PlaneShift
Gameplay => General Discussion => Topic started by: kdblackbass on August 19, 2003, 08:26:47 pm
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Hi! Beautiful game - can\'t wait for the Mac version; I\'ve checked the news but nothing since July. Can you give us an idea? Weeks? Months? Years (hope not!)? Thanks!!!
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From what I\'ve heard, the Mac release is virtually complete, but there\'s some issues with the performance/lag that have yet to be resolved (yes, lag even worse than the normal version ;)).
I have no idea when it will be ready for public use though, sorry.
[Edit: Rephrased a bit.]
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Mogura is correct. There are serious performance problems with the Mac version due to the way Apple has implemented certain OpenGL features. A beta version of Panther improves these issues significantly, but still doesn\'t solve them 100%. We are waiting to see what other drivers and improvements are made in panther.
That being said, the code base works on Mac, the client will connect to our servers, etc. It is really up to Apple at this point.
- Venge
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hmm... any thought s on if Apple will act any time soon - what if no improvements are found? will the team attempt to patch them?
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We, like any Mac developers, are at Apple\'s mercy.
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Originally posted by Vengeance
Mogura is correct. There are serious performance problems with the Mac version due to the way Apple has implemented certain OpenGL features. A beta version of Panther improves these issues significantly, but still doesn\'t solve them 100%. We are waiting to see what other drivers and improvements are made in panther.
That being said, the code base works on Mac, the client will connect to our servers, etc. It is really up to Apple at this point.
- Venge
Vengeance,
I fail to see how it can be totally Apple\'s problem. There are a number of other OpenGL games for the Mac that run with no performance issues.
Zanzan
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Alright I don\'t follow technical jargon very well.... is the Apple problem/incompatibility with Planeshift\'s Code or with the Crystal Space Engine?
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Those games have custom coded engines which code around Apple\'s implementation nightmares. Crystal Space is a cross-platform engine for OpenGL which is not going to ever have platform-specific hacks.
Obviously since Apple has improved these issues in Panther, they are aware of their problems and are working on them. So one of these days, maybe Apple will have a nice compliant OpenGL implementation like other platforms and it will work.
-Venge
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Originally posted by Vengeance
We, like any Mac developers, are at Apple\'s mercy.
Mac;
Crash different
Mac KILLS my inner child.
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Originally posted by Saphire
Originally posted by Vengeance
We, like any Mac developers, are at Apple\'s mercy.
Mac;
Crash different
Mac KILLS my inner child.
:D
\"Working on a MAC is a little different from working on a PC.\" :)
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Wow.
Simply wow.
I have to pay my highest compliments to the team of developers, artists, etc. who are responsible for bringing about PlaneShift. Right now, I am playing Neverwinter Nights and enjoying it quite a bit, but am very saddened by their lack of editing tools on the Mac platform. I sincerely hope that such tools are going to be available for the Macintosh, as well as the PlaneShift client. The fact that you are developing for MacOS X is so astonishingly heartwarming that I am a bit of a loss for words.
I am at work now on sending you my resume, having experience working for Iron Crown Enterprises (Rolemaster, Champions / Hero System, etc.) and Wizards of the Coast (no explanation required, I assume). My main job was as a graphic designer, but in my spare time was a contributing writer (uncredited) on several titles. I hope that I am somehow able to contribute to PlaneShift.
Hopefully Apple will be able to work with you on providing you the support you need to bring PlaneShift \"up to speed\" on the Mac platform. Wishing you the very best and hopefully we will be working together, or at least playing together, in the near future.
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Ananna, Im sure that you can contribute with much to the team, so make sure you can send a mail to the DEVs, also, check out the IRC-channel, where a few of the DEVs are.
(I\'ve been told that I should not post the DEV-channel everywhere, so ask someone else for it ;)
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Who told you not to post irc info so that new people who want to contribute have a hard time finding us? That doesn\'t sound right to me.
Ananna, you should email info@planeshift.it per the \"Help Us\" webpage on http://www.planeshift.it, but you are also welcome to come looking for us on irc.freenode.net #planeshift anytime. Someone is usually on, although timezones will affect your success rate. :-)
Thanks for the offer and cu soon. :)
- Venge
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Originally posted by Ananna
Iron Crown Enterprises (Rolemaster, Champions / Hero System, etc.) and Wizards of the Coast (no explanation required, I assume).
a bit off topic but... wow! Welcome to Planeshift :D
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Hi all
Now that mac OS 10.3 Panther is released, will there be a new test like a few months ago ? Or did nothing change with it ?
Thx for all your work !
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...anyone ??
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Originally posted by Sybelius
...anyone ??
The forum-members doesn\'t really know. You should ask one of the DEVs if you want a straight answer.
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Panther makes the CVS (current) version of Planeshift fairly tolerable--i.e. much faster. The MB version, however, is not compatible with our server no matter what version of Mac OS you are running. I think it is quite possible CB will have a Mac distro as well.
- Venge
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wow, great news!
Can\'t wait to see Planeshift running on OS X :)
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Originally posted by Vengeance
Mogura is correct. There are serious performance problems with the Mac version due to the way Apple has implemented certain OpenGL features. A beta version of Panther improves these issues significantly, but still doesn\'t solve them 100%. We are waiting to see what other drivers and improvements are made in panther.
That being said, the code base works on Mac, the client will connect to our servers, etc. It is really up to Apple at this point.
- Venge
Is there any reason why you [the Planeshift dev team] cannot put the so-called \'hacks\' in yourself. Honestly, i have heard of this \'crystal space/apple\'s openGL implementation\' problem for about 4 years. I doubt anything is going to happen on Apple or CS\'s end, so the best thing to do is just junk the idea of them ever working on a solution, and you guys just come up with your own.
From what I have read, it appears to just be a graphics problem. I doubt mac users (myself being one) wouldn\'t mind some graphics options not working, as long as the game generally runs and looks better than MacEverquest.
The worst thing you guys could do is pull a Valve. Tell mac users \'it\'s coming\', then change it to \'it\'s coming, but without mac/pc networking\' and then just say \'screw it, we won\'t release Half-life for Mac\'.
Is there any technical reason why your team cannot write your own ways around the CS/Apple problems?
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A) None of the devs have Macs.
B) Putting in platform-specific hacks into CS is contrary to the platform-independent design philosophy of the CS devs.
C) As I said, Panther is much better and Apple has helped us in the past as well as promised more help when CB is closer.
So just relax. :-)
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In addition to platform-specific hacks being contrary to the CS design philosophy, they\'d also probably be a nightmare to maintain.
As far as I know, the main problem is related to Apple\'s \"interesting\" approach to texture management. Because they\'ve done things ... \"differently\" (for good reason, mostly), the standard way to do lightmapping in CS comes out horribly slow. One hack has already been implemented, and that got the framerates up to something usable for most development purposes (although probably not for planeshift...)
If it is possible to abstract the way CS manages textures, making a \"platform-specific hack\" might be feasible (since upgrading to Panther costs $$, and I don\'t have $$, and I\'d like to be able to play Planeshift some day.)
That said, it\'s been a while since I took a look at why Crystalspace is a bit slow for me (on my Mac)- at one point, it seemed to speed up ridiculously, but then it quickly went back to normal (during a weird sequence of buggy system updates)
I\'m pretty sure the PlaneShift team wants a Mac version, more so than Valve. In addition, the Crystalspace team also wants good performance on all platforms. It might take a while, but it will happen.
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well, I guess I will just have to use my PC for Ps after I get it fixed, though my G4 mac should still be fully capiable of running a future release of Planeshift.
How do you think Planeshift would run on these specs for PC and Mac based on what you guys have experienced?
PowerMacintosh G4, 1.3GHz
GeForce 4 32MB AGP
1GB Ram
plenty of HD space
56K modem (only sucky part, plus no local high speed, so I am stuck)
Duron 600MHz
GeForce 2 32MB AGP
256MB ram
plenty of HD space
56K modem
I also took some time to look at the Crystal Space website and I saw this...
* A convertor to convert MAP files (from Quake/HalfLife) to CS is also included. You can use this to edit levels with QuarK/WorldCraft or other editors.
I am new here and a search of the forums yielded some posts on the subject of world editing, but when I have my PC up and running and start using Planeshift, I would like to add my skills if possible in the area of dungeon mapping, as long as you have access to the MAP converter (as described above and on the CS website). I know Quake/Half Life MAP files are outdated, but it would work well for a \"general design\" stage, then just convert it and hand that dungeon over to the detailer who finishes it off in Maya.
Besides, I can make some freakishly weird catacombs.
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Just wanted to let people know that both BusError (on IRC) and I have managed to compile and run the current version of Planeshift in CVS on the mac (without all the great CB artwork, of course!)
There are some basic bugs that have to be worked out, as well as a general lack of stability; when we get those worked out then maybe we can take another swing at doing platform-specific hacks on Crystalspace in a cross-platform-friendly way :)
Thanks,
Daniel