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Technical Help: IN GAME bugs (after loading world) / Sausage maker
« on: March 29, 2006, 07:04:47 pm »
I strongly suspect a sausage maker would accept any part of any animal...
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General Discussion / The damage done in PS is excessive
« on: March 17, 2006, 03:56:58 pm »
I\'ve fallen down stairs and slided down slopes quite often - in my experience the worst you\'ll get are a few bruises.
So I would say the damage done in PS is excessive. When my character just started, I died from falling about a meter or so - I kid you not.
As for falling in the hills - people can - in RL that is - fall, slide and tumble considerable distances without dieing.
To sum it up: it\'s way too easy to accidentally die in PS. I think a game should make moving around a little safer than RL, instead of a real hazard, especially since you haven\'t got the same controls you have in RL, but are confined to a non-stereoscopic view and pressing buttons.
So I would say the damage done in PS is excessive. When my character just started, I died from falling about a meter or so - I kid you not.
As for falling in the hills - people can - in RL that is - fall, slide and tumble considerable distances without dieing.
To sum it up: it\'s way too easy to accidentally die in PS. I think a game should make moving around a little safer than RL, instead of a real hazard, especially since you haven\'t got the same controls you have in RL, but are confined to a non-stereoscopic view and pressing buttons.
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Wish list / Purge maps
« on: March 06, 2006, 01:07:53 pm »
I really like the \"keep maps in memory\" option. It makes gameplay generally a lot smoother and it solves most crashes (don\'t ask me why).
However, if you walk too far, for instance from the sewers to the other town, memory is so full that I need to exit and restart PS.
Is there a \"purge all maps except the one you\'re currently in\" command? There should be a way to automatically purge the oldest map(s) if memory use gets above a configurable amount.
However, if you walk too far, for instance from the sewers to the other town, memory is so full that I need to exit and restart PS.
Is there a \"purge all maps except the one you\'re currently in\" command? There should be a way to automatically purge the oldest map(s) if memory use gets above a configurable amount.
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Newbie Help (Start Here) / Auto-die?
« on: March 06, 2006, 01:02:56 pm »
Still, it would be a good idea to have everything that touches the bottom of the DR die automatically. It can be done using the Quake engine, so the PS devs can do that too. In fact, I really don\'t like the /die command. You shouldn\'t be able to take a poison pill and get something positive. I appreciate that it can be useful to compensate for bugs in the game, but let\'s make the /die command as useless as it can possibly be.
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Wish list / Climbing, etc.
« on: March 06, 2006, 12:49:55 pm »
More importantly, currently it is impossible to negotiate obstacles that are trivial in real life, because you can only jump.
Take for instance a ledge 1 m high. In real life you can easily climb it. In PS, the only way is to try to jump it, which won\'t work, because 1 m is a lot higher that way. Same holds for fences etc.
There are lots of low ledges that my character can\'t jump, but in RL could be negotiated in a single step...
It would also be nice if running starts had a more noticable effect. I know from experience that low fences that I couldn\'t possibly jump from stance, are trivial with a running start.
Also our characters seem to make it themselves very difficult by insisting that their legs point straight down at all times. That effectively makes all objects about 50 cm higher too.
I really liked Zelda\'s way of jumping. For the uninitiated: there is no jump key, but your character jumps automatically when needed. It sounds very odd, but it works very good. Also in Zelda you could climb stuff.
I\'m not arguing that PS should be like Zelda, because it shouldn\'t. But at some things Zelda just does a wonderful job. The interface was very clean and intuitive too.
Take for instance a ledge 1 m high. In real life you can easily climb it. In PS, the only way is to try to jump it, which won\'t work, because 1 m is a lot higher that way. Same holds for fences etc.
There are lots of low ledges that my character can\'t jump, but in RL could be negotiated in a single step...
It would also be nice if running starts had a more noticable effect. I know from experience that low fences that I couldn\'t possibly jump from stance, are trivial with a running start.
Also our characters seem to make it themselves very difficult by insisting that their legs point straight down at all times. That effectively makes all objects about 50 cm higher too.
I really liked Zelda\'s way of jumping. For the uninitiated: there is no jump key, but your character jumps automatically when needed. It sounds very odd, but it works very good. Also in Zelda you could climb stuff.
I\'m not arguing that PS should be like Zelda, because it shouldn\'t. But at some things Zelda just does a wonderful job. The interface was very clean and intuitive too.
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Technical Help: Problems BEFORE entering the game / A short log
« on: March 01, 2006, 03:24:39 am »
I\'m going to try the manual update in a minute. Here is a short log that might at least tell us why it didn\'t quit with a nicer error message.
In module vfs:
--(probable start of function)--
10007d80 56 push esi
10007d81 57 push edi
10007d82 8bf0 mov esi,eax
10007d84 a17cc00110 mov eax,[vfs!csVFS_Create+0x181ec (1001c07c)]
10007d89 83cfff or edi,0xffffffff
10007d8c 3bc7 cmp eax,edi
10007d8e 7523 jnz vfs!csVFS_Create+0x3f23 (10007db3)
10007d90 8b0dd0c20110 mov ecx,[vfs!csVFS_Create+0x18440 (1001c2d0)]
10007d96 8b01 mov eax,[ecx]
10007d98 688c9d0110 push 0x10019d8c
10007d9d ff5050 call dword ptr [eax+0x50]
10007da0 68e0170010 push 0x100017e0
10007da5 a37cc00110 mov [vfs!csVFS_Create+0x181ec (1001c07c)],eax
10007daa ff1578c00110 call dword ptr [vfs!csVFS_Create+0x181e8 (1001c078)]
10007db0 83c404 add esp,0x4
10007db3 a17cc00110 mov eax,[vfs!csVFS_Create+0x181ec (1001c07c)]
10007db8 8b16 mov edx,[esi]
10007dba 6a02 push 0x2
10007dbc 50 push eax
10007dbd 688c9d0110 push 0x10019d8c
10007dc2 8bce mov ecx,esi
10007dc4 ff522c call dword ptr [edx+0x2c]
--(this call fails)--
Because at [edx+0x2c] is the value 0x5e, which is not a valid function pointer.
All things considered, I think esi is an object pointer or something similar.
Therefore edx must be a pointer to a virtual function table, which as it happens is not pointing at an actual virtual function table.
Assuming thiscall calling convention, I think it tries to make this call:
esi->_vf[11](0x10019d8c, eax, 0x2);
esi == 0xb35860: not in any module -- on the heap?
0x10019d8c: address in vfs
eax == 9 == **1001c2d0: data at pointer at address in vfs
0x2: a constant value
Memory range for vfs: 0x10000000 - 0x10020000
edit: I\'ve downloaded the zip file and extracted the files. PS starts, but when attempting to load the world it always quits with an access violation at address 0041AC3B.
According to the dump:
(4a4.8ec): Access violation - code c0000005 (!!! second chance !!!)
eax=000008ec ebx=0012f854 ecx=00000000 edx=001f03ff esi=0012f156 edi=000001b4
eip=7c90eb94 esp=0012e1bc ebp=0012e1cc iopl=0 nv up ei pl nz na pe nc
cs=001b ss=0023 ds=0023 es=0023 fs=003b gs=0000 efl=00000202
It\'s the Win32 version. Perhaps a developer can figure out which source line it is and why it tries to fetch data from no man\'s land.
edit: Funny things happened in the updater.
First it couldn\'t update libmng-cs.dll. I solved this by renaming it. The updater gave a nasty error message on startup but worked fine.
Secondly, the file trevor.cal3d seems to be permanently out-of-date, even though it gets updated correctly.
I\'m still getting the same error message - I don\'t think I can solve this. Perhaps if I had a debug-build of psclient.exe with symbols and source-lines I could at least report a bit more specifics on the accessvio.
Oh, and while I\'m at it, if the program crashes while in fullscreen, the error is unreadable.
In module vfs:
--(probable start of function)--
10007d80 56 push esi
10007d81 57 push edi
10007d82 8bf0 mov esi,eax
10007d84 a17cc00110 mov eax,[vfs!csVFS_Create+0x181ec (1001c07c)]
10007d89 83cfff or edi,0xffffffff
10007d8c 3bc7 cmp eax,edi
10007d8e 7523 jnz vfs!csVFS_Create+0x3f23 (10007db3)
10007d90 8b0dd0c20110 mov ecx,[vfs!csVFS_Create+0x18440 (1001c2d0)]
10007d96 8b01 mov eax,[ecx]
10007d98 688c9d0110 push 0x10019d8c
10007d9d ff5050 call dword ptr [eax+0x50]
10007da0 68e0170010 push 0x100017e0
10007da5 a37cc00110 mov [vfs!csVFS_Create+0x181ec (1001c07c)],eax
10007daa ff1578c00110 call dword ptr [vfs!csVFS_Create+0x181e8 (1001c078)]
10007db0 83c404 add esp,0x4
10007db3 a17cc00110 mov eax,[vfs!csVFS_Create+0x181ec (1001c07c)]
10007db8 8b16 mov edx,[esi]
10007dba 6a02 push 0x2
10007dbc 50 push eax
10007dbd 688c9d0110 push 0x10019d8c
10007dc2 8bce mov ecx,esi
10007dc4 ff522c call dword ptr [edx+0x2c]
--(this call fails)--
Because at [edx+0x2c] is the value 0x5e, which is not a valid function pointer.
All things considered, I think esi is an object pointer or something similar.
Therefore edx must be a pointer to a virtual function table, which as it happens is not pointing at an actual virtual function table.
Assuming thiscall calling convention, I think it tries to make this call:
esi->_vf[11](0x10019d8c, eax, 0x2);
esi == 0xb35860: not in any module -- on the heap?
0x10019d8c: address in vfs
eax == 9 == **1001c2d0: data at pointer at address in vfs
0x2: a constant value
Memory range for vfs: 0x10000000 - 0x10020000
edit: I\'ve downloaded the zip file and extracted the files. PS starts, but when attempting to load the world it always quits with an access violation at address 0041AC3B.
According to the dump:
(4a4.8ec): Access violation - code c0000005 (!!! second chance !!!)
eax=000008ec ebx=0012f854 ecx=00000000 edx=001f03ff esi=0012f156 edi=000001b4
eip=7c90eb94 esp=0012e1bc ebp=0012e1cc iopl=0 nv up ei pl nz na pe nc
cs=001b ss=0023 ds=0023 es=0023 fs=003b gs=0000 efl=00000202
It\'s the Win32 version. Perhaps a developer can figure out which source line it is and why it tries to fetch data from no man\'s land.
edit: Funny things happened in the updater.
First it couldn\'t update libmng-cs.dll. I solved this by renaming it. The updater gave a nasty error message on startup but worked fine.
Secondly, the file trevor.cal3d seems to be permanently out-of-date, even though it gets updated correctly.
I\'m still getting the same error message - I don\'t think I can solve this. Perhaps if I had a debug-build of psclient.exe with symbols and source-lines I could at least report a bit more specifics on the accessvio.
Oh, and while I\'m at it, if the program crashes while in fullscreen, the error is unreadable.
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Technical Help: IN GAME bugs (after loading world) / Vertical portals
« on: February 17, 2006, 07:26:08 pm »
Does it also solve the crashes on vertical portals?
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Technical Help: IN GAME bugs (after loading world) / Great. And I thought I was being useful...
« on: February 17, 2006, 06:37:02 pm »
Maybe it would be easier if I could e-mail both the screenshot and the log to a developer? Is there a standard contact for things like this?
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Wish list / Is that update-safe?
« on: February 17, 2006, 06:24:49 pm »
Won\'t I risk losing my changes on updating?
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Wish list / Suggestion
« on: February 17, 2006, 06:17:43 pm »
I have found a cfg file with a Quake-like bind system, so perhaps there is hope. They don\'t use the exact same syntax however; does anyone have any experience with this?
On another note, most of the buttons on the toolbar aren\'t needed often. So it\'s not a real bother to have mouselook on permanently. You could use some special key (Esc or middle-mouse-button would be a good choice) and pop up a menu wherein mouselook is temporarily off. The function keys could be shortcuts to the relevant submenus.
Selecting an entity without doing anything is very rare, so the left mouse button could be run/walk depending on preferences. Right-click could pop up the contextmenu. Note: in another thread someone suggested using \"Attack there\" etc. commands instead of \"Attack\" etc. That would make you run to the entity and e.g. attack it. I don\'t use backtrack and sidestep that often; that\'s more useful for shooters, but if you need it, you could perhaps use drag-right.
I don\'t think you would need go-where-I-click that much, although if you want to talk while walking, it might still be useful. I still think double-click-left would be okay. If anyone has suggestions on improving this system, or on actually implementing it someway or another, please reply.
*edit* Can someone explain to me what\'s needed to reprogram the UI? I have programming experience. I might also be able to do an interface mash-up, i.e. a demo of what the interface should/could look like / how it could function without an actual working Planeshift. Just enough to get the idea that is, so that the interface programmers who know what they\'re doing can use that as inspiration.
On another note, most of the buttons on the toolbar aren\'t needed often. So it\'s not a real bother to have mouselook on permanently. You could use some special key (Esc or middle-mouse-button would be a good choice) and pop up a menu wherein mouselook is temporarily off. The function keys could be shortcuts to the relevant submenus.
Selecting an entity without doing anything is very rare, so the left mouse button could be run/walk depending on preferences. Right-click could pop up the contextmenu. Note: in another thread someone suggested using \"Attack there\" etc. commands instead of \"Attack\" etc. That would make you run to the entity and e.g. attack it. I don\'t use backtrack and sidestep that often; that\'s more useful for shooters, but if you need it, you could perhaps use drag-right.
I don\'t think you would need go-where-I-click that much, although if you want to talk while walking, it might still be useful. I still think double-click-left would be okay. If anyone has suggestions on improving this system, or on actually implementing it someway or another, please reply.
*edit* Can someone explain to me what\'s needed to reprogram the UI? I have programming experience. I might also be able to do an interface mash-up, i.e. a demo of what the interface should/could look like / how it could function without an actual working Planeshift. Just enough to get the idea that is, so that the interface programmers who know what they\'re doing can use that as inspiration.
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Technical Help: IN GAME bugs (after loading world) / So the engine messes up horizontal portals?
« on: February 16, 2006, 05:26:08 pm »
@This is a bug in our graphics engine caused by horizontal portals:
Maybe things can be reworked so as not to have horizontal portals anymore. Apart from that I can\'t think of a solution right now. Engine problems are hard to work around.
Maybe things can be reworked so as not to have horizontal portals anymore. Apart from that I can\'t think of a solution right now. Engine problems are hard to work around.
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Wish list / If you say so...
« on: February 16, 2006, 05:09:55 pm »
Well, I haven\'t been able to do so, but I\'ll look into this some more. Suppose I could get the system above working, do you suppose there are others who would like to see the config file or whatever is needed to do this?
*edit*
The options menu isn\'t versatile enough at all... whatever the devs wanted on the mouse can only be done with the mouse and the same applies to the keyboard. Does anyone know of a way to overcome the limitations of the options menu? Is there a way to do what I described above?
*edit*
The options menu isn\'t versatile enough at all... whatever the devs wanted on the mouse can only be done with the mouse and the same applies to the keyboard. Does anyone know of a way to overcome the limitations of the options menu? Is there a way to do what I described above?
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Technical Help: IN GAME bugs (after loading world) /
« on: February 16, 2006, 05:06:02 pm »
First off all: thanks for all the bugs that have been fixed - I can barely contain my anticipation for the release. I allways search the forums before I post something (and have actually not posted some issues because they were reported already), but there is always a chance of reporting an old problem. Better to report a problem twice than not at all.
@I don\'t quite understand what this one is.:
When you e.g. right-click on something and the buttons appear partially behind the toolbar. Visually they appear clickable and \"in tje heat of the game\" you don\'t realize that you\'re actually clicking the toolbar and e.g. the Help window pops up.
@I don\'t quite understand what this one is.:
When you e.g. right-click on something and the buttons appear partially behind the toolbar. Visually they appear clickable and \"in tje heat of the game\" you don\'t realize that you\'re actually clicking the toolbar and e.g. the Help window pops up.
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