The state of roleplaying in PS (aka, something you won't ever admit)

[novacadian]

Thats the nice thing about dicing, its fair and fun as long as both parties can agree on the terms, though it can get complicated and the rolling can be a little distracting. In another game that I play, one of the players coded an addon that would enable players to dice roll their rp actions automatically. I don't know how the system works in detail, but in brief, each player sets up a simple profile containing the stats they wish to play ( yes, they are honest about this ). When they enter an RP fight or whatever, they can issue a command that does a number of dice rolls that take their declared stats into consideration. They are then left to rp the action and consequence based on the result for that action.

Perhaps easier than an add on would be a PvP option like the Duel Invitation scheme where one could set One Step style PvP. With both characters being set to One Step then when choosing attack only one hit would be calculated; making all appropriate adjustments like any PvP hit. The respected guidelines could be that each player takes their turn in making an action. They could speak, move or what-have-you. Any of them being considered an action.

To implement such a scheme should be fairly easy; as you would just need to take the loop out of PvP combat and have only one hit calculated before exiting if the setting is One Step.

n00bs to PlaneShift are likely coming from an RPG background like myself. They may ultimately move on to the more traditional Planeshift RP Combat; yet would allow them to do so cautiously as trust is formed with fellow RPers. Without that trust then dice are a nice umpire. Personally they appeal to me as they take the outcome out of the hands of me, the player.

Do you think there would be any interest for such a scheme and do you think it would garner any weight in the Wish List?

- Nova

[Zon]

One last point, and yes, this is on topic as it pertains to why rp has taken a nosedive, is settings. It would help if the settings web page was updated/corrected, and if setting info was put in one easy to access place - preferable a web page. A player could then study the setting before making a charater. They would not need to stumble though the game like an ooc ass and do a million mile long quests in order to learn about the setting. The setting and background info should also be completed... This is just story writing.. its not that hard to do for someone who is creative and organized.

Yep. I am looking for these settings a million times. People would say "do some quests" or "Go to the library?". If your character cannot read, why would you go to the library? I found this great website with the books of PS and people here said that is was spoilers. I mean come on. Those books in the web actually helped me but now it is gone. (who removed it?)

Also, I agree with Rigwyn's number two.  To be honest, I am tired of seeing one-dimensional characters. Most characters are "I am a warrior because I like fighting." It is very dull. Flavourless. It does not show weakness, strengths, anything that might change your character's intention etc. Maybe the reason why many don't want their characters to lose?

Another thing is the mechanics. As it is right now. Everyone can be a warrior-mage-smith-crafter-fisherman. There is no limitations. I know most would say "be true to your character" and stuff like that but that is the point. People abuse it.. Unless if the money system for these works, not only that but also able to not learn everything to "level 100" I can't imagine people with complex characters. THey will be focused on grinding and money making. Some indeed do not grind and level and etc. but for roleplay to improve, it must involve everybody not just a group of people that are actually WILLING to roleplay. Roleplaying is not only about making yourself good,. It is also about making the others that you roleplay with better as well

[Illysia]

@Akaiddo: No... I would not complain about the regulations as frankly there has been some disappointing stuff in game as of late. I am one of the few that say keep the tutorial. The tutorial is what kept most of the SA guys out of the game to troll it. It makes people have to slow down and consider if they really want to bother. Regulations would probably have the same affect. I don't want to have to deal with the common MMO fare as they seem to have an IQ smaller than their shoe size and the maturity level of a grape. More importantly, I can play other games if I want to deal with them that badly.

Basically, what Rigwyn is saying is like the broken window principle. If you leave the bar down, it will only go lower. If you raise it, people will eventually get to the point where they do better. I want to accommodate newbs, not n00bz, and you need people willing to come up to a higher standard first. It's not that they have to be great at it, but they, at least, need to want to be good at it. Even CotH is pretty forgiving if you read the accepted intros. I was surprised.

On the cloaks and guards thing, that problem would be because your guild isn't the official guard. The official guard would be given more consideration as they have more force to bring to bare. Rogues are likely to view vigilantes as little more than a slightly "Do Gooder" version of themselves and will blow off any perceived meddling.

Also, keep in mind that many players never come in contact with guilds beyond knowing who is in what guild. Many players are completely unaffiliated or they guild is so dead that they might as well be guildless. Most guilds are so dead that they can't possibly be contributing that much to bad RP. The bigger help would be measures that work person by person which goes back to Rigwyn's ideas. I think the basic problem in this regard is that there are too many differing opinions on what is right and what is wrong. Regulation would offer some consistency and give people something to base their arguments for right and wrong on.

Ok, I'll address some of the other stuff in the posts since mine later as this is more typing than my arm can handle.

[Maisent]

I think this was a good post

[Akkaido Kivikar]

@Akaiddo: No... I would not complain about the regulations as frankly there has been some disappointing stuff in game as of late. I am one of the few that say keep the tutorial. The tutorial is what kept most of the SA guys out of the game to troll it. It makes people have to slow down and consider if they really want to bother. Regulations would probably have the same affect. I don't want to have to deal with the common MMO fare as they seem to have an IQ smaller than their shoe size and the maturity level of a grape. More importantly, I can play other games if I want to deal with them that badly.

Basically, what Rigwyn is saying is like the broken window principle. If you leave the bar down, it will only go lower. If you raise it, people will eventually get to the point where they do better. I want to accommodate newbs, not n00bz, and you need people willing to come up to a higher standard first. It's not that they have to be great at it, but they, at least, need to want to be good at it. Even CotH is pretty forgiving if you read the accepted intros. I was surprised.

I didn't say "remove the tutorial", what I am saying is "don't make newbs get a forum account and feel they have to try and look good enough for us".

This "appalling stuff" you have seen in game, well in my opinion, on the RP server, you should be able to report that to a GM and have the player talked to/warned/punished if repetitive. We have the function to record 5 minutes, we should be able to use it. That's a way to raise the bar.

[jaculapundactum]

If PS truly is to be a role playing game many changes has to be made. For example:

*Clear rules about godmodding, meta gaming and playing a character that is not yourself.
*GM's enforcing the said rules
*Clear stat, skill, race and class restrictions. [Leaving players unable to improve upon the stats they start out with dramatically, as well as being unable to master all skills. The "improvement's" that could be made should rather be Dependant on ones characters race and class. This would at a large scale defeat the purpose of PLing]
*Making roll combat the tool of choice. This way RP battles can transpire smoothly, without any frustrating deadlocks such as characters being unable to be hit.

I'm not going to obfuscate my own origin however. I learned role playing by listening to others, doing many mistakes before I began to consider myself as able to play my character accordingly. Making mistakes is a natural part of learning after all.

With that said, setting rules and restrictions in not elitist or meant to offend anyone. I enjoyed PS a lot at one point in time, and I assure you reading that I'm not here to say that I'm superior to you in the terms of role playing or any other.

With that said, what I have seen on these forums during my absence is disappointing. The community appears to have grown spiteful, malicious and last but not least: plain childish.
As far as the RP community goes it appears to have been reduced to shame as well, with only a few glints of hope to be had.

In conclusion, for role playing to work there has to be rules that are being enforced. For as of now, RP seems to have died and been buried six feet under.

[Rigwyn]

I would just like to clarify a few points as several others did on my behalf. The point in approving a character before the player can use it is to prevent players from starting out with something that they cannot rp. If Joe Blow makes a succubus, then what am I supposed to do if he tries to rp with my characters? In the setting, there is no such thing. This character is invalid. If he started out with something that made sense then he would at least fit in.

The point here is not to be an elitist or nazi but to help the new player to get off to a good start. It would also filter out those players who don't have the time or interest to learn a little bit about the settings and write a simple character profile. I'm not talking about a novel, just a simple one page description that does not violate the setting.

Perhaps we have different definitions for the words "nazi" and "elitist". To me, these are very negative and oppressive types of people. If you call coaching a newcomer and teaching him to learn the setting and rp well elitism, then I suppose I am guilty of that by your definition, however I see nothing wrong with that.  Elitist does not mean "good", "professional", or "talented"... its more in line with words like "jerk", "ahole"  and "troll".

As a new player I think I might have felt more confident about trying to role play if I had help setting up a character on the forums and started playing with the knowledge that my character had the approval of other well respected players or Gms. Yes, I started out as a mild PLer, and then learned from others how to RP by looking up RP guilds on the forum and then seeking out one of the listed players. I am not suggesting that a new player be good before they start, they should just be required to set up a simple character profile and have it approved. ( approved =  it does not violate settings, it makes sense, perhaps some other very basic criteria )

Having a character approval process is just one idea.. its not critical, but I think it would help.

As for mentioning other games, I really tried not to drag in the names of other games out of courtesy.. ( Yes, I still have  a small shred of decency left )

Regarding the rp attacks in Oja.. at the time, masked rogue npcs were walking around and attacking people on the spot. Entering Oja masked therefore did not seem like it would violate the setting for Oja at least.After all, there are only two guards .. and they ignore all the masked rogues. The last time I played the rogue NPCs were lined up nicely and not moving .. is that because of game limitations or is it because settings -wise they do not run the town anymore? As a player I can only guess. Anyway ... Akaiddo, while Jacula's character did some serious damage,  I yielded my character to you in an rp fight. ( and to Emmara, Atagal and Shoral ). I think you guys got a good mix of victory and defeat. You should not complain about that .. thats as fair as it gets.

I agree with you Illy, an auto-incarcerate feature would be just as good. Or perhaps just a light toasting with a tazer ( freeze for 1 minute ).  How a guard would know you are cloaked would be a game mechanics issue .. it could be done if the devs felt like implementing hoods or something. As for the issue with seds .. tough luck. Its an rp server. Swords are swords on the rp server, not ooc stat bufs.

[verden]

Already asked, it won't happen. If it didn't while XilliX was here, let alone now that there's no dev left that can RP.

Not to mention that any of the regulations that have been enacted haven't helped the community much, if at all. But anyway, now that all the real RP'ers have decided to introduce a higher level of regulation to the game, I'm sure it will happen straightaway. Not. Face it, the developers have completely different ideas on what constitutes roleplay versus what the community thinks is roleplay. This isn't a roleplaying game yet, its just a game that asks you to roleplay your characters.

[bloodedIrishman]

zing

[Geoni]

Roleplay:

-To newbs:
-remember what you learned in the tutorial, which should NEVER be taken out of the game.
-Stay in the settings. (like countless others have said)
-Don't godmod.
-Fill out a page or two of character creation for each of your characters, it's not that difficult.
-When you play this game, it is not to be "the strongest player in the world!" There will be a wipe that will destroy that quote in the future.
-Using your characters history and status in society, play him/her/kra out to that accordingly. 
-You don't have to type out walls of text, or have your character be overemotional, or some crazy killer. (Anything overdoing things)
-Play your character out according to what the character around him/her/kra are doing/saying.
-If your character will have more to RP when he/she/kra gets a job, joins a guild (depends on the guild though), or joins a religion. I'm sure that is not all that could help your character interact, but they are good starters.
-Please don't leave your character standing around while you are afk for hours, log off.

To people who know how to RP:

-Don't just RP with people you know, and all their alts. Those are RP clicks, a no-no, roleplay with everybody.
-If you see a new player, don't let him run around looking for stuff, get his character included in some interesting situation. Perhaps actually greeting somebody would be a good start, and I'm not talking about /greet.
-Don't play on too many alts at once, it just causes you to be slow on each one. (unless you are REALLY good at that.)
-Don't pre-plan any RP's or make up some random story about characters. (Your character doesn't suddenly know that there has been a kidnapping in ojaveda when he/she/kra is in Hydlaa. Unless he/she/kra gets a message or hears it from somebody, he/she/kra doesn't know about it.)
-If you find that new player that you greeted or put in a situation (remember him?) Have your character talk to that person again instead of running by him, or letting him run by you. Constant immersion will get new players to want to roleplay more. (That's how it got me interested.)
-If you complain about RP being dead, either get in game and help by roleplaying, or shut up and stop complaining about how things aren't what they used to be.

[novacadian]

Roleplay:
-If you complain about RP being dead, either get in game and help by roleplaying, or shut up and stop complaining about how things aren't what they used to be.

Those are wise words, Geoni!

From the perspective of a somewhat new player the level of RP has been very satisfactory to me. So far, more established players have been very kind to my character in an IC manner. Even when acting out nasty thieves, those players have been helpful to me via OOC tells to help me with my RP questions. One player kindly spent a lot of time chatting in group chat to me about ideas on RP battles and how it traditionally works on PS in the tavern one night. 

This newbie feels that there is a strong caring community of RP players on PS. From my limited experience new players quickly fall into RP as a rule. Only two player encounters went against that observation and they were bare fisted while battling rats in the sewers; so that indicates how new they
were.

Bottom line is that all players which have interacted with me IC online seem to trying their best. Can one ask for more than that from any player in any game?

- Nova

[bloodedIrishman]

Future Planeshift will likely have less role play rules and consequently less enforcement than it does now.

Planeshift caters to casual role players. COTH caters to another "niche" of what you might call "hardcore" role players. That is just the way it is, and the way it will be.

This is just what I think. I'm sure most of you think something else. I'm still right though. 

[Roled]

There's still lots of room for players who would like a specific part in one of the 4 interwoven plots now happening...
PM me here or find anyone involved in the recent engagements, or the recent abductions, the recent gatherings of Crystal Mages {and one more set of occurrences that are just starting..] If you PM please tell me just a short bit about your character motivations and the core creators will do our best to fit your character into the action and give you something important and fun to do. And it's collaborative , so you're input is essential. check our Long Form thread please.

And you don't have to have a specific part, please join in the rp in any way that your character would!. New to the game? Ask in game in character, and we'll welcome you.

Anyone else find it ironic that this thread was started almost a year ago?.. such a long, drawn out  'dying' of these apparently illusive ghosts called role players...[/i] 

RR

[Rigwyn]

Yes Roled, its because the problem has been going on for that long. I remember people moaning about rp dying and the community eroding back in feb 08. Its the same thing now except there are far less players left then there were back then.

Regarding this grand rp event Roled, I hope you haven't told anyone about our little secret

[Nivm]

 So I guess that means natural state of Plane Shift's role-playing is "dying", and any action can be considered "death throws". Well, I guess that can be said for all life on our planet.