Wipe y/n?

[Grigori]

91 items are buggy as there is a sorta of shift in the columns, before those items even crashed everyone in sight of who used them. (note there are probably countless ones in addition to these 91 bugged for other reasons, like items with a script which is missing etc)
the db is full of missing pet cross references
some items aren't anymore supposed to be called in a certain way but til they are removed they stay there,
there are some named gold ring which aren't supposed to be there at all and are due for deletion
money item glitches

Database only stores data. It is the program that interprets the data. If item has missing script or other way is corrupted, the program could just change the item to pile of dust.
Have you ever found out what caused such item to appear? If not, then the buggy program will create that shit again in new database.

[Bonifarzia]

Just to focus on two questions that repeatedly appear in this thread without anyone giving a clear answer:

Is it really that troublesome (prone to errors, difficult, tedious or maybe even impossible) ...

... to track down those buggy items and modify the corresponding entries in the database(s) without touching the player characters state otherwise?
... to automatically send out an email notification to inactive accounts (for instance, no login during 3 months) and to delete irresponsive ones (maybe after another month)?

[cormah]

I have seen many points about the economy being unbalanced no economy is balanced

I voted no but if the wipe happens i will pick myself up and start again there is no point in whining about it.

[Mordraugion]

Database only stores data. It is the program that interprets the data. If item has missing script or other way is corrupted, the program could just change the item to pile of dust.
Have you ever found out what caused such item to appear? If not, then the buggy program will create that shit again in new database.

You have a cupboard, now that cupboard only stores food, every week you do your shopping and put your food into the cupboard, some of the food goes off and starts to smell, by your scenario you leave the mouldy, smelly rotten food inside the cupboard and just stop buying food. Personally I'd prefer to clean the cupboard out and change my shopping list than just leave the cruft in the cupboard and try to work around it.

Just to focus on two questions that repeatedly appear in this thread without anyone giving a clear answer:
Is it really that troublesome (prone to errors, difficult, tedious or maybe even impossible) ...

... to track down those buggy items and modify the corresponding entries in the database(s) without touching the player characters state otherwise?

Yes it is, some of the stuff we don't even know about yet.

... to automatically send out an email notification to inactive accounts (for instance, no login during 3 months) and to delete irresponsive ones (maybe after another month)?

Why? if DB is cleaned there will be no need to do so and as was previously mentioned accounts remain it is the data that goes with them that will be wiped. secondly why 3 months? why not 1 month or 6 months? we sometimes have players coming back after a couple of years

[verden]

but I fail to see how it actually improves my or the others gameplay.

You fail to see how reaching the goal of having the client and the server software working as intended will promote enjoyment of the game?

[hitancrias]

If there has to be a wipe, I just hope the devs carefully prepare for it so they take maximum advantage of it. I especially hope that, before they wipe, they have clear plans on how to balance the game and accordingly redesign or tweak the main systems: leveling, questing, crafting, and money influx through looting and mining  This may sound obvious, but so far 'balancing' has been rather ad hoc.

[Jullun Sihena]

Just thought of something...

Can the wipe be the occasion to move things around ?
You know, so that there's some unknown territory to explore, mines to rediscover, and so on...

[Akkaido Kivikar]

If there has to be a wipe, I just hope the devs carefully prepare for it so they take maximum advantage of it. I especially hope that, before they wipe, they have clear plans on how to balance the game and accordingly redesign or tweak the main systems: leveling, questing, crafting, and money influx through looting and mining  This may sound obvious, but so far 'balancing' has been rather ad hoc.

I think that the devteam has more than enough smarts to ave already realised this, without needing every second players suggestion as to how they should monitor the database to prevent further wipes.

Remember, the wipe is out of necessity, the devteam don't like pulling wipes out.

[Prolix]

If there is a wipe it is bound to be followed by a large flushing sound....

[playbetter]

Weltall, Thank you. You heard what I said and answered clearly the reasons. That was exactly what I said should be done, as we now have a clear picture of why, instead of whiney "he/she/kra is more leveled than me, and I don't like anything" posters.

[Grigori]

You have a cupboard, now that cupboard only stores food, every week you do your shopping and put your food into the cupboard, some of the food goes off and starts to smell, by your scenario you leave the mouldy, smelly rotten food inside the cupboard and just stop buying food. Personally I'd prefer to clean the cupboard out and change my shopping list than just leave the cruft in the cupboard and try to work around it.

No. It is in your scenario you just burn the house where the cupboard is located.
I'd prefer to clean what is dirty and not destroy the rest. Like I said bad items could be just changed to piles of dust.

Wiping entire database is like healing headache with guillotine.

[Tuxide]

Like I said bad items could be just changed to piles of dust.

Bad items can also be sold to the vendor for cash.

[Mordraugion]

You have a cupboard, now that cupboard only stores food, every week you do your shopping and put your food into the cupboard, some of the food goes off and starts to smell, by your scenario you leave the mouldy, smelly rotten food inside the cupboard and just stop buying food. Personally I'd prefer to clean the cupboard out and change my shopping list than just leave the cruft in the cupboard and try to work around it.

No. It is in your scenario you just burn the house where the cupboard is located.
I'd prefer to clean what is dirty and not destroy the rest. Like I said bad items could be just changed to piles of dust.

Wiping entire database is like healing headache with guillotine.

I stated my scenario but its clear you chose to allow yourself not to read it because it doesn't fit with your view

[angstrom]

Wait! Inspiration has struck me! 

I have a suggestion for the Devs that might keep both sides of the table happy:
Go ahead and do a wipe, but reserve character and guild names. Then (and here's the clever bit) set everyone's stats to max, give them millions of tria, and one of every item available in the game! 

Anyone who wishes to RP can continue to do so, and PL's can carry on making q300 weapons and so on....
As an added bonus, people wont be looking for loopholes to exploit, thus stopping the game from becoming un-balanced!

A perfect solution, Non?   

[Elvors]

91 items are buggy as there is a sorta of shift in the columns, before those items even crashed everyone in sight of who used them. (note there are probably countless ones in addition to these 91 bugged for other reasons, like items with a script which is missing etc)

As I wrote earlier: consider the cruft in the database as a test case for how ironclad the server code is.
Data errors will inevitably be reintroduced, be it via server bugs, via somebody with an erroneous SQL UPDATE in Phpmyadmin, a bug in the web frontend, or someobdy entering wrong data in the web frontend. As has been written by others, if the server chokes on invalid data, you have two bugs: one in the data, one in the code that cannot handle it.

Possible solutions:
1) Use Postgresql and add CHECK and FOREIGN KEY constraints. That would take care of the vast majority of wrong data.
2) Have a database access layer and have it check the constraints on the C++ side.
Both approaches would be lots of work, but a wipe would be a non-solution to the database problems IMNSHO.

Either solution would have a very positive side effect though: coders would have a by-definition precise and complete documentation of what they can write to the database and what they cannot. That's better than those always-slightly-outdated specification documents or that always-slightly-incomplete hearsay.