PlaneShift
Gameplay => Wish list => Topic started by: Kuiper7986 on January 23, 2004, 06:33:17 am
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I didn\'t want to post on the other card game because I wanted to start proposing the card game and eventually send a proposal to the devs.
Here\'s what I got so far:
(http://img15.photobucket.com/albums/v46/Kuiper/PScards2.jpg)
* The board: the board is a 5x5 grid containing spaces for that the card can move on.
A.) Name of the card.
B.) Elemetal Type (arcane way type).
C.) The allotted spaces it can move consecutively.
D.) Amount of Hit Points it has.
E.) The range of the attack in which the cards attack can do.
F.) The direction of the attack and the damage it can do.
G.) Elemental Weakness (arcane way type).
I some very basic rules typed out. I just don\'t have enough space to post it. But for now its the basics.
If anyone would like to help me out with rules, logos, back-side card picture, and someone who has really good essay writing, so like if we propose the idea to the Devs, it looks presentable.
-What you see now is:
Left Hand Side: The fireball card is in the center, the squares that are filled in Red represent how it can attack, range, and damage of attack.
Right Hand Side: That\'s what the card looks like without anything but the barebones.
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i like what you have going. it reminds me alot of the FF card games (which i invested too many hourse into).
i am in the process of trying to create a card game myself but it is more like a game of chance (poker like). hopefully the devs will consider our ideas.
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we have each have minds, wanna work together? I likr your chance idea a lot. If someone how we can integrate our ideas, I think it\'ll come out great.
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Pretty nice idea there.... a collectible dueling card game within the universe of Planeshift.
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Hmm.... I\'m interested to see where this goes. I, too, enjoyed the card mini-game in FF IX. Keep posting on this. :)
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Savion has an idea, instead of the board being a constant 5 X 5, players can buy their own boards, with different shapes... like one can be a triangle, another a rectangle, diamond, etc etc... Just kind of adding another dimention to the card game.
Another thing... what will determine what space your card starts out on? What card from your deck you will be using? How many rounds will be played? Here is another thing Savion has thought of:
A \'dice\' application is made... that rolls a number. Each square on the board is given a number. Your card\'s starting position is the square that corresponds to the number you rolled.
About the card that will be played and the rounds... there could be 15 rounds. The player chooses 15 cards (need at least that many to play... but players could buy a \'starter\' deck with 15 basic cards). Those cards are shuffled by the computer. The top card that is drawn is the creature you will use. Whoever wins the most out of 15 rounds, wins the game.
Savion would like to talk to you more about this game. If you could PM Savion....
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I\'m going to school like in 5 minutes because its 7:37AM here, I\"m in California, I\'ll get back to you as soon as I can, after I get back from school or tonight at 10:00PM United States Pacific time.
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Ah yes, here is a point where community can help a lot.
I like the basic idea.
Try to be original and also thinks about the story of PS when doing this.
Will the fact it\'s in a stalagtit will affects the game?
Will it be ruled by crystals?
Who invented this game in PS world (could be an ancient Diaboli, etc... his name could become the game name)?
In which side of Yliakum is the game played (some very hot place, some dark place, some place with bad guys, etc..)?
Also it\'s extremely important that the game is simple (and that\'s where I don\'t like your ideas Savion).
First because technically it will be easier.
Second because simpler concept are the best.
So, try to find a concept in your card game.
Is the goal to destroy all opponent card?
Prevent him from achieving an objective?
Well, good initiative.
Also remember it can also be something else than card.
In the universe of PS I don\'t know if thousand of cards can be printed.
What about stones as support, little piece of wood?
Anyway, it\'s fantasy, so if cards are more efficient, simply use cards :)
Edit: for the graphical side, we can take care of it ;)
Keep the good work.
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its not that complex... those would be the only rules... simple enough if you ask Savion...
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I would like to help in the creation of this card game in anyway that i can. Kuiper if you could PM me with the rules you have so far i would be very appreciative. It may take me a few days to respond because i am leaving town and will not be back home until Sunday.
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One really quick idea to make the cards more PS like would be to use the magical ways as elements - so instead of weak to water, make it weak to Blue Way.
And if printing technology isn\'t the greatest make having your own set of cards be like a status symbol. Cards existed in RL before printing technology became really good you know. ;) If you\'re just looking for a little fun borrow some cards from your local bar or pub or where ever you\'re playing.
I LOVE this thread - keep it up! :D
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My biggest concern with this idea is how do we get the cards?
I dont think that there should be a spell you cast to increase your chances of recieving a card because that takes away the chances of non-mages getting any cards. Buying cards is rather boring.
Determining how players get the cards is just as important as developing the card game in my opinion.
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I think the game should rely on a set of cards. there are no additions you can make to your deck. collecting cards is boring and unnoriginal. and it would have to somewhat resemble pokemon if you collected them. something like traditional card games where you play with a set of cards which cannot be modified.
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well I won\'t say a whole lot but i believe cards should be able to be acquired all sorts of ways. Get them by killing the monster, buy the cards from \"card stores,\" get them from quests, beating other people, etc...
That\'s just very general right, now.
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If it wasn\'t a collectable card game, I think there would be quite a bit less strategy. Although some system should be implemented to put players on even terms, possibly \"points\" that must be spent to use cards in a game. More powerful cards require more points, thusly this creates a form of balance. Games could then be restricted based on set point values, similar to tabletop war games such as Warhammer.
It sounds like you have the rules fairly fleshed out, and it sounds a bit like a mix between a card game and a strategy/RPG, which sounds very enjoyable.
I\'ve designed innumerous board and card games in the past, so this interests me greatly.
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Anyone know what kind of monsters the game should use? I mean I don\'t want to make up monsters or names that will interfere with the Planeshift storyline.
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Originally posted by Grakrim
If it wasn\'t a collectable card game, I think there would be quite a bit less strategy.
Non colectable card games need waaay more strategy. the only strategy most collectable card games use is buy more better cards to use. thats dumb. poker uses way more strategy than pokemon or magic.
Originally posted by Kuiper7986
Anyone know what kind of monsters the game should use? I mean I don\'t want to make up monsters or names that will interfere with the Planeshift storyline.
Well the trepor for one. I really dont know what else though...
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That\'s one problem. I can\'t make cards of monsters that don\'t exist because it\'ll seem though as I\'m forcing monster ideas to become in the game. Then I\'m reluctant to make cards after people on the forums because it isn\'t fair for someone to be like a PS celebrity even though the guy before might have been a commoner.
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Well, im against the whole card thing in general.... My bro watches Yogio and that show pisses me off... but if your gona put names on cards... you should put the names of guild leaders or something...
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Originally posted by RussianVodka
Well, im against the whole card thing in general.... My bro watches Yogio and that show pisses me off... but if your gona put names on cards... you should put the names of guild leaders or something...
The fact that it is a card game doesn\'t make it anything like Yu gi oh. As for guild leaders, these people change, monsters wont. Just my 2 cents anyway.
But anyways, I like the basic idea so far. Keep us posted :)
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Originally posted by Kuiper7986
That\'s one problem. I can\'t make cards of monsters that don\'t exist because it\'ll seem though as I\'m forcing monster ideas to become in the game. Then I\'m reluctant to make cards after people on the forums because it isn\'t fair for someone to be like a PS celebrity even though the guy before might have been a commoner.
This is a wonderfull point. Before a card game is produced we need more info on monstes. This means you devs. show us somemore monsters we wanna make material!!! Show us what youve got back there cus we really need to know.
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Originally posted by RussianVodka
Well, im against the whole card thing in general.... My bro watches Yogio and that show pisses me off... but if your gona put names on cards... you should put the names of guild leaders or something...
Well I can\'t change your opinion. I respect your opinion.
...BUT, (ahh the worst word in the english language) your saying it should be the names of the guild leaders? So if I had a guild called the Super guild, and the next day my guild is shutdown the next day, I should have a card named after me? (Sorry I use satire a lot because its my best method of a proving a point, not to be mean).
Lastly, Yugi-Oh? Dude I hate that show also, how can you compare this \"idea\" from Planeshift to that low-class non-sense show, I\'m deeply saddened by that remark. :)
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thats why we should make a game like traditional card games and not collectable card games. every collectable card game is like yugio or pokemon in some way. I hate the style.
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As I said before - what\'s to stop the DEVS from putting in more than one card game? PS is the best MMORPG out there so obviously we can get away with crazy ideas like that ;)
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need armor stat to reduce damage
like attacker\'s attack - target\'s armor = ?
? - target\'s health = target\'s current health
armor makes it a little harder to figure out the best course of action there by making the card game a little more fun for card game players anyhow
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Bah, dial-up ate my super-sized post! I\'ll try to redo it... Heregoes...
I\'m against the concept that collectible card games should have the randomness of buying boosters. I\'ve always thought that one should be able to buy cards they want via vending machines or online.
And as for Poker being strategic, I agree, but this is not because of the rules. Poker strategy comes from mastering human emotion, and is not at all suited (no pun intended) for online play.
I don\'t think we can actually design the cards yet, but if the ruleset is defined, the actual cards can be defined later. Or, a placeholder card set could be created until enough creatures are available to base cards on.
Just a few notes on the concept thus far: 5x5 seems to be quite a small play area, especially when you consider your Fireball example. Fireball\'s attack covers up to 9 of 25 squares, meaning a 36% hit with a blind shot. Of course, smartly you gave its attack a low damage. I believe a bigger grid, possibly 6x6 or 8x8 should work better, but it might draw the game out longer.
Also, as Djagg wisely pointed out, it needs to be decided where this game originated from in terms of the storyline. If the game originates from Yliakum itself, I suggest the board be made into the stalactite, similar to Star Trek Tri-D Chess. Maybe even making the crystal affect game play (certain elements become more powerful at certain times of the year perhaps, making for \"fad decks\" ) .
I think that covers everything I lost... Oh well.
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*pictures chars in a computer MMORPG crowed around a table at a pub using pencil and paper to figure out stats for a card game because it\'s so complicated*
That\'s SOOO cool :D
(seriously though, I like the idea to add more stats, it seems to add more depth to the rules... of course, that could just be an illusion)
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yay I\'m starting to realize also that 5 x 5 is too small. I\'m thinking of 7 x 7, because, but it has too be odd. Since its odd, it will always have one extra row and line and diagnol that makes one area \"neutral.\"
Here\'s what the 7 x 7 would look like.
(http://img15.photobucket.com/albums/v46/Kuiper/PScards3.jpg)
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I like the idea if collectable cards it would be good.
Would the more powerfull cards be rarer and more exspensive ?
One of my ideas would be a game of planeshift chess/checkers but the rules alot different.
It would be cool to bet money on these card or chess games and you could gamble with other players.
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7x7 looks much better, now Fireball no longer has a stranglehold on the board, but still has a very strategic posistion. I suppose odds are better.
Any idea as to how this is actually going to play out, though? Something like souped-up chess or Archon, perhaps?
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Hi
Hmm, not everyone have read my text...
Personnaly, I would prefer non collectable cards.
Strategy are surely more important in non c cards.
Not only coming from players but it\'s not hard, when you give more and more rules and objects to play with, you\'re guiding a lot the players.
PS itself is a good example, this is actually just an empty city to visit, and I\'m surprised to see how people have found way to have fun in it.
If you made rules too complex: first, people will don\'t want to learn it.
second, you will not make a cult game.
Personnally I don\'t think Magic cards are a legend (I\'ve played them a lot).
Chess are.
Try to find someone (above 10 year old ;)) who don\'t know chess.
What I feel by reading all that post is you\'re too influenced by others games.
Of course you must understand and know as much possible as others games but if you\'re not able to go further....
Is it interesting to fight with monsters btw??
You will not have infos on monsters, so it\'s a constraint you must find an alternative.
Also, in our world, we\'re inventing card games with monsters like it\'s possible to found in PS.
So in PS, do they need to use their own monster?
And if the monsters in this card game was animal of our world??
I do that with question because this is the kind of things you must think of to be creative.
And why it should be battle?
You must also thinks from what the game has been created. Take Rock, paper, scissor for example.
It\'s coming from martial arts.
It\'s also important to take your inspiration in the nature itself or some mystical elements.
Concerning this cards, it seems they could be magic, I mean only created by magic but staying in a material form.
BTW, the only cool things to have them collectable is to found them in monsters etc.
But has been so much seen and PS could be the little game around the big one finally.
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Going with the monster idea...
The cards can be introduced into the game by being placed only at certain spots on a table top playing board. (Or all arranged before the game starts) Once the card is placed a small 3D version of the monster appears (this will probably be possible since the devs have already modeled these monsters). The monster piece can then moved or commanded to take up strategic positions or to attack opposing monsters. Or more simply let run until only one monster stands similar to the game of life. I?m thinking of a game like those 3D monster chess games, but using this world?s monsters.
Maybe you would only be able to play a new monster card if your opponent already had played one or some other way limit the number of new cards that can be played. Another approach gives each card a strength point value and each player is limited to a total number of points. So you may choose a strategy of a small number of powerful monsters, a mixed set of complimentary monsters, or go with the small army style.
How about if the playing board becomes a miniature world where we would be able to essentially play the monster like how we now play our current characters. All the monsters on the currently playing cards would be able to be played. We would be able to move back and forth amongst the monsters playing whichever one we want. The monsters not controlled would behave NPC like and attack the opponent?s monsters at will. Other players would be able to switch ?think teleport? to this world to watch.
Different worlds can be available from hilly, to forest, to flat arena like playing worlds. Since the worlds would be very simple and non-complex it might not take long for the devs to design all sorts of interesting places.
Something like this would also server to teach the newbees about the various characteristics of the neighborhood MOBs.
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Poor Djagg, they just ignore him ;) .
I was thinkin that any game should be based off of the elemental crystals. Perhaps you have a board setup like the stalactite and you play crystals on it in an Othello fashion to try and fill the board with your crystal. That even invites the possibility of more than 1v1 play. Some sort of variant of Chinese Checkers would work really well too I think. Also been thinking some sort of \"stacking\" game where you build up crystals in a stalactite would be very cool, but I\'m no good at coming up with rulesets for that kinda stuff :( .
Anyway though, I think a CCG would be dumb, that\'s just for people that like to collect rare stuff so they can feel 1337. And mini-game with static pieces would still be worth playing if you just add an offical wagering system to it :D .
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Well, this thread is exclusively for Kuiper\'s CCG minigame, so that\'s why everyone is talking about cards so much. Although I do like some of the concepts you presented, Wedge; perhaps you should branch off into another thread for those?
As for the cards actually not being cards in-game, I agree with that, but its easier to just refer to them as cards until someone determines what they should be otherwise.
Since everyone dislikes CCGs so much, and rightfully so as they\'re just money making gimmicks (little known fact: Richard Garfield, creator of M:tG, created the game as a fundrasier to work on his real project, Robo Rally, the single greatest boardgame ever created). How about we give players the full set of cards (or stones, etc.); but not every card is at their disposal, they still must select which ones they will be using ahead of time. This would also be more realistic in terms of an ancient game.
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You know I\'m very reluctant to put this pic on here because I haven\'t even finalized all the rules and I don\'t want to lose that integrity. So anyways what happened if I did this. same rules and everything, but instead of cards, you got a game piece, and the board is a 3D terrain and its still 7x7.
(http://img15.photobucket.com/albums/v46/Kuiper/PS3D.jpg)
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I thought this was gonna be a card game....
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well I hope its a card game too, but there are some people who like a board game with pieces. I just want to have it balanced. But I personally absolutely want the card game.
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Just a question: What about using an hexagonal grid? No more problems with diagonals! Of course you do what you want with your game, I just thought it would be nice to have hexagons when playing strategy games.
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I don\'t know how many of you have played the Might & Magic series on PC, but in the later versions (I remember 7 & 8 ), there was a card game you played in the taverns called Arcomage. The cards were preset, not collectable. You didn\'t even have access to the cards outside the taverns. Basically, each player had a deck of the same cards, shuffled. Each player had a tower and a defense wall, and the goal was to add points to your tower to reach a certain height or to destroy your opponent\'s tower. Another way of winning, each player had a quarry, magic, and bestiary, and cards drawn could give or take points from them. If a preset level was reached, you won. It may sound complicated at first, but if you play it, it\'s fairly fun. I lost a few hours to that game... ;)
Anyway, just something else to maybe take inspiration from.
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here are some concepts that could help the game greatly (flame if you want):
-on the 7x7 board: the Upper-Left square is Player 1\'s base, and the Bottom-Right square is Player 2\'s base (I use base as a generic term)
-The purpose of the game is to use your cards to either defeat all your opponents monsters or capture his base
-we can give players access to all cards but aid a great deal of strategy to creating a deck by adding a cost to each card.
EX: Each card has a value 1-7, and the player\'s total value for every card he controls in play can not exceed 15.
-each space on the grid is randomly assigned an arcane way type. If a card of one arcane way type is on a space of that type it deals 2x damage and takes 1/2 damage. If a card is on an arcane waytype that it is weak to it deals 1/2 damage and takes 2x.
These ideas are just some concepts. I have some simple rules developed as well.
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I have a question regarding the attack direction. an you choose from the possible directions on the card, or goes a attack in every direction?
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hey Kuiper on the example card after the movement range you have free in parenthesis what does it mean?
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the elements refered to could be changed to crystal powers relatively.
so im assuming that particular cards will allow for tactics, eg one card may attack <---- for 7 for defence,
ones with higher movement will allow to run for opp base and ones with certain abilities can say \'jump\' to move over an opponents attack etc...
I think the board played on should be elongated more ^ so its more 7 x 10, this makes for tactics in movement like a wartop battle game.
how about the monsters spirits are held in small crystals that a player collects, instead of cards =) only 1 - 2 inches big.
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To Zinder:
No, the only way to attack is shown. The arrows pointing out are the directions it can attack in. So if you saw the arrows only pointing up and down, then the cards attack can only go up and down.
To Tybrus:
The free doesn\'t mean anything, I forgot to delete it when I saved it. It was something for me to differentiate something, so don\'t worry about the free, it don\'t mean jack.
To Kwartz:
Yes I have changed the elements to the \"ways\" of the different crystal in my rules that I\'m typing up. And yes I still find the board a bit small. But I don\'t want it so big that
To all:
I\'m trying to avoid that pokemon and yugioh stylistic card dueling or monster battling. But keeping some needed components to make the game interesting.
And the key to the game right now is to defeat your opponents cards or make it in such a way that he can\'t. win.
Lastly, I find nothing wrong with cards that are collectible. I mean, it gives you something to do and bragging rights.
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Seems i was not clear. What i mean:
Lets say the card can attack up and down. Now i have a board with my card on c3, other cards lay on c2 and c4. When my card attacks, which card(s) are hit? Both or have i to choose the card up or the card down. And if both, is friendly fire possible?
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I think that most cards so only be able to attack one space
however i think that this would be determined by the type of monster the card is based on
ex. if a monster has a meteor spell that can hit multiple tragets that directly next to each then the card should be able to strike more than one other card so long as the targeted cards are touching
this ability would be marked on the card of course
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Zinder:
oops, maybe I wasn\'t clear sorry. You can choose what direction you can attack, either up or down.
Tybrus:
Sorry I don\'t get your example. It seems worded very weirdly, so my apology. Oh and I\'ll PM you my game rules. Also, if my rules are too long for PM\'ing, then I\'ll email it to you.
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sorry kuiper
mainly all i was saying is that if a monster can attack multiple targets in PS it should be able to in the card game as well
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Here\'s an example of what the card could look like:
The backround of the card comes from one of the rendered pictures from the main website under the pictures area.
edit: I stripped the picture. I don\'t want to infrige on a copyright and get sued or something.
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Originally posted by Kuiper7986
The backround of the card comes from one of the rendered pictures from the main website under the pictures area.
*turns on sireN* WOOOOOT WOOOOT WOOOT!!!! Sound the alarms!!! Theres a copyright infringment on the loose!!!1 Get out the lawyers and the jury! Weve got a hard case in front of us!! MOVE MOVE MOVE!!!1 You ARE GUILTY MY FRIEND GUILTY!! haha you might just want to check with the devs before you just start using planeshift material with out consent.
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well, anything I post becomes Planeshift Property, so technically, it\'s already their property. So I can\'t really get into trouble for using something that\'s theirs and becomes theirs.
Just to be on the safe side, to any Dev that reads this or leader of the team that controls the rendered artwork, may I use the picture of the Kran and the Lady standing outside of Hydlaa Plaza? If not I\'ll strip the picture from the forum.
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Originally posted by Kuiper7986
well, anything I post becomes Planeshift Property, so technically, it\'s already their property. So I can\'t really get into trouble for using something that\'s theirs and becomes theirs.
you\'d be surprised but do you know what the terms are on fan art in the fan art forum? does that become thiers too? *thinks about all of the fan art that may be lost forever...*
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hmmm...i cant see the image for the card background
can anyone else see it or is it just me?
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i think he took it off in compliance to my flame :P well at least there was no law suit *notices headline in paper: \'Planeshift player sued in card background incident* welll never mind...
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oh...that will teach me to read the whole post from now on *smacks self for being stupid*
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Originally posted by tybrus
oh...that will teach me to read the whole post from now on *smacks self for being stupid*
Well dont smack your self, even the best like me *strikes legendary posE* dont read the whole post. posting without reading is a bit like freeballing I must say. You never know whats gonna happen!
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To Tybrus:
I\'ll send you the rules soon, I\'m almost \"getting there,\" done. I\"ll try to message you as soon as possible.
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Wizards of the coast is going to be plenty mad when they find out that PS is offering a better trading card game for free. :)
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kuiper:
that will be great...i dont know if you have previously thought of this but when we (i include myself because i want to help so i hope you take no offence) complete the rules maybe someone will be able to code the game so we will be able to play it outside of PS until the devs are able to include it in the game. i dont know how complicated this will be and also if anyone will be willing to do it. i have no knowledge of coding so i dont know if this is possible just a thought
to olig:
that would be awesome. if wizards of the coast somehow noticed our card game that would be the ultimate compliment
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Originally posted by Olig
Wizards of the coast is going to be plenty mad when they find out that PS is offering a better trading card game for free. :)
alot of people are going to be mad when they see what PS has for free
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kuiper: just wondering if you ahve anything new...i havent had much time to invest myself (calculus cutting into my PS time)
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I have seen this topic discussed before, the idea of a mini game, but it didn?t get that far. The basic problem was the people discussing it didn?t take it to the next level.
In order to make this game a reality we need a set of pieces that we can print so we can play this game with our friends. Since the concept is this is a card or board game, maybe a combination of the two, it would make sense that we could play it like one.
We don?t need fancy cards just ones with the data on it to play the game. The gameboard looks fairly straightforward to build.
So what we need is.
1: a list of cards for a simple hand. I?m thinking a list of 15 cards with different powers and attributes.
2: a set of simple rules. Figure out what the very simplest set of rules possible to make the game work.
Later on after we have played the game awhile the group developing the game can come up with suggestions to enhance play.
The developers are right, you really shouldn?t let this one die.
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loads of various card games (see if u can get any extra inspiration): http://www.twilightcards.com/
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The current idea of a card game is a bit unconventional, I like unconventional, and kind of requires its own rules set. The current rules that were developed as far as I can see are a bit like chess but not quite. It?s more like a game from SPI, (they is no longer in business). What they did was create games that were more like reality simulators.
In this case the reality is how plain shift will be played. So this makes it a game based on a fantasy role-playing game. Way cool! In fact it would probably be best to finish off this concept with the next revision of the actual game. However once you get the basic rules in place the work modifying them to implement the current game should be relatively straightforward.
The current concept I believe will work. It just needs to be developed more. Rather than implementing new rule concepts I believe it will work with what is already here.
Is anybody up to this challenge?
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to fish: the rules you see posted are but a small adn dluted sample of what kuiper has been developing...i have many many ideas but have had little time recently
to kwartz: i have played quite a bit of mage knight myself and have already been drawing some inspiration from that source thnx forthe link :)
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There has been MANY card games in many RPGs...
BUt PS should make a card game that is sorta like \"Magic the Gathering\". or \"yugioh\". but based on Crystalsor PS monsters
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I like CCGs like Yu-Gi-Oh and Magic so I think this would be a pretty good idea. However, I think that first there should be a non-collectible card game that would fit better with the world. You know how there\'s \"Three-Dragon Ante\" for D&D? There should be something like that in PS. It would add a lot of flavor to walk into the tavern and see people playing a game like that.