Need help please

[DaveG]

SpiritWarmer:  I really hate to be the dreams-crusher, but if you just learned c++ from a "for dummies" book you don't have anywhere close to the knowledge needed to make a game.  I'll start by answering some of your questions:
1) CGI is a web page thing; no.
2) OpenGL is a graphics library, which we do use here via Crystal Space.
3) Yes, you have a server running the show and a client to do the graphics stuff on the players' computers.
4) The 2 compilers used are GCC and MSVC.  GCC is the standard Linux compiler and is also available on Windows via MinGW.  MSVC is Microsoft's Windows compiler.  Either one is fine.  Some say MSVC is easier to start with, though frankly GCC requires less futzing.  (though, GCC links slowly on Windows, but you probably don't care)
5) For learning network programming, not sure where to point you exactly.  Try Googling it first of, and also just take a look at our code.  I will tell you, however, that if you're still at the "for dummies" level you'll be better suited to use a game SDK that can do that for you.  (there was one I remembered a few people used; the name escapes me at the moment)  Also, if you're at the "for dummies", chances are you probably need to learn quite a bit more to be able to do anything like this.  Your best bet is to work on an existing project, and not go off trying to make your own thing.

[SpiritWarmer]

No, you're not a dream crusher. I already knew it would take me some time before I'd be ready to make anything close to a mmorpg.
I'm just in the learning phase now and I am trying to learn this stuff so I'll eventually be good enough to make a nice game(course I'll probably need lots of help when i do). I'm currently enrolled in both high school(junior) and in college(freshman)~~its a unique course my school has where my school pays for all my college classes for two years and i get both high school and college credit(high school classes optional).

Question:
what classes should i take in college?

Thanks

[DaveG]

Ok, good.  We've gotten a few people here that think they can just grab CS and PS and slap a game together over the weekend...  I'm glad you're not one of them. 

Hmm... Classes to be a game programmer?  Well, I'd go with C++ for starters, followed by math.  Take at least up to multi-variable calculus, and differential equations or some other vector math class (maybe a simple mathematical physics class) might be good too.  Frankly, you should just dive in now and start playing around.  That's the best way to learn.  Fill out one of our apps and fix a few bugs or something.  Learn by doing. 

[neko kyouran]

No, you're not a dream crusher. I already knew it would take me some time before I'd be ready to make anything close to a mmorpg.
I'm just in the learning phase now and I am trying to learn this stuff so I'll eventually be good enough to make a nice game(course I'll probably need lots of help when i do). I'm currently enrolled in both high school(junior) and in college(freshman)~~its a unique course my school has where my school pays for all my college classes for two years and i get both high school and college credit(high school classes optional).

Question:
what classes should i take in college?

Thanks

Where I live, it was called PSEO, Post Secondary Enrolement Option.  Quite nice, I was able to get a couple associates degrees for next to nill cost wise.  (The way it works in my state, the taxpayers pay for it out of their taxes every year.)  Anyways, classes to take in college, well, it depends on the college for starters.  I'd look into a college more devoted to computer related sciences since those are the ones that would give you the greatest freedom when choosing classes.  I got a few pdf's of some of the computer science related degrees from where I went to college at.  As for Dave's suggestion about classes on C++, unfortunataly at least around where I live, the colleges have moved away from even offering any type of C language.  They have all moved toward MS .NET framework.  Last time I looked I only saw C Sharp being taught.   But perhaps its different for you. 

PDF 1
PDF 2

Hope this helps.

[SpiritWarmer]

when you said: "Fill out one of our apps and fix a few bugs or something,"
did you mean for me to fill out one of these Apps or something else?
The college in my area offers a C++ class...YAY!

I downloaded CS but i haven't a clue where to start compiling it.
could use some direction.

Thanks

[DaveG]

Most universities have a C class and/or Java class.  Many computer schools shy towards MS crap, yeah, but they should at least have a C-style class too.

Yes, I meant to take a crack at our code.  Might be a good idea to just play around at first.  If you can fix an  (unassigned) bug from BugTracker, feel free to give it to me and I'll review and commit.

[SpiritWarmer]

I'm trying to build crystal space but i dont think im doing it right and the instructions aren't all too clear; I downloaded this file from crystal space website: cs-pseudo-stable-2006-01-27
do you have a copy you could email me or maybe some better instructions?

Thanks

P.S. Post that you have a copy of crystal space to get email address.

[DaveG]

You don't want that if you want to build CS.  We use much more recent source.  Please read our build guide on CVS for more info.

[Zarj Prax]

ok the guide here is missing a few things.

make sure you have used the pull downs at top and picked windows/mscv.

then follow the instructions.

a few things when you get to the parts of:

CS Windows Libraries
http://crystalspace3d.org/support/win32/

just get this version cs-win32libs-0.99r0_021

to get the cvs i used TortoiseCVS works great

make sure you get TortoiseSVN. too

you have to install the WordNet dictionaries
[do it at this part, wait till that part when it says to copy the files, its in two diffrent places]
--------------------------------------------
Get the Server Running
Optional section
Copy Dictionary Files

Simply copy the dictionary files from your \WordNet\2.1\dict folder to the \PlaneShift\data\dict folder.
-------------------------------------------------

grab the code make sure you use SVN as yes the cvs of cs and cel do download, you need the SVN versions
make sure you use the revisons and dates (planeshift CVS download, only one that has cvs downlaod)

double check the Setup MSVC Environment paths as i made a typo here...so double check it

one thing to make sure of too
Under Tools->Options  make sure the show all settings is checked (mine was not by default)  its in the far left hand botom conner

when making the cs compile a line has to be added to cs for the CS SVN revison: 24890
-------------------------------------
in the solution exployer(right hand files box)
click on the plus sign to expand app3ds2lev
then expand source and there will be a file called 3ds2lev.cpp
open that file (double click it)
after all the #include's
and before enum
put this line
CS_IMPLEMENT_APPLICATION
so it looks like this

Code: [Select]

#include "csutil/scfstr.h"
#include "csutil/sysfunc.h"

#include "levelwriter.h"

CS_IMPLEMENT_APPLICATION

enum
{
  FLAG_VERBOSE = 0x0001,
  FLAG_LIST     = 0x0002,    /* List all objects in this 3ds     */
  FLAG_SPRITE = 0x0004
};
------------------------------------
im going to make another install docs for mscv myself with the direct download links and instructions... as well as make a server install package (as not all the files are needed to run the server(its very bulky with all the cvs and svn stuff)

please remeber this is for the current cvs as of Saturday, July 29, 2006 (they may fix or change it in the future, as the cvs is always changeing)
the current info was when i did all this:

Currently compatable with Laanx:
PS CVS date: "2006-07-12 00:00:00 UTC"
CS SVN revison: 24890
CEL SVN revison: 2046

so if you have the same on the compile page as that and cant find the missing code chances are you needed this post

hope you can get it going now & good luck.

[DaveG]

Under the "Get the Server Running", yes, it does tell you to copy the WordNet dictionary files, which is what you're quoting there.  What do you mean by "it does not say this in the docs"?  Were you using an old version for some reason, or something?

The reason it doesn't tell you which cswinlibs to get, is that v22 is new.  I should probably note in there that it needs newer CS, and v21 only works with older, until we bump the date to match v22.  (though, it does currently tell you to check the date)

With the typos, there's a little checkmark button you can click there to check them all for you.

The weird problems you were getting were because you were not building from the listed revision, and unless you actually needed that app you could've ignored.  What CS are you using there?

[Zarj Prax]

reread my post it tells you the page i used and the fixes to that page..what revision i was useing was the same one on the page if you read my post you would have known that....

those are what i did to get it to work..

hope it helps others so they dont pullmy hair out like i did.

[DaveG]

No one else had these issues, and the CS_IMPLEMENT_APPLICATION is in that exact spot in that and previous revisons.  I have no idea what you did to get these problems...

Again, please tell me what you meant by:

you have to install the WordNet dictionaries (it does not say this in the docs)
[do it after this part, wait till that part when it says to get the files, its in two diffrent places]

I don't understand what you're saying.  You're saying "it does not say this in the docs" but it is, and you quote it just after this.

If you think the guide is missing something, please explain what it needs better so it can be added.

[Zarj Prax]

this was problems i had when instlaling it...

hope it helps someone else...

have fun!

[AryHann]

Surely it does, thanks for your contribution and if you have any more suggestions don't hesitate to give them!

[Uyaem]

I'm not sure if this is correct but this has something to do with cgi, right?

CGI is short for Common Gateway Interface and a technology used with/on web servers
Unless you want to make a browser-based game, CGI has nothing to do with it

This book also doesn't tell me how to use any kind of graphics; researched it on the internet: something about OpenGL?
Again...know any good reading that could help me?

OpenGL is short for Open Graphics Library and probably the most promising approach if you don't want to rely on Microsoft (DirectX as "competitor" to OpenGL). OpenGL basically is a set of instructions that your GFX driver understands and executes either software-based or (preferrably) hardware-based. Through OpenGL, you can instruct your GFX card to do everything you want, but on a very basic level, you need quite a few lines of code to even draw a simple thing like a cube. That's why 3d-Engines like CrystalSpace are your friend. They take care of the basic stuff, at the same time providing your with a much more abstract and comfortable API.

when a game is a mmorpg like PS, it has two parts...right? one part being on the server sending data to players about where everything is and the other on our computers which generates visuals from the files on our computers?

Basically, that's true. You have to different applications, server and client. The client connects to the server using a TCP or UDP Socket, which basically is a "channel" between the server and a client that they can use to communicate.

what software(compilers and such) are you using to make planeshift or what would you reccomend I use?

That heavily depends on the operating system you are using. For Windows, I recommend MS Visual Studio (which is not free) or MinGW (which is free). For Linux, there's gcc which should be included in any distro worth its salt.