Author Topic: "Secret" Meetings.  (Read 4522 times)

Thoughtcrime

  • Hydlaa Resident
  • *
  • Posts: 153
    • View Profile
    • fakespace.
"Secret" Meetings.
« on: August 02, 2006, 05:35:27 am »
Almost every time I go on PS, I see groups of people standing somewhere out in the broad daylight of Hydlaa and talking. I, usually, have no problem with this. Sometimes, if I happen to be doing something near them, I'll stay and watch. I don't do it to eavesdrop or to be nosy, but just out of sheer curiosity.

Many times I'll see a newer player, or just another confused soul like myself, walk up to them and ask them what's going on. Said player is "chewed out" and asked to leave, sometimes not so nicely.

This is something I do not understand, and something I'd like to bring to everyone's attention. Why would people discussing such important, secretive topics hold their meetings on the street where eveyone is walking? First of all, it is very unrealistic. There are many private places (lakes, upstairs of taverns, tents, empty buildings, etc.) in which these meetings can be held, and many are actually implemented for such reasons.  Second, even if you're in heated discussion and don't want to be disturbed, there's no reason to kick a curious newbie in the rear like they had some major offense.

And finally, why do people feel the need to have such cladenstine events in the open air?  Is it to make them feel important, to gain attention to high-and-mighty?  I'm not sure, but from what I gather that sounds like a valid idea.

DaveG

  • Forum Addict
  • *
  • Posts: 2058
    • View Profile
Re: "Secret" Meetings.
« Reply #1 on: August 02, 2006, 07:21:55 am »
Or the more obvious point:  Just use group chat.

::  PlaneShift Team Programmer  ::

Ralas

  • Hydlaa Citizen
  • *
  • Posts: 255
  • Explorers Guild
    • View Profile
    • Reincrownation :D
Re: "Secret" Meetings.
« Reply #2 on: August 02, 2006, 08:25:08 am »
Group chat if it's OOC.  Otherwise that just looks silly.  Interactions should be IC, so if it's in your character's nature to not care what others think, an interuption should happen (with an OOC explanation to make sure no feelings are hurt).  Otherwise he should use his good judgement about when is interpution may be welcome, as in RL.  There is no set in stone rule.

Aside from that, it is important to do a fair amount of RP in public as to be a good influence.  Of course, anything very private should be and usually is done in public.  It is generally acceptable to hang out and watch RP, not being there IC, but it is a good idea to ask first.

But basically, IMO, introducing yourself to as many people as possible is the best way to get into RP.  My character is shy, so this is difficult to do IC, but I've found ways.

Anyway, if things are as you described, I haven't seen it.  But it should not be that way--IC privacy or aloofness should be footnoted OOCly.
Yliakum, a really big crystal. These are the voyages of the Explorers Guild.  Its ongoing mission: to explore strange new maps, to seek out new life and new NPCs.  To boldly glitch where no one has glitched before.

www.reincrownation.com :D

althos_tarante

  • Guest
Re: "Secret" Meetings.
« Reply #3 on: August 02, 2006, 04:24:49 pm »
I have no problems with the cliques, I want nothing from them. I have found that if you use the RP functions and speak well to people, they generally respond very well in game. And I do not sweat it if they do not, typing on a keyboard is not the most natural means of expression for a lot of people and some people don't want to talk or do not like the way they were approached. Pretty much the same as going about everyday life...

zorbels

  • Forum Addict
  • *
  • Posts: 2132
  • Screenshot Queen of PS - EX GM - Strawberries <3
    • View Profile
Re: "Secret" Meetings.
« Reply #4 on: August 02, 2006, 06:14:21 pm »
Quote from: Thoughtcrime
Many times I'll see a newer player, or just another confused soul like myself, walk up to them and ask them what's going on. Said player is "chewed out" and asked to leave, sometimes not so nicely.

I just want to point out .... you don't just walk up to strangers in RL and interupt their conversation and say "Hey! Whatca talking about?" If you did you would probably get some strange looks and the strangers might ask you to mind your own business and leave. That being said, the way people are reacting is very realistic. It is rude to barge in on a conversation, especailly if you don't know the group. 

I don't think people do that to be "high and mighty" so much as it is irritating to have people (not just newbies) stumble in on your conversations with the expectation that you'll stop everything your doing just to explain to them what is going on. I am not saying it is ok to get upset and flip out but being "chew out" might teach them some manners. I am sure if that same person entered the group politely asking if they could join, a better reaction would be had.

Also let us not forget everyone is not nice and polite in the RL, so expecting everyone to be that way is just ignoring a major fact of life. We all know bullies exsist. Venting about them isn't going to make them go away.Trouble shooting the problem will help the issue. If you see a newbie getting chewed out for not knowing better, don't just stand there and watch. Help the newbie understand why they got a bad reaction (if you can) and how they can prevent it further into the furture. Lead by example.

This has been discussed alot on the forums. I posted this awhile ago but I think this thread calls for it.   Newbies vs Oldbies

Anyway I have had the same experiences as althos_tarante. I rarely meet rude people, and I find if you are polite and unobtrusive then all is good.
« Last Edit: August 02, 2006, 06:16:42 pm by zorbels »
   I've been outside, it's overrated and the graphics suck!

Thoughtcrime

  • Hydlaa Resident
  • *
  • Posts: 153
    • View Profile
    • fakespace.
Re: "Secret" Meetings.
« Reply #5 on: August 02, 2006, 06:22:04 pm »
Aside from that, it is important to do a fair amount of RP in public as to be a good influence.  Of course, anything very private should be and usually is done in public.  It is generally acceptable to hang out and watch RP, not being there IC, but it is a good idea to ask first.

Oh yes, I completely agree. Public RPing is one of my favorite aspects of the game. But I think if a group of people, in character, do not want to be disturbed, they could go to a private place to hold their meeting.

Quote from: zorbels
I am sure if that same person entered the group politely asking if they could join, a better reaction would be had.

This is also true, but from the one or two experiences I've seen it was just a n00b asking what was going on. Obviously not the best RPing, but they were just curious, not exactly rude. I don't exactly agree with prodding into business that isn't your own, but of course new players are going to be naturally curious. It goes along with what the Purrty's said a while back about guilds belittling people and making them feel excluded, I s'pose.

*shrugs* Dunno, maybe it seems like I'm attacking people, but I just wanted to know if anyone experienced something like this. ;)
« Last Edit: August 02, 2006, 06:24:27 pm by Thoughtcrime »

Ambiguous-Existence

  • Traveller
  • *
  • Posts: 36
    • View Profile
Re: "Secret" Meetings.
« Reply #6 on: August 02, 2006, 08:29:18 pm »
hmmmm sounds like the same thing i would do in your position and i agree it does look silly. if i was them i woudl be a little more creative as in i would hold a secret meeting at teh places you mentioned, though if it was at a tavern i would either pay someone to stand gaurd or keep to of my men in teh group at the door to prevent people from coming in and easedropping.

To bad their are very few people in teh gaming world who are creative as that. :(

zorbels

  • Forum Addict
  • *
  • Posts: 2132
  • Screenshot Queen of PS - EX GM - Strawberries <3
    • View Profile
Re: "Secret" Meetings.
« Reply #7 on: August 02, 2006, 10:47:22 pm »
Quote from: Thoughtcrime
It goes along with what the Purrty's said a while back about guilds belittling people and making them feel excluded, I s'pose.

So it was a guild who did this? Or was it just one person who was in a guild?  :) (Far to many times I have seen people blame guilds for things they shouldn't be blamed for just because one person in that guild acted out ... this is why I am asking.)

By the way I never thought you were attacking people. I read your post as a frustrated player, who would rather see people being polite and not being jerks as the "newbie" might not understand why the people who are in the group might be upset to their intrusion. Just wanted to clear that up.
   I've been outside, it's overrated and the graphics suck!

Kiern

  • Forum Addict
  • *
  • Posts: 2680
    • View Profile
Re: "Secret" Meetings.
« Reply #8 on: August 03, 2006, 12:49:18 am »
So it was a guild who did this? Or was it just one person who was in a guild?  :) (Far to many times I have seen people blame guilds for things they shouldn't be blamed for just because one person in that guild acted out ... this is why I am asking.)

Are you saying guilds aren't responsible for the way their members act?  That seems like a key feature to me..

Ralas

  • Hydlaa Citizen
  • *
  • Posts: 255
  • Explorers Guild
    • View Profile
    • Reincrownation :D
Re: "Secret" Meetings.
« Reply #9 on: August 03, 2006, 01:01:37 am »
Aside from that, it is important to do a fair amount of RP in public as to be a good influence.  Of course, anything very private should be and usually is done in public.  It is generally acceptable to hang out and watch RP, not being there IC, but it is a good idea to ask first.

Oh yes, I completely agree. Public RPing is one of my favorite aspects of the game. But I think if a group of people, in character, do not want to be disturbed, they could go to a private place to hold their meeting.




Oops, I meant to say that anything private should be and usually is done in private.  Not publiic.  There may still be times when a conversation held in public does not warrant invites to newcomers, but it really depends on the situation.  As in RL, you'd use caution when approaching a group of strangers so as not to distrurb them at a bad time, even if they are in public.  Unless it's in your character not to care.  Again, whenever there's confusion, these things should be explained OOC'ly so as not to hurt any RL feelings.
Yliakum, a really big crystal. These are the voyages of the Explorers Guild.  Its ongoing mission: to explore strange new maps, to seek out new life and new NPCs.  To boldly glitch where no one has glitched before.

www.reincrownation.com :D

zorbels

  • Forum Addict
  • *
  • Posts: 2132
  • Screenshot Queen of PS - EX GM - Strawberries <3
    • View Profile
Re: "Secret" Meetings.
« Reply #10 on: August 03, 2006, 01:18:46 am »
Quote from: Kiern
Are you saying guilds aren't responsible for the way their members act?  That seems like a key feature to me..

No, I am saying that just because it is one persons "bad behavior"  that is noticed, doesn't mean the whole guild is that way.  

The only control a guild master has is an option to kick that certain member if in fact the guild master doesn't agree with their behavior. If the guild master is not aware of this behavior and the other guild members follow the rules accordingly then I feel it isn't fair to pass judgement on the whole guild. Another form of punishment would be to demote them, that is if they have ranked. If that is the case, you still can't judge the guild on that persons behavior because the guild master is showing he/she doesn't approve with the demotion.

Is a parent responsible for a child that is over the age of 18? No. Not according to the law. Why would a guild be any different?  :) You join forces a guild because you believe in the same goals and such, not to be baby sat.
   I've been outside, it's overrated and the graphics suck!

Weavers

  • Traveller
  • *
  • Posts: 33
    • View Profile
Re: "Secret" Meetings.
« Reply #11 on: August 03, 2006, 01:28:38 am »
We have found that coming into any situation with fingers blazing on the keyboard is not the best of plans. That is, unless you are playing a boisterous and happy character. They seem to be welcome anywhere.

The best way to introduce yourself into a roleplay group can be not introducing yourself at all. A simple /me pauses in his/her walk at the site of such a large group. If the other players are good RPers, they will welcome you into the group in much the same way. Perhaps with a /me takes note of **player's** curious glance. That is a very good sign you have been invited. If not, then move on. There is roleplay to be found everywhere. Maybe, you just need to start your own group.

RP on.

Kiern

  • Forum Addict
  • *
  • Posts: 2680
    • View Profile
Re: "Secret" Meetings.
« Reply #12 on: August 03, 2006, 01:30:23 am »
Is a parent responsible for a child that is over the age of 18? No. Not according to the law. Why would a guild be any different?  :) You join forces a guild because you believe in the same goals and such, not to be baby sat.

I'm just saying, in OI you only became a member because we trusted you...we knew none of our members would just go out and smear our name.  Sure, they might get into arguments or something (Atticus and myself were council members...though I guess you probably don't know Atticus so that reference is lost) but if we got flak for it OI was willing to accept that.  

Being a guild member is a responsibility, and if you can't accept that you shouldn't be in a guild.  So yes, one member can define a guild, if someone in your guild is acting up and you don't know about it then it is the faulty recruitment you have going on and therefore your guild deserves to be held responsible for that.

EDIT:  Apparently I left out many, many words.  Sorry if I didn't catch them all.  I really need to learn how to type.
« Last Edit: August 03, 2006, 01:32:53 am by Kiern »

Janner

  • Hydlaa Citizen
  • *
  • Posts: 315
    • View Profile
Re: "Secret" Meetings.
« Reply #13 on: August 03, 2006, 01:38:03 am »
 If you join a guild your actions reflect on the hole guild so yes the guild will be tarred with same brush.
Glad to help.

zorbels

  • Forum Addict
  • *
  • Posts: 2132
  • Screenshot Queen of PS - EX GM - Strawberries <3
    • View Profile
Re: "Secret" Meetings.
« Reply #14 on: August 03, 2006, 01:47:40 am »
Quote from: Kiern
I'm just saying, in OI you only became a member because we trusted you...we knew none of our members would just go out and smear our name.  Sure, they might get into arguments or something (Atticus and myself were council members...though I guess you probably don't know Atticus so that reference is lost) but if we got flak for it OI was willing to accept that.  

Being a guild member is a responsibility, and if you can't accept that you shouldn't be in a guild.  So yes, one member can define a guild, if someone in your guild is acting up and you don't know about it then it is the faulty recruitment you have going on and therefore your guild deserves to be held responsible for that.

Well you raise some very good points Kiern. I am used to these mass recruiting guilds and the lack of effort put into them.Truth be told I hadn't really looked at it from your point of view until you explained your meaning. What you have stated makes complete sense. I am reconsidering my standing on this issue because of these good points.
   I've been outside, it's overrated and the graphics suck!