Languages in PS

[mromu'e fanza]

If you want to be *really* purist about not letting languages split the community, there\'s always the option of inventing a whole new language for the game and only allowing that to be spoken... but then you probably won\'t get many players.

Although IMHO it\'s the lesser evil for multiple languages to exist rather than everyone speaking the same (and English did not become the international language by being any good for the purpose), ramlambmoo mentioned the idea that different languages are like different types of food.  Indeed they both add diversity to to the world, but there is a serious flaw in directly comparing languages to food: everyone knows how to eat - there is no or very little learning needed to eat different types of food (maybe e.g. learning to use chopsticks and even that\'s usually optional), whereas a lot of effort is needed to learn to understand a new language.  Even the effort involved in learning to cook different food is probably less than learning to speak a different language.

Can I just point anyone who hasn\'t seen it to my suggestion for a translation help channel (on the Wish List board):

http://www.planeshift3d.com/wbboard/thread.php?threadid=14746&boardid=11&styleid=3&sid=59f6e22ac12164b343e67d1b2ea07e6b

...and my post about gestures which is somewhere earlier in this thread, and maybe I should re-post it somewhere else.

And, not related to PS (but this thread isn\'t now anyway) - here\'s a few fun language-related links:

http://www.omniglot.com/ - if you think \"writing\" only means the letters A to Z, think again...
http://www.trigeminal.com/samples/provincial.html - \"Why can\'t they just speak English?\"... and the equivalent phrase in about 100 languages.
http://www.google.co.uk/language_tools?hl=en - by clicking the links under \"Use the Google Interface in Your Language\", you can see what Google looks like in all the supported languages without it changing your default language to them.
http://www.lojban.org/ - Lojban: the logical language - an interesting constructed language which is based on the principles of logic and aims to allow maximum flexibility of expression.  But isn\'t, in my experience, quite as easy to learn as they claim.

[ramlambmoo]

Ram: you\'re beginning to sound ungrateful for your MacDonald\'s and Nikes.  

Dont get me started....

ramlambmoo mentioned the idea that different languages are like different types of food. Indeed they both add diversity to to the world, but there is a serious flaw in directly comparing languages to food: everyone knows how to eat - there is no or very little learning needed to eat different types of food (maybe e.g. learning to use chopsticks and even that\'s usually optional), whereas a lot of effort is needed to learn to understand a new language.

1) I didnt say languages and food were the same, i was just saying that those are two of the many things which add diversity, and which would increase effeciency if they were made uniform.  I was just showing how if everyone conformed it wouldnt be very good.
2) Theres more to eating then shoving food in your mouth- if i go to japan and eat there it would be a couple of months before i would adapt and come to actually enjoy eating, because it would take a long time to get used to their food, just like it would take a long time to get used to language.  Im not saying they\'re the same, the time span for language is significantly longer than food but there are similarities, and i think my point holds.

...and my post about gestures which is somewhere earlier in this thread, and maybe I should re-post it somewhere else.

I saw it, but due to the nature of the discussion it seems to have been lost in the flurry of arguements.  Try posting it on the suggestion boards, if it hasnt already been suggested there.

actually i learned good bit of english from playing police quest, space quest and leisure suit larry games when i was younger...

ahhh, good old police quest and space quest, i remember those...

[muteki]

Originally posted by ramlambmoo

The official language of PS is english. If you\'re going to help people get into PS in their native languages, fine, but I\'m totally against the separation based on language that will inevitably happen if people can have the convenience of using their native language, instead of having to practice english. This separation will hamper RP, and be bad for a general mindset that might even culminate in racism towards RL people, that will manifest at least in guilds only accepting people who come from certain language areas, which would not even have any RP value. Furthermore, in todays world, being able to communicate in the english language is almost a requirement, so why not take the opportunity to learn it while doing something fun, where it doesn\'t matter if you make mistakes, than having to do so later under way less pleasant circumstances?

And before you accuse me of not knowing what it is like to be non-native english speaking: I am not natively english speaking, but AMOF, I don\'t see this matter in any way, and will decline to use my native language in PS.

In fact, I think it sucks very badly to have all these non-english content on the internet. It adds to redundancy, and the information I need might simply be written in any of the multiple languages I don\'t understand. If everyone would simply use english if by any means possible, the purpose of the internet, which is communicating information to the broadest base of people possible, would be achieved way better.

That has got to be the most narrow minded rant ive ever heard.  Ok, the offical language of PS is english, so that language should be used.  But how can you expect everyone on the internet to use english? Oh, boo hoo you cant read some of the content?  Oh, you must feel so left out being the majority of users who can read most things on the internet.  Why in gods name should everyone be forced to speak english on the inernet? To make it easier for us? WTF? Its called tolerance.  Diversity.  I only speak english, but i understand how bad it is as a language to learn properly.  Linguistically english is one of the worst languages around with the amount of euphemisms, sayings, metaphors etc... plus the largely non-existent spelling rules (well for me ) and the ridiculously felixble grammer system.... Im very happy i was born and english speaker because it is the language out of all in the world i would least like to have to learn. I would support a global language on the internet, but only if it wasnt english, so it would be easy to learn.  Something like Korean, except more european. (latin perhaps? lol).  I say korean because its a very structured, scientific language- everything can be said pretty much one or two ways, and you know exactly what everything means.  Plus it is 100% phonetically correct- what you see written is exactly how you pronounce it, every time.  If we had a global language, it surely would need to be a good language.

um... speaking of worst laguage to learn, try chinese, especially traditional chinese...which is using in Taiwan.
Instead of using spelling, we have over 400,000 characters exist. 4,000 of them are the common use characters. Lots of characters have two or three different pronunciations, applying the different pronunciation can lead the sentence to completely different meaning. And even by missing one tiny stroke of some characters can oppsite the meanings.
I havn\'t start to talk about the grammer yet...

why i\'m talking about those? i think i\'m just bored...

[mcclane]

>> would you choose english or gaelic, provided that you\'re capable of writing in both?

Theres no such language as gaelic. Gaelic is a term to describe 3 different languages and also as a term to describe a particular culture of people i.e > The gaels.

Theres Gaeilge (Irish Gaelic), Scottish Gaelic and Manx (Isle of Man).

I?d choose gaeilge.

[mcclane]

>>speaking of worst laguage to learn, try chinese, especially traditional chinese

I?ve heard that alright but i?d have to try it to believe it. English is actually supposed to be particularily difficult for non-native speakers but gaeilge (Irish gaelic) is extremely difficult.