Let's make some changes and be more RP for Laanx sake!

[Edicho]

So... here are some things that we discussed on IRC and i want you all to read it. Let me know your opinion but please do NOT offtopic, i want to hear your yes or no. (if no, give me the reason). Do NOT reply to others posts, only mine please. So...Here we go...:

Guilds creation fee 200k-500k - (will need newbies to be in game for some time before creating a guild and know each other, or let them find guild that suits them)

those are too lazy to use "/tell playername message" - use "/invite playername" instead for free temporary group

Guild leaders - Are restricted to take care of their members, should learn them roleplay, using OOC and IC, and tell them to not using OOC on main tab. forced to learn recruited ones so he knows what ooc and ic is and how to use them. Should point to the forums to read (carefully and with understanding). Teach members about everything but quest solutions.

Guilded members - Those who are guildmembers/leaders are not allowed to use OOC on main tab (even with brackets), doing so allows any player to petition guildleader to kick member for breaking the rules. Guild members are allowed to ask their guildmates only (will force guilds to be experienced, and leaders to be responsible for members).

OOC and brackets - only not guilded people are allowed to use it [in brackets of course] until they know what's going on, if anyone wants to help him/her and teach him/her, use "/invite playername"

Guilds - Each guildleader have a month to clarify rules, ranks, and eventually some story for his guild. Take a serious name which will properly describe your guild (do not choose warriors, fighters if any of your member will not fight if challanged). Guild which haven't managed to create rules etc. are deleted. Similiar guilds are merged if needed [will need GM help on that if possible]

[Ekarotas]

I agree with that. Guilds are made now either out of laziness (use /tell or groups,people!) or the "pride" to have a guild name on your tag. Guild invites are made just to gain numbers and newbies are then left on thier own. Most new people I saw IG are mostly there to powerlevel, only a few really care about RP (or understand this game is based on RP). And OOC talk in main is getting a bit out of hand imo.

[pKrime]

So, I don't want to start a flame, but to tell the truth, I'm so bored by "role playing" talibans!

If you forget to use brackets, it's not the end of the world, if you use a funny name, it's just a funny name, if you want to make a pun about the mercenary helm resembling Darth Vader mask, make the pun.

Want to know a funny thing?  Our characters are aware being in a game, I hope it's the same for you.

[Nikodemus]

Want to know a funny thing?  Our characters are aware being in a game

Nope, go play some non RP game. Or rather RP game with setting which is messed up with our world and some fantasy/scifi/whatever thing. It can be fun with no doubt, but PS isn't one of them. And thats is because in PS developers and people actually care about explaining RP, while in games you are lookin for it isn't needed at all, since people playing them don't need it.

Oh noes! I broke Edicho request ;P I gues you just can't reply only to the original topic, ignoring the rest of the thread

Guilds creation fee 200k-500k - (will need newbies to be in game for some time before creating a guild and know each other, or let them find guild that suits them)

Nope, how can you set IC factor to stand for OOC requirement? With this Attitude you are wanting the same game as pKrime

As for the rest of the post, thats really nice wishes, but i have no idea how you are going to restrict them. That would be nice if guild leaders and members cared about the whole thing, but if not... you want to punish them?
Some say we need quality over quantity. Unfortunately the quality comes with quantity. This means that many people sometimes case problems, but in other situations they are more than needed if we don't want get bored to death in this game.

[Shangreloo]

Guilds creation fee 200k-500k:
Yes! Please keep it moderately expensive/difficult to create a new guild. And Yes! A person should have to be in game for a minimum period of time before being able to make a new guild; that a character has the tria to do so shouldn't be all that is required to form a new guild.

Guild leaders - Are restricted to take care of their members:
Perhaps "required" is a better word than "restricted". But yes, guild leaders should be held responsible for the behaviour of their guild members. Perhaps this would make some guild leaders a little more selective.

Guilded members - Those who are guildmembers/leaders are not allowed to use OOC on main tab:
Isn't using OOC in main tab already discouraged? This would fall under the previous advisory of guild leaders being responsible for the behaviour of their guild members in making sure new members understand the ruels of the game, and the proper use of the various communication tabs.

OOC and brackets:
Again, already a policy, even though it is being more and more widely ignored.

Guilds - Each guildleader have a month to clarify rules, ranks, and eventually some story for his guild. Take a serious name which will properly describe your guild. Guild which haven't managed to create rules etc. are deleted. Similiar guilds are merged if needed:

I'm not sure similar guilds should be merged. There are several guilds in game with similar goals. As an example: there are at least three guilds that have crafting, and all that goes along with it (mining, smelting, sales), as their primary activity. Having several guilds pursuing similar crafting goals isn't necessarily a bad thing and invites comptetion in respect to prices for ores, stock, and crafted goods. As an independant crafter, the exsistence of one or more of these guilds isn't necessarily good for my own character, but it is good for the overall economy of Yliakum. Ultimately, I can see mandatory guild merges as being a way for larger guilds to swallow up all the smaller competing guilds.. and that's not necessarily a good thing for the overall economy.

Just a suggestion of my own:
Take guild tags out of overt public view and place them in the character description instead.

[Narure]

I think we should keep guild tags untill the option for guild uniforms is in game.

[lordraleigh]

Guild creation 200k-500k : Great, now not only either one makes a miner alt or powerlevels the main character to be a powerminer! Also it is a 100% OOC measure, why would I have to pay 500k(More than 10 times the price of a pterosaur)  IC for a guild? It's simply ridiculous and not the best solution, specially due to the currently flawed economy.

Guild leaders restricted to babysit their members: I'm not a babysitter, RPing guilds don't exist so their founders assume the responsability for the OOC mistakes of their members, this will create an atmosphere of fear as well, and people will be afraid, very afraid. Each one should assume responsability for the acts commited, a guild leader shouldn't become a large target to others put the blame on the actions of members, as sometimes even known roleplayers make mistakes. This will only create stagnation and make things much harder for new and old guilds to expand.

OOC and brackets: Why should non-guilded members be allowed to do it while guilded members can't do it? This is simply unfair to restrain guilded individuals from deviating from hardcore roleplaying. Also even I use OOC talk sometimes. Do we really wish to create such atmosphere of terror and to scare away people from joining guilds?

Guilds  - Similar guilds. There's something called competition and other thing called cooperation, merging similar guilds is simply a forced OOC action to IC aspects. If they wish to merge, it should be through IC diplomacy.

I'm so bored by "role playing" talibans!

A nice description of this... OOC RP Police State. This proposal is the most closer to:

Die Roleplay Uber Reich

* lordraleigh is shot down by the cops because he forgot to put brackets once

[thesoundless]

OOC  talk should be allowed [in brackets of course] in main chat.  sometimes it is just necessary.

[Karyuu]

You can't enforce roleplay. You can but encourage it, and not with excess rules.

[Proglin]

Karyuu is right. Encourage it more then enforce it.

However, I'm a big fan of Role-play and all that has to do with it. I appriciate you all thinking with us and would like you to keep doing so. Naturally most of the GM's as well as devs listen to threads like these and erad over them twice at least. Keep it up, and think things over.

[Idoru]

I seem to agree with all that Lordraleigh says, but not the entire sentiment.
I agree with Karyuu that you cant just enforce it, but you still must enforce it. If someone uses [] to tell a newbie something is one thing. To use [] to have an in depth talk about the latest kernel for Linux is another.

We shouldnt be looking for OOC soloutions to fix OOC problems, that is just propagating OOC-ness.

[Heyok]

I agree we should do more rping, but we should still be allowed the option of the brackets. i often find myself having to use brackets to clarify something or help someone

[Edicho]

I'm going to quote your replies to let you know what i meant. Again... do not quote other replies please.

Guilds creation fee 200k-500k - didn't mean to set it exactly 200-500k. This is just amount big enough. All I want is to set it higher so guild creation isn't just a matter of few mining trips. Hope you get it now.

pKrime - all i want you to understand is: RPG games are made to RP, try to play lego in quake for example. You can't? well that's why because that was not the intention of making lego pieces in quake ! quake is for killing and RPG are for RP. Sorry you have to live with that fact and agree to it.... (want to talk about it? PM me.)

"If you forget to use brackets, it's not the end of the world" - of course it's not, but there is a difference between forgetting to use them and use them too much.

Nikodemus -

"Guilds creation fee 200k-500k - (will need newbies to be in game for some time before creating a guild and know each other, or let them find guild that suits them)
Nope, how can you set IC factor to stand for OOC requirement?" - Now i know what you mean. I don't want to set people newbies or not. I just want people to be mentally able to maintain a guild that's all. Thank you for bringing this out

"As for the rest of the post, thats really nice wishes, but i have no idea how you are going to restrict them. That would be nice if guild leaders and members cared about the whole thing, but if not... you want to punish them?
Some say we need quality over quantity. Unfortunately the quality comes with quantity. This means that many people sometimes case problems, but in other situations they are more than needed if we don't want get bored to death in this game." - Well i don't want to kill this game if that's what you mean i just want people to use brackets as rare as possible. most RP situations are killed with [man i hate these crashes] because some others might find it enjoyable to say [hey me too , my comp just hangs up few times a day recenty] that's why i want people to talk on groups about that things or use tells.

Shangreloo -

"I'm not sure similar guilds should be merged. There are several guilds in game with similar goals. As an example: there are at least three guilds that have crafting, and all that goes along with it (mining, smelting, sales), as their primary activity. Having several guilds pursuing similar crafting goals isn't necessarily a bad thing and invites comptetion in respect to prices for ores, stock, and crafted goods. As an independant crafter, the exsistence of one or more of these guilds isn't necessarily good for my own character, but it is good for the overall economy of Yliakum. Ultimately, I can see mandatory guild merges as being a way for larger guilds to swallow up all the smaller competing guilds.. and that's not necessarily a good thing for the overall economy." - Now i agree on that, you have right. but someone should take a look into the guilds.

"Take guild tags out of overt public view and place them in the character description instead." - I think it is right as it is. i think others are ok with it too.
 
Narure -

"I think we should keep guild tags untill the option for guild uniforms is in game." - yes that's how it should be

lordraleigh -

I think you've overreacted. Babysitting? It seems you're on of those who like to mass recruit and leave the members on their own. No i don't wan't babysitting. I want leaders to keep an eye on their members and hit them hard when they do something not guild-like. if you are crafters, do not take part in duels so often.  If you are fighters, hire miners to mine. Be like your guild should be. want to have miners/fighters/crafters in your guild ? Set ranks! it's just what is is for - sharing duties.

"Why should non-guilded members be allowed to do it while guilded members can't do it? " - do you think english is my first language ? of course not and so i know the others have the same problem too. And that's why i want guildleaders and guildmember to help their members in it. I don't want your members to hardcore RP he can use very simple words or answers as long as we understand what is he saying. I just don't want to hear him talking about his new girlfriend he gone to the cinema with or his brand new bmw he just bought in the middle of the event...... [want to explain him something? group or use guild tab we don't need to listen to it and those tabs can be used OOC]

I'm a bit disappointed hydlaa notable can only complain and can't propose any fix .....

the soundless

"OOC  talk should be allowed [in brackets of course] in main chat.  sometimes it is just necessary." - of course, when we need to help newcomer we can use it explain him how to use group and go on groupchannel later

Karyuu

"You can't enforce roleplay. You can but encourage it, and not with excess rules." - I don't want to enforce it. Do i want to ban/kick players ? no i want to have more clear main tab. And i think others too.....

[Karyuu]

Please use a different font color in the future, that blue is almost impossible to read on the default forum theme. Moreover, this is a public board for interaction between all people, and limiting them to reply to the first post only and no one else's is a bit silly. If you want one-on-one conversations, use PMs. Here, everyone should be free to join in.

Aren't you really preaching to the choir, however? Nearly everyone who makes themselves a regular on this board roleplays, and tries to use OOC chat as rarely as possible.

I also think that you are getting ahead of yourself. We already have a rule where if a certain group of people chat about their computers or girlfriends or the latest movies where people are RPing, they'll get to have a conversation with a Game Master afterwards. If it's a couple of lines here and there, the world isn't going to collapse, and your roleplays aren't in jeopardy. If you can't filter out a few sentences and their mere presence is making you halt your RP, your RP is very weak.

I think higher fees for the creation of guilds is a poor solution. I would much prefer quests, for example. Anyway, good guild leaders already make sure their recruits are familiar with PS rules and guidelines. Your suggestion for guild members not to use OOC chat anywhere is also very iron-fisted. Are you here to play, or are you here to police each other for every minor offense? Please don't give our GMs more to do than absolutely necessary. Asking them to come after someone who used a single line in brackets during RP is worthy of an eye-roll.

You sound like you need to relax a bit and take on a bit more of a live-and-let-live attitude. I don't mean relax completely into "anything goes," but I wouldn't want to play a game with the suggestions you have made.

[Indygo]

I think Edicho's intentions in the opening of this thread are good, and he has some suggestions that could be tweaked a bit to help.  However, you are never going to completely clean out the OOC annoyances that occur from time to time.  It seems many want there to be total compliance with the RP guidelines but dont really want to be bothered by contributing their time to help those that dont get the concept.

In my obsvervation it has been since the absence of the Vespers of Laanx that OOC has become more prevalent.  I myself was helped immensely by Xillix and Company in my beginnings in Yliakum and without them, and the help of a few others, I am positive I would not have gotten it as fast.  I remember well the days of the stairs to the temple being packed and the Vespers of Laanx preaching, I'm sure many of you do as well.

In my opinion what is truly needed is a guild that is dedicated to helping the new and unguided.  When I say help I dont mean give them all the answers to quests and location of NPC's or the tria they need to buy armor, or the weapons they want.  What I mean is direction... make up a simple quest you give to noobies that has a purpose and makes them take initiative.  The vespers for example had three small tasks; help five people out of the death realm and tell them to seek the vespers at the temple of Laanx, register on their forums and read the history of Yliakum, a certain amount of tria was given and the player had to seek out glyphs and armor... dont recall the order they were given.  These three tasks were very helpful to me and quite simple to come up with.

I think a solution that would have real effect is a group of players form a guild to give guidance and help people get started.  The sole purpose of this guild would be to assist new players by teaching them the settings and basic rules, not to recruit the new and grow.  Perhaps some of us players that have been around a while could contribute  six hours a week in the guild for example using alts.  The others that dont have the time could help support this guild with tria or in quest roles.  In a perfect world everyone is reading the player guide and the settings before they play, but in reality they are downloading and connecting.  Without some direction, how else do you expect them to act?  The responsibility falls on us not the GM's in this case, they have responsibilities in helping the developers test new features and hunt down bugs, not baby sit the 'noobs'.  Even a night a week spent in advisormode would be a great way to contribute.

I know there are players that are interested in doing something to help, they just need to be organized.  It would take some effort but it would benefit everyone.