An aethiest's prayer to Catholics on this sad day.

[Moogie]

Gronomist, John Paul II was the single Pope for over 20 years. How old are you again, girl...? O.o

As for his life achievements. He himself was the first Polish pontiff. He left his homeland to achieve this position after his religious beliefs became strengthened from many years of hardship under the occupation of Nazi Germany, Russia and other invading countries. He is largely responsible for the downfall of communism in these places- an incredible feat on its own.

Many other feats include the construction of hundreds of new churches all over the world, speaking to audiences of over 16 million pilgrims on special services held on Wednesdays, his campaigning for human rights, his consolidation of the church... he did many things. Whether they actually mean important things to the non-religious of us doesn\'t matter, because they were still great achievements under any opinion. Yes, he had some controversial views on things such as contraception and abortion, but his aim was to strive towards a world where people don\'t settle feuds with bloodshed and war and death, where everyone could live happily as equals. Religious or not, that\'s a beautiful thing to strive for.

[acraig]

From what I understand he wanted to stay on in his role no matter what.  He said suffering and struggle is part of the faith.  Again I might not agree 100% with his stance on issues but at least he was firm in them and didn\'t try to pander to people in order to be popular.  The Pope visited our city in 1984 and drove down near my house .  The thing with the Pope was that his only agenda was his faith and trying to do what he thought was right.  Unlike some people in society who try to twist faith as a hammer to beat people over the head with.

[Efflixi Aduro]

Though I\'m not a catholic nor a very good christian (still stuck between if theres a God or not) I still feel bad for the people who where truly affected by his death. But, if theres a God or not, his soul is now at rest. And, personally, I could see this coming. This makes 2 people I knew personally and the pope died in one week...

He was a truly good man though. When a man attempted to assasinate him, he went to the prison the guy was being held and forgived him and his sins.

[Phinehas]

I am a Christian, although a Protestant, not a Catholic. I do not agree with everything that has been said on this thread, but I do agree that he was a great man, and did many good things in his lifetime. It is sad to see him go, and I hope that the next pope will be similar.

[Icefalcon]

I am also a Protestant Christian, and so I don\'t agree with his religion. But from I could tell, he was a good Catholic Pope, not self-absorbed and self-centered like so many others. I cannot say I mourn the loss, but I can sympathize.

[Foresteer]

Originally posted by Monketh

Originally posted by Gronomist (
Oh... And well, I\'m not really a celebrity stalker, but what exactly did he do for his people besides read prayers and appear once in a while? Anything I missed?

*cough* Fall of the Iron Curtain *cough*

The pope was an important figure.. but it was the german people who tore down the wall after taking the words of the soviets about granting more freedom (an obvious sign of weakness) and *ahem* \"capitalized\" on it *pun inteneded* tearing down the wall ending the iron curtian as russia basicaly gave up and collapsed upon itself...

Still was an important role of wisdom to many people

(as per my multiverse-al beliefs) May he have much fun exploring the next plane past this one (his wavelength was definantly high enough to get him at LEAST a few vibrations higher) who knows.. i hear we\'re all up for a dimmentional shift higher in 2012 maybe we\'ll see him again some day one of the predicted evens of 2012 \"the age of aquarious\" is that many of the higher vibration \"dead\" will again be on the same plane of existence as earth.. more like we join them but whatever

Rest in peace paul you are the one religous leader that honestly didnt have an agenda behind you.. we\'ll miss you sorely

[lynx_lupo]

He was a man of great achievements. Even if you strip the whole religion bit from them, the result of his \"reign\" is very good.

[Cybio Kingfist]

Originally posted by provisionist1
Whether you\'re agnostic, Anglican, an atheist, Baha\'i, Buddhist, Catholic, Confucian, Hindu, Islamic, Jewish, Pagan, Protestant, Shinto, Sikh, or Taoist, he was a great man. Lets hope/pray the next Pope does as a good a job.

What if we\'re none of the above?

I don\'t know anything really about the Pope\'s accomplishments but from what I\'ve heard he was a pretty demn good Pope. So sorry to hear it.

Especially sucks that he had to go on sick for the time that he did.

[Cyl]

Well I dont know what to think.  Somehow I think that death must hav been a redemption for him. In the last years of his life Johannes Paul II. was ridden from diseases, and age took it\'s toll. He was a great man, but he had reached his limits.

[Platyna]

I do underestand and respect that people are sad that they lost their
religious leader. But for god\'s sake, 50 TV channels and everywhere about
pope all the time...I see news paper in a shop...pope, first page, second,
third...last, on the cover...I will turn on my favorite music station - pope,
I will enter URL of my favorite info service...whole design in black, whole
site with some pope\'s quotes and photos...like nothing else important would
happen on the entire planet. Now some big guys in Cracov will raise hell
in Vatican to get pope\'s heart so they will have same amount of pilgrims
and tourists who leaves there thick cash, like Jasna Gora or Czestochowa,
or Wadowice (the city where pope was born). It is disgusting and sick in
my opinion.

Regards.

[Moogie]

Let people pay homage and show their respect, it\'s not sick. Incase you didn\'t notice, the guy died. He won\'t ever be watching HIS favourite TV channels ever again. I\'m sure you can put up with it for a few days untill people calm down and life turns back to normal. Show some sympathy.

[Robinmagus]

I\'m christian. Maybe not die hard but i am. And i never saw what he did exept what gronomist stated above...I should watch the news more often...

[Platyna]

Originally posted by Moogie
Let people pay homage and show their respect, it\'s not sick. Incase you didn\'t notice, the guy died. He won\'t ever be watching HIS favourite TV channels ever again. I\'m sure you can put up with it for a few days untill people calm down and life turns back to normal. Show some sympathy.

In Poland, Moogie, it will take like a month. It is here like some kind of
national hysteria. Looks like those people don\'t really believe in God if they
are that sad that pope is now with God, If I\'d believe in that there is a better
life after death I\'d be rather happy that pope died since it is better to be
with your Lord in heaven than be a weak, suffering from Parkinson old man.
Also first major demonstration were in 1968 - 10 years before pope became
a pope, and that demonstration had been made by students of University
of Warsaw after communist goverment forbidden to play \"Dziady\" written
by A. Mickiewicz who is considered our greatest poet. Students organized
a gathering near the Mickiewicz\'s statue, alot of people from whole Warsaw
has came to demonstrate with them, goverment has sent military and police.
My mother got beaten up almost to death and arrested, few years later she
had to escape because in her close friend\'s home police found leaflets,
they executed him instantly, and she saw, how they are taking him out,
through the window, where then were the pope? Safely in Rome with
guards. I am not negating that pope was a good man but people are
exaggerating it too much. Communism would die without speeches of pope
anyway.


Regards.

[Lyrah]

I am not sure the timing of this, but I would say more than a year ago, he went officially to Jerusalem and appologized for the Inquisition (well not by name, but \"sins of the Roman Church against Jews...what else could he have meant?), and surprisingly...the appology was accepted. Since then the Roman Church and Jewish Faith have been MUCH more friendly. I would say that his forgiving nature, OH did I say that he forgave the man that shot and TRIED to kill him...well he did, is one part of him that MANY have trouble understanding or embracing. I know that I would have trouble forgiving someone that tried to kill me, unless they ASKED for forgiveness and showed remorse...then I would be MUCH more inclined to forgive.

He also followed his conscious and became a priest in a time and place where doing so was DANGEROUS, or even deadly. Nazis put Catholics in death camps too.

Whether or not I agree with him, his charisma was something to be amazed at. Many catholics have always traveled to Rome, but...NO crowd has EVER broken his numbers...no matter WHERE he went the crowds were mind blowingly HUGE.

Originally posted by Gronomist
I can\'t say that I bother the least. I think I\'ve seen the pope die ten times already, and if I\'m not entirely mistaken, they\'ll just elect another man who\'s so old, he\'ll die soon too anyway.

But yeah, sad face and all that.

Oh... And well, I\'m not really a celebrity stalker, but what exactly did he do for his people besides read prayers and appear once in a while? Anything I missed?

[Lyrah]

I did notice a few people on the local news (DFW Texas) that were sad, but it was a bit different than others, they stated that they felt empty like a family member died, but were sure that he was in God\'s presence now, and NOT in pain.  The lady fairly GLOWED when she said this, so I am sure it was a relief to her, I only hope that the rest of the worlds Catholics get to the point she was at.

[/QUOTE]
In Poland, Moogie, it will take like a month. It is here like some kind of
national hysteria. Looks like those people don\'t really believe in God if they
are that sad that pope is now with God, If I\'d believe in that there is a better
life after death I\'d be rather happy that pope died since it is better to be
with your Lord in heaven than be a weak, suffering from Parkinson old man.
Also first major demonstration were in 1968 - 10 years before pope became
a pope, and that demonstration had been made by students of University
of Warsaw after communist goverment forbidden to play \"Dziady\" written
by A. Mickiewicz who is considered our greatest poet. Students organized
a gathering near the Mickiewicz\'s statue, alot of people from whole Warsaw
has came to demonstrate with them, goverment has sent military and police.
My mother got beaten up almost to death and arrested, few years later she
had to escape because in her close friend\'s home police found leaflets,
they executed him instantly, and she saw, how they are taking him out,
through the window, where then were the pope? Safely in Rome with
guards. I am not negating that pope was a good man but people are
exaggerating it too much. Communism would die without speeches of pope
anyway.


Regards.
[/QUOTE]