PlaneShift
Gameplay => Wish list => PvP,PK and Thieving => Topic started by: louscroo on May 29, 2009, 12:27:16 am
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This came into mind a while before the server crashed not too long ago.
The thing is to have a city, or multiple cities, that are completely Open PvP, where players can attack players without challenges. The point is to possibly add a more strategic element to fighting and to also allow combat-based guilds to apply their power.
To give incentive to attempt seizing control of a city, there can be valuable mines and monsters within city limits, special NPC merchants (that would provide rare goods, pay more for goods, etc.), special trainers, or any other valuable asset, allowing a group of players to have an economical growth advantage over those who cannot take the city. However the advantage shouldn't be too broken.
In addition to the above gameplay elements, the feature would recreate the sort of warring over cities that occurred in the Middle Ages, allowing a more immersive role-playing experience.
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Here's a little more elaboration.
These cities should be relatively out of the way of the normal paths, yet still accessible to informed newbs.
Also, the purpose of these cities shouldn't be completely for warring, but could possibly allow players to carry out government and enforcement of laws created by players within the city. Again, this allows a more immersive role-playing experience and provides more jobs and roles to be implemented.
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Open PvP as you describe is already implemented in at least two areas in game.
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Open PvP as you describe is already implemented in at least two areas in game.
In small areas where theres no incentive to try to fight there besides fighting. My proposition poses "meaningful" fighting.
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This isn't a new idea and not a bad one but I doubt it will happen. There isn't much use of the PvP areas already in game.
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There isnt much use of those areas cuz there is nothing important inside them (except for dlayos but not everyone can go and kill one), if something important is put inside that are would be great, everyone fighting to control/get there... Besides the idea of a whole city would be great!!! not just an isolated small area...
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As this is all in testing, the first step was to add the open-PvP areas. It appears to me that the long-term approach to open PvP areas is being evaluated. But its been a couple of years for the team to get those two areas in game and see how they worked, and how the players responded to them.
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Banishment camp does have a fully supplied blacksmith shop. If the other blacksmith areas get to crowded then the equipment at Banishment camp could become of some value.
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The other blacksmith areas are never crowded enough to get someone to go work there...
As for the testing part, would be worth to test this, in a whole city, besides is almost impossible (imho) to test how useful or useless are this areas if there is nothing else but to die in there, nothing of interest for everybody, not just for those who can kill dlayos or risk themselves to craft in the camp
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So move the platinum mine there and see if people bother to fight for it?
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I have seen people working at the smith equipment in the Banishment camp.
Yes if a mine was closer there would be more use to the furnace there,
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As it is the two PvP areas are rarely used for RP (though the Nexus is trying to encourage some at the Dlayo enclosure)...there simply isn`t time to type anything and engage in RP before someone smashes you with flying stones just for the hell of it and you find yourself in the Death Realm.
Put a mine in a PvP area and won`t everyone just stand next to each other mining away, the PvP nature of the location being ignored? If there was some limit to the number of players who could mine at the same time (only so much room at the platinum seam, etc) then I could see it sparking conflict as some mine whilst their guildmates keep others at bay.
Or, and I`m loath to open this can of worms, if there was a way to loot from killed players, that would make PvP more worthwhile. Those miners would need their guards even more so to prevent others from killing and robbing them as soon as they`ve filled their sacks with ore.
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Do you know what's the difference between the Ferrari and the maxed Brown Way?
the Ferry goes from 0-100 in 4 seconds and the brown goes 100 to 0 in the same lapse of time.
The game needs more PvP areas yes, in the lawless wilderness, where the bandits and cutts have their hideouts, but not the mine, because at this point one maxed BrW vile mage could kill a miner in seconds before the guard, also maxed in BrW could even be able to target him/her. To do the PvP free at the mine I think combat and specially brown magic should be rebalanced, if not, I see it very difficult to be able to protect the miners, the mage-guards would never stand one minimun chance against the attacking (offensive) battlemages.
summarizing, platmine PvP yes, but after a magic ways rebalancing. Wild areas and some roads, where some player could rplay highwayman, imho are more realistically suitable places.
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Here are some caveats - if a guild gains control of an area with UNIQUE resources (note the caps), then three things are likely to happen:
1) Some folk may, out of frustration and misdirected anger at being unable to get to a particular area, accuse the PS team of supporting a particular guild in their takeover. The result? Wholesale mistrust between players and team, not to mention grievous insults to those team members who work hard every single day to ensure that the game is fair and fun.
2) Some folk may, out of frustration and misdirected anger at being unable to get to a particular area, accuse a particular guild of cheating/glitching to achieve their takeover. The result? Wholesale mistrust between guilds, not to mention grievous insults to those guild members who work hard every single day to ensure that the game is fair and fun.
3) A player or a group of players will be able to directly restrict the character development of another player or group of players by blocking them from quests or resources. This could be a dangerous precedent. Admittedly factions (in the fullness of time) will also limit the quest paths a character can take. However, factions are a part of game mechanics. They will be evaluated for lore compliance, play balance, and common sense by multiple devs and faction points will apply equally to all players who chose the same paths in the same quests. Currently there is no way to ensure the same level of quality control and equality for guild controlled areas.
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Here are some caveats - if a guild gains control of an area with UNIQUE resources (note the caps), then three things are likely to happen:
1) Some folk may, out of frustration and misdirected anger at being unable to get to a particular area, accuse the PS team of supporting a particular guild in their takeover. The result? Wholesale mistrust between players and team, not to mention grievous insults to those team members who work hard every single day to ensure that the game is fair and fun.
2) Some folk may, out of frustration and misdirected anger at being unable to get to a particular area, accuse a particular guild of cheating/glitching to achieve their takeover. The result? Wholesale mistrust between guilds, not to mention grievous insults to those guild members who work hard every single day to ensure that the game is fair and fun.
3) A player or a group of players will be able to directly restrict the character development of another player or group of players by blocking them from quests or resources. This could be a dangerous precedent. Admittedly factions (in the fullness of time) will also limit the quest paths a character can take. However, factions are a part of game mechanics. They will be evaluated for lore compliance, play balance, and common sense by multiple devs and faction points will apply equally to all players who chose the same paths in the same quests. Currently there is no way to ensure the same level of quality control and equality for guild controlled areas.
The idea I proposed was not to make an area that was necessary to quests or other growth-vital things an Open PvP area, but areas that were out of the way and still somewhat valuable. Platinum mines would be an excellent testing ground for Open PvP, but I still think the creation of a new city that is Open PvP would be more appropriate. A city itself provides a more open area that allows some strategy to be employed in fighting, besides the dueling tactics that have been developed and employed by players, which is something that could allow roles as military commanders and the like.
I think that the areas between the main cities should be Open PvP as well, for the same reasons as mentioned above: it provides more roles (bandits, highway patrol and such) and recreates the lawlessness of the high roads.
Also I think that more Open PvP gives incentive to develop ones character stats. As of now, a player aspires to reach max stats for virtually nothing. Essentially, the most you can aspire to is becoming a better duelist. Besides that, all this game has is socialization through RP. Yes, that is a great aspect of the game, but you can have the same RP fun in a chat room :-\
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I don't know for sure how I would like open PvP in the outdoors. I don't want to play an action game but it's true that, in a way, real danger may add to PS immersion.
What I'm sure of is that it's way too early for that. With balance and more combat options, maybe, the combat option I am most interested in being to be able to flee or hide. Seems to me that, currently, once one is targeted by a spellcaster, he's toast.
Now an open PvP town, as long as we don't spawn in it, and are not forced to visit it in any way... I don't know. I guess Khoridor would never go, and it's ok to be persona non grata locally. It depends a lot on the results of the Camp Banished experiment (which rose a fair amount of players complains at times). There is also the fact that building a city is a lot of work, so it's even a bigger risk to take for the devs. And then there is the setting issue: why would a city be lawless ? Maybe because:
- A new city could be open PvP just for a while, before the octarchy regains control and order is restored. That could be explained by a recent plague killing most people, or a raid, or by an officer gone mad. The city would not have much NPCs at first, until proper guards are installed. The restoration of the town would be achieved through GM events.
- An existing city could be made lawless for a while, as an experimental event. One where not much happens, to see if that attracts players. Add a few barricades, hide some NPCs, and, most important, have someone warning people outside the gates, so that we can stay away. Not very fair for the people who spawn inside though, unless they want to fight, in which case they have an advantage.
My point of view comes from someone who doesn't concern himself much with PvP, obviously. That's one aspect of the game I personally keep for later. I do have an alto ready for experiments though.
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I don't know for sure how I would like open PvP in the outdoors. I don't want to play an action game but it's true that, in a way, real danger may add to PS immersion.
What I'm sure of is that it's way too early for that. With balance and more combat options, maybe, the combat option I am most interested in being to be able to flee or hide. Seems to me that, currently, once one is targeted by a spellcaster, he's toast.
It is true that is too early, magic makes impossible to do PvP fairly in game atm, and also trua that it add to PS inmersion
Now an open PvP town, as long as we don't spawn in it, and are not forced to visit it in any way... I don't know. I guess Khoridor would never go, and it's ok to be persona non grata locally. It depends a lot on the results of the Camp Banished experiment (which rose a fair amount of players complains at times). There is also the fact that building a city is a lot of work, so it's even a bigger risk to take for the devs. And then there is the setting issue: why would a city be lawless ? Maybe because:
- A new city could be open PvP just for a while, before the octarchy regains control and order is restored. That could be explained by a recent plague killing most people, or a raid, or by an officer gone mad. The city would not have much NPCs at first, until proper guards are installed. The restoration of the town would be achieved through GM events.
- An existing city could be made lawless for a while, as an experimental event. One where not much happens, to see if that attracts players. Add a few barricades, hide some NPCs, and, most important, have someone warning people outside the gates, so that we can stay away. Not very fair for the people who spawn inside though, unless they want to fight, in which case they have an advantage.
That sounds awesome but the problems is that only once that players can enjoy the fact of doing this event, maybe that the city keeps in control of the bandits and regular groups try to go and conquer, or go and find an NPc or certain item (of curse with GM making it hard and putting a great story behind it, witch Im sure thay and the settings team are very capable of doing greatly) that way anyone new or oldie can enjoy the fact of that area, and when is not in event, is a good place to have fun killing, been killed and roleplaying, althou is hard of curse