PlaneShift
Gameplay => General Discussion => Topic started by: Xillix Queen of Fools on December 20, 2009, 05:04:55 am
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so let's see how you feel.
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snorx because i know not of this rp covthang
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I think this is it:
http://www.hydlaaplaza.com/smf/index.php?topic=34508.0
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Snorks, because honestly, I'm done caring. The forums, as we all know, are not an accurate representation of the actual ingame community. There is considerably less whining, and considerably more playing ingame. Not that the whining is ungrounded, it usually has some sort of basis in reality, but it compounds to the point in which I want to slap everyone for being annoying and stupid.
Now, let the whining commence!
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No.
Added: I recall my decision, I see that enforcement on bad RP would be ruinous, but enforcement on blatant non roleplay can be done with player reporting, as the lack of manpower is painfully obvious.
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meow!
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I voted no, but I think that as a whole we're closer to being sufficient than before.
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No, because rules without enforcement have no effect.
Sen
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I voted no for the following reasons:
1. The rules say nothing about godmoding ( If they do then I missed something or failed to find it )
- I think they should also state what godmoding is.
2. The rules need to be put in a very prominent place - perhaps on the splash screen in very condensed form
I think it would be good perhaps to have two sets of rules:
A. GM-enforced rules
- such as harassment, gaming the system, etc..
B. Player-enforced rules
- godmodding, ic/ooc confusion, poor rp in general
I don't think GM's should be burdened with the task of enforcing rules that pertain to RP. If someone godmods, says they are a pink and purple dragon, or confuses ic and ooc info or uses ooc info with the excuse that they are psychic then players can teach them, deal with them or ignore them. In this case the "player enforced rules" could be cited by them to support their argument.
If a player is flat out disruptive and its not just bad guy RP then yes, perhaps a GM could be asked for help.
It might also help to find out which rules people want added.
Just to make one thing clear - I do not support RP-NAZI-ISM, Eliteism, or /ignoring players for trivial reasons.
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They ARE in a very clear place, every new player will see them and these are the guidelines the community approved.
Enforcement depends on people reporting bad behavior, we can't be everywhere.
Godmodding is ALREADY included in the tips. Guidance is already a help. We don't have the time or people-power to enforce everything.
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I was kind of no and snorks (but I chose no) because I learned that the RP Covenant was there. But I usually skim cause I have a short attention span. And I don't really remember it so.....
Snorks.
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Yes - 23 (53.5%)
No - 8 (18.6%)
Snorks - 12 (27.9%)
Only posts from people who voted for 'no' or 'snorks' until now.
I voted for 'yes', because it is a good start in my opinion. We will have to wait and see if more needs to be done.
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I voted snorks, because this is just a stupid game, and anyone losing sleep over bad RP might have some issues...
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I voted snorks, because this is just a stupid game, and anyone losing sleep over bad RP might have some issues...
Well said.
It's just a role playing game, with the development team attempting to set rules for role playing. It's so stupid.
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Since my account is still alive;)..
I voted snorks, because this is just a stupid game, and anyone losing sleep over bad RP might have some issues...
I did not vote, since I am about to lose interest about thinking PS is not really as much focused on RP as it claims to be - this statement of Vannaka's however, I think is one of those rather (meanwhile) stereotype ones regarding the particular question, worthless and without any substance. Of course I would vote for Yes, because if I would look around for some pure roleplaying game (which is why I am here in the first place) I would like to find myself in an environment that it was described to be. I would be shaking my head if I was in a strategy game whereas the same game was advertized to be the one and only unique and special one first person shooter!
No, I am not losing my sleep. I want to find a roleplaying game which provides with the atmosphere that was announced. In contrary, looking for another MMORPG I might be satisfied as I find it in PS right now, but then again graphics cant stand the competition. Before I would be losing my sleep I would just move along to another game, of which there are plenty. And, honestly and maybe without being able to not sound rude, your attitude, Vannaka as a PS regular, makes me wonder if PS really is the type of mature and reasonable RPG that I am looking for.
Xil you might hate me and I give a shit, but really.. reconsider "your" game's definition and your strategy, saying: Hell yes, include a "mandatory covenant". Back in the days there were less people knowing about PS, and the ones involved experienced a less defined setting for they created groupings like kingdoms (of purrty) or empires (of the dark) - no offense meant, all these people are or were great, awesome and whatnot, but times changed, things evolved and wheeled forth. Setting is more detailedly defined now, as it will continue, and more people apparently are attracted. And with each more single player attracted you might want to question the motivation - why do people want to join? Because it simply is free?
When I joined years back I read PS was striving for becoming a very special game, a roleplaying game. What has become of it nowadays? Graphics improved a bit, content was added a lot.. but not a single hint changed about its RP component. Nowadays there are even dead fried fish talking, officially approved, like in some hilarious kiddies anime series.
If my vote would bring any change towards PlaneShift becoming really RP focused, I would vote for Yes.
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I voted snorks because I don't think anyone is really going to care about this.
All the people who think RP in PS should be governed by a cabal are wrong.
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I don't hate you. I hope you find what you are looking for elsewhere, or stop complaining and MAKE it here.
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For months and years I tried to add providing atmosphere by planning plots hosted for involving other players.
Recently I attempted to revive the "Covenant" thread and it gets locked since you apparently dont care?
MAKE it here
Means? (Of course this cant but has to be understood rhetorically.)
I hope you find what you are looking for elsewhere
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For months and years I tried to add providing atmosphere by planning plots hosted for involving other players.
Recently I attempted to revive the "Covenant" thread and it gets locked since you apparently dont care?
MAKE it here
Means? (Of course this cant but has to be understood rhetorically.)
I hope you find what you are looking for elsewhere
I recall my 'No' and input a 'Yes'. I know now that it's a 'community effort' and the development team can only go so far in enforcing roleplay. Players who act in clear, non-RPs on Laanx can and are dealt with by Game Masters. Players making roleplays considered lesser or insufficient to some standard should be gently pushed in the right direction by the community.
Raekh: You're deleting your account, just as Lhaa and Aiwendil did, you're basically throwing your last thoughts before you leave. You aren't going to make anything better, or work for anything to improve the game, BUT YOU ARE JUST LEAVING AFTER WHINING.
Whats the point?
None at all.
I don't hate you. I hope you find what you are looking for elsewhere, or stop complaining and MAKE it here.
Means? (Of course this cant but has to be understood rhetorically.)
It means if you're going to be part of the community and aren't just going to whine, that he would like you to do something about it.
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The covenant is now IN GAME as it was agreed to. Every new player will see it.
I instigated the OSP events for rpers to have a chance to own property and use it.
I added many bits of advice on proper rp to the server tips.
I hire more rp oriented gms so policing botting wasn't the only task gms do and events became a greater focus.
I did all of this to please the rp crowd.
The team built a second server for non-rpers, and has banned many distracting players.
All of these efforts have met with more criticism, demands that we go further.
PlaneShift is made by a team of developers, not all of them agree with very strict rules, and we simply don't have the people-power to police rp in the way that SOME people seem to want it done.
We are talking about many many man-hours of work, hours of people's lives, that they'll never get back, that they aren't compensated for in any way.
I wish people could take a step back and realize how demanding they sound. Instead of complaining about the state of the game, team up and train new people, HELP something because all the QQ isn't helping anyone, and more importantly it isn't helping YOU realize the game you want to see.
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I'm going to follow bloodyIrishguy's move and switch to yes.
All you RPers who say that the devs and GMs don't do enough, look what happened when Naimon and Vvallace griefed the server (at seperate times)? They were banned. People who do not adhere to the simple RP rules on Laanx and are reported are warned, kicked and banned.
Policing the quality of RP past this point is wrong and elitist.
</rant>
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I vote yes as the only other thing left to do is be thought police and we all know how well that goes. ::)
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Yes - 23 (53.5%)
No - 8 (18.6%)
Snorks - 12 (27.9%)
Only posts from people who voted for 'no' or 'snorks' until now.
I voted for 'yes', because it is a good start in my opinion. We will have to wait and see if more needs to be done.
hey, "meow" means yes in sarrasaur!
and in case a few whiny roleplayers forgot, there's this /report feature... if you see something, report it. no one follows guidelines anyway. or laws irl. hence we have police. you report lawbreaking to them.
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I start to wonder what the point of the poll is, if only one opinion is allowed.
When I say I would like to see the rules enforced doesn't it mean, that I demand the gms to be everywhere at anytime. At this point I only said I would like to see the rules enforced. (there is a full stop). Now, to go a step further, I refer to some other thread where it was suggested to use petitions as first step in enforcement. So the question for me is, if petitions can be a good way, or if there is a better way.
Sen
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Please consider this.
My character was just leaving Gug, walking down the ramp, when he sees several people all running about. They seem to be running to get out of the path of a rogue Dlayo gladiator. My character kills the gladiator, then gets yelled at by someone for messing something up, then witnesses a bit of over-sensationalized violence pretending to be RP (yuk), asks about the Dlayo and gets no response (except through a tell later with a comment that they were too bust RPing to pay attention to my character), then later when back at the Stonehead tavern hears one of those RPers shout "bye guys where ever you are re i gtg:)!" in main.
not much fun,
but then
I have found some of the best RP to be spontaneous, in which my character just happens to play a part (sometimes big, sometimes small), but makes a difference in the story. ...and these are not found on the forums, they are special stories, enjoyed by those involved and maybe told to others. The best are just being somewhere at some moment and making a difference, changing the story and only being a piece of it.
so "rules"?, well let's just have some fun, keeping it within the settings and considering everyones story can be just as enjoyable.
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I have found some of the best RP to be spontaneous, in which my character just happens to play a part (sometimes big, sometimes small), but makes a difference in the story. ...and these are not found on the forums, they are special stories, enjoyed by those involved and maybe told to others. The best are just being somewhere at some moment and making a difference, changing the story and only being a piece of it.
This, this and this. I couldn't agree more. But I don't see how that's an argument against RP rules.
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I voted "yes", as the "covenant" seems to me to be a very strong suggestion as to how we play our character. I am still fairly new, and need help; the characters that help me in game by role-playing add charm (and relief). They also help teach me how to role-player, by example.
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Do you not have sufficient rules in real life to live by and be controlled by ?
Lets see, WHY do I play a game ?
1. Main reason to have fun.
2. To get away from real world rules.
3. Do others around me have fun when I play? I like to think so, as I try my best not to upset anyone, and be nice and helpful.
4. Do I RP, yes in my own way, [Point to note here, there are many ways to RP] trying to fit in with the settings and not god modeing, as that is a lame excuse for bad RP.
5. If I feel my character should die in a RP, then he does.
6. IF a player asks me for or to give advice, I listen and see if I can give advice.
7. Would rules for RP make me want to stop playing, SORRY but yes it I probably would, reason; My way is not always the right way, but I get along with almost all I talk to, as well as them getting along with me, so as I show respect for others and they me, so I see no need for rules at all, and I think the covenant is a good guide line to follow.
As for how YOU can help the GMs police bad RP, report and petition the offending player, that way with a brief detail the GM can go to the report and see what was said. [On report the last five minutes are logged, so please use it]
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Voted snorks because PS is a game and more players makes it better. Extra rules will just make more play on EZPCUSA when there is eventually a wipe.
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More players is not always better. Quality players makes it better. There are plenty of lax-rules games out there to bring in the most idiots that PS does not need to become another just so the idiots have something to play.
The 'rules' are pretty straight forward. Act like an idiot, get booted.
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Personally I do not understand this. Isn't a game supposed to be fun? How many rules can a game have and still be fun? Especially when it comes to role play that takes creativity and should have freedoms to do so. That is what role playing is all about. Is not role play the development of a character within the 'world' you have created?
Why all the conflict? People of like minds should role together. That would make the conflicts stop and make it more enjoyable for everybody.
Many seem to leave this game unhappy of where it is heading. Maybe something should be rethought here.
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Personally I do not understand this. Isn't a game supposed to be fun? How many rules can a game have and still be fun? Especially when it comes to role play that takes creativity and should have freedoms to do so. That is what role playing is all about. Is not role play the development of a character within the 'world' you have created?
Why all the conflict? People of like minds should role together. That would make the conflicts stop and make it more enjoyable for everybody.
Many seem to leave this game unhappy of where it is heading. Maybe something should be rethought here.
I concur. Some people on this forum and who play PlaneShift are unwilling to accept that there are people with philosophies that conflict with their own.
I'd like to label them all, but not in such a way that violates Godwin's Law.
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There are two servers precisely to get differing philosophies their own play field to enjoy their own distinct play style.
In other games I have played people make elaborate player made videos to mock rpers, I'd like to see the ezpcusa people gather resources to make things like that a reality, because it is fun.
The rpers on Laanx should be happier with the changes we added to Laanx, but we'll see.
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Personally I do not understand this. Isn't a game supposed to be fun? How many rules can a game have and still be fun?
Have you ever played a card game? Without rules, playing cards aren't much fun. Using them to build pyramids is about the only thing you can do with them without any rules. Even sorting needs the rules in which order they go. Game rules are what makes them fun. And different sets of rules can lead to very different kinds of games. Some of them require a lot of understanding, others don't need much of an intellect.
I think more complex rules don't necessarily mean restriction, or less fun. They just establish a different kind of game.
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Pardon, I was speaking of role play based on creativity and imagination that should have no boundaries nor rules if it is true role play of course. Very different from a card game so it cannot be compared, I believe.
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There are two servers precisely to get differing philosophies their own play field to enjoy their own distinct play style.
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The rpers on Laanx should be happier with the changes we added to Laanx, but we'll see.
That's not really what I meant, I think there are conflicting philosophies even between roleplayers. Making more rules cannot solve such conflicting views because these are personal issues. It's up to the players to find a suitable troll bridge that makes the two sides come together, not the people who run the game.
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I find the biggest problem is adherence to Settings....
PlayerX: "I don't have to follow the law, I can duel in Hydlaa, they won't do anything and even so, what has the Octarchy done for me?"
PlayerX: "Our guild comes from XYZFantasyland, where we run the place."
PlayerX: "I killed a great dragon, and wear it's tooth around my neck."
As more and more Settings info becomes available, the expectancy laid upon RPers and guild masters to make things stick to Settings grows greater.
The typical 'lol', 'lmao', 'brb'.... it's gotten to the point where I just mentally ignore them with ease. Seeing non-Settings RP just trashes my experience.
@Tuxide: I agree with your view, but the covenant is more about drawing a line, not about favouring one view over another. Distinguishing RP from non-RP properly.
@Happy: You've obviously never played D&D, Warhammer, or other games. Taking out the rules leaves everything absolutely open for abuse, godmodding and crap. It's like the concept of anarchy, it just cannot work because there's always a griefer.
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What are the "conflicting philosophies" between role players?
What would be a "suitable troll bridge" that makes the two sides come together?
If you wish to have all on the same page then the people who run the game must be agreeable also. Is this not a team effort?
Yes I have enjoyed role play games with little or no conflict between players.
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I find the biggest problem is adherence to Settings....
PlayerX: "I don't have to follow the law, I can duel in Hydlaa, they won't do anything and even so, what has the Octarchy done for me?"
PlayerX: "Our guild comes from XYZFantasyland, where we run the place."
PlayerX: "I killed a great dragon, and wear it's tooth around my neck."
As more and more Settings info becomes available, the expectancy laid upon RPers and guild masters to make things stick to Settings grows greater.
The typical 'lol', 'lmao', 'brb'.... it's gotten to the point where I just mentally ignore them with ease. Seeing non-Settings RP just trashes my experience.
@Tuxide: I agree with your view, but the covenant is more about drawing a line, not about favouring one view over another. Distinguishing RP from non-RP properly.
@Happy: You've obviously never played D&D, Warhammer, or other games. Taking out the rules leaves everything absolutely open for abuse, godmodding and crap. It's like the concept of anarchy, it just cannot work because there's always a griefer.
This covers it.
The covenant doesn't restrict roleplay, its necessary so everyone can have a good time and know whats fine and what isn't.
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I find the biggest problem is adherence to Settings....
PlayerX: "I don't have to follow the law, I can duel in Hydlaa, they won't do anything and even so, what has the Octarchy done for me?"
Exactly the attitude, every psycho, NRA activist and afghanian warlord has. Why again, can't this be the choice of my role to play? Oh, btw. duelling in public places is/was not allowed in western societies for centuries - Nobody cared though. Ever read a book by Alexandre Dumas ("Three Musketeers" for example)? The adventures of Casanova? Maybe seen a western movie with a shoot out at high noon on main street? For historical reference: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Duel#Opposition_to_duelling
And don't even get me started on bar brawls.
The world is not full of law abiding citizens and the Octarchy, though being powerful, does not have the means, modern police has to enforce the law. Besides, the ever so holy roleplay, which is hold in ever such high regard on this game has, by definition, something to do with character development. Character development may very well include conflict (in fact, it is the spice in an otherwise dull character). If my character was to encounter the murderer of my family in the tavern, boasting about how he dealt with my sister, you can count on me not asking him politely to step outside the city gates, so we can "discuss" the matter in a lawful manner. This would be outright silly, pointless in terms of roleplay and serve no purpose beyond satisfying the whims of some rule fetishists!
PlayerX: "Our guild comes from XYZFantasyland, where we run the place."
PlayerX: "I killed a great dragon, and wear it's tooth around my neck."
The fact, that dragons do not exist on planet earth did not keep the brothers Grimm from writing fairy tales about them. The fact, that nobody ever set foot on the moon till 1969 did not keep Jules Verne from writing a novel about it, almost 100 years earlier. The fact, that Bigfoot does not exist does not keep souvenir shops from peddling kitsch, supposedly made out of bigfoot bodyparts to tourists. In medieval times, it was en vogue to sell narwhal tooth as unicorn horn and chicken bones as relics from saints, nobody had ever heard about (at least not until the fat friar told the story, he just invented). Superstitious people attribute ever squeak in the middle of the night to a poltergeist and see phantoms in every blurry shape. Weather balloons turn into extraterrestrial spacecrafts and crop circles into messages from aliens, if mixed with a bit of media spin.
Hollywood even turned it into a whole industry to "go against the settings" of planet earth.
Heavens forbid, that we ever use our imagination, when roleplaying! The idea, that Player X could either be a complete lunatic, an honest, but gullable idiot or bullshitting the hell out of everyone for personal gains is obviously too far fetched.
The typical 'lol', 'lmao', 'brb'.... it's gotten to the point where I just mentally ignore them with ease. Seeing non-Settings RP just trashes my experience.
Something, that trashes my experience is, when someone forces me to step out of my role of being a complete lunatic, an honest, but gullable fool or bullshitting the hell out of everyone and I have to have an [ooc discussion of what narrow minded people consider to be acceptable and what not].
@Tuxide: I agree with your view, but the covenant is more about drawing a line, not about favouring one view over another. Distinguishing RP from non-RP properly.
@Happy: You've obviously never played D&D, Warhammer, or other games. Taking out the rules leaves everything absolutely open for abuse, godmodding and crap. It's like the concept of anarchy, it just cannot work because there's always a griefer.
The rules of (A)D&D and others are, that you throw a Dwhatever, add a bit of something and look the result up in table soandso. You might be surprised, that such rules exist in Planeshift in terms of game mechanics, enforcing pretty well, whether you hit something or not. The game mechanics, by the way, can or rather could be used to stop people from godmodding. Just make the whole world open PVP and I guarantee you, nobody will be godmodding a blade of the dragon slayer in my presence (at least not without that being put to the test).
It is actually your precious little covenant (which btw. was agreed upon in the same way, that it was agreed upon to build a bypass through Arthur Dents house: By only asking those who wanted it and ignoring the voices of those who didn't), which allows all kinds of crap, abuse and godmodding. It is the perfect excuse for people running around, bullying and threatening other people to "roleplay" (in which "roleplay" means "whatever I consider it to be"), demanding that they sheath their weapons in the city (sure thing, if there is an armed and dangerous guy walking down the street, the sanest thing to do is stepping up to him and demanding him to follow the law, which he is obviously ignoring on purpose for whatever reason) and generally educating people about what they think is good and right, but which they obviously never wasted much thought about.
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to add to all the law stuff, how come when your bein chased by a guard they can just freaze you? why dont they just chase you like youd expect them to? i've only been chaswed by a guard once, the rest freazed me...
ah the guard days...
havnt been to bad fer the past few months
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[...]
I think I love you.
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Exactly the attitude, every psycho, NRA activist and afghanian warlord has. Why again, can't this be the choice of my role to play?
You don’t have to follow the law, but if you make a character that permanently kills someone, you have to be ready to face the consequence. That if you get caught you will be permanently killed and cant whine about it.
The fact, that dragons do not exist on planet earth did not keep the brothers Grimm from writing fairy tales about them. The fact, that nobody ever set foot on the moon till 1969 did not keep Jules Verne from writing a novel about it, almost 100 years earlier. The fact, that Bigfoot does not exist does not keep souvenir shops from peddling kitsch, supposedly made out of bigfoot body parts to tourists. In medieval times, it was en vogue to sell narwhal tooth as unicorn horn and chicken bones as relics from saints, nobody had ever heard about (at least not until the fat friar told the story, he just invented). Superstitious people attribute ever squeak in the middle of the night to a poltergeist and see phantoms in every blurry shape. Weather balloons turn into extraterrestrial spacecrafts and crop circles into messages from aliens, if mixed with a bit of media spin.
Hollywood even turned it into a whole industry to "go against the settings" of planet earth.
Heavens forbid, that we ever use our imagination, when roleplaying! The idea, that Player X could either be a complete lunatic, an honest, but gullable idiot or bullshitting the hell out of everyone for personal gains is obviously too far fetched.
The fact that dragons don’t exist in PS don’t stop you from writing stories about them, but like in the 1800 and in PS now, how many people do you think will believe you if you claim to have killed one??? none, but I’d read the book if a good story about one is written. It may even end up in Jayose's library.
There is no moon in PS, but feel free to write a book about flying off to one if you want, but you can’t claim to have been there, as it doesn’t exist.
If you want to make up some beastie and sell fake body parts to tourists to some fake tourist spot you make up, feel free, but don’t expect many to come.
The thing is that the PS world is rather small compared to earth, and there is nothing stopping you saying our guild use to rule the land where we came from but the fact is that the Octarch rule.
And with your whole comment on game mechanics allowing you to stop god modding, that could be god modding in upon its self. I’d like to point you to something timmothy wrote a while back.
It's kinda like "mechanics say who plays right" and those who play for other reasons, will sooner or later go.
It's the mechanics which say which kind of game it can be and dependant on that the "fitting" people are attracted.
No. You're actually, really, really wrong. It's an incomplete game, mechanics are extremely underdeveloped and still being worked out. Settings determine your character, not mechanics. For example. Settings allow me to avoid a magic spell that would one-hit me, then flee the scene to avoid a fight. Mechanics do not.
Someone maxes magic and armour and swords and dagger and axe and...and and and and....... and using that to play a dagger master sword wielding axe swinging dark way blasting crystal blinding ore melting fish grilling armour wearing poet is, well, ridiculous. and I’d like to point you to something Phinease wrote
How were things different ?
Well, as I mentioned above, things were more epic. Now the community is bigger and there's a lot more stuff going on, even if it's mostly lower quality. So it's hard for a really great idea or guild or whatever to stand out from the masses. Also with the game actually having mechanics now, it becomes hard for people to RP a powerful character without having the muscle to back it up. That's easiest for melee - oriented characters, but even for them it's not that easy. It's rare you'll find someone who roleplays well and also has a high-level character. Back then it was a little different, power was almost entirely political, or to put it another way, the community gave you power. You then wielded that power within your RP, possibly as direct skill in combat, but other people respected and fell in line with your RPed power because of your power within the community.
That is how I try and RP, acting strong because the people I RP with believe me to be strong, I don’t just RP strong as I’ve done the training. Though I do have the training to match the strengths that people see me as having.
(and a side note, guards dont chase you because they dont have too, because they have magic wands and can freeze you.)
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Last I remember: the covenant was supposed to be a guide of how to RP correctly, for those that have never RP'd. It is helpful to have a guide like this when venturing into something new. The versions of the 'covenant' that I have read are all good and fairly similar, it teaches people how to RP a well rounded character and how to interact with other players to create a fun interactive environment, regardless of what game/world you choose to play.
RPing is a skill, it takes time to get really good at it and to learn to divorce your RL self from your PS character(s) personality. Many people try to force stories to conform to what they want to happen, it takes practice and discipline to remember RPs do not always have the expected result (even when partially planned out in private OOC convos)...sometimes they do work out how we think they will. Many people new to RP don't realize one key to good RPing is remembering the good results and the bad results; play your character consist with the outcomes, so the character grows richer and deeper in personality.
@Irgendwer: I have no problem with people that want to peddle imaginary beast parts or wear them, but the RPer must have that idea in their head that their character is a con-artist, deluded/insane, easily fooled (at least for the questionable topic), etc. I have a feeling most of the people that do something like that, believe their character really "killed a dragon in Yliakum" because they didn't read the settings.
@Happy: The devs have worked very hard to create a unique world for us to play in, so yes it is important to follow the settings to the best of a players knowledge when creating RPs and a character's history. This is not a free-for-all. If your complaint is with the covenant, then read my opening line.
As Jacula mentioned in one of his topics, you do not have to be a perfect RPer to have fun. But I would add this, in my humble opinion: We should all be trying to raise our RP skills to the next level and showing good faith to stay within settings. Engage in RPs with other characters to support testing the boundaries of settings. Worlds that involve magic always have a lot of room for imagination without actually breaking the history/settings/theology of the world. RPs are sometimes about exceptional situations; exceptional situations create drama; drama creates personalities; personalities create unique characters; unique characters create variety during any RPs.
PS: Fast typers and wordy players, give time for other people to respond to what your character is saying or doing. Some people type slow, encounter lag, or need a moment to consider how their character will respond [some guilds use a 'pause' request]. This is a suggestion for smaller group RPs; larger RPs have a tendency to move faster, use your descretion.
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(and a side note, guards dont chase you because they dont have too, because they have magic wands and can freeze you.)
i really dont have to worry bout gaurds anymore, but them havin a magic wand that can freaze you halfway across town, dont you think thats kinda ridiculous?
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No, I don't.
You fought the law, and the law won.
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No, I don't.
You fought the law, and the law won.
you forgot this: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4-1Ihwt48EM
:P
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Thanks Shangsi for completely missing the point. How do you actually roleplay with that level text comprehension? The point was not, whether or not I can claim to have killed a dragon, but that I will immediately have people like bloodedIrishman, Akkaido Kivikar, you and a whole bunch of other self proclaimed "roleplayers" on my trail, which are so skilled in their chosen art of "roleplaying", that whining and complaining to game masters/the forum or lecturing the player in question, seems to be the only way you know how to deal with the situation.
Yes, I do understand, that there are genuine newbies, who are actually serious about wearing a dragon skull on their helmet, but know what,? I do not care about that at all. What I care about are "roleplayers" with a rule fetish. You know, that kind of people, who love to sleep with a AD&D source book (or an RP covenant for that matter) under their pillow, so they can lecture others like Brainy Smurf. I care about idiots, stepping up to me, because they feel the need to remind me of sheating my weapons (I don't do that, because the UI is sluggish and I don't want to remember equipping them again the moment, I hit attack on an ulbernaut). Thats the most dull, repetitive and pointless "roleplay" I am forced to do over and over again(it is especially annoying, since these idiots obviously never spend a single thought about where they want to go with their so called "roleplay"). I do especially care about idiots, feeling a need to report me to Game Masters for this and other things, they are too narrow minded to understand (unfortunately, most GMs I have had to deal with seem to be of the same breed).
That ill begotten covenant is not helping roleplay at all. It only gives squealers and know-it-alls an excuse to force their opinion on proper roleplay down every one elses throat. It actually stiffles roleplay to a point where any creativity is killed on the holy altar of settings. People are trained to think twice about everything they say, lest they offend someone. I for myself would not mind at all, if Darth Vader himself paid a visit to Hydlaa main square, if it was entertaining, because that is why I log in: to be entertained, not to watch some completely anemic, but totally conform "roleplay" about properly introducing yourself and then visiting the tavern as the only other option of doing something acceptable. I like the settings and it most certainly disturbs me, when they are violated. However, I do not complain about that like a crybaby. When someone approaches me, who has a dragon skull in his character description, I have all of these options:
* Completely ignore him
* At least ignore the dragon skull, if it is not actively brought to my attention
* Make an IC remark, that I never encountered such a creature in these lands (potentially confirm OOC, that this is indeed not a critter, living in this world).
* Simply go along with his story (if it is fun) and afterwards totally ignore, that the whole event took place in the first place. I do not consider my chatlog to be an epic work of poetry, that might only be filled with proper content and caption.
In any case, I do not need a covenant, to enforce what cannot be enforced, since it cannot be defined and only forces Game Masters to act at haphazard just to please an RP community, that is actually nothing but a liability to this game in terms of public relations. Or does anyone think the phrase "maybe this is not the right game for you", which is used ever so often by die hard "roleplayers" is actually a welcoming message? Does anybody think, that the attitude "covenant breakers can/will be dealt with" is particularly attractive? Especially, if it is peanuts, which can upset roleplayers and the tutorial leaves little doubt about that?
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Irgendwer, you are welcome to play on the other server and avoid this covenant entirely. It will be filling up surely as more people try out the game. I am sure the wild-west gaming over there will be entertaining.
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Irgendwer, you are welcome to play on the other server and avoid this covenant entirely. It will be filling up surely as more people try out the game. I am sure the wild-west gaming over there will be entertaining.
Actually, I do. I was forced back however, when appearantly ECPCUSA got the status of "just a test server" again. You might understand, that it is not particularly appealing to invest a lot of time into building a character, that can be trashed or become unavailable at or for any time. Sorry, Xillix, if you want us "powerlevelers" to leave Laanx, then give us the same guarantee for availability, that "roleplayer" have on Laanx for their precious, albeit boring books.
Also, while you are at it, please fix this attitude of ECPCUSA is the "other server", which is so rampant in these forums. It's belitteling and another reason not to switch, as it gives a feeling of discontinuety, which was only confirmed by your choice to prerelease v0.5 with the Laanx database there.
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We restored the DB on the other server as soon as we could.
You know I am sorry but we had need of the second server to test the new release.
I don't know what it is you want us to do, we are all volunteers working on donated gear.
The whole tone of your post isn't very friendly or understanding at all.
Ezpcusa is fully available to you now.
If you have issues as to how the release was handled, I highly encourage you to send a letter to Talad as executive decisions of that nature fall on him.
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Actually, I do. I was forced back however, when appearantly ECPCUSA got the status of "just a test server" again. You might understand, that it is not particularly appealing to invest a lot of time into building a character, that can be trashed or become unavailable at or for any time. Sorry, Xillix, if you want us "powerlevelers" to leave Laanx, then give us the same guarantee for availability, that "roleplayer" have on Laanx for their precious, albeit boring books.
Also, while you are at it, please fix this attitude of ECPCUSA is the "other server", which is so rampant in these forums. It's belitteling and another reason not to switch, as it gives a feeling of discontinuety, which was only confirmed by your choice to prerelease v0.5 with the Laanx database there.
Oh, wow, watch this boy rage. You'll be glad to know that Guild <Banker> has its old house back, the War on Pants continues, and Guild <Heroes> is pretty much dead.
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I still do not understand what all the fuss is about. Role play should be fun. It seems you people are at odds over it. Maybe instead of arguing over it some kind of agreement can be found. This covenant that was made seems unpopular to many. Is it possible to revise it to make the majority happier?
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The majority made the RP covenant.
The trouble is that debate isn't going into appropriate places. Here you have rpers arguing with Plers, instead of arguing in favor of their own server's situation. This is another of those endless debates with no positive outcome. If the tone doesn't change it will be locked.
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The majority made the covenant when? Do most of those players still play? If not should it possibly be revised as I mentioned before for a new set of players?
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We restored the DB on the other server as soon as we could.
You know I am sorry but we had need of the second server to test the new release.
I don't know what it is you want us to do, we are all volunteers working on donated gear.
The whole tone of your post isn't very friendly or understanding at all.
I am well aware of that. I am also well aware, of the fact, that in this community, everyone who does not subscribe to the "roleplay is holy" doctrine is considered to be a second class citizen at best and treated as such. If you are complaining about a lack of manpower in your voluntary effort, I might suggest thinking about how many potential volunteers you already lost, because you and others told them to "play somewhere else", which they happily did. And this is exactly the reason, why my tone is not very friendly or understanding at all. In all the time, I have been here, this community has taken every effort to drive people away and the dev team has always been happy to assist. The RP covenant only being the latest of these antics.
Do you guys actually think about, where PS could be today, if the game was more welcoming? And no, it is not welcomning, to just state, that everyone is welcome, if that is immediately qualified with "as long as your roleplay", without a definition of what "roleplay" is suppose to be (such a statement alone is a serious turn off to everyone, who does software development) and a threat, that you can be dealt with, if you do not follow the non-rules.
The thing I want you (as in "dev/gm team") to do, though I have no hope of that ever happening, is to stop catering to the idiots. Plain and simple. You managed to breed yourself an utmost vocal and utterly braindead community of people, who shoot themselves in their own foot with every wet dream they get fulfilled (anyone remember that time, where you had to mutually introduce yourself in order to not be labeled "Someone" in chat - Great roleplay feature!). With a little bit of sanity and throwing the moronic attitude of roleplaying is so holy, that it deserves no other place than the main chat over board, there would neither be a need for a covenant nor for a second server with relaxed rules (which as a statement is stupid to begin with, because the strict rules do not actually exist in any applicable way). In other words, what I expect you to do is to stop making PS a parody of "bacon of hope".
Here are some really easy ideas, that would instantly relief you of most of the quarrels:
* Scrap the covenant and rephrase the tutorial/loading screen hints. It's really basic psychology, that people are far more inclined to do something, if offered as an option instead of as a must. While at it, also clarify that [ooc bracket rule] to be a convention to be used only, when you have to step out of character and want to prevent missunderstandings. Make it perfectly clear, that Brainy Smurf behaviour will not be tollerated in the future (currently, it is encouraged).
* Make the whole world open PVP. Roleplay is about consequences, right? Can you think of a better consequence for bad roleplay, than to be beaten up for it? I run around all the time with weapons drawn and seriously, when someone steps up to me, to remind me of the law, he'd better be in a position to actually enforce it (alone or grouped with others). This also opens up a path for real roleplay.
* In order to keep people from grieving others with random PK, install a criminal system. Every player starts out with zero PK points. Whenever someone assaults someone with zero PK, s/he gets 5 points, another 5, if that aussault results in a kill and even more, if new players are attacked. Every character having PK points can be attacked without penalty and also be looted by everyone, once defeated. Only way to remove PK points is by paying heavy bribes to government chars or similar.
* Heck, man the guards occasionally and hunt PKers in the city down!
* Get RP out of main. Seriously, I mean it. The whoe idea of main being the RP chat is flawed to begin with. For once, roleplayers love to be among themselves anyway and second, one channel does not scale anyway. You cannot have two stories take place in the tavern at the same time, one including it being set on fire, while the other being about whatever you do upstairs. Instead of RP taking place in main, make use of story specific channels, everyone interested in can subscribe to. If you want it really fancy, put a glowing beacon in the air, stating "a story is going on here", which also provides the last 5 minutes of chatlogs for those who come in late. That will completely remove the need for any covenant. People can just choose their own style, instead of having own shoved down their throat.
* Give players the ability to flag themselves as either strict or casual roleplayers. That way the evil powerlevers can know ahead, who is an roleplayer and vice versa, allowing both groups to ignore each other.
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The development team has made the effort to create a relaxed server so that players who did not want to rp had a place that they can do so. It is not the case that the second server is for second class citizens and the development team as a whole has not taken a side on the rp vs. pler debate.
Ezpcusa is a server dedicated to players who do not like these rules. Laanx is a role-play server. We instituted this with the hope that the two types of players would finally separate and play happily in their own world, without having to argue with each other in this manner.
I simply don't understand the anger.
As for your long list of development decisions they have all been discussed and were decided against. Coding a PK system is not something we have the resources to handle at this time. You can however continue to enjoy ezpcusa as it is.
Thanks for your continued support.
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If you verbally abuse the people who consistently manage to mess up RP by going against every setting ever made, they will either sink (Leave the game) or swim (Learn to Rp right)
And don't tell me this is a bad method. I turned out Ok, didn't I? ;)
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lmao irgendwer i cN barely read what u wrote, but ur like one of those crazy radio tLk show conspirators hahaha
also dont type so much i cant read it now and woulfny hace bothered with full vision. freaking use paragrapjs
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...my tone is not very friendly or understanding at all.
No kidding.
Make the whole world open PVP. Roleplay is about consequences, right? Can you think of a better consequence for bad roleplay, than to be beaten up for it? I run around all the time with weapons drawn and seriously, when someone steps up to me, to remind me of the law, he'd better be in a position to actually enforce it (alone or grouped with others). This also opens up a path for real roleplay.
This also opens up a path for griefing. I've played games that were like this where the devs explicitly encouraged both role-playing and griefing through free-for-all PvP with looting, and it only really works if both sides can tolerate each other since these are obviously conflicting playing styles. Through your comments (as well as most people's on this forum) I get the impression that people who play this game in general don't have ANY tolerance towards other people's playing styles or philosophies. There is no way in hell this could happen in PlaneShift unless the such a shard wasn't RP-strict.
Furthermore, if everything you wanted did happen and your RP becomes ruined by someone, then you'll just come back here and rage some more.
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Locking choice made.
Enjoy PlaneShift Safely.
All threads with PLER VS. RP will be locked immediately in future, you have been warned.