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Messages - phervers

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1
Wish list /
« on: January 27, 2005, 01:30:14 am »
Hi there, i wanted to add some of my thoughts. There is one game (hell i\'m talking about it again) where economy problem seems to be solved. Everything is based on some interesting rules, which fullfill most of the points you have stated.

1. It is very difficult to get rich, actually most of the players are very poor, and it\'s hard to afford proper equipment. And when leveling you continously need new equipment.

2. Mass production is non existent because of supply rarity, to craft uber items you need some very rare items. Crafting simple items is not very profittable and it gives you low xp.

3. Some uber items have prices which are unimaginable for a new player. Example, at lvl 50 you get about 20-30k credits for completing a mission. There are items that cost like 10-20 million credits. Most powerful items in game cost like 800 mil for an armor. So you\'re not likely to get best items in game, and if you want to try it will take you a long long time, like year of playing. Then you can start new character. :)

What i would like to see is player based economy, with large player base it should be possible to create such an economy. We need thousands of players to achieve that, but i think planeshift has a potential. :)

2
Wish list /
« on: January 26, 2005, 11:54:13 pm »
bleh, if i want to test my aiming skills i play fpp, if i want to test my dexterity i play winter olympics. When i play rpg i expect that skills of my character determines if i can hit, not my skills. Otherwise it\'s not rpg its arcade.

3
Wish list /
« on: January 26, 2005, 11:36:14 pm »
I\'m afraid that such a system is not a good idea. I\'d rather see 50 uniquely coded spells, rather than 5000 spells which difer only by some small details like type of damage. Besides that kind of system will create opportunity for abuses. When someone will find a combination to cast ultra armageddon soon every mage will start casting it. I really think that traditional spell book magic system, where mage has to learn new spells would work better in mmorpg. Other ideai would like to see is material spell components. So that some more powerful spells would not be overused.

4
Wish list /
« on: January 24, 2005, 09:51:08 pm »
Yesss clothes ! More clothes ! We need it done in a way it\'s in AO and other RPG\'s. I mean that every part of clothing should be visible. Shoes, helmet, sleeves, etc. That way we will have endless combinations and everyone will look different. What i hate most now is that everyone looks the same, except for weapons.

5
Wish list /
« on: January 24, 2005, 09:36:00 pm »
Hey i think that guild controlled cities are a great idea,  though we will need some kind of limitations. Firstly having a town will cost a great amount of money so that small guilds will not be able to afford it. Secondly devs should prepare some spots for building a city, so that it cant be built just anywhere. This will remove the problem of having cities 5 metres from each other. Last but not least, all the city buildings must have an impact on gameplay. Capturing towns should be possible, but it have to be very difficult to do it, defenders must know about upcoming attack before it happens, so that they can prepare themselves.

6
Wish list /
« on: January 21, 2005, 09:49:54 am »
Thats a good idea, it might be doable from a programmer point of view, and it might add a new dimension for spellcasters. It might not be very difficult to implement, if spells are programmed properly, so that you can alter their effect by %. Some spells might be completely useless in a bad environment (like lighting bolt in cave), and some would be less effective. About fire elementals : They are hot ! They like heat ! They should be weaker when it\'s cold, and they might die because of rain.

7
Wish list /
« on: January 21, 2005, 01:51:43 am »
Soo i read this thread and i think that you guys have some good ideas which are erm mostly useless. We dont need an in depth overall simulation of mining ! Why ?

1. It would be a full time job for the programmers, and it might finally turn out that after few years we have a wonderful mmoms (massive multiplayer online mining simulator). Trust me its not worth an effort.

2. It\'s not going to be fun to do. Now tell me how many people dream of beiing a miner ? Imagine working in a dark corridor all day it might be very hot in there and air is not fresh at all. It\'s not my definition of fun.  And it\'s just the first part of crafting process, i would rather make it as simple as it can be. Ofcourse it needs some improvements. But what you\'re aiming is getting a complete realism. And if we would like to follow that route we would get a crafting process that takes month to make a sword.

8
Wish list /
« on: January 21, 2005, 01:28:12 am »
Well what i dont like about the idea of public mines is that they are so unrealistic. First of all you do not mine pure metal, they need to be processed, you need some kind of furnace to do that, and tell me who places furnaces around so that anyone can use them ? I agree that it\'s possible to mine some resources by yourself (coal, some gems), and it should be possible to do so. However if mined ore needs some specialistic processing, or it\'s only accessible in deep mines you will probably need to buy it. Besides if you\'re a blacksmith, you\'re not going to waste your time on learning how to mine, but you will try to master your crafting skills. And if your ambition is to mine either to earn money or gaining mining skills, you wont need  the ore anyway. If you do and you\'re a miner you can get neccessary materials at a slight bargain.

However if you get in a possesion of some ore, it should be possible to use mine furnace for some amount of cash.  Another thing to do for mine administrator.

Besides that i had it on my mind, but it looks like i forgot to mention it. Administrator mining skill should affect mine efficiency.

Azuros: Surely everyone would want to have a mine, first of all there should be some reasonable limit of mines per guild, depending on guild significance, but i think that 3 mines should be max.  Well you know it\'s not going to be easy to take over a mine. Defenders will know about the attack before it occurs and they can prepare themselves, or at least be online when it happens. NPC defenders will add some more difficulty to that, so that attacking team will have to much stronger than original owners.

There is a similiar concept in one of other MMORPGS, and while the game is completely different (Sci-Fi setting) the system works perfectly, and there is no chaos. People are fighting but its not a frequent occasion when one guild takes over other guilds base.

9
Wish list /
« on: January 20, 2005, 08:28:34 pm »
Combat is what i perceive as a greatest weakness of all mmorpgs, whatever you do it will get repetitive. Maybe not at lower lvls, but if you want to get to higher lvl you will probably have to kill hundreds or even thousands of mobs. Even with this glyph super move idea you will finally find best combo and you will stick to it. Sure different monsters might take different combo to kill easiest, but how many different monsters can we have ? After some time you will memorize every mob and kill them with their own combo. Hmm sounds boring.  The real time fighting system like in LOTR is simply not an option for an mmorpg, also other ideas like tactical combat mini game doesnt appeal to me, how would that appear to other players ? Would the fighting players vanish ? Would they stand and do nothing? The best overall idea is that with queuing combat moves i like it and i think it might work, other thing is that we need more diversity among enemies, that could be solved by assigning them random powers. Maybe not to every single mob, but some may have auras, which would be graphically distinctive, so that you will know what power does that mob have. They should be varied in level too. And last but not least we will need a large variety of combat moves, preferably trainable, or attained by some other means (quests, divine blessing, etc.), also those must be tied to the weapon type or magic school player uses.

10
Wish list /
« on: January 20, 2005, 02:37:43 pm »
thats a nice idea, but it\'s too much exploitable, you say you would be limited to one char per account, but what stops you from making 10 accounts? Nothing since it\'s free. What i\'d rather see is a system, when you can select some unique traits describing your character, which would avtually affect gameplay.

11
Wish list /
« on: January 20, 2005, 02:31:06 pm »
the solution to mesh problem would be making some bag mesh and use this instead of dwarf, later on objects might get meshes and they will be used instead.

12
Wish list / My idea of mining and some more.
« on: January 20, 2005, 02:22:36 pm »
Ok so first i want to say that the way it works now is completely boring/unrealistic. Here\'s my idea on how to make it interesting addition to gameworld.
This is just a draft, i can work on more details, if the idea is liked and accepted.

I. how would a guild get a mine ?

There are 2 ways  of doing that:

1. Building new mine
a) Finding deposit
b) Building mine
 
2. Taking over control of mine from other guild (either by peaceful or war means)
a) Buying mine
b) Taking over mine
- Declare war , this will set the attack date for example +2 days from now. Notify defenders that there is going to be a war.
- Take over , attackers will have to take over mine in 2 hours.
- Keep control , for some amount of real time so that owners have chance to defend.

II. Administration

1. Mine Administrator
Person will be selected by guild leader, administrator will be responsible for mine. Might get a salary which can be either based on income or flat.

2. Administration aspects
- Setting sale prices
- Setting worker wages
- Hiring guards for mine defence (only when war is not declared, it will prevent hiring guards after someone declares war and firing them during peace)
- Expanding mine (*) will increase worker capacity
- Upgrading mine (*) will increase efficiency (amount of metal extracted from ore).

III Mine workers

1. Mine worker capacity
The mine will have limited capacity of workers depending on its size.

2. NPC workers
In general mine workers will be npc\'s, the higher the wages the more npc\'s will be attracted to work in mine.

3. Player workers
Any player having appropriate skill in mining can work and earn. If mine capacity is at full player workers will automatically replace npc\'s. During work player will get some experience. In game it will be something similiar to what is going on now: Player will have to mine ore, this wil be semi-automatic, but will require some attention. What i imagine is player will issue mine command, and he will mine until ore vein depletes, then player will have to find other ore vein to mine. Veins will respawn after some amount of time. This might be a bit boring and repetitive, but who said mining is fun ? Mining is hard work you do to earn some money.When player cannot carry any more ore he will have to go up to surface and unload ore, where he will get payment. Players should not be let out by guards when having ore in inventory (it\'s kinda hard to sneak carrying a heavy bag of ore isnt it ?). Also there might be a chance of random monsters appearing in mine (large spider, cave goblin, etc.).

IV Mine types

Ok who have seen a mine, where they mine coal, iron, gold, silver and all the other metals ?? That is simply not the case. Every mine will yeld one type of metal. Each ore type will have different difficulty to mine it. We should have all the popular earthly metals + some magical ones. There will be also gems. It might be sensible to have 2 or even 3 types of gems in one mine, but it would complicate things  a little bit.

V Deposits

1. Finding a deposit. Deposits might be found using magical means, or by som mining specialists.

2. Deposits may vary in size and quality. Size means how much of ore can be mined before mine depletes, quality means how much pure metal will ore contains.

3. New deposits must appear somehow around the gameworld, either by automaticall respawn, or set by administrators.

VI Building mine

Building a mine over existing deposit wil require a large sum of money, and some time. It should be automated process done entirely by npcs

VII Selling mine products

1. selling the metal and gems to npc\'s, some amount of products will have to be sold to npc\'s, i would prefer completely player driven economy, but it may be impossinble during early days, so it needs some npcs

2. Selling to players, player can come to mine selling depot and buy some metal for his tradeskilling needs.

VIII Tradeskills

Players buy metals, gems to make something of them. It can be simply dagger, or some enchanted heavy plate armor. All this should be included in tradeskilling. This might be the hardest part to code. What i would suggest is making a flexible system which allows to craft almost anything based on what modifier some modifications give (for example Iron sword of swift, sword made of iron and imbued with swift spell), but also add a decent amount of unique named items which can be crafted using special components (for example Dragon scale armor). One thing is that recipes should be somehow kept hidden from players, i know it\'s open source, but it might spoil the fun knowing all the recipes before. They might be released by some quests, or finding old notes.

IX Player driven economy

Thats the most interesting economy model one can think of, what would it require to have player driven shops. I would make this guild based again, these might be one of reasons to build castles. When a player is in a guild which has castle, he/she can buy a shop and sell items crafted/found by the player. Shops should be taxed and taxes will go to guild bank. When the economy will start to expand NPC driven shops should be slowly removed, leaving only those selling really basic supplies, though those can be removed either if those supplies can be crafted by players.

Thats my idea of mining and overall economy system. I tried to make it simple and interesting at the same time. It might take some simplifications, but it\'s more or less what i\'d like to see. Waiting on your comments :)

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