Author Topic: RP Arguments, Fights and Mechs  (Read 2346 times)

zhai

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RP Arguments, Fights and Mechs
« on: December 14, 2006, 11:26:05 am »
I've read a couple of threads lately about RP confrontations gone bad because of godmodding or actions going too quick for a player to enjoy so I thought I'd point something out. It's happened to me before when doing some RP that sometimes things quicken up and challenges kick in after just a few words, sending some players to the DR before they can even learn what's going on. Sure, you can say it may be realistic in some level (as in "my character is quick to anger and doesn't have the patience to deal with strangers butting in"), but the point should always be that all players involved have fun.

Many players think that just because they have a maxed character or because the person they are talking to is "significantly weaker" they can play bullies and /challenge if they see a sign of opposition coming from the weaker character. This makes them think they can RP anything just because they are stronger, like "order" you around or gormod in a RP fight. I am not refering to any particular case or person here, but I've seen this happen a couple of times, usually involving a poor RPer with a PLed character on the "bully" side. They come in, RP little, and think that everything has to be settled in /challenge. Dead RP.

Whereas I think that game mechanics can help limit what your character can do (who's faster, who's stronger, who has a better chance to do something) and cannot do, they should only be a reference, and we need to be flexible about how to use them. In reality, what your character can do or cannot do depends more on what other players grant you in each situation.

UTM's idea when Janeous used many ingenious traps to stop those hunting him down worked out pretty well. He used your stats as a reference to see if you would be able to avoid or endure the trap. Other game mechs like rolling dice are also a good way to compromise. What to roll and how to determine success or failure is up to the players and the situation at hand. Using these game mechs is much more interesting than basing your judgement of a situation on a character's description. If you really want to RP, having these being part of what you do would allow you and others around to be involved and not die so quickly. It also keeps lots of OOC crap out of the way.

Now, another important factor is that you cannot force people to join your RP just as much as you cannot ignore other people's RP. I think we are entitled to the choice of whether or not we want to RP with someone or a certain situation. However, our way in and out of a RP cannot be disruptive. If you find yourself being dragged into a RP you don't wish try to find an IC way to get yourself out of it (like calling the guards or standing right next to them, leaving the city or place where the RP is happening, etc.). If the others won't listen or seem to be interested in having their way no matter what, explain to them OOC that you are not interested. What may come out of it if you do the latter is that they might not want to RP with you again (but if you tried the first and they, in fact, didn't respect your right to have fun, you will probably be better off not RPing with them either).

This leads us to how certain situations are brought IC. I find it a turn-off when evil characters are dumb enough as to pretend they can do evil stuff in plain sight and bare no consequences to their IC actions. Sure, game mechs won't respond to that. Guards don't move. They'd rather have you bring them their lunch or train you than leave their post to catch a punk BUT this doesn't mean there are no laws. When an evil action takes place with no regards of guards, witnesses, and laws, I prefer not to be involved or if I find myself somewhat involved, my expectations on the outcome are rather low and I try to find a quick way out.


So, summing up:

- Don't rush to /challenge just to prove your point. It's anti-climatic and leaves no room to RP or enjoy what is going on. Don't be the one-minute-RPer, sending others to the DR before they get to have a little fun. They could RP being unconscious and still follow up the RP and the effect would be the same. Likewise, if you put a little event together, try to keep the challenges for the very last moment if at all.

- Using mechs that are fair for all players, like rolling dice using current stats or personality traits has worked wonderfully in my experience (because even the mightiest can fail and the weakest have lucky strike).

- You have the right to choose whether or not to join any RP but you should try to make your way in or out of it IC. A plain "[not interested]" is not good enough, just like being a punk ignoring facts that are not yet integrated to game mechs (like guards doing their job). Both attitudes are turn-offs and will probably ban you from a player's "People I like to RP with" list.


And, on a final note:

Our IC actions are independent from game mechanics simply because at the moment the game doesn't give us enough animations or mechs to support the extent of our RP. However, I've always thought that a character's personality has to be related somehow to their current stats and skills and not wander off too far from them to prevent godmodding. However, this should also apply the other way arround, limiting the choices this character makes in terms of training to those areas where they would have interest IC.

A character who can do everything because they're trained in it all (magic, mining, crafting, combat, etc.) and who RPs knowledge in all these fields is less likely to be considered a specialist or an expert in any of those. You may want to have a fully trained character, but would your character want that? Would they really like doing everything? Very few people do or are able to IRL so why RP that a character would? If you RP that your character is fully commited to only a few fields of knowledge (despite the fact that you've trained them in other fields as well for OOC reasons like needing to mine to pay for training or needing to fight to get experience), you are choosing where you are most likely to succeed and where you're most likely to need help.

Personally, I would grant a player the ability to cast spells that are not implemented in-game yet if they consistently RP that they are wizards and that magic is their main field of interest, just like I would grant a consistent herbalist the skill to treat a deadly poison successfully because they work their RP around those skills. It is not something they get out of the hat. A fighter/wizard/ninja/demi-god is a pain in the neck. You're much more likely to get your way if you choose an actual path for your character. And that gives room for situations in which you will need the help of other characters, encouraging more interaction between characters. Wouldn't that make sense?


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There. I'm done. Sorry for the long post. Again, I am not referring to anyone or any situation in particular. These are just a few ideas based on my experience in the game.


Edit: Typo.
« Last Edit: December 14, 2006, 03:06:41 pm by zhai »
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Ithorius

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Re: RP Arguments, Fights and Mechs
« Reply #1 on: December 14, 2006, 11:31:14 am »
this should be stickied.... IMO...

Thanks for posting what no one wanted to type up because of the length ;D

but it should be stickied...

Karyuu

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Re: RP Arguments, Fights and Mechs
« Reply #2 on: December 14, 2006, 02:58:29 pm »
How about just moved into the "Guides and Tutorials" section? If Zhai won't mind :]
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zhai

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Re: RP Arguments, Fights and Mechs
« Reply #3 on: December 14, 2006, 03:08:41 pm »
Sure, no problem. :)
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zorbels

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Re: RP Arguments, Fights and Mechs
« Reply #4 on: December 14, 2006, 03:10:31 pm »
 :woot: I love your mind! Zhai, a huge thanks for taking the time to put thought into this particular topic, type out those thoughts and post them. Know it is appreciated. I am glad this will be "Guides and Tutorials" section, with your permission of course.  :flowers:
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lanser

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Re: RP Arguments, Fights and Mechs
« Reply #5 on: December 14, 2006, 03:48:55 pm »
* lanser adds a link to a much earlier thread that also contains some useful info

http://hydlaa.com/smf/index.php?topic=19339.0
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Rayken

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Re: RP Arguments, Fights and Mechs
« Reply #6 on: December 14, 2006, 04:19:08 pm »
Nice job Zhai :thumbup:  I haven't  yet tried incorporating /roll (I usually just leave it up to players to determine outcomes, which can work), but i'm intrigued and will give it a shot next chance i get.

@Lanser: Thanks for bringing up that link, I think everyone should read that one too.
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eldoth_terevan

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Re: RP Arguments, Fights and Mechs
« Reply #7 on: December 14, 2006, 04:35:37 pm »
You are awesome, Zhai. I was trying to think of how to explain using rolls to avoid godmodding, but you said it much better.

zhai

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Re: RP Arguments, Fights and Mechs
« Reply #8 on: December 14, 2006, 04:54:38 pm »
Thank you, thank you. :D

Now, for those new to the game who are wondering how to roll the dice in-game, just use the command /roll and the number of sides you wish the die to have.

For example: /roll 6 would work as a six-sided die and /roll 100 would give you a number between 1 and 100.

If you wish to roll a stat just use your current stat value in the /roll command. For example: you testing your strength against someone else's. Let's say your strength is 68 so you would do /roll 68. If your opponent's strength is 150, they would do a /roll 150. Odds obviously lean towards the other guy, but you can get lucky and still win. Maybe he had a campy day or you ate all your veggies.

I don't think this has to be a rule but is a good tie breaker. I suggest discussing how to /roll in /tells depending on the situation. Not everything will find a solution using stat rolls. For example, a wizard may cast a spell on you and it might not exactly depend on either one's stats to be successful but more on location or elements around you, for instance. Or maybe someone might try to remain unseen in a shady corner or move across the room quietly to surprise you from behind.

It is a matter of compromise. You can be very creative on how to call for the rolls. Under the Moon's traps were a great example. I think that if we all agree that we can't win them all we're off to a good start.

If after all the /rolls you still feel like /challenging, knock yourself out. As long as you feel the RP prior to the kill was fulfilling and everyone had fun it's all good.
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