PlaneShift
Fan Area => The Hydlaa Plaza => Topic started by: cmhitman on May 23, 2003, 05:16:13 pm
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I saw the matrix two and loved it. I thought it was cool how they incorporated so much depth into the movie discussing existence from a scientific viewpoint and all but I found alot of people didn\'t like the ending. I thought it was good adding some suspense with the machnine and man side by side. anyway, I was wondering what others thought about it.
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Originally posted by cmhitman
I found alot of people didn\'t like the ending.
Well, you can\'t say they didn\'t warn you. :) The fact that it was going to be a cliffhanger has been around since it was anounced they were making the sequels. Anyway, they only have to wait until November.
ATTENTION: ****THE FOLLOWING COMMENTS ARE A SPOILER! DO NOT READ UNLESS YOU HAVE ALREADY SEEN THE MOVIE!***********
Did anyone else get that the \"real world\" was really just a part of the Matrix? The Architect talked about the fact that Zion was a control mechanism and the whole thing with Neo\'s \"machine sense\" supports this. The only thing contrary points are that Neo doesn\'t catch this (doesn\'t mention it to anyone else) and that the machines don\'t just \"reboot\" the Zion area. Comments?
EDIT: BTW, besides the sometimes crappy CG and some over-the-top scenes (Trinity/Neo love scene and the whole \"orgasm in a pie\" scene), I though the movie was great.
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aarrgh dont talk about it
SPOILER ALERT
im going to see it right now tho so i dont mind i will tell you what i think
but i know allready im going to love it :D
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I saw the movie twice and didn\'t like it. In my opinion they subsituted too much graphics and fight scenes for plot line. The fight scenes were great but the whole plot of the movie was awful. There should have been like two big fight scenes and leave it at that. Hopefully the next movie will be better.
Ooo one thing I did like even though it really has nothing to do with the movie itself. I stayed after to see the next movie\'s preview and I noticed there was a song in the movie called Mona Lisa Overdrive. Also in the game Enter the Matrix there is mention of Wintermute. Just something I picked up on. for those of you who haven\'t read William Gibson\'s books you really should.
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I hate saying this (I\'m a big fan of The Matrix), but I?m kinda with Aendar on this. I did really enjoy the movie ? there are some truly astounding effects, fight scenes and chases which really blow you away. But he?s right, it?s almost as if these are compensating for a lack of story. The story does develop and get interesting, but only towards the end.
Maybe I?ve been spoilt with the first Matrix - still an absolute joy to watch, with a fantastic twisting plot. This sequel somehow didn?t sit right for me ? with some pretty awful moments (as kinshadow has rightly pointed out, the pie and the love scene with the bizzare tribal drum dance thing), and some inconsistencies that somewhat destroy some of the originals atmosphere.
I was left with the feeling that ?Reloaded? is just a bridge to the final chapter and doesn?t stand up as a great film in it?s own right as the original does ? I feel it could?ve been so much more. Perhaps I will see Reloaded in a different light when the third installment is released ? I really hope so.
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woaw
i thought it was fantastic
i loved the fight scenes wich were alot better than the first one, although i thought some of the graphics were well lets say \"dodgy\" and in a movie of this calibre i thought i shouldnt be able to spot stunt doubles wich i spotted alot,
but all round i really enjoyed the film i actually like the way it went and the twist was well done, although some of the people i was with didnt \"get it\" the twist that is , i liked the ending although leaving me realing for more :D
i thouroughly recomend it to everyone, although be prepare for a \"mind fuk\" toward the end.
EDIT
oh yeah my girlfriend REALLY loved the idea of orgasm pie :D
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I don\'t know why your complaining about the matrix 2 having to many fight scenes cause one of the main reasons the original was made was becasue of cool kun foo modern movies like Blade etc
That part in the temple was yuk worst part of the movie
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Well Partyboy, it must be that you are not providing the adequate amount time to your girlfriends cares.
Ok, sorry bad stab but it was way too much out there to ignore.
On my view of the Matrix reloaded?
Until the part with the Oracle I was almost bored?no that is the wrong term I was analyzing the CGI more then I was enjoying the movie?after the oracle I really liked it.
Is it better then the first??? Yes and no. it is not as good cause it explains the first and also ruins the first, because we now know that the matrix is not really the matrix but a layer of the matrix. Also we know that the ?machines? are much more in control then what it seemed in the first.
What I loved about this movie what the introduction of politics not only in Zion but among the programs.
The addition of the doorways was in my view excellent?my only question is why Neo just doesn?t teleport where ever he wants.
I loved the ?old agents? ghosts vampires and werewolves Oh, My!! What a wonderful world to role-play in. Would allow a GM to introduce whatever he wanted whenever he wanted and it would be in Genre. Also allows for a reason to make sword-fighting viable and not just cool.
As for the mind screw aspect?what is wrong with it? The first movie was one mind screw this one has 5 or 6.
What I feel many fans of the first dislike is simply that this one made it into less of a linear fight, you lost faith as does Morphious (who is looking a bit pudgy around the midsection by the way) and the ending is a bit too made for TV cliffhanger in my view?but since the next installment is in 6 months??? What is the big deal?
As for the CGI well it is good, though I feel cheated in that they put a ton of makeup on Keanu to make him mono-tone and thus easy to make into a CGI and Ms. Moss they gave no make-up look, making her look a lot more masculine then Keanu. Overall I liked the movie, will see it again in the theater and see it many many times on DVD.
The question really is what makes a good movie, or a good sequel. I feel this does both in that it extends the story and enriches it, and I felt that my 8 bucks was well spent. Do I like it more then the first??? Not really sure, as I feel they are very different. And like everyone I really did not like the ?love scene? nor the great huge party.
After the third installment we will all be able to sit back and say what was the best, usually the middle one is not great?and all too often the third is terrible, I feel the second was a good strong showing good writing and good plot.
But in the end, what do I know this is all opinion and mine may change in a couple of weeks.
Edit>
I should add, the comment to partyboy was made in fun I really don?t mean anything by it?and I understand the concept of going to the movies with people that don?t get it, that is why I try to go to these things with people who are like minded to me, or at least as intelligent (in my view) or more so. This movie provided at least 3 hours of after movie parking lot conversation so, I rate it as a good movie. The only movie that I think was great but did not have me talking at all about it was Seven. After seeing it in the theater me and my friend just drove home and we didn?t say a word other then to comment that they ended it in the right way.
Some many days later we really talked about it.
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Originally posted by paxx
Well Partyboy, it must be that you are not providing the adequate amount time to your girlfriends cares.
can you blame me when this game is taking over my life:)
Originally posted by paxx and I understand the concept of going to the movies with people that don?t get it, that is why I try to go to these things with people who are like minded to me, or at least as intelligent (in my view) or more so.
im probably going to get hurt badly for saying thid but i went with a group of couples and when the movie ended all the women had to say that it it was \"crap\" and the first was much better, an ALL the women completely lost the plot when the \"Architect\" was babling on and didnt get \"it\" at all
/me ducks the flying shoe :) j/k
im not sayng all women are thick just the ones i went to see it with
]Originally posted by paxx
The only movie that I think was great but did not have me talking at all about it was Seven. After seeing it in the theater me and my friend just drove home and we didn?t say a word other then to comment that they ended it in the right way.
Some many days later we really talked about it.
i still havent seen seven yet i heard it was good tho
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Seven is one of those movies you need to see without interruption or other things going on. If you get distracted or hit rewind (meaning you step out of the movie for a bit) you probably will not get the impact of it.
It is not a nice movie at all. But in my opinion it did a great job in telling a story and having an impact.
And do not watch it with someone who saw it already.
It is slow and sometimes pointless?but it is in my opinion one of the best suspense flicks in recent times.
It was also the movie that made me see Brad Pitt as a serious actor and not a pretty boy.
If you get on a Brad Pitt kick?things to see and in order.
Fight Club
12 Monkeys
Seven
You can move Fight club around but it puts some perspective to the others.
Kalifornia is bad, but has him in a different role then the rest.
12 monkeys must be seen after matrix, Brazil ( Robert DeNiro in it) is another movie that makes president into this mind screw new age concept and there are many movies that have followed in its footsteps. If you want to go down the trail of what came before the matrix?see Brazil, 12 monkeys?I assume you have seen Terminator and T2 and then there is Jonnie Neumonic (bad), and many more that I am forgetting?but to a large degree Brazil is the first good one, you should add in Blade Runner directors cut and you have?
So for you screw with your head bleak sci-fi genre novices, I suggest the following Blade Runner directors cut,
Brazil
12 monkeys
And in the matrix you get the wonderful blend of action and screw with your headedness I am sure there is more to add here?but this is off the top of my head.
As of right now, the matrix is the only one I know of that has more then one installment. But it is also a happier movie then the rest
Sorry for the rant.
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EDIT: BTW, besides the sometimes crappy CG and some over-the-top scenes (Trinity/Neo love scene and the whole \"orgasm in a pie\" scene), I though the movie was great.
haha i gotta agree with that.. the dance scene was crap and the GI JOE style neo was a joke as well.
fight scenes got kinda stupid like when neo was fighting a big crowd of heaps of the same person. lame jokes etc
the first matrix was SO much better
still its worth whatever u pay to go see the movie i geuss.
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I WONT EVEN BOTHER WITH A GOOD SPOILER WARNING... AS IT IS WELL PAST IT NOW!
Originally posted by kinshadow
Did anyone else get that the \"real world\" was really just a part of the Matrix? The Architect talked about the fact that Zion was a control mechanism and the whole thing with Neo\'s \"machine sense\" supports this. The only thing contrary points are that Neo doesn\'t catch this (doesn\'t mention it to anyone else) and that the machines don\'t just \"reboot\" the Zion area. Comments?
Zion does exist. The control they talk about is that because Zion is organized, all the people that reject the Matrix gather in one location. When it gets too big, just gotta bring in the insecticide and get them in one shot.
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Hmm....well I liked orignal Matrix more. First, it just had a general coolness to it all, like: red pill blue pill scene, computer talking to him, window wipers in the boss\' office, \"and you help your landlady take out her garbage\". And I liked the humor more, I mean, \"now it\'s just me, me, me, and me too.\" not really that humorous of a movie, except for Trinity getting p.issed off. The fight scene were awesome in M2, I loved the weapons. The CGI in the Agent Smith fight scene took 2 years to render. I really wouldn\'t complain if I were you.
And it\'s not really exaggerating. If anything it\'s under-rating Neo. He can control anything he wants. He is omnipotent in the Matrix. There should have been 10x that many agents in the fight scene.
And of course he\'s going to fly. That be the first thing I\'d start doing. Though the superman, pause scene was crappy CGI.
And why does every new character need a 5 minute boring speech. I mean listening to Agent Smith purr, was more than blah blah blah, it got your attention. Instead of going over the same points over and over, choices, reactions, choices, reactions, destiny, did we mention choices? Agent Smith\'s rant was great dialogue and acting. There was actually some sign of emotion in it. Other than some french pansy talking about a cake, that was so pointless. They should have just burned the entire cake scene and flush it down the toilet.
I thought I was watching a Britney Spear\'s music video once they started having an o.rgy in the rave cave. Who really needed to see Trinity have an o.rgasm?
Peace8)
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I was getting the feeling that either there inside a second matrix or that neo is realizing that he can use his powers in both worlds.
but really I think that man and machine are really one in the same and that sooner or later they\'ll join up together to rage against the machine, the machine being the powers that be and not freed robots.
edit: I liked the cake scene and the huge orgy...i mean party, it was cool to me. the party was kinda what I imagine woodstock year 3068 would look like and the cake...well who wouldn\'t want and orgasm cake; I mean come on...be real with yourself.
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I believe that Zion is just another Matrix. I base this on:
1.) How could they take the spoon out?
2.) How could Neo have powers in the \"real\" world. So what if He was overlapped with Smith, Smith is still just a program. And the Architect said that \"The One\" was just a flaw in the Matrix. This supports my idea.
The only thing I am doubting is this: What if it wasnt Neo who used the EMP, what if it was the rescue ship?
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thats true...they did get rescued just after neo feel out...
and it looked like the emp gave him a headache, maybe he\'s a machine, in the literal sense. Cause man and machine really are one in the same in the matrix, whos to say they don\'t have androids in the \"real world\" and wouldn\'t that be a plot twister:
the program that became biological(smith) and the machine who thinks he\'s a man(neo) . we already witnessed smith\'s \"rebirth\", maybe neo will find that he\'s unhuman.
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Originally posted by Caldazar
I believe that Zion is just another Matrix. I base this on:
1.) How could they take the spoon out?
2.) How could Neo have powers in the \"real\" world. So what if He was overlapped with Smith, Smith is still just a program. And the Architect said that \"The One\" was just a flaw in the Matrix. This supports my idea.
The only thing I am doubting is this: What if it wasnt Neo who used the EMP, what if it was the rescue ship?
AND, if Zion is real, then how could Smith control that clone?
gah... gettin\' paranoid.. gotta see it again.
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well, i saw it two weekends ago and it was just as disapointing as i thought it would be. my reasons are mostly the same as the ones stated above, so i wont reiterate.
by making a half-assed sequel, the makers of matrix: reloaded lost the $8.50 i was going to spend on the third movie. im sure im not the only one. dont get me wrong, i will see the third movie, but it will likely be a downloaded version.
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Well, just to pose a counter argument on the fuzziness of the situation:
Originally posted by Caldazar
I believe that Zion is just another Matrix. I base this on:
1.) How could they take the spoon out?
2.) How could Neo have powers in the \"real\" world. So what if He was overlapped with Smith, Smith is still just a program. And the Architect said that \"The One\" was just a flaw in the Matrix. This supports my idea.
The only thing I am doubting is this: What if it wasnt Neo who used the EMP, what if it was the rescue ship?
1) The spoon was made in Zion. They didn\'t \"take it out\" of anything. This was obvious from its crude manufacture and the giver meant it as a joke/inspirational tool.
2) See bellow to how they could \"overlap\". As for the Neo effecting things in the real world.... the former Matrix residents are all tweaked with mech goodies. Who is to say they aren\'t riddled with dormant nano-tech or the Matrix/the machines aren\'t contactable through extra-mental methods. This is, of course, stretching the point, but it shows anything can be rationalized until the 3rd movie comes out.
As for the EMP, the ship\'s EMP makes a shockwave (however unrealistic that is), yet you saw no shockwave. Of course, this could be a camera angle issue and not a plot hole. Then again, perhaps the extra-mental powers (via nano-tech or otherwise) simply overloaded Neo. Which comes to the fact that if Zion was another Matrix, why couldn\'t Neo take the pressure of stopping the machines? He stopped things all the time in the \"real\" Matrix.
Originally posted by Caldazar
AND, if Zion is real, then how could Smith control that clone?
In a realistic sense, the machine\'s AI is probably neural based. This is due the fact that it was originally designed by humans, it must continue to interact with humans, and it must (on some level) be able to \"understand\" humans. Agent Smith has shown emotions and human traits more than once. Thus, to \"overwrite\" a human mind, the AI would \"simply\" re-train the host?s neural network with the stimuli/behavior that defines itself. This has been shown every time an agent \"pops\" into a resident of the Matrix. Also, on a side note, the original Matrix story dealt with machines harnessing humans for processor power, not body heat. This was changed because it was too complicated for Joe Sixpack.
On the other hand... ;)
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BAH!
Shut up, you are destroying my paranioa. ;)
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ok what o got from the film was well think of it as \"layers\" a matrix within a matrix
the human race needs something some hope to latch on to to survive that is why the first 4 or 5 matrix\'s failed otherwise how is smith able to move into that \"real\" world and take over a humans brain.
and they are not all the ones that \"reject\" the matrix there is only 1 person who can ever \"reject\" the matrix at a time the achitect said that %99 percent dont reject it, and neo did something the other \"ones\" didnt do they choose to rebuild zion after its collapse wich forms a cycle but neo chose trinity over zion wich is why he figures out that he niver left the matrix,
neo is not a machie, nor is he a program
so thats just my 2 cents a matrix within a matrix
layers im sure that was mentioned in the film somewhere
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yeah, i got that too its just that its fun to hypothesize about other plot directions.
man
thats crazy how that plays into freedom being a matter of perception,
he\'s the only one...the only one.
I\'d choose trinity too, better that than everyone die and me be the only truely \"free\" human.
I wrote an essay about the american dream and found myself discussing existence in it. it was funny cause I\'ve always been figuring existence since i was like old enough to ask about god, but its always been a back burner issue; like i only dealt with it in dreams and when i was doing something boring or that didn\'t required much thought. but anyway, what was funny was that I came up with none existence being the ultimate freedom.
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Thirteenth Floor anyone? :D
I think THAT is waaaaay better, than Matrix.
Matrix 2 was f**ked up. The rave party in Zion was ridiculous, and Morpheus speaking.... :rolleyes: Like some fanatic sect-leader.
I\'m happy that I didn\'t go to a cinema to see it. Instead I saw it home. I\'ve saved the money for sure.
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Greetings,
E.
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now you dirty little boy Elminster.. you didnt download it ilegally did you? :rolleyes: :P 8o :D :tongue:
EDIT: Has anyone seen Animatrix? If you havent, then you should see matrix, animatrix and reloaded. In that order.
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I didn\'t download Matrix 2. I got it from a friend :D
And I have seen Animatrix before Matrix 2. It was good, I liked it. Though the second series of cartoon had a \"strange\" approach on the story... Humans hurting poor robot women, then they settle, and form a new country, etc. I felt pity for them though.
But there are many things why I think this matrix-stuff is bit irreal, and nearly impossible to happen: I think it would require more power to maintain, than what energy the robots get from the human body. Imagine, that the Matrix HAS to be modeled on atomic (or lower) level, so everything works (new inventions INSIDE the matrix, electricity, etc.). And modeling it in very low-level is not easy.
Of course, you can say, that time it will be possible, but still I think, that it would require more energy to maintain, than what they can get from the human body.
My thought.
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Greetings,
E.
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Orgasm-in-a-pie? Ah, I didn\'t got it until now, got it? :D
Yes, the spript wasn\'t anything to cheer for, but the fighting-scenes was extraordiary. It was definitly worth the money just to see that. :)
I loved the multiple Mr-Smith fighting scene. The best computer-created fight I\'ve seen in my life.
Nice popcorn-movie.
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I just noticed a thing, scramble the letters in Neo, and the become oNe, funny isnt it?
Oh, and that chinese guy who guards the Oracle, he is a firewall, right?
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yeah I saw them rearranging the letters in Neo in the music video for POD\'s newest single...
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funniest part:
Link yelling \'yes\' when Neo swoops in to catch morpheus and keymaker... you juz had to laugh...
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One thing that bothers me, shouldn\'t Neo be able to fly through buildings? After all, he can put his hand into Trinitys body.