Author Topic: Some observations  (Read 5518 times)

Aiwendil

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Re: Some observations
« Reply #45 on: August 13, 2010, 05:24:12 pm »

Roled

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Re: Some observations
« Reply #46 on: August 13, 2010, 05:31:17 pm »
8-15-10
Friends and PS Community:  MY APOLOGY and CLARIFICATION

It was brought to my attention that some folks may have inferred meanings from my original post that I didn’t intend. Specifically some think, from reading my post, that I was accusing Eelin of the issues in my items two and three. That wasn’t and isn’t my intention at all.

My first comment was in direct response to Eelin’s post.   I still believe it to be true that role plays change, no matter how much planning happens, and that there was never an OOC plan or agreement to include torture or rape in our engagement rp. Eelin and I and I think everyone else involved concur on that. It wasn’t planned.

My second and third comments DO NOT refer to Eelin/ Ahriman. I am truly sorry if anyone has drawn that conclusion. I did not intend to accuse Eelin or his player, or anyone specific, of these issues. I meant my comments about using rape as entertainment as general comments. I meant my questions as to 'do we know who we play with' as general questions, as cautions to us all as responsible people.

I am truly sorry to you, Eelin, that you have borne the brunt of this misconstruing of my general meanings.

Comment 3 was also meant as a general comment. Please don’t assume that I was calling anyone a predator. That is certainly not what I meant. My comment was about generally behaving as caring and humane people.

Finally I am retracting my entire comment about my PS virtual character being ‘nice to slime buckets’ because that was taken wrong too apparently.  Roled as you know is a goodie two shoes mostly. I am sorry for any hurt feelings I have caused by his spouting off and bluster. And for my responsibility as his player for allowing him to do so.

 I do stand by my final sentence in the original post.

Please let’s act like human beings and not sociopaths.

On that note I apologize again, to Eelin, to anyone I have offended in character or ooc, through my flawed humanness and my mistakes. I am truly, truly sorry for any mistakes I have made, any untrue rumors about anyone especially Eelin, and any hurt players have borne from me opening my mouth.

And as I told Eelin today, Please know that everything I have said, I said out of a place of love and respect. I may be wrong in my assessment of the impact of what I was saying, and I may have been clumsy and unclear in my expression. But please know my intention was/is to contribute to making our little game world more loving and more respectful.

I am truly sorry for all the ways that I have failed in fulfilling my own intentions.

Sincerely,

Roled and
Roled’s player
***************************************************** Original post***************************************************

I have 3 comments:

1) It is unlikely that 'every IC action was agreed to OOCly before the rp' to paraphrase. Role plays go where they go- sometimes far afield from what was agreed on before hand by players. Roled was in on three group conversations planning certain parts of the 'engagement role play' which suddenly turned into a mind poisoning, torture including, rape including in game happening. That was NEVER EVER EVER agreed on OOCly. You know that. And you know, I would never ever agree to that as a basis of any story line I was helping with.

2) I have sisters irl and this is for them, and for me, in order to live in the rl world with some kind of humanity and honor. And to mirror rl emotions of our virtual characters.

It is totally unacceptable to tell people you are going to do one thing OOC, then push the limits of that into cybering, rape, harassment, abuse, torture, cruelty, under the illusion of IC actions. How old is the partner? Are you sure? Have they really agreed to that? Where is personal responsibility? Would a healthy person or healthy community or healthy respectful society use holocaust death camp actions for one's own 'fun' in a 'game'? If not then why on earth would one use rape as fun in a game?

It's the 'blame the victim' defense that I find reprehensible. ***edited***  I am honored that I have female character friends in this game, and I assume some of them to actually be female. Tho' I don't know. But think about it , who are the demographic playing this game? What is the likelihood that you DON'T HAVE ANY IDEA who that person is really, how old they are really, whether they are young but think they are old enough to handle a role play that turns a blurred line between IC and OOC.

3) It is the Responsibiliy of each of us to protect players from predators. Simple as that.

It is the responsibility of the GMs to act when THEY ARE TOLD BY PLAYERS about unacceptable OOC behavior. It is the responsibility of us as players to not tolerate any form of hatred and disregard of humanity. One cannot go around spouting racial slurs and expect to get away with it, IC or OOC. Neither should one expect to go around using and abusing women characters as objects or property or playthings for enjoyment. Be aware that sexual slavery is a real problem world wide. What if your little sister thought she was going to have a romantic picnic with some hunky avatar and then gets there and is instructed to take of her clothes, or do the bidding of this disembodied thing? Go to an adult chat room with a consenting adult and do that. Don't do it here.

**edited**

Act like human beings instead of sociopaths.

Roled Rolak
« Last Edit: August 15, 2010, 10:16:26 pm by Roled »
"RR is a PieSexual" ~ Monala

Illysia

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Re: Some observations
« Reply #47 on: August 13, 2010, 05:46:30 pm »
I agree, especially this part:

Act like human beings instead of sociopaths.

This is a place to act out things you can't necessarily do in RL; however, there is a line. It's is not an excuse to be a sociopath and get away with it. Somethings are unacceptable.

Sarva

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Re: Some observations
« Reply #48 on: August 13, 2010, 06:09:55 pm »
Speaking only as a single member of the GM team I feel ANY kind f rape RP is totally unacceptable. I don't care how much all the parties say it was planed, agreed to and consensual. I think if such an RP is brought to the attention of the GM team then everyone involved should be looking at a ban, especially if the details of the rape are acted out. Again just one GM's opinion but if need be I'll push hard that my view is acted on if the situation comes up.

verden

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Re: Some observations
« Reply #49 on: August 13, 2010, 06:54:54 pm »
OP keeps bringing up things that others did to obfuscate their own actions. Please try this tactic in a court of law to see how effective it is. The fact remains that running around pissing on things is not acceptable RP. Whatever others did is hearsay and not relevant to this specific incident. Apparently this sort of RP is condoned within your guild, so your guild is sharing the blame. That is the way that goes.

Zytorr

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Re: Some observations
« Reply #50 on: August 13, 2010, 08:26:14 pm »
Thank you Roled. you said it better than I so instead of emphsising this point I thank you.

Geoni

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Re: Some observations
« Reply #51 on: August 13, 2010, 10:09:52 pm »
This thread needs a sticky in the "What not to do" section, and what Roled said needs a highlight...hmm...there is no section in that name...


-sig by sarras

troyyer

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Re: Some observations
« Reply #52 on: August 13, 2010, 10:29:53 pm »
I have 3 comments:

1) It is unlikely that 'every IC action was agreed to OOCly before the rp' to paraphrase. Role plays go where they go- sometimes far afield from what was agreed on before hand by players. Roled was in on three group conversations planning certain parts of the 'engagement role play' which suddenly turned into a mind poisoning, torture including, rape including in game happening. That was NEVER EVER EVER agreed on OOCly. You know that. And you know, I would never ever agree to that as a basis of any story line I was helping with.

2) I have sisters irl and this is for them, and for me, in order to live in the rl world with some kind of humanity and honor. And to mirror rl emotions of our virtual characters.

It is totally unacceptable to tell people you are going to do one thing OOC, then push the limits of that into cybering, rape, harassment, abuse, torture, cruelty, under the illusion of IC actions. How old is the partner? Are you sure? Have they really agreed to that? Where is personal responsibility? Would a healthy person or healthy community or healthy respectful society use holocaust death camp actions for one's own 'fun' in a 'game'? If not then why on earth would one use rape as fun in a game?

It's the 'blame the victim' defense that I find reprehensible. "They all knew it was happening" Bull. I am honored that I have female character friends in this game, and I assume some of them to actually be female. Tho' I don't know. But think about it , who are the demographic playing this game? What is the likelihood that you DON'T HAVE ANY IDEA who that person is really, how old they are really, whether they are young but think they are old enough to handle a role play that turns a blurred line between IC and OOC.

3) It is the Responsibiliy of each of us to protect players from predators. Simple as that.

It is the responsibility of the GMs to act when THEY ARE TOLD BY PLAYERS about unacceptable OOC behavior. It is the responsibility of us as players to not tolerate any form of hatred and disregard of humanity. One cannot go around spouting racial slurs and expect to get away with it, IC or OOC. Neither should one expect to go around using and abusing women characters as objects or property or playthings for enjoyment. Be aware that sexual slavery is a real problem world wide. What if your little sister thought she was going to have a romantic picnic with some hunky avatar and then gets there and is instructed to take of her clothes, or do the bidding of this disembodied thing? Go to an adult chat room with a consenting adult and do that. Don't do it here.

Roled is tired of being nice to slime buckets. Roled has skills and mechanics.  

Act like human beings instead of sociopaths.

Roled Rolak

Well said Roled and i agree.

If i'm asked by Parents about their kids playing planeshift, i certainly can not recommend it...

Please let me add, that i really do not care what two adults are doing privately, as that is not my business.
« Last Edit: August 13, 2010, 11:36:14 pm by troyyer »

novacadian

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Re: Some observations
« Reply #53 on: August 14, 2010, 12:27:58 am »
Please let me add, that i really do not care what two adults are doing privately, as that is not my business.

Venorel care, because she is curious by nature.  ;D

troyyer

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Re: Some observations
« Reply #54 on: August 14, 2010, 03:46:55 pm »
Most everyone who knows Eelin also knows that I play Ahriman as well. He has been talked about a lot on the forums recently. For the record, Ahriman was created for the sole purpose of participating in a major RP. Every one of Ahriman's victims were volunteers and every one of them was given full reign to control the boundaries of the RP (eg. sex, rape, torture). There was never one incidence involving Ahriman's participation that was not discussed and agreed upon OOCly before it took place ICly.
And as Sarva pointed out, Ahriman did pay for one of his crimes, and he made a rather remarkable self-atonement for another. The point, RP crime has consequences and Ahriman is facing them.

First of all, thank you Eelin for your detailed explanation.

If i understand this correctly, and speaking in general, in certain situation one just creates an alt to rp weird stuff. If that alt gets punished, one laughs about it, logs on the main char and plays as if nothing happened...

Is that how this planeshift game works?

Eelin

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Re: Some observations
« Reply #55 on: August 14, 2010, 04:03:36 pm »
If i understand this correctly, and speaking in general, in certain situation one just creates an alt to rp weird stuff.

People play alts for lots of reasons, one being to RP different experiences and personalities that are inconsistent with their current character.
Qata says: Eelin, you know not of what you speek

troyyer

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Re: Some observations
« Reply #56 on: August 14, 2010, 04:08:37 pm »
Yes, and that is perfectly fine.

But if you create an alt for the short term and you use that alt to rp weird stuff it looks a bit fishy in my eyes.

Eelin

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Re: Some observations
« Reply #57 on: August 14, 2010, 04:18:12 pm »
But if you create an alt for the short term and you use that alt to rp weird stuff it looks a bit fishy in my eyes.

It's your right to have your own opinions and beliefs, as it is everyone's, and I will support your right with the same vigor as I would the next person's.
Qata says: Eelin, you know not of what you speek

troyyer

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Re: Some observations
« Reply #58 on: August 14, 2010, 04:23:34 pm »
I appreciate the way you contribute to this discussion, Eelin. At least, it seems to be possible to talk to you in a civilized manner.

We seem to agree to disagree in some areas. That's life.

Eelin

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Re: Some observations
« Reply #59 on: August 14, 2010, 04:35:26 pm »
I appreciate the way you contribute to this discussion, Eelin. At least, it seems to be possible to talk to you in a civilized manner.

We seem to agree to disagree in some areas. That's life.


Thank you, Troyyer. I took the time to respond to your original post hoping to answer your question. I'm the nicest guy in the world, and harbor no hate or resentment to anyone. Some have a tendency to attach Ahriman's actions and beliefs to me, the player. Ahri was just a character created for a plot...most definately evil, but most definately not me!
Qata says: Eelin, you know not of what you speek