Imagine the area around Harns with lots of people afk. The air would be cluttered with chat bubbles.

I have no idea about how easy it would be, but my initial worry is the same as Kiaerulf's thought here. I can see it being very useful, but if I was going to see something on screen for every player who is not actively typing (and possibly every player who is as well?), I'd just want to turn it off. We might also get some frustrated public speakers when they find their audience has 'fallen asleep'.

Illysia's /away idea which would be a good way to avoid it kicking in when it's not actually wanted. The information could just be shown once that command is used, but if there's no way to make it automatic I'd worry that it wouldn't work as hoped. If someone has to leave the screen there's no guarantee they'll remembered to use that command first, so you still wouldn't know for sure if they are there or not.

Instead of a chat bubble, maybe some kind of indicator in the chat window or information window that just shows for the character you have selected? Then you'd still be able to check the status of the person you're RPing with without needing any clutter on your screen from other characters.

I also think it maybe should be an opt-in thing. That shouldn't make any problems as if you select the person and it shows neither typing nor not typing, you'd know they haven't opted in and could choose if you wanted to wait to find out.

I shouldn't have gotten personal about Taya's post, so the subsequent irritations/defenses/misunderstandings are my own fault.  Next time I will respond to ideas/thoughts, not the person posting them (yes, ok, easy to say and obvious anyway, but need to remind myself at times).

If you can manage this, it's appreciated (very, very much so). But, as you seem to have no wish to make amends with me despite going above and beyond in your efforts with others, it's hard for me to feel much good will. I still feel you very much misinterpreted me at several points and that you have built up an opinion of me that is completely undeserved. I am very glad you apologised to Eredin, but your assumption that I am the sort of person who makes alts to defend myself with still seems to stand, and I find that more than a little offensive. If I am wrong, please correct my thinking in this.

Thank you for acknowledging that you should not have got personal, but it does go a little deeper than this and I would rather have this fixed to avoid issues in the future if it's in any way possible.

Okay. 

I wasn't going to post more in this thread because I didn't see it leading anywhere constructive and my opinion there hasn't really changed. But the portions of the community who seem to find this kind of attack acceptable completely sicken me, and because I am 'still' having this directed at me, even after what Pierre called my 'calm diffusive' reply to his original attack, I will say my piece.

I have a problem with the way Taya interacts with people who criticize and how he or she thinks about events.

I think you have a problem with polite discussion when it doesn't immediately follow your chain of thoughts and that you like dishing out accusations and then react poorly when people give back. (Note how much personally directed negatively from your side it's taken before I direct any back at you personally in turn.)

Now tell me, why is it a bad thing to point out that prospects are more likely to get a good or bad experience depending on what they expect and how they present themselves? Are you expecting me to sugar-coat the whole experience so that people who have the wrong expectations will join? Do you realise that the reason some prospects are less than satisfied is because of the expectations they start with? Did you pay any attention to where I pointed out that it is completely possible to have a positive experience by contributing? Did you notice that I advised discussion and noted that there are things prospects should get back from the team in turn?

If your opinion about me is shared and others feel I truly deserve your attack, I will gladly step down from my position and leave the game.

I was clear that I have no problem with other devs, and in fact apologized in advance to them.

Yet oddly, I doubt you'd find many who disagree with my stance, if any. You do seem to have an issue with Eredin as well and he's one of the most active devs.

Whoever "Eredin" is, if not Taya, is out of line to make a new forum identity to bash me and stick up for someone said explicitly that she can take criticism.

Your apologies about your level of harshness are completely worthless when you immediately spring into a new accusation like this. I am not Eredin. Eredin is an established and long term member of the PS community who has tirelessly contributed to the game in return for far too little acknowledgement from the playerbase. But he gets on with it and continues to make the game better whenever he is able to, regardless of what's thrown at him.

Is it a requirement to have an existing account in order for him to give his opinion here and do you think that everyone who reads the forum has made an account? There are a lot of people who only speak up when they feel a need to do so and don't often feel the need. I'd assume that's the case here; he finally had something he wanted to say, so made one.

Also:
Just because someone can handle criticism, does that mean they should not get an apology where deserved?

If you were offended and wanting to demand an apology, Taya, better to say it to me up front and not have other devs coming in here for one post identities to do the dirty work.

If this is meaning to imply that Eredin is a 'dev alt' who was hiding his ID to comment under my request, you are misguided. I didn't ask him to post and that's his main ID. If you have any doubts, go and check the listing of team members.

As for 'demanding' an apology - I don't feel any real need to. I find your manner of discussion insulting, negative, derogatory and generally unwanted and undeserved and, though you occasionally seem to veer back to the more reasonable, I have absolutely no faith that any apology from you would be sincere in any way at all. You seem to consistently jump to the worst possible conclusion, suspecting me of negative and deceptive action based on... what? I feel it's a pity, because if you learned to be constructive in your approach you could probably make a difference here.

I'm interested in engaging with players who want to make the game better - not with players who are out to attack me and/or any other dev or GM. To the first group, I am and have been willing to give as much spare time as I have available. I'm also generally the one who is calling for criticism and feedback for the teams and have actively fought for greater acknowledgement of the work done by prospective developers. But when 'criticism' crosses the line from constructive to insulting, I really rather have no part in it.

So my cards are on the table. My goal is to help this game and make it better for the players. If Pierre is correct and the game would be better without me, let me know and I'll be gone. There is no point me being here if I am indeed the thing that makes people not want to help.

With that said, apologies for the long post. I've no interests in prolonging this discussion anymore and it's already 'too much' for me because it's not what I'm here for.

Based on my experiences - I've seen development prospects walk in and do well and gain from the experience. I've also seen people walk in and quite quickly and easily change the direction of certain things. And then on the other hand I've seen prospects who annoy everyone because they make judgements without seeing the whole picture and because they seem to think they are better than and know more about the game than anyone else. Does this mean their criticism is 100% useless or misplaced? No. There are issues and there will always be issues because [insert all the things others have already said] and some of them may be possible to improve on. But generally there is a time and a way to communicate those issues and, if it's not done well, it shouldn't be too surprising if a dev limits their communication with people who are basically telling them "everything you're doing is wrong and even though I've only been here a day I clearly know better than you so change everything!" (Exaggeration yes, but it should give the idea.)

In the end, so much is down to how a person presents things.

If you want to help you should be:
1 - realistic about your expectations. Don't expect immediate access to everything or to be given ultra important projects to work on right away. But do expect to be given a fair chance to become useful and to see your work in game if you stick with it.
2 - honest about how much time you have and what we should expect from you. It's completely possible to contribute even if you don't have much free time, but it's best if the devs know this in advance when possible.
3 - cooperative. You usually won't change things unless you work with and then from within them. If you want to change how something is done, approach it slowly and be positive. Remember everything is a two way process. Suggestions and criticisms should be possible from either side so long as they are presented politely.

I recommend spending some time talking to one of the devs in the area you might be interested in before committing as well. Find out if it works for 'both' sides before jumping in. I've known a lot of people who have said they'd love to help but they are scared they won't be good enough or worried they don't have enough time - but you won't know this unless you look into it.


Closing note, just so that false impressions aren't left to stand as fact - IRC and forums are not the only tools used by the developers. Just because access to everything isn't handed out immediately doesn't mean nothing else is ever used.

Eonwind - Yes, I think those changes should help.

I've been playing since late 2008 and never heard anyone laugh for receiving pp and tria.  If you have seen this happen, honestly, then ok.  But I find it hard to believe.

I've seen it happen, regardless of whether you find it hard to believe. Quite likely for the reasons you explain yourself - experienced characters don't need these rewards, and the vast number of characters attending are often those who have been around a long time. Which again, doesn't mean we'll never include pp as a reward, but it's just not going to be automatic thing to get in every event.

I'm also in 100% agreement with Eonwind. I'm certainly not going to announce rewards in advance and I don't think any of the others will. (As a side note, there are a few players who dislike any aspect of events being pre-announced, including even announcing that there will be an event at all. Again, this might be hard for some people to believe, but for others it breaks the immersions/in character-ness of events.)

For the guide, it might be good to add more about what a player should or should not expect from an event in terms of reward. Just to make sure players won't get the impression that there will always be one or will always be a certain thing they'll get.

Random additional note: no GM's player character ever gets a thing for helping out, tria, pp or otherwise. This also extends to players who are official helpers in a GM event. Please remember this if you don't like a reward.

A reward isn't guaranteed. And even when there is one, there's no guarantee it will be something any particular player wants or finds useful (though hopefully it will be to some). Sadly pleasing every single player who attends is almost certain to be impossible, so we don't try and do it.

The current pattern is to reward a certain amount of tria to all participants, and then, depending on the event, a limited number of players may be given an additional reward. This isn't something anyone should expect though. A reward isn't the point of events and sometimes it won't be appropriate to give one, depending on what happens during the event itself.

I think I will add a few points briefly.

1.
It wasn't only Sarko's decision to handle things any certain way. A GM doesn't just make a decision this large all by themselves - they talk about it between themselves and often with whichever developers are available at the time as well.

2.
The guards did not just materialize out of thin air and arrest Magitex. That is the first most players will have seen of it, and certainly the first many will have heard of it due to how vocal he became in gossip, but there was a whole chain of RP involving several players who had been hurt by the theft.

I've sat and checked up with a few people and gathered the facts, so that I can show there was RP behind it all:

The guards inspected the house lock for damage and concluded it was either a very skilled thief or someone with a key since there was no damage. They then interviewed members of the guild and requested a list of all key bearers. They asked if anyone had suspicions about who was to blame. They asked if anyone on that list had been acting suspiciously.

Magitex's name came to light at this point in the RP due to his strong stance against the feelings of the rest of his guild at the economic council meeting.

The guards then also collected a list of items that had been stolen based on the memories of the victims. Merchants were then asked if anyone had attempted to sell them these items, closest merchants to the house first.

Logs were only looked at to then confirm if these trades took place or not for a given NPC. NPCs are real individuals as far as anything IC is concerned. Otherwise they could not buy items or give you items in a quest. It doesn't matter if they don't usually have actual players behind them. From an in character perspective, no character would understand what IC or OOC or a player character even is.

There were also no opportunities generated by Magitex for anyone to gain RP interaction with him, though I guess he will argue with this as well. This is very different, either way,  from the type of 'bad guy' RP I've seen from characters like Rigwyn who are willing to be caught and who are even willing to lose when it makes sense to do so.

With all that said, I think Magitex got off very lightly here.


[edits only for silly typos - I am not yet awake enough for good english]