PlaneShift
Gameplay => Wish list => Topic started by: karakth on March 16, 2004, 03:41:48 pm
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Ok I did a search and I didn\'t find anything on this...
Not sure how healing is going to work in CB but most games I\'ve seen have instant healing (i.e. drink a magic potion, which is EXTREMELY cheap to buy and easy to find might I add, and you\'re instantly healed). Now...This system works, but how realistic is it? Why not have s-l-o-w healing. Like, for example, you\'ve escaped a close encounter with death and you\'ve been bandaged/sewn up/whatever. It should take you at least a day or two to get back on your feet.
Ok, now some of you might be thinking about magical healing. Well, what if magical healing demanded something out of the person getting healed? So like after you\'re healed you\'re not hurt, but extremely exhausted for a day or two?
Dunno, just a thought.
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well you are right about the not so realistic part. A heal should take longer, you dont get all better in a minut from breaking just about every bone in your body.
And healing with magic is offcource faster :)
But the question is, is it more fun for the game play, from a broken bone you have to wait about 2 months, and thats no fun!
And the exhausted part, yeah... but how you gonna do that? Say the dex will go down by half?
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I agree that a healing should take longer than a minute, but two days are much too long... if you are a warrior you can\'t do anything (well, not much) in this time.
What about that idea:
Potions could be (much) more expensiv, so you will think twice if you want to use it. A Potion will heal you instantly.
A Cheaper way would be to use bandages, they would be less expensiv than a potion but you need also 1 - 2 hours to recover.
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Aarg, I accidently deleted my two page post I was writing X( X( X( *sigh* now I gotta type it all again...
Good point, but I think we have to draw the line somewhere concerning realism. I think the most important thing to me is how fun it is. Waiting for yourself to heal when you\'r in the mood to bash some heads in wouldnt be fun, though it would be more realistic. I do agree that potions are overused in RPGs. I think that potions should be more expensive than in the average RPG, but they heal instantly. Then we also have food which should heal slowly. Say you eat a piece of bread, for example. We could have a little bar in the corner of our screen that slowly fills up. While filling up, you would gain HP, when the bar fills up completely, you would stop gaining HP. You should only be able to eat one piece of food at a time. This would be a more realistic way, but still maintaining a good level of fun :D
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Good point...Which leads me to another one: How about if we have a \"fatigue level\"? This would increase as you run about/fight/heal from wounds and can be lowered by resting and eating. If it gets too high you lose strength and agility, etc.
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or you lose HP... yes I think food should restore fatigue as well, add it to my earlier idea, it would slowly raise hp and fatigue. You could increase your fatigue tolerance (lack of words) by training in some body development skill.
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Hmm and casting magic would also increase your mental fatigue.
Although now we have to be careful. Like in all RPGs, there\'s a danger of adding too many stats and ending up with more numbers than gameplay.
P.S. I\'m using this whole fatigue idea from Healing in the Wheel of Time series. Healing heals people, but leaves their body exhausted.
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Ya I figured that, it sounded like WoT, and yes we shouldn\'t have too many stats. I don\'t think mental fatigue and physical fatigue should be seperate, but I dont think casting spells should then drain you fatigue, it should just use MP...
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How much fun you can have with a broken leg depends on how cool tradeskills and jobs are. I bet the devs could pull off extended healing times for really bad injuries if they put their minds to it.
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Yes maybe we should have separate uh, ways to be hurt, we could have regular HP with everything I described above, but also have \"wounds\", like a broken leg or a really big gash, which take time to heal and you could speed up the process by using herbs and stuff like that.
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I used to play in a MUD that was written that way Icefalcon. It was great.
?>/stats:
>You have 110 HP remaining of 200 HP
>/Look at me:
>You appear to have been in a recent battle with a small Cat or Rat. You have abrasions and scratches on your head, legs, arms and chest.
>You have a long scar on you left arm and a concussion.?
That?s what it looked like.
No I had not really been in a fight with a cat, it was a mongoose, and the scar was from a Maintain lion two months earlier!:))
It eventually went away though.:(
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I think it would probably be more practical just to have one dmg type, and maybe just display random wounds on your character until you get your health back up. Maybe if your down to 40% health you are bleeding moderatly from your leg or arm, and at 20% you have a broken nose with a twisted leg and wrist (just examples)
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that fatigue idea is great, maybe we could like have beds to sleep in and restore fatigue faster.
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XpYtZ - that would be cool that the player would have a description that would include what the player experienced. A history of the player would be neat that included such encounters. Not sure if this game is up to that now.
Otherwise it\'s all about stats. There are temporary increase/decrease in stats for a variety of reasons.
I propose that there should be a semi-permanent stat change, where serious injuries would play a part. A large MOB rolls over your leg and your dexterity is -2. It will last 6 months real time. But that fact that you survived the encounter is a badge of courage.
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Uh...History would need to be recorded in a seporate log file in which case you could edit your characters life into a story.
Yes. That is exactly what happened in that game if you looked at your actual...Uh...Attributes, yea, attributes. You would see a decrese for a time. They had a strange thing that allowed Internal (invisable) damage and Exteranl (visable) damage kinds as well. When healing you were only able to heal exteranl injuries naturaly and internal required potions or magical healing.
I am by no means saying that this should be an implemented damage system. Its only an example of another system. :)
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If every idea that was ever written in these forums (or at least the good ones) we would have the greatest mmorpg of all time but hey lets face it we have to keep it simple at first then the devs can add on too the game as we play :). These injury ideas are really cool and well if u read the ranged weapons forum boomerangs thats neat. but back to the injury idea. Having physical affects of injuries would top the scale but they would have to keep it simple at first. correct me if i\'m wrong i have never created or even looked into creating a game but would it be too hard to just at first say during your battle with the bear you suffered a savere gash to your right ankle this will decrease moblity (affecting evasion skills or wat not) and later they can get into all that cool healing crap.
-Dathias
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So, what kind of contact would be needed in order to heal? Physical contact, ranged, or healing by range only if bonded in a way? I personally think that some sort of physical contact would be needed in order to heal, if only for the sake of realism. Unless a mage is incredibly skilled in the art of healing, they might have to be touching the wound in order to heal it.
As for fatigue after healing... What about the victim being healed? We have the healer being fatigued, but what should happen to the victim? In the WoT series, they get hungry. Or starve. Or in Mat\'s case, emaciated. In PS, however, perhaps the victim could either suffer from fatigue as well, or their mana could go down if personal mana is needed for healing.
Now, what about healing not-so-physical ailments? Like disease, infection, and even curses (temporary blindless, slowness, etc.). Perhaps there could be some sort of spell that combines the skills of multiple Ways to heal, depending on the kind of infection. If it is heat-oriented, or cold, or death and rotting... Things like that. Herbs might be required to aid in such healings.
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Have any of you played Morrowind? They had implemented a fatigue system that was affected by running (as opposed to walking), fighting, jumping, etc.
However it wasn\'t that \'great\' it didn\'t add any feeling of depth to the RPG and just got annoying when you had to wait around for a couple of seconds every soo often because you were tired.
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I suppose it all depends on how much you want the game to resemble reality. All kinds of cool ideas come and go because the engine wont handle it or the programmers have a deadline to meet. That?s the great part about Planeshift.
The distance restrictions on healing kind of depend on what medium you are using since you have to drink a potion, apply bandages or (in the case of magic) you would be limited by the spell and the users ability with it.
Fatigue in Morro? was not as bad as that ?though I?ll be the first to admit it was annoying at times- and fatigue can be used properly if you define it correctly. In my mind there are different kinds of fatigue. The physical kind, which makes you week if not replenished and the mental/spiritual (I don?t know which magic will rely on.) fatigue that makes that area tired. In both of these cases the characters fatigue can be drained but they are very different kinds in that you are tired only in that area and you could, for instance, continue fighting physically though your mental/spiritual strength/stamina had been drained or vice versa. I do think that neither would replenish unless you rested or would replenish much slower.
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i think healing potions should just be like
cheap health potion: heals 30 hp over 30 seconds
expensive health potion: heals 50 hp over 10 seconds
and with healing magic the higher the level should make the spell quicker and heal more
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Right, thats simple enough, we don\'t want to make it too complicated.
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Healing potion could merely increase the healing rate.
Example...
Under normal condition, the player\'s HP regenerates by 1 HP per 5 seconds.
When drink, say, a 100HP potion. The HP regenerates by an additional 5HP per second for 20 seconds. All potions regens in 20 seconds. So a 500HP potion regens at 25HP per second.
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or... maybe a healing spell doesn\'t make the healed tired but the magic-user maybe like a transfer of clerics hp to target player hp to heal him and you choose how much you wish to heal them from your hp if you transfer to much you pass out or something and maybe cleric could heal faster if its like that so they could do more.. :]
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Healing just as an act of transfer HP seems un-reasonable. This just make the cleric a sort of HP pool to draw from. And no one will be willing to play that class. However, I do propose that HP could be used as a part of the cost to cast a spell. But the spell will have to be very powerful to warrant that.
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There are MANY realistic healing arts, from channeling energy, drawing amplifying, and aiming it at the sick (various styles from Reiki to Praunic to \"spiritual healing\" and laying on of hands), various herbs, minerals, stones (ground and ingested OR worn on the body using the \"vibration\" of the stone to adjust the injured or ill persons \"vibration\" to more healthy), pins and needles ALA acupunture, massage (from Rolfing to Swedish, to accupressure of the hands, feet, face and basically ANY accupuncture site can also be more mildly \"activated\" by pressure on the site.
The forms of NON medical healing are as VAST as the variety of people that use them. I have tried many of them for problems from Hyperactivity when I was a child (Acupressure, and accupuncture work WELL with ADHD kids), to insomnia as an adult (Valerian is an herb that is available over the counter and is gentle and effective, other herbs that work for this are Chamomile, cat nip, Kava Kava Etc). I have used and am atuned for Reiki (level one only) and have eased brused, slowed the flow from a bloody nose, calmed a paniced child and eased the suffering during colds and flu (person\'s spirit would NOT allow anything more, and had never been asked to try it before). I carry various gemstones (most semi precious or NOT jewelry quality precious) that affect my moods, help clear thinking, give encouragement, inhance joy and other emotions (Lapidalite is a purple/lavender...sometimes flaking gem that calms, gives peace and emotional stability...which is NOT surprising since it has a HIGH concentration of the element Lithium...CAUTION keep this gem OUT of your mouth and keep away from children. If you are allergic to lithium or taking meds for Biopolar it is best to carry it in a bag.)
In game, I think laying on of hands would be a more Earthy based healing, and accupuncture would be a more cerebral or \"thinking\" form.
Alchemy would be more of herbs and minerals and MIGHT relate differently for the Rock people race than the carbon based races. potions could be JUST herbs.
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Syzerians idea is good, healing should take time, but i wonder how many people would be online if you would have 2 weeks of recovering time, at least server wouldnt be crowded :P, but would it be too good game at all, this is eventually still a game.. how many of you have tried using a magic potion or magic to heal yourself in real life? Recovering should just the way it is now, maybe little slower healing from items but its good now..
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The reason why healing potions in RPGs are so cheap is that they have to compete with the regeneration abilities of the characters.
In most RPGs (including PS) you can see the hitpoint bar of your character raise. This is evil!
If you are healed in a few minutes naturally, the potions have to be cheap and instanteous to compete.
And it makes healers ridilculous. You buy a load of potions from an alchemist and go fighting until you run out.
Even if you are seriosly hurt, you would not go searching for a healer. What for - before you find one you would be already healthy !!
IMHO healing should be much slower. Since we got only a few animations so far characters probably would not be crawling when they are near-death.
But if healing took hours, it would be worthwile to seek healers. Or return to the town for treatment. And buy potions that are all but cheap and instanteous.
And in the meantime you can go to the tavern and tell everybody what a powerful moster you were fighting:)
Also longer healing will discourage powerlevelling of fighting skills. Fighting easy safe opponents would take too long, defeating a strong opponent would be a real challenge.
Not like \"I am the same level as the bear, and it has no armor or sword.
So I should beat it easily enough, and heal while skinning it and searching for the next one.\"
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I agree that healing should take some time, or the instant healing potions should cost thousands. Plus, there should be draw backs in taking potions during combat.
That\'s the part that confuses me the most, actually. How can a fighter drink a potion instantly while being hit? Probably he would get his head sliced off, or his arm injured and the content of the potion would spread in the ground.
I really think there should be a handicap for fighters who drink potions while being hit.
And I really like the idea about giving more importance to professional healers.