Training by PCs

[Andrek]

Sorry if this has been posted, I could not find it in a search.

I think that being trained by PC\'s of a higher rank in skill thank you should be allowed.

WHY:
1. This will give players a chance to exchange service for tria
2.  This gives a good start for the barter system
3.  The economy could start to grow
4.  Older players could teach the new ones their style of fighting, mining, spellcasting (ie RolePlaying)
5.  Competitive Pricing which drives prices down on training... (you will still have control of the physical goods ie glyphs, weapons, armor, etc...)
6.  How many master swordsmen/smiths/cooks would train their apprentices back in the day... it will transfer over.

I like the idea please give all feedback.

[Talamir]

This will lead in situations like guild leaders giving their members training for free, while others waste tria and PP. That gives those people a totally unfair advantage. Since the trainer has to pick his own price/barter guess what. Theres no stopping him from taking 1 tria every level and then giving that back to the person. Its a no. Sorry. Later. Bye. Cya.

[Andrek]

This is true... though you could ask all the guild leaders not to do so... if caught the guild could be put on probation.  If it happens again it could be disbanded.

Now that is a little extreme, but as well SOME free training could be used as a guild tool for recruitment (limit it).  Possibly you cannot train unless you have at least a rank 5 higher than the person asking to be trained.  I don\' t think it would be to bad.

Just some food for thought.

[hramrach]

But if you are training your guild members you want some services back in exchage. So you just choose a different way of payment.

Otherwise you would train anybody for free, or am I missing something?

[Talamir]

Now that is a little extreme, but as well SOME free training could be used as a guild tool for recruitment (limit it).

Did I miss something or did you just say that leaders could use free training to get people in their guild? To bribe new members? Eh? have you no shame!? Any guild leader that does/suggests that deserves to be banned/overthrown. Now..If you didn\'t mean that, please, explain.

[hramrach]

Anyway, what exactly would the training be like?

Normally characters advance by practicing thier skills, at least it is what I would expect. What would the training be like?

Perhaps practicing while quided by a more skilled teacher could yield faster advances. And there could be a teaching skill that further increases the bonus

[hramrach]

What\'s wrong with leaders bribing new members?

I guess that\'s what guilds are for. They can provide some services to you and require you to provide something back.

Anyway, the leader would still put some effort into the teaching. So if he needs the new members so badly, why not?

[Nikodemus]

This would be great, realistic and logical idea, but:
As Talamir told, it will lead to training for free and generally most of the people will use it in the wrong way.
Unless there will be some good working idea to prevent all this, what isn\'t happying in real and what is in MMORPGS, there is nothing to talk about.

[Andrek]

Originally posted by Talamir

Now that is a little extreme, but as well SOME free training could be used as a guild tool for recruitment (limit it).

Did I miss something or did you just say that leaders could use free training to get people in their guild? To bribe new members? Eh? have you no shame!? Any guild leader that does/suggests that deserves to be banned/overthrown. Now..If you didn\'t mean that, please, explain.

Sorry, for another payment besides Tria.

I think that a guild leader or any Character that knows swordsmanship, Mining, or Spellcasting could do this.  They could charge less, or require some service.

It opens the doors to good RP.  \"Yeah I\'ll teach you to use fire, but those pesky cats keep getting up on my roof.  Put some oil up there and I will help you with fire magic.\"  \"Mining is a dwarven thing... you wouldn\'t get it, though if you bring me a few grobble fingers I may consider it.\"  \"I need some gold ore for a new weapon idea, bring me 4 of them and I will train you.\"

Think about it....

[Darkhack]

Originally posted by Andrek
It opens the doors to good RP.  \"Yeah I\'ll teach you to use fire, but those pesky cats keep getting up on my roof.  Put some oil up there and I will help you with fire magic.\"  \"Mining is a dwarven thing... you wouldn\'t get it, though if you bring me a few grobble fingers I may consider it.\"  \"I need some gold ore for a new weapon idea, bring me 4 of them and I will train you.\"

It also opens up the door to in game scamming as well.  It seems to be that people might try to take advantage of it, like making you do things and give them stuff and not train you in return or vice versa.  

Not that the PS community would do such a thing, because to be honest this is probebly one of the BEST communities I\'ve seen in a long time.  Probebly because all the people who would act in such a rude manor wouldn\'t bother to play such a \"sucky game like planeshift\" not realizing it\'s still in development.  But still, despite this, at some point in the future this could possibily be used in such a way so we would need a system to prevent/counter it.

[Danok]

I actually think this is a cool idea, Andrek.  I think it would add immensely to the RP and would enable more accomplished players to \"pass-along\" their skills.

I don\'t see why one couldn\'t structure in a \"Fair Market Value\" system into this to help curb abuses.

I do understand some of the concern--this is a very free-market concept and such systems do not function well in the absence of a moral framework.

For example, if I were a member of a Guild (currently training but not there yet), I would still be delighted to spend time working with a Newbie to help him/her progress quicker.  My hope would be they would want to follow in my footsteps, but hey it\'s a free world and I can\'t force him/her to do anything, right?  If they didn\'t \"take up the cause,\" as it were, it\'s my own fault if I didn\'t get something in return for my efforts.

[hramrach]

You cannot dismiss everything that could possibly be abused. If we did so, there would be nothing in the game.
It is always so with services that you cannot enforce that people do get what they paid for. It is the same with teaching, smithing, or anything else.

The only thing that prevents scamming is bad reputation of the scammer. There is nothing else that could be done AFAIK.

It becomes bad when the number of people playing in overlapping timezones gets over some hundreds. Before that the reputation works quite well.

[Andrek]

What is AFAIK?

Now I understand it could be abused and bad reps will occur.  This is part of the game.  There could be lists in taverns or city squares that will tell you such things.  But they need to be reported and investigated by leadership (ie GM\'s and such), courts could happen and thus more good story could play out.

As well punishment should happen for falsely accusing people.

JM2C

[DaveG]

Originally posted by Andrek
What is AFAIK?

That means \"as far as I know\".  There\'s allot of \'Net abbreviations, though I usually restrict myself to \"aka\" and \"btw\".  (Come on people... just type things out...   )

Here\'s a link to the forums FAQ listing the common ones.

[Darkmoon]

The ability for players to train players is not only already possible, but is in use now in-game.  Those with the ability are a rare occurrence at the moment, as I\'m still trying to figure out how to best make this work and minimize the things that can go wrong with it.  It is not something that can be attained by any player yet through game mechanics, it must be manually assigned by an admin.  It also does not work as dynamically now as I\'d like for it to.  This will be a WIP for some time yet, but I think it will come eventually.  Player trainers will be scarce, as I don\'t think it should be handed to just anyone who wants to.  Sort of like hidden masters that train beyond NPC ability or train obscure/rare skill aspects that can\'t be obtained anywhere else.  This can also be an avenue for impromptu player-made quests in exchange for said special training.

Details on player training will not be forthcoming anytime soon; those who watch the codebase commits will probably know before the rest of you when support for this gets implemented.  Key words there being \"not.. ..soon\".