Everyone hates mining. Right?

[Under the moon]

* /dig for gold /dig for iron /dig for gold /dig for iron /dig for gold /dig for iron *

Sounds pretty boring, doesn\'t it.  And easily bot-able.

So why can\'t mining be fun? Could it not be turned into some sort of un-bot-able mini-game? Like some sort of Tetris or PPuzzle League (god that game was addictive). Dirt would be useless brown blocks while ore would be different shiny and puuurdy colors. Line up so many gold/iron/copper/etc blocks, they disappear, and you get one unit of that ore. Then you could mine for more than one type of ore at a time. Different areas could yield varying amounts of ore blocks, or veins. If too many \'dirt\' blocks accumulate and reach the top, your \'mine\' collapses and you have to start over. Pick durability could affect the speed at which you can move or switch blocks. Race differences would effect this also (dwarves are little dirt grubbers after all  ).

This is just one example of how tedious tasks could be made fun. Who wants to spend hours typing */dig whatever*. We are supposed to be role-playing and having fun here, not having boring on-line jobs, aren\'t we? Otherwise, what\'s the point?

Ya, I know, the Devs are up to their ears in work, and can\'t be bothered with this, but that shouldn\'t stop us from discussing the problem.

*puts on his flame-proof suit of crystal scale*
I\'m ready.

[Diamondcite]

*takes out a adamantium chain saw with an automatic starter*

Your mini game idea should remain a minigame for those that would like to have fun while trying to mine, you can even make it give more valuable minerals as a bonus. As you speak I am minning and making frieldly chatter with other miners in the area, mining can be a fun enjoyable task, just like a fishing trip, you just need to know how to enjoy the area.

If you didn\'t like mining then you shouldn\'t be mining at all. This is an RPG after all, since this game is in development not all roles are well covered at the moment, maybe you can find a new profitable interest in the future.

[Myrtl]

Yes! Dwars need to start off with at least 1 mining skill. Thats what they all do for a living...  

I think we need a system change too

[Sulatorc]

I don\'t think it has to be that hard. Just have it similar to the way they have it in World of Warcraft. Sorry but i feel the way they have it is very hard to bot and noticable when it is botted. Have mine deposits/rocks spring up randomly which should be no more harder to script than the enemy spawn script. Once a player sees the deposit it just has to type \'/dig\'. There is no need for /dig gold or /dig iron. The resources will be assigned a number according to their rarity. iron = 10, gold = 20, and platinum = 30.

Once the /dig command is executed a random number between 1-20 is generated which is added to your level. This then determines what you mine. On a roll where you can either get 1 gold or 2 iron this would be assigned randomly via another roll. Higher the level in mining the ability to mine rarer resources increases. This would make leveling up more rewarding.

An example of this would be a level 10 miner executes /dig and gets a 10. This ten is added to his level to get twenty. The twenty could then be split two ways: 2 irons or 1 gold. Another random number between 0-1 give a 0 so i get 2 irons. If i got a 1 then i would have recieved the 1 gold. This would only get more difficult as the number of levels and resources increase.

They way they have it now is very easy to bot. Too easy if you ask me. A guy running from ore deposit to ore deposit for an extend amount of time is sure to get the attention of not only the GM but the other players. A player hiding behind a rock botting is not.

[Under the moon]

Yes, but is that fun?  The only reason I (and you, admit it) play games is for entertainment.  If I have to spend hours typing dig or killing rats to get just enough money to roleplay a little, it can be discouraging.

[Sulatorc]

Originally posted by Under the moon
Yes, but is that fun?  The only reason I (and you, admit it) play games is for entertainment.  If I have to spend hours typing dig or killing rats to get just enough money to roleplay a little, it can be discouraging.

I hope they don\'t have the spawn time set to the same amount of time as they have now. You would not be standing in the same spot like you do now for rats. It would take hours for that mine deposit to reappear.

Mining would be more of \"on the way to doing quest X i found some ore deposit on the side of the road and mined\" instead of sitting for hours at place Y and type \'/dig\' or click your mouse.

As for the money problem, maybe more drops or better drops from the enemies? More money from completing a quest? Increased price from ore? I did find it interesting that i got more trias from a rat than gold ore (6 = rat pelts + 1 = rat eye, 6 = gold ore). Money wise it makes no sense to mine gold ore. I am not sure how much trias you got for Platinum because i never found it.

[Elscha]

Platinum does exist! (thanks Zet) and the smithy buy\'s em\' for 12 Tria apiece

   So that makes mining conserably more profitable than rat killing! So if your after Tria for training & have loads of PP\'s then leave the poor lil\' rats to the lvl 1 weapon folks.

   Don\'t want to give out the location but if you \"/dig platinum\" in the three mining locations your sure to come across it soon enough

[diabolus]

As you speak I am minning and making frieldly chatter with other miners in the area, mining can be a fun enjoyable task, just like a fishing trip, you just need to know how to enjoy the area.

That argument is flawed. Wait until you\'re \'chatting\' with a bunch of botting miners next to you. Odds are, with mining being as easily scriptable as now, that a large group of people will go into \'mining mode\' and chat somewhere else [outside the game?] , actually they\'ll probably go to sleep.
(I come from a MUD where mining worked exactly like this, except it\'s all text, trust me, people do not become mysteriously chatty with a well written mining bot)

I also agree with the \'spawning\' idea of minerals, although i\'m more for a type of setting where you actually -see- a mining opportunity [i.e. crystals embedded into the rock] and then having it -deplete-. Not sure how\'s it in WoW/WC3 , but i\'d think having a single large deposit spawn randomly instead of alot of small deposits would be better.

Reason? Large deposit will facilitate a group mining scenario [so you have 10 payers mining it at the same time]  instead of a solo guy walking around for a small desposit. So essentially it facilitates the \'enjoying chatting\' scenario alot more , because all the people mining at the spot can\'t be botting [although they can turn their bots on for a brief period before the deposit depletes].

And if you want to go wild with this, create a mining skill which is required to actually see/find these deposits [i.e. if the skill is high enough you can visibly spot a gold vein  or some rare metal deposit]. Guess who\'s going to be very popular at leading mining expeditions then

[Foresteer]

Originally posted by Sulatorc
Once the /dig command is executed a random number between 1-20 is generated which is added to your level. This then determines what you mine. On a roll where you can either get 1 gold or 2 iron this would be assigned randomly via another roll. Higher the level in mining the ability to mine rarer resources increases. This would make leveling up more rewarding

but not if i WANT iron (blacksmiths eat the stuff for breakfast ya know) so if i got high level at mining then iron would become rare for me to get XD but the random deposit idea is great.. with a little work.. a few changes would be A. make the spawned depsoit of one metal and one metal only B. make the deposit have \"HP\" every time somebody tries to mine it that gets lower (even if one fails) then when the \"hp\" is 0 then the mine is spent up and C. make iron spawn in a general are gold in a area and so on (certian regions in the wolrd are noted as having many deposits of iron or gold or whatnot in one place) (but then again anything could rarely spawn anywhere so .)

[Distruzione_di_Massa]

Personally i don\'t like the idea of spawning mines, it\'s just too irrealistic. Instead, the idea of crystal filled walls of rock or boulders which can be spotted by skilled chars is very good.
Also, mines should someday get depleted.. this way skilled miners could want to create some lobby or their personal mining guild, hiring workers and guards to prevent ore stealing and going to explore new areas to find other suitable digging places, others could go venturing acting freelance and so on, creating patterns of role playing politics and relations.
Anyway, i agree with the need to change the system to something less boring, the idea of the little game is really interesting

[ramlambmoo]

mining defiantly needs to be changed, so you can only mine like 20 times a day or something,... and more if your mining skill is higher.  At the moment it just rewards people for sitting there typing /dig gold, or if they\'re clever using a bot to do it.

[Seytra]

Yes, you can either increase the fun aspect by including some form of surprise effect (like either spawning mines, which I don\'t like, or by adding the visual indication, which I\'d really like), or decrease the tediousness of the process.
As I have stated on another thread, I think that it would be a good idea to severely increase the duration that one single mining operation (i.e., one \"/dig XY\") lasts, and at the same time increase the outcome by the same factor. This way mining would be more realistic and less repetitive, while loosing nothing. It would increase the chatting opportunities since you don\'t need to keep typing and clicking. Obviously, it\'d still be bottable, but that\'s not my point ATM. My point is that it\'d reduce the use of bots since the \"bot\" is implemented in the client, but only to the extent of bridging some minutes, not endlessly.
Also, I like the idea of having the mines deplete some day (though they should last RL months, to allow for stable economies and politics to form). This should be like IRL: the mine will yield less and less, until it\'s not worth the effort anymore, except for the most desperate or causal miner / mining apprentice, or someone who just needs very few ore.

[Kiern]

I don\'t really have that much to add, as I haven\'t tried mining out other then testing it and haven\'t mined in any other games.

But, I remember when mining was something that the developers used to be definately against simply because of the reasons stated above (too simple, mind deadening).

I just find it funny that it somehow went from that to being one of the first things actually implemented into the game. :baby:

[elscouta]

I think a good way to do mining would be to put mining spots in very deep caves, easy to discover (veins that any miner can see or books/NPCs pointing to the spot) BUT these caves are infested of monsters that spawn quite fast and with very random power (like a quite invincible monster spawns every two hours, normal monsters every two minutes. Make the monsters patrol in the mine and be somewhat stealth (so miners are taken by surprise) and you can turn out the current system in an interesting challenge.

For mining being implemented so quickly i guess it is because it\'s easy to implement

[Kixie]

I think there should be a mining mini game, it would be a great idea. But this mini game has to be very dependent on your mining skill. It must be MUCH easier for someone who has the 19th level of mining, and MUCH harder for for someone at 0 or 1.

For example the mining game could consist of a simple 2d game that shows your character and the dirt under him and unknowledgable items. As you click the deeper you make a hole untill you finally get to the object you saw deep in the ground. As your mining skill goes up, it will 1) be faster diging (less clicks) and 2) Less times the object you dug down to will be useless clumps of dirt etc.

Love the idea, think we should do a whole bunch of mini game type things like  bartender game, a fishing game, alchemist game, bookeeper game, etc. Maybe a bad idea to some, and would the game seem kind of cartoony, but it would be a nice niche to Planeshift.