capable of playing Plane Shift, will crash shortly whenever it does anything strenuous or involving the graphics card. We've attempted to fix this for about a year now, and I went through particular pains to try back when I first got Oblivion. Updates, re-installs (software and hardware), cleaning, reformatting, and intelligent customer support haven't helped. We are fairly sure now that either the motherboard, the video card, or both are damaged. We do not have enough money for a new computer of that "high" quality.
The second glitch I spoke of was not the crashes, it was the fact that NPCs assume you are in Hydlaa when giving directions, and give you the same directions every time. It looks like this (http://www.hydlaaplaza.com/smf/index.php?topic=32419.0) thread was supposed to address it, but it is very old.
Do not remind me to ask a player for directions; that doesn't work. Even more so for me since the one time I did manage to find someone willing to help, he wasn't there after the next crash.
Apparently I wont be able to build since none of the three windows options work. In fact, very little that I've tried to do has worked.
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Not to contradict my betters
nor to contradict the developers
but...
even though clicking on the lips is the "right way" to answer quest questions, I have found that it is still possible to answer the questions by typing in responses...
so even when a certain quest dialogue is buggy, you can still move ahead in the quest sometimes by typing the answer in that the npc won't accept from the buggy text box
AND
for general knowledge questions like
/about windowless tower
/about Talad
/about diamond
you can still type in the {slash} /about something and get useful knowledge from many npcs...
Roled Rolak
old school guy getting around some of the glitches...
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the first i said myself it's still possible but not supported (you probably need the precise phrase as all the combinations were removed)
as for the second sorry to contradict you but with /about talad:
(http://img156.imageshack.us/img156/639/schermatafinestrasenzat.png)
:)
btw this is the entire list of commands:
(http://img685.imageshack.us/img685/639/schermatafinestrasenzat.png)
i made a video but mencoder refuses to process it (and mplayer to play it for unknown reasons so i can't upload it for now maybe i'll look at it later)
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but you are using 0.5.4
ow! I need to update!!!
Edit:
or not? :)
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Not to contradict my betters
Now what does this mean? Those types of people tend to make things messy, spoiled, or both.
Those posts make more sense now that I know what they're translated from. I have many more questions, but no reason to ask them.