Good vs. EVIL

[Draklar]

To quote some writeress,
I think that the beginning of essential morality would be to see yourself with the eyes of others.

Also difference of opinion won\'t always happen.
In the moment of earthquake, who will think it\'s good?
Wouldn\'t everyone think it\'s evil?

Of course, looking at everything with your own eyes, makes you pretty much narrow-minded. And looking at yourself with the eyes of others, is just beginning of morality. There are different views.
Just like when killing for food...

- With your own eyes (I got myself some food, that is good)
- With the eyes of others (I killed an animal, that is evil)
- With your own rationality (I killed an animal, but thanks to that I got myself some food. That is both evil and good)

- Swords

[Psycon]

What is wrong with killing an animal? Fortunately I don\'t see many ppl with this sudden love for animals where I live. Why should I feel bad for cutting the throat of a rabbit? I really don\'t see the point. Yeah, the sight would not be very pleasant with blood and all.... etc but I don\'t feel bad for stepping on the grass, killing a weed, cutting a tree, squashing a fly, not to mention the bilions of bacterias I kill every day by washing my hands. The only reason I agree for not killing animals is not to drive them into extinction. Except for this what\'s the point?

[Draklar]

I always thought that listening is important part of discussion.
What should I say? Besides that I never said killing for food is wrong? And that I said many times, evil does not equal wrong?
oh yea, I\'ll answer that:

The only reason I agree for not killing animals is not to drive them into extinction. Except for this what\'s the point?

Well here\'s the point: They are alive! They are normal thinking beings!
Really, one day some higher form of life should destroy all mankind just because they are able to. Oh right, sorry, just kill the most arrogant ones to not drive us into extinction...

- Swords

[Psycon]

They are normal thinking beings!

I really don\'t see the thinking part when animals involved.

[Draklar]

Yeah, blind people usually don\'t see things...

Others however could notice the behaviour of such animals as dolphins, squirrels or even monkeys, that couldn\'t be result of anything but intelligence.

Really, believing out of all creatures on Earth, we are the only ones that think? How stupid is that?

- Swords

[Psycon]

I don\'t say animals don\'t think, but I don\'t take their thinking as \"normal\". Human thinking is far more complex than animal one. No animal is aware of some basic things like right and wrong or the feeling of love.

I really don\'t see that beeing alive is a reason not to be killed (beeing dead would be a great one ) Or the thing that animals have some spark of intelligence (some computers are even more \"intelignet\" than humans). Nature is cruel as death is the main force behind evolution. Animals aren\'t intelligent enough so the death of one will matter (unlike humans) so if you feel bad about me wacking some rabbits I\'ll give you a pair so you could take care of the prosperity of the rabbit population.

Maybe you should kill an animal and then talk about the right or wrong of this action as I don\'t think that at the time there were no supermarkets ppl thought it\'s bad to kill a rabbit for example. Maybe you should go out in the nature more Darklar and really see what animals can or can\'t do... stop applying to them human behaviour as animals are just animals. It\'s more likely to find the animal side in you that the human one in an animal.

[Hatchnet]

Lol I have told him many times Psycon that animals are thinking but not reasoning beings but he does not seem to understand the difference.

[Draklar]

I really don\'t see the thinking part when animals involved.

I don\'t say animals don\'t think

Sure you don\'t.

No animal is aware of some basic things like right and wrong or the feeling of love.

I could see that in dog. Any arguments proving it isn\'t so?

so if you feel bad about me wacking some rabbits I\'ll give you a pair so you could take care of the prosperity of the rabbit population.

wow... your logic amazes me... what does population grow help when the living being gets murdered?

stop applying to them human behaviour as animals are just animals.

ok, quote me when I apply human behaviour to them. Did I say they steal? kill for no apparent reason? Strive to destroy themselves?

Maybe you should kill an animal and then talk about the right or wrong

ok, that\'s just sadistic... maybe you should kill a human and then talk about right or wrong?

I really don\'t see that beeing alive is a reason not to be killed

So I assume the reason is if something can solve math, speak the way you speak? How illogical, plus primitive way of basing morality on your race... racism against animals?
We should only hope that more intelligent race that uses telepathy wouldn\'t have same views on different races, or we would be pretty much dead... then again, is that a bad thing?

Maybe you should go out in the nature more Darklar and really see what animals can or can\'t do...

Funny, in past, people who really lived close to nature, respected it. Were praying for the killed animal... today still some are praying if they pull out plant from their garden.
The question who has better understanding of nature: those who live in it, or those who spend their time in front of computer, should have obvious answer...

Hatchnet: I\'ve seen animals reasoning...

I really should stop discussing it before I start to hate mankind...

- Swords

[Hatchnet]

Originally posted by Draklar
Hatchnet: I\'ve seen animals reasoning...

- Swords

Draklar I grew up around a great many animals of a great many types and while I have seen some very inteligent animals; I have never seen one with the ability to reason. So I say to you be sure you do not confuse an animals ability to assotiate with the human ability to reason.

I really should stop discussing it before I start to hate mankind...

From the way you speak you already do.

[Draklar]

I don\'t hate mankind... I hate nazism, ignorance and... christianity

And imo, knowledge won\'t hit you in face no matter how close you stand to it. You still have to reach for it.

I\'ve seen squirrel learning on its own mistakes... and very quickly I shall add. Many other experiments showed that animals can use their logics. Reason.

But you could simply look at behaviour of dog, which has been taught of right and wrong.

- Swords

[Hatchnet]

Originally posted by Draklar
I don\'t hate mankind... I hate nazism, ignorance and... christianity

And imo, knowledge won\'t hit you in face no matter how close you stand to it. You still have to reach for it.

I\'ve seen squirrel learning on its own mistakes... and very quickly I shall add. Many other experiments showed that animals can use their logics. Reason.

But you could simply look at behaviour of dog, which has been taught of right and wrong.

- Swords

You moron you just described association not reason; I told you not to confuse them! Association is the ability to learn from what has already happened (an ability tied to instinct) while reason is the ability to make a logical choice based on given knowledge. I almost constantly see animals perform the former and have never seen them perform the later.

[Draklar]

yay... insults...

Originally posted by Hatchnet
reason is the ability to make a logical choice based on given knowledge. I almost constantly see animals perform the former and have never seen them perform the later.

gee.. and I thought that\'s what I meant by saying

Many other experiments showed that animals can use their logics. Reason.

Scientists came to conclusion that yes, they can use it. But what can I, \"moron\" know about it, eh?

- Swords

[Hatchnet]

Draklar scientist are the ones most likely to confuse the two. If you can\'t figure out why then perhaps you are not as smart as you like to think you are; it does not take a brain surgen after all.

[Draklar]

I\'m sorry, but you throw away everything that might change your world view. You criticize the experiments without even knowing what they were about. You made your observations and thus you are right. No matter if someone made more observations, if he doesn\'t say what you say - he is wrong.

- Swords

[seperot]

i hate mankind in total.....i have to work with the genreal public and the sheer mass of ignorance with simple tasks...for example
i work on a moblie phone shop where what we sell is clearly in view.

(did you bring your mobile (cell) phone with you sir so we can check it for you?....oh no i never take my phone out the house) then why have a mobile phone

(hi can i help....yes do you sell hair dryers?) ...

(*woman looking at phone cases* hi there what phone do you have?...oh no i dont own a phone i was just looking at the pretty patterns)