DR Sickness "debuff" length

[Zwenze]

I hate it. I truely hate the DR sickness. Its annoying and frustrating. The introduction of it makes death annoying and frustrating. I welcome that change. But I really hate it. Well, its not meant as an complain, as dying should be hated and I truely hate it now Good work - I hate it.

[Xillix Queen of Fools]

Death is death and there is settings backing what happens and why. Go and read the newer books. I have no pity for the new player, and you want to know why? The penalty is automatically scalable. If you have lower stats you lose less. A half hour is nothing. I wanted 6 hrs. Death SHOULD hurt, hurt bad. Anyone who thinks "this is a game, games should be fun" does not get human psychology very well. Whether one is ready to admit it or not humans enjoy a challenge.

The whole idea that we should not implement this because the game is in testing seems bunk to me. As with everything we do some players always propose a "better" solution. I do not believe however that any of you realize what it is like to deliberate many long hours with a core of dedicated people to find a good solution to have people turn around and tell you, you have done it wrong, or have failed to account for X or Y or Z.

We did speak of all of this before it was implemented and this is a compromise. (remember I still want it to be MUCH more difficult on the character to die) unfortunate circumstance for players? Yes, but in terms of the character and character perception what we have now accomplishes exactly what we aimed for it to both from a settings and rules perspective. The goal is simple: Death != Good.

Btw, I have said this many times before: You are all testers. I have no problem with people having fun playing the game, I love that some of you can do so. I do however think that ultimately you are testers of the game and it is vital to that role that you do in fact, help us to build planeshift, make bug reports, participate in the forums, provided feedback nicely etc.

I really do love the community but it seems you often have very mixed motives. In reference to this and all issues I would like to remind you "you asked for this."

For once I actually agree with Draklar impossible to please both subsections of the gaming world.

Induane also, don't worry, I got so much death up my sleeve that even you will be happy one day.

Final note, I do thank everyone for their thoughts here. Since some players have left (whether willingly or not) the complaint dept. and the forums at large are no longer an evil chore but a pleasant experience of feedback and discussion. I hope people will continue to keep the very nice tone to their arguments that they have had of late.

Enjoy Death!(tm)


(small note: we are no where near done with the death penalty, look forward to more deathy goodness in subsequent releases)

[bilbous]

You know I do not really understand people complaining about being overweight under the penalty. You can sell a bunch of stuff to the Death Guardian, You can give a bunch of stuff to another character and ultimately you can drop any excess at the spawn point. I can sort of see it if you are an undeveloped character (mechanics-wise, not role play) and the armor you choose to wear and the weapon you carry is more than half your weight allowance but even then it seems a little iffy. I was in the BD region the other day and I decided to climb the cliff-face to check out what appeared to be a cave. I was carrying more than half my weight allowance and pretty much new there was only one way out of the gorge. I sold off some gold and was good to go. Another time I died inadvertently to a tough rogue and had to sell off some of the weapons I had been collecting. I learned long ago that such things in the long run are unimportant so when I left the DR I was able to move. If you die in a role play through the awkward chat/movement functionality and you really cannot afford to lose what you are carrying then get a friend to carry it or station an alt in the DR for just such an occasion. At least until further developments require new methods.

[Eodun]

Lol, you know all this discussion has made my character want to go to the DR for a walk? I never thought I could say that XD

I'm ok with penalties. In fact, I think it's too nice :p

[Aiken]

I am a bit heavier than normal at weight 77/300. The death penalty does not remove any incentive to use DR as a shortcut if there is a reason I want to get back to Oja very quickly. Especially from the fortress. If I have been hunting and that last ulber kills me and I have to sit when I leave DR I go and do something else. Last time I mowed some more of the lawn.

When a 1/2 hour hit on my stats does not stuff up what I am doing I don't care.

The longest trip is Oja  <-> fortress which is about 1/2 hour. I favour making DR take longer than that to get out of (guess that will take a fair bit of work) or as was mentioned above random spawn points on the map. The maps already have default spawn points on them and they are used now if you fall of the maps. When someone leaves DR randomly pick a map and send them to the spawn point for that map. Some times you will end up closer. Sometimes you will end up further away.

Not knowing where I would appear in the world is more incentive to not use the dr shortcut compared to a stats hit that my character is strong enough to mostly ignore.

[bilbous]

Maybe just make the DR portal send you back to the Death Guardian 75% of the time

[Ravenguard]

I would say yes to a more harsh death penalty; only after examining creatures really works (I've had bad experiences).  I'd like that longer range too, just to make it easier to avoid death.

It doesn't make sense to examine a Tefusang, have it say, 'You notice that Tefusang is noticebly weaker than you,'  go up, hit it once, and it beats the living crap out of you.  I've even had 'somewhat weaker' ones take me down easy.

[bilbous]

Are your mental stats low? Your character might just be a poor judge of relative strength.

[Rongar Elani]

I can confirm Ravenguard's statement. There are these tefus on Ojaroad 2, close to the goldmine there, which 'won't require any effort to defeat' to me. All my stats are 200, but these tefus would slowly rip me apart if I didn't hit back. And this with a full set of HA and a lvl, close to max. Might check them later with nature intuition spell. <.<

[darhark]

Penalty is not to stop abusing /die command. It is to make death somewhat terrifying. Well, id does not. It's boring. The only bad side i see from dieing is i must sit down every 10-15 steps i make for a 30 minutes. Well, sometimes you have to "unburden" yourself. When i've first read it i was thinking i have to drop all my stuff except quest items to the ground, and what? That guardian is BUYING items from me, i.e. the system is sooooo friendly so it almost tells "i'm sorry for your death, i know it could be OOC; it's a pity but i have to take something from you for your own sake. Select something you don't really need and give it to the guard. Don't worry, i will pay you for that, here. Now please go read some books in our library. Enjoy your stay and have good time. Ask someone to get you out of here if you still don't know the path when you will want to go back to Hydlaa. By the way, after you quit you will have a little annoying penalty for 30 mins, but, you know, well... hm... how it says... WELL I AM THAT HORRIBLE DEATH, WHAT WOULD YOU EXPECT FROM ME?!". Scary. You can increase penalty time up to 6 or 12 or 24 hours, that only make people to slowly get out from PS. Because, as i said, the penalty is just annoying, it does not terrify anyone. I agree that permadeath could be a solution. I know of OOC deaths, but there are many rogulike games providing that sort of dieing. You can play it for days or even weeks, maybe even trying to RP for it is quite easy there because you are really afraid for that little "@" on the screen, and die in a moment, after what you have to create a new character. And it often happens that you are killed by a bug (not an insect, i mean glitch), or just due to in-game event (you try to open a common door and a huge heavy boulder is falling on you) anyone knows it and no one is against it. Because despite of it's negative sides it brings a special and unique taste to the game. I doubd there ever will be permadeath in PS, and understand it - it's still a risky idea for such a succesfull project. But there could be at least really serious _permanent_ penalties: skills decrease, items loss, and so on. Much worse than in JUST-FOR-FAN-MMORPG's. Death is a thing that is always takes something forever - in our world is anything, but it can be something less vital somewhere. Maybe even there is a need to somehow make people to RP their own penalties, however not anyone are so fair to do that. That is not the same of course, but it's much closer then the current system.

Buy the way, don't want to be annoying, but that part of a setting with DR is a one of very few things i don't appreciate in PS. Because it steals last drops of heroism, sorrow, evil, and some other loud words from the world. Who can fairly mourn for the friend he've lost if that friend is soon to return. And as far as that is an officially part of a setting, one should NOT mourn for him. He should take no care if he is a hardcore roleplayer. That's the worst thing in PS to my mind, really. It's better to leave DR where it is but remove the ability to revive from world description and books (maybe it can be a rumor though). It is not so fair, but makes RP much more interesting and realistic.

[darhark]

And finally, a've got an IDEA. That is a quite difficult for devs and fo players, 'cause it contains both technical and roleplaying sides of a game. What if when you die, you forget the most part of your life? You start with a new name, you loose you rank in your guild, you forget your friends and they forgets you too, you loose your standing in society, you loose a part of your skills. That is a complex problem - it needs an implemention of player introducing to let your friends "forget" about, or at least forget about how do you look like, and to let you yourself forget your friends (you can of course remember them accidentially when someone is speaking a name of your friend). It requires a good roleplaying skill to act like a returned-from-death-forgotten-most-part-of-what-he-used-to-know person. But if you think that's impossible, then we should forget about this game is RP-oriented and play_just_for_fun (and then i quit).  That at least solves some problems: death is not so fearsome for newbies as they don't have any friends and ranks in game, while it is quite terrifying (very terrifying) for old ones. It does not need to change the world setting too much (there is a revival from death still) and returns some tragedy to the world. And, after all, your skills are at most stay with you, you don't need to create a new character, so it will not scare people too much.

I was even thinking of one idea: when someone dies, he cannot be ressurected before someone alife finishes all his quests for him (like "unfinished business" we often speak about ghosts).

Hm. I'm sorry i'm drunk a little, the idea is to my mind a brilliant, if you will not get it, i will explain it much better tomorrow 

[Raa]

NO.

[darhark]

Eehh... no what? 

[Raa]

It sucks.

[zorbels]

And finally, a've got an IDEA. That is a quite difficult for devs and fo players, 'cause it contains both technical and roleplaying sides of a game. What if when you die, you forget the most part of your life? You start with a new name, you loose you rank in your guild, you forget your friends and they forgets you too, you loose your standing in society, you loose a part of your skills. That is a complex problem - it needs an implemention of player introducing to let your friends "forget" about, or at least forget about how do you look like, and to let you yourself forget your friends (you can of course remember them accidentially when someone is speaking a name of your friend). It requires a good roleplaying skill to act like a returned-from-death-forgotten-most-part-of-what-he-used-to-know person. But if you think that's impossible, then we should forget about this game is RP-oriented and play_just_for_fun (and then i quit).  That at least solves some problems: death is not so fearsome for newbies as they don't have any friends and ranks in game, while it is quite terrifying (very terrifying) for old ones. It does not need to change the world setting too much (there is a revival from death still) and returns some tragedy to the world. And, after all, your skills are at most stay with you, you don't need to create a new character, so it will not scare people too much.

I was even thinking of one idea: when someone dies, he cannot be ressurected before someone alife finishes all his quests for him (like "unfinished business" we often speak about ghosts).

Hm. I'm sorry i'm drunk a little, the idea is to my mind a brilliant, if you will not get it, i will explain it much better tomorrow 

I am thinking your idea would have more players quit then try to remake a character in game.