Idea from a new player - Basic Stats

[Soripe]

My name is Soripe Sorone, [I am a new player - I have only been playing a few days, but I had an idea and would like bounce it off of you guys. This is totally OOC on the thread. But after poking around the forums for the past few days I couldn't help but think about the PP and rank system for basic stats (Endurance, Strength, Agility, Intelligence, Willpower and Charisma). I notice that you must train in Endurance, Strength, Agility, Intelligence, Willpower and Charisma. I also notice you can train in all of the arts/crafts of swords, daggers, axes, and in different skills such as mining, lockpicking, backstabbing, blacksmithing etc. Now I can understand ranking these so called "arts/crafts" since in reality you start off in a trade as a journeyman take some sort of test, or practice and slowly become a master at said "art or craft" But training for say strength, endurance, intelligence this is not done by a trainer but by the individual. Now in some cases you may have a personal trainer or a teacher help build such stats, but you must still do something yourself to build it. Even if a teacher is teaching you, you must still study, if a personal traininer is making you run, you must still run. So in reality if you want to boost your endurance you would go running, to build strength you'd lift weigts or something, to boost intelligence read books, etc. And being PS tries to mimic some reality in game would there be some way that by "running or Jogging" you could boost your endurance, Find a class room setting, or read books in the library to boost Intelligence, carry alot of weight in your back for long periods of time to increase strength. I think this would be more realistic in building stats than having a trainer train just give you strength or endurance for a few PP, rather than running and building endurance, and carrying heavy loads to build strength. - This is just a thought.

Also, I was thinking would it be possible to have people who are say rank 10 in say blacksmithing, could they become traininers in blacksmithing for ranks 1-9 for free. If all else fails you could find an NPC trainer but it would save some new people some money - just a thought.

These are just two ideas I had coming into the game as a new player and reading some of the forums, please feel free to comment on thoughts. Thanks! ]

Soripe picks up his rock pick and stares blankly at it and wonders to himself "I spend days in this grubby mine, but where am I going? where did I come from? This is not the way to find out...."
He tosses his rockpick aside, it hits the ground with a loud thud... he stares at it for a moment... blinks a time or two... and picks it back up.
He thinks "well I won't get very far without some money, better get back to mining" as he swings at the loose dirt in search of gold.

[VMann]

yes, good ideas, but old and probably supposed hundreds of times.
better leveling systems are discussed again and again, and what you wrote is only the very basic idea. Everyone wants the system to be more like that, but that will rather come at a later state.
your post does not have anything new in it.

by the way, most parts of the forums are totally OOC anyway, so you only need to use [] in the forum if the thread shows it should be IC, and that makes no sense in the parts about discussing the game mechanics

[Soripe]

Ah, My sincere apologies, I was reading through the forums and I did not see anything related to this particular idea, however there are many pages that span several years so 2 weeks of reading isn't quite enough time to look over them all over. This was something that i just came up with over the past day or two. I am not suprised that is has been brought up before. Thanks for the input! i'll read more carefully next time.

[Idoru]

To me it sound a little like the method used in The Elder Scrolls games, but I worry that if a system like this would be implemented then you would end up with people stood around harnquists, or running from area to area jumping up and down constantly to train agility. (much like I used to in Morrowind) Or whatever tasks were chosen to promote a certain stat.

Hope I havent misunderstood your post.

[Soripe]

Nope, you haven't misunderstood, the shear fact that they have to do something to build up the stat is exactly what I am getting at. Unfortunately I have never played the elder scrolls games. Running from area to area (without the jumping) should build endurance, after all you are running. Though, I do see your point. Alot of people would stand in one spot to train agility, that could definitely be bad. Though a possible solution could be to create a medieval "gym" of some kind where you must be inside one of these areas to train say STR and AGI or something along those lines. Or maybe even a different method than jumping (since i do not believe you can jump in game anyway). That way people wouldn't be just standing near Harnquist jumping up and down. Though, I am unsure how well that would work, you'd end up with 45 people just jumping over and over in the so called "gym"...

[Idoru]

Hmm, I dont really see how you would explain only being able to train in a gym, after all people IRL can just jump up and down wherever they want to and it has the same effect (making them look stupid).

I can also imagine a whole new load of botters who just use a keyboard macro to make them run around or pick up and drop things or anything simple that would train their stats.

As for jumping, you can do it in game

[Soripe]

You CAN jump in game?!?! how do i do this!? - that excites me

You make good points, I am not sure how to solve this issue. I guess a gymnist that is extremely agile needs help being taught how to be (unless they are born with this ability). Endurance and Strength and possibly intelligence seem to be the only ones that just stand out that anyone can do on their own. And since agility is a specialized ability they should make it a little more complicated to increase it. Strength is simple, endurance is simple, intelligence is harder but still relatively easy, Charisma, Willpower and Agility could require some more sophisticated means of training, maybe even an NPC trainer/practice points like some of the other skills. It just seems that these should not be taught by the so called "book learning" as it is described when using progression points. Reading a book does not increase strength (unless it's a really heavy book that you pick up and put down alot) Nor does it increase endurance. It is so difficult because I think about these ideas and I realize that people are going to find a way to exploit it and do it over and over with some form of macro... so, sad.

[Idoru]

It is so difficult because I think about these ideas and I realize that people are going to find a way to exploit it and do it over and over with some form of macro... so, sad.

Yup, I know what you mean. I'm sure these players are a right pain for the Devs and GMs, but its an open game, they will always come and try to exploit things to get a leg up and bypass the systems that are put in place to help with realism. The good thing is that when they get where they want to be they will just get very bored and leave :oD

Hmmm, I would think that Intelligence (seeing as that word is used) should be fixed from birth anyway. I dont think you can learn to be more intelligent, you are or you arnt. But that is semantics I think, It should be 'knowledge' instead but that isnt really the point

I should point out to you that I seem to be the only one on these forums who actually likes the training system, IMO it is one of the most innovative systems ive seen. The only problem I can see is that some of the things, the stats as you point out, just shouldnt be trained in the same way as skills. I  think there should be a practice element involved in it somewhere, you got to your trainer, just like with skills, the trainer teaches you some 'new excercises' or something equal to the theory training of skills, then you must go practice it. Dont exactly know how you would practice, maybe doing the things you stated.

OH, and jumping; I have it as [ENTER] but it may be [SPACE] as standard, its been so long since ive had to change them

[Soripe]

I must say I love the training system as well, i've played a few other MMORPG's and the "level system" is just crappy. I loved the old version of star wars galaxies where you get practice experience for whatever you are doing (shooting a rifle = rifle experience, using your hands was unarmed experience) but they did a way with that and went to a level system. I love how PS you learn the theory and then apply it in practice. I agree with what your saying, the stats need to be trained differently, they simply have no theory to them, so why train them as such.
I love the ability is PS to mold your character to whatever you want. if you want to build things, be a mage and use a sword you can do so. I also love the fact that a casual player (such as myself) can pick this game up and do something in a short time, but i also can do something if i have several hours to kill. I like this "exercises" thing. "Go do 15 laps around Hydlaa plaza" and you get rank 1 of endurance. "run to the bronze doors and back" get rank 2, do it two times for rank 3 etc. That might work even better than a mundane repetative system. The only issue comes in there coming up with 200 ish of these to max out endurance. Strength might be something along the lines of carry 80+  pounds around the hydlaa  plaza for a while, something. Very interesting where that could go.

I agree with the intelligence vs knowledge thing that makes alot of sense