Author Topic: Learn from Books  (Read 3966 times)

Jakob

  • Hydlaa Citizen
  • *
  • Posts: 263
    • View Profile
(No subject)
« Reply #30 on: January 23, 2005, 08:46:02 pm »
Quote
Originally posted by Icefalcon
Some of you are saying these books that you gain knowledge from should disappear after use. This is certainly not how I think it should work...

I agree, but I think instead of selling a book it should have to be passed along only in your guild, and only if you have a certain rank in the guild.  That way the specific knowledge of a book, where there are maybe only a few of a certain volume, will become even rarer.  Maybe a skill will exist to copy a volume if you have enough paper, inteligence, and exp in the skill you are copying the book about.  That volume would be sold outside the guild, but a copy can only be made once by a certain player, and there would be a limit to the number copies that could exist, and a member based number of books that a guild can own.  Therefore guild masters and members are encouraged to get as many members in their guild as they can, and the books owned by a guild would be a good incentive for people to join a guild.  eg. My guild, Silver Rain (heh, couldn\'t resist a plug), is based on helping other players and each other, but not at the cost of the game.  Maybe Silver Rain obtains a book containing knowledge of a lost glyph in the Crystal Way, and one or two other copies exist.  The easiest way to obtain knowledge of this Crystal Way glyph is to join Silver Rain.  As long as you are a member of Silver Rain, or own a copy of the tome, you have the ability to use the glyph.  If you break the rules of the guild and are removed, or if you quit you lose the ability to use the glyph.  This encourages guilds to be more close-knit in their beliefs as well.
« Last Edit: January 23, 2005, 08:46:29 pm by Jakob »

I am Arew Silverwing, and one day I will rule the WORLD!:D
All y\'all stick yourselves onto the board.

Grindalyx

  • Hydlaa Resident
  • *
  • Posts: 103
    • View Profile
(No subject)
« Reply #31 on: January 23, 2005, 09:36:45 pm »
Quote

Right now, we spend PP on a trainer to train in Theoretic Knowledge. But how about learning from books? In Morrowind, if you read certain books, you gain levels in certain skills. The problem with that is that all you need to do is open the book, you don\'t actually have to read it.

I would like there to be books that will raise your Knowledge, only after reading the story. At the end, after flipping throught the pages, there would be a little quiz, just to make sure you read it and deserve the Knowledge you are about to receive. The quiz would be asimple, one or two question multiple choice. If you get the right answer, your Knowledge increases, if you get the wrong answer, you get to sit there and wish you read the book. Now, the quiz is only available the first time you open the book, so there is no cheating.

I think this would be a pretty cool feature to be added in later releases. It promotes roleplaying, and is a nice addition to the current training system.


i love that idea :D. it\'s be fantastic used in conjunction with the anti-cheating idea, and taking into account the whole literacy/level it\'ll teach angles

Quote

Maybe Silver Rain obtains a book containing knowledge of a lost glyph in the Crystal Way, and one or two other copies exist.  The easiest way to obtain knowledge of this Crystal Way glyph is to join Silver Rain.  As long as you are a member of Silver Rain, or own a copy of the tome, you have the ability to use the glyph.  If you break the rules of the guild and are removed, or if you quit you lose the ability to use the glyph.  This encourages guilds to be more close-knit in their beliefs as well.

while good in theory, i\'m not sure that part would work, afterall, once you learn something it\'s impossible to forget, so long as you use it daily.

Quote

1. I pick up a book that gives a rudimentary skill in knife making. (I know not implemented.) And I can learn from that book only the first level of knife making. Later on I find the book again, having a skill four in knife making. Oh well, the book gives me nothing, as I already know that basics. But I can give the book to someone else who can use it. If the book is too advanced for me it also does nothing, I have two levels of skill in knife making and the book teaches level 5. It will be too advanced for me to learn anything out of.

2. I read a book that teaches me the theory for mage craft, not the practical...

Excellent ideas :)

Quote

Hey, I think intelligence should come into play. Only people with a certain level of intelligence can read.

Good in theory, but you forgot one small thing. Reading is a skill that you have to learn. Being intelligent doesn\'t mean you can read (i know some pretty stupid people, and they can read rather well). Thats not to say it\'s a bad idea though, just instead of reading ability relying solely on intelligence, add a reading skill, which as you gain levels in the skill, your char starts understanding the written word. Intelligence could come into play as a cap for the max level of the skill, say.. 36 intelligence = max reading level of 6, at such a level some of the larger words would still be hard to understand.

I can think of many other possibilities, for example, people mentioned languages. Now, i\'m not even going to try and say it\'ll be easy to set up, as the languages would have to be created, but if languages are implemented, the language skills could become trainable after the character is literate. For example, once they can understand the basic books, the higher levels of intelligence, and language skill (could maybe have a sub-window for the language you wish to focus on) would open the way for higher reading levels, which would work with the language skill to make foreign books readable.

Quote

Maybe a skill will exist to copy a volume if you have enough paper, inteligence, and exp in the skill you are copying the book about.


Scribing should definately be considered, and intelligence should definately be a factor, but you shouldn\'t require knowledge in the field the book is about if you\'re just copying it (providing you can read it of course)


*glances back at what he just said* le sigh.. i did it again. eh well, i\'m sure anyone that doesn\'t like my idea regarding intelligence and proposed skills of reading and language being co-dependant will tell me. :P
« Last Edit: January 23, 2005, 09:46:31 pm by Grindalyx »
Forfeit the game, stop the talk show
Product of what you\'re taught to know,
Forfeit the game, cos tomorrow
when it\'s all done, you\'ll reap what you sow.

Azuros

  • Hydlaa Resident
  • *
  • Posts: 53
    • View Profile
(No subject)
« Reply #32 on: January 23, 2005, 10:10:24 pm »
I reaaly think books are a good idea. Here more details about my opinion:

- There should be 3 ways to learn:  Theorical (by books), therical (by teaching), pratical.

- Some skills could requiert only one of the two theorical ways (or both), but pratical would be necessary.

- The order to learn would be important: so you\'d have to first read book(s), learn by a teacher and then practice it; when books are unecessary, it would be like it is now.

- for exemple, a book could have a range of what it can learn (let\'s say Crystal Way, 1-5) and a minimum intellgience to understand to book (well, combat skill won\'t need books, so...).  Book reading could be a skill that would influence the rapidity of reading (learned by teaching, and by practice (that would be when you read story or knowledge books)

- When you read books, there would be a jauge that tells you the reading progression.  You could stop whenever you want and continue after.  When it\'s over, you are ready to learn with the teacher.

- What a book can learn and how much intelligence it takes to understand it could be hide to players, by telling the same message (\"You can\'t understand this book\", for exemple).  We could have an idea about this with the price the book cost :D.

- Some books could be very rares and giving after very hard and long quests.

- It would not be hard to implement because it\'s almost the same system; it\'s just a new similar thing to add :D
You are a mage who is looking for a Guild? Join the Order of the Sorcerors of the Moon

~Archos Azuremoon

Andrek

  • Hydlaa Resident
  • *
  • Posts: 176
  • Your mom liked it!
    • View Profile
(No subject)
« Reply #33 on: September 01, 2005, 09:13:43 am »
So where can one find the book on Gorbiak?  Does it still exist?
I'm taking a shower.  Don't think of me as dirty, naked will do just fine ;)

Lordbug

  • Hydlaa Notable
  • *
  • Posts: 597
  • Magic Mugs!
    • View Profile
    • Knowledge Seekers guild
(No subject)
« Reply #34 on: September 01, 2005, 10:15:49 am »
Quote
Originally posted by Andrek
So where can one find the book on Gorbiak?  Does it still exist?

Checked the shelves of the library already?
I already read every book in it and the creatures language one is still there ^^
"Lordbug" Dosaki, Chancellor of Knowledge Seekers Guild

Where does the PlaneShift Modding Community live nowadays?

Neryam

  • Hydlaa Citizen
  • *
  • Posts: 363
  • Knight Avatar of the Guild Knights
    • View Profile
    • Dragon Peak
(No subject)
« Reply #35 on: September 01, 2005, 01:18:45 pm »
Hmm.. I rather like this idea. :D
I don\'t think the flags idea would be a good one, since everybody reads at a different pace and it would get to be darn boring. And I\'m sure a great number of talented story writers in the Communative Storywriting section would voluenteer to write the books.. :D

I like the quiz idea best.

Intelligence shouldn\'t come into play as it would cause the ways to become imbalanced (Int would become more valuable than char or will).
Actually I don\'t think int should be a mental stat, it should be changed to Determination or something, then int should be a global mental stat as well as a stat for many other things (Including reading and mabye the effectiveness of each training knowledge level etc.)

I think..
Books are Theoretical Knowledge,
Training is Practial Knowledge,
Practice is Skill.

Oh and yeh, scribing would definitely be considered but the more difficult the book the difficutly in scribing it would rise EXPONENTIALLY to prevent copying of rare books. Because just dissalowing it would be weird and unrealistic.
Vis vires est haud claustrum ut animus. Power is no bar to the Heart.
Guild Knights will return. When I feel like it.


odd2k

  • Hydlaa Resident
  • *
  • Posts: 76
    • View Profile
(No subject)
« Reply #36 on: September 01, 2005, 07:49:19 pm »
Sounds like a good idea. It\'s not hard, it doesnt involve fancy 3d graphics and it would add to realism and freedom for players to evolve. The popquiz idea is a must-implement!

Also, maybe not all characters know how to read.. It could depend on intelligence, and perhaps also a reading skill. finally those big bulky Krans will pay for their stupidity. Or they could take evening classes.

hereticalfaction

  • Traveller
  • *
  • Posts: 17
    • View Profile
(No subject)
« Reply #37 on: September 01, 2005, 11:11:13 pm »
Buying books, questing for books, being-of-high-enough level-and-only-in-the-right-guild-so-that-those-who-played-ps-first-will-always-retain-in-game-advantage-rather-than-making-game-open-to-all-of-us.... BAH!

Your just going to change \"Kill mobs - Get loot -level up\" paradigm into \"Kill mobs- getloot - read books - level up\".

Look, I know that many of you have powerful charachters because you have \"invested\" thousands of hours powerkilling in the arena... That is the wrong way... Stop having a fit everytime you think someone might get a loint of skill in something without having to \"earn\" it by killing stuff.

In a fully developed game, having the whole population devoted to kill and loot activities would be stupid anyway. Having to kill 20k rats to get a decent skill in mining is simply retarded.

Have books persistent in specific locations, one use per charachter, gives (with quiz) one points in one skill in one range. Make ranges like 5 points, so that you can use (skill)book one to get a point as long as your skill is 0-4, (skill)book two: 5-9, etc.

Yes, without ever drawing your sword you should be able to get 1/5 of your advancement from reading as long as you seek out all the books in the game.

And yes, you should be able to pass on info about the location of books. If it is out of game, it is a spoiler, and the traditional rules apply. If it is an in game hint, that is roleplay of training/helping out younger people, and should be encouraged.

darkw00t

  • Hydlaa Citizen
  • *
  • Posts: 271
    • View Profile
(No subject)
« Reply #38 on: September 06, 2005, 11:29:48 pm »
You should need a book for questing to give information or clues on where to get something, also you should get a magazine or book telling you how to make a weapon like on FF8 but you have to obtain the magazine/book to make the items it my first post so it just an idea
Eleloy Shadowfrost

odd2k

  • Hydlaa Resident
  • *
  • Posts: 76
    • View Profile
(No subject)
« Reply #39 on: September 07, 2005, 04:45:13 am »
hm darkwoot I think the devs are planning to do so already. yay!

Rage McCloud

  • Hydlaa Citizen
  • *
  • Posts: 235
    • View Profile
(No subject)
« Reply #40 on: September 07, 2005, 05:13:00 am »
its funny... Morrowind seems to be a great source for these ideas... not to flame or anything because i think morrowind SHOULD set an example... anyways back to the topic

i think once you read a book it would disolve thus preventing circulation... and the books would appeaar in random locations so that there wouldnt be lines and camping... but of course they would appear in certain ranges of certain areas... therefore it couldnt just appear in the middle of the plaza... and rare books should be found DEEP in ruins and caves past bosses and such... and there should be volumes of books... like Alchemy Of Billy Vol:I Vol:II Vol:III Vol:IV and such...
Greeting fellow adventurers!
My name is Rohnan Darosel.

Neryam

  • Hydlaa Citizen
  • *
  • Posts: 363
  • Knight Avatar of the Guild Knights
    • View Profile
    • Dragon Peak
(No subject)
« Reply #41 on: September 07, 2005, 02:04:12 pm »
Yeah..although not quite sure about the cave thing, I don\'t see why trepors would want to guard a book :P

For rare books I\'d say you would need to complete very difficult quests or go to dangerous ruins of destroyed cities and find the ancient library.. that would be better I\'d say.

And books shouldn\'t move around, I think Jayose would murder you if you put the book back in the wrong shelf. :P And books shouldn\'t dissolve either as Jayose would put your head on a hook in the library attic if you made the book dissolve.. :P
Instead of those, to prevent book-camping I guess there would be multiple copies of the book so everybody can read it at once.. and the library shouldn\'t have books That great, just a little useful, and mabye you need to read some of them to start a new skill.. (\"How to make a simple dagger\", \"Forging metals\", and \"Blacksmith\'s guide\" to start a career in smithying). None of them would give you huge bonuses.

As for the rare books, you should be able to take it out and share it and the rest would be warded, more quests would be made to get more and more books. those books would then always be in circulation. Copies could be made and sold but as I said earlier the higher the book level the scribing skill needed would rise exponentially..
Vis vires est haud claustrum ut animus. Power is no bar to the Heart.
Guild Knights will return. When I feel like it.