Author Topic: Good vs. EVIL  (Read 8547 times)

Draklar

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« Reply #60 on: December 05, 2004, 09:24:17 pm »
Quote
Originally posted by Hatchnet
Draklar in that pic I see no disaster only nature.
Well I see water filled with toxic wastes. All people who don\'t see the number of pollution as disaster should drink from something like that :P

And I\'d ask in what way killing a living creature is not evil, but I guess I won\'t hear anything new...

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Psycon

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« Reply #61 on: December 05, 2004, 10:11:53 pm »
Killing a living creature is not evil when one does it in order to survive. Not that I mind shooting a few rabbits for fun but the general idea about killing stuff to live is that people need organic material in order to live. Since ONLY plants can make organic stuff from light and minerals all other beeings take their organic stuff by consuming another organism totally or partially.

Since killing plants is no fun at all as they don\'t cry for help or react in a visible way ppl kill animals for sport. So  ones that are against killing animals are just hypocrits as they kill plants or mutilate them (I preffer the mutilating since the plants suffer more).

Bottom line is that is very nice that humans are on the top of the food chain. Killing is in human nature. You can\'t deny some milions of years of evolution and say you don\'t kill. Yeah, human beeing is the perfect killing machine. So perfect that he even kills himself. Interesting to see that there are no suicide cases at any other species. So no matter what you do you kill something but I find particullary sick ppl who kill themselves. Like WTF? Milions of years of evolution spawns a specimen completly wrong which doesn\'t wanna live as it doesn\'t wanna kill. Fortunately evolution has has spawned another creation called \"the psychiatrist\" in order assure the survival of the human species.

Yeah, don\'t listen to what others say and start listening to your instincts. Milions of years of evolution can\'t be wrong. :) If you feel hungry GO KILL SOMETHING. As dead things are best fresh. :D
« Last Edit: December 05, 2004, 10:13:36 pm by Psycon »
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Draklar

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« Reply #62 on: December 05, 2004, 10:44:02 pm »
I see that everyone prefer to ignore XpYtZ\' post:
Quote
Main Entry: 2evil
Function: noun
1 a : the fact of suffering, misfortune, and wrongdoing b : a cosmic evil force
2 : something that brings sorrow, distress, or calamity
Now where\'s the difference if you kill for food or not? Does animal suffer any less if you kill it to survive?
I have nothing against killing animals for food, but this is ridiculous!
Why is it hard to understand that when you kill for food, you do two things:
You kill animal - which is evil (killing)
eat animal - which is good (keeping yourself alive)
While all in all it\'s both good and evil, here we\'re talking about fact of killing only, not eating it!

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Hatchnet

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« Reply #63 on: December 06, 2004, 01:55:23 am »
Draklar all I see in that pic is a bunch of muddy water flowing thru a broken natural dam. If you have evidence of the toxic waste please post it. (Yes that is a tree that formed the dam) And what we are seeing looks to be a wet season flood; although the flood could have been produced by a toxic waste dump but as I said you are going to need to prove it.

Draklar

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« Reply #64 on: December 06, 2004, 07:57:54 am »
Then I assume you see what you want to see.
How can someone see just mud in there is beyond me...
That white substance is not made by muddy water...
http://encarta.msn.com/media_461516588/Polluted_River_in_the_United_Kingdom.html

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Psycon

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« Reply #65 on: December 06, 2004, 09:00:42 am »
Quote
Originally posted by Draklar
I see that everyone prefer to ignore XpYtZ\' post:
Quote
Main Entry: 2evil
Function: noun
1 a : the fact of suffering, misfortune, and wrongdoing b : a cosmic evil force
2 : something that brings sorrow, distress, or calamity
Now where\'s the difference if you kill for food or not? Does animal suffer any less if you kill it to survive?
I have nothing against killing animals for food, but this is ridiculous!
Why is it hard to understand that when you kill for food, you do two things:
You kill animal - which is evil (killing)
eat animal - which is good (keeping yourself alive)
While all in all it\'s both good and evil, here we\'re talking about fact of killing only, not eating it!

- Swords


Yeah, I skimmed through the posts but my point is that one is forced to kill. About weather it is good or evil is up to you to decide but for the sake of your mental sanity put killing of certain animals/plants on the good things to do list. If you are forced to kill and feel bad about it makes you go insane so maybe you should finnaly choose if killing an animal is good or evil (can\'t be both) as you mainly see the problem from 2 different points of view (you have double personality?). And yeah, it is a cruel world, if you didn\'t realise till now you can\'t avoid making someone suffer so choosing the what evil to do is the main issue about life.

Oh, and I think that this evil/good discussion has gone past the dictionary definition and gone into philosophical debate. :)
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XpYtZ

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« Reply #66 on: December 06, 2004, 10:52:19 am »
I know the post was a while ago but I have been AWOL since I made it.
Quote
Well, that stealing thing and good chars doesn\'t fit.     Would it be evil to steal some bread from a baron to save someone other from starving?     Would it be bad to steal the ring that gives the power to an evil emperor, so he can be destroyed?

Read the post again, I addressed that concern: or better yet, read the entire post if you did not the first time.

As for the muddy watter, I have studied my fair share of Botany over the years and that could just be silt from a heavy flood or clay deposits that have been washed in from a heavy rain.
If it is T-waste than just let me say, \"what a waste.\" Though without a check of what is actually \'in\' the water I would be sceptical of anyone not with a govenment that got that close and lived, -again if all that silt and bacteria are from man-made toxins and not just fish crap and rotting leaves.

Weather or not the action of pollution is \'evil\' should not really be much of a debate since we are killing ourselves, though I do pose this question: Is there a difference between an Evil act by purpose and an Evil act by accident.
I.E. A man takes a walk down the road and happenes to drop some change. Later another man is walking down the street and seeing the change bends down to pick it up. In the course of bending the second man looses his balance and falls on his head, breaing his neck and, even killing him.
Is this event the evil act of the man who dropped the change, the man who bent to pick it up or a malevolent, unseen force (like a god or ghost) or just plain bad luck?

Just post your oppinion, no need to argue weather the event brought pain and suffering on anyone.

Draklar

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« Reply #67 on: December 06, 2004, 10:56:16 am »
Philosophical debate usually bases itself on theory/definition. Debate has no sense if everyone are talking about different thing.

And I don\'t go by:
Evil - Don\'t do that!
Good - Do that!

I accept both, so why should I care about the insanity thing?
I can tell good from evil. But why should I stick to only one of them? Nature doesn\'t. I\'m part of nature. So why should I go by different laws?

And as for choosing yourself what is good and what is evil: There\'s no better way to screw up your morality and go by the rule of \"Good is what is good to me\". Pretty egoistic thought. Nothing less, nothing more.
Also creating own definitions of good and evil, was used quite well as an excuse for religious opressions in the past... and still is...

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Jaakon

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« Reply #68 on: December 06, 2004, 11:28:28 am »
sigh...
It goes out after eating, catches something and dont eat it.

Draklar

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« Reply #69 on: December 06, 2004, 03:37:08 pm »
Quote
Originally posted by XpYtZ
though I do pose this question: Is there a difference between an Evil act by purpose and an Evil act by accident.
I.E. A man takes a walk down the road and happenes to drop some change. Later another man is walking down the street and seeing the change bends down to pick it up. In the course of bending the second man looses his balance and falls on his head, breaing his neck and, even killing him.
Is this event the evil act of the man who dropped the change, the man who bent to pick it up or a malevolent, unseen force (like a god or ghost) or just plain bad luck?
Well there can\'t be any difference between the acts. No matter what the thoughts are. Thoughts and deeds influence each other, but thought won\'t influence the outcome quality of deed.
For example, if you make ugly painting, will it change anything that you either wanted or didn\'t want to make it look so?
The evil was caused by both men... and people who ever had anything to do with them... and people who had anything to do with those people... and so on. In fact, the only way to not cause any evil would be to never exist...
So trying to do \"good\" only is pretty much pointless... people should simply follow their ethics, trying to do what\'s \"right\", not what\'s \"wrong\".

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Merdarion

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« Reply #70 on: December 06, 2004, 07:19:16 pm »
Let\'s go down to the primary needs of the human:
Hunger
Shelter
Sleep
Hygenics
Reproduction.

Well then evil could be defined by: making yourself getting as much as possible of all these needs.

And Good: to pass, so someone could live better.

Neutral: Don\'t be a parazit nor a good Samarite
I want to be a flame, to crumble to ash, but never ever burnt.

I want to rise higher, rise up to the heavens, but sink, just sink down deeper and deeper into nothing,

I want to be an angel, a chosen, a devil, but I am just a creature that ever wants what it wont get.


Moogie

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« Reply #71 on: December 06, 2004, 08:51:23 pm »
Good and Evil are just a difference of opinion.

XpYtZ

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« Reply #72 on: December 06, 2004, 08:57:47 pm »
I am not sure Drak that you were speaking to me with but just in case:
It was not my intention to suggest that people should decide for themselves what right and wrong are. I was actually hoping to say that everyone knows already what is right and wrong. The only exceptions that I see to that are people with sociopathic disorders, and there is a reason that we call them disorders.
We usually call it a conscience, though I also believe that our conscience can become scarred or calloused to certain things over time. One of the reasons I shy away from violent movies.
Sorry for the miscommunication on that one.

Draklar

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« Reply #73 on: December 06, 2004, 09:41:28 pm »
Nah, it wasn\'t pointed to anyone in particular. Just stating my general opinion.

Well some religions and society often try to influence the conscience, in order to have better control over people. It\'s rather hard to keep your own ethics nowadays. As well as block yourself from influences coming from games or TV...

But that brings a question:
Are we born with set of ethics or do we gain it by living in society? Or maybe by observations and experience taken from life?

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Hatchnet

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« Reply #74 on: December 07, 2004, 07:00:01 am »
Draklar after visiting the site I agree that unless the picture is a hoax the water is probably contaminated however the white substance you are referring to is called white water which is a mixture of air and water (you?ll notice it does not exist on the upstream side of the dam) next time just post the link to the site as the pic could barely be considered proof of anything.