PlaneShift
Support => Complaint Department => Topic started by: jowifi on August 07, 2013, 06:33:47 pm
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I've been trying to train up my blue way stat by using freeze on rats in Ojaveda. Usually, these spells were taking about 25 m.stamina points per cast. Yesterday, after 20-25 spells, they were taking 250 points. Today, it was over 400! I was casting at 0% power. Boosting to 100% used the same amount of m.stamina. Once this happens, any spell I cast uses the same energy. (I only have a few realm 1 spells). My stats: AGI-25, CHA-80, END-60, INT-110, STR-50, Will-85, Blue Way-16.
I tried with another character and was able to get from level 6 to level 9 in azure using defensive wind without a problem. I also did some rat hunting with freeze and cast about 25 spells with no problem.
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I heard that now wearing armor tires you out faster. Try taking the armor off and see if your mental stamina isn't used up as fast.
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I increased my CHA and Will to 90 each, and now the penalty is 450 out of 470 pts. I've only been wearing leather armor. Taking it off does seem to help. I could understand a 5-10% penalty, maybe more for the chain and plate armor, but 95% is ridiculous. It does seem to be tied to the character's level. I just came back from the Death Realm; my total m.stamina is 238 and the penalty without armor is about 70 pts. With leather armor, it is 220 for a 0% defensive wind spell.
So far, it only seems to happen with one of my characters. I'll try the others and see what happens.
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Do you hold any heavy items in your hands, such as a shield? I observed the weapon weight has a significant impact on physical stamina usage, which I find quite a reasonable addition, so maybe this plays a role here, too.
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/me puts 2 cent into the troll box:
How much realism is how much fun? :-\
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Actually, this isn't all that bad. Before I could just stand there and spam spells while casting an azure way spell every now and then to replenish mana. I could quaff gallons of potions too. Now, there's this tiring factor that didn't exist before so I'll cast maybe 10 spells, then need to run for a bit, rest, and cast again. While its a little less convenient, its more realistic than just standing there and spamming.
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Menille and I were talking last night, and she made a very good point as far as settings go, which is, if a character is a highly trained, strong fighter and spellcaster, wouldn't you expect that character to have GREATER stamina rather than lesser stamina? Isn't that what more 'realistic' training is for, to increase not only skill but stamina?
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Yeah really if you think about it, training skill in armor would really only have small benefits in terms of protection. Sure, you can move and absorb blows in ways to reduce taking damage up to a point, but after all leather can only stop so much, no matter how much you practice with it.
The real difference (at least in my mind) between someone skilled in using armor and someone who isn't is that the skilled user will be able to move and fight effectively in the armor without tiring out or being restricted. So it would make sense that high armor skills would reduce the stamina penalty a significant amount.
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The real difference (at least in my mind) between someone skilled in using armor and someone who isn't is that the skilled user will be able to move and fight effectively in the armor without tiring out or being restricted.
Yes, that has always been my opinion, but I think it would make balancing the rules much more difficult. Untrained characters with low physical stats and combat skills should still be able to do something, and for the advanced fighers the armor type should not be entirely irrelevant. It seems there is not much room for tuning this.
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The differences between armors could still be pretty big if heavier armor had a much higher base protection but also a base stamina penalty (no matter how much you train, it is still going to tire you out a certain amount).
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After a night of hunting, I have another observation. Riding my rivnak, my "strong" rivnak across the valley of the tefs one time chasing the prey, and I am too tired to move? Really? My rivnak is too tired to move? I keep very little in my inventory, and have lots of strength buffs, and have maxed endurance, strength, etc stats (all stats maxed actually). This doesn't seem right, either IC or via settings....
RR :(
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Just to show the other side. Pakerl, who is by design a rather weak person, almost never wearing armor, hunted and rode around quite unimpeded.
I think, this does the correct thing. I always was bothered by the power of armor, which was a bonus without any cost. I had to rp the bonus of traveling lightly. Now it is "real" :).
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After a night of hunting, I have another observation. Riding my rivnak, my "strong" rivnak across the valley of the tefs one time chasing the prey, and I am too tired to move? Really? My rivnak is too tired to move? I keep very little in my inventory, and have lots of strength buffs, and have maxed endurance, strength, etc stats (all stats maxed actually). This doesn't seem right, either IC or via settings....
RR :(
the stamina drain for walking/riding/working/running wasn't changed at all, I think it must be due to something else.
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I've noticed stamina drain on running as well that I don't think was there before. I didn't test walking or riding yet, but I really don't like it. Long travel (Hydlaa to BD and similar) was already annoying/tedious/boring enough. :( I really, really, really pity characters with low stats right now.
My thoughts on mental stamina on the other hand are quite mixed. I've never known a game to have/need two different consumable stats for spell casting before. Stamina as consumable stat for physical actions and mana/mp as consumable stat for spells was always the normal. The current assumption for PS though seems to be that hp for a fighter equates to mana for a mage, and therefore stamina equates to mental stamina, but this is false as hp is also a requirement for a mage as well, and generally stamina for a fighter should equate to mana/mp for a mage.
To make sense, mental stamina needs to do something different than mana/mp, and as far as I can see so far (limited testing so please tell me if I am wrong), it doesn't really achieve this. So it feels like a bit of a pointless over-complication f the system to me that will be more likely to annoy people than add anything to gameplay. With that said, if it can be given value of it's own, it can have a lot of worrth (maybe mental stamina can instead be a requirement for casting spells higher than 0% power, but is not required for lower power spells that take less concentration? Just a quick idea as a way to differentiate them and give both things value, so there are probably better ideas than this around as well...)
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Good thought Tava, perhaps then, the mana pool should be where magic damage is assessed instead of hit points and spell casting be solely limited by mental stamina. This could be justified by saying the magic power comes from the glyph requiring mental effort to unleash. In this way death would come through either lost hit points or lost mana points. Sadly this would mean that fighters would have to chase down their prey to finish them off as as spell to do the coup de grace would be ineffective.
Probably not the way to go.
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Mental stamina is used for magical or tedious crafting, just as physical stamina is used in mining and smithing.
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To make sense, mental stamina needs to do something different than mana/mp, and as far as I can see so far (limited testing so please tell me if I am wrong), it doesn't really achieve this.
I had the impression that mental stamina is recovered and spent much more quickly than mana, so it may serve as a limiting factor for intense use of magic in a short time interval, while mana can be the bottle neck on a longer time scale.
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I have to agree with the depletion of either physical and mental stamina. It is going too fast. I have spoken with several people ingame and apparently it was less of a problem before, so it's also unfair to newer players that haven't leveled-up their skills yet. It is much harder to train your magic skills now that you need to sleep+sit after five or six casts of a higher level spell.
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It's easier to deal with now that the Rinse spell recovers five times what it used to, but that's not necessarily the easiest glyph to get. New players will have a really hard time until they can get one.