Steep learning curve, fun?

[hitancrias]

I?m glad to hear people found my tips useful.

Originally posted by Godfrey
So, um... am I the only person who actually enjoyed the

I too enjoyed the death-realm the first time I got there, and still do. But the big difference is that our first ?death-realm experience? was in a much smaller death-realm. Sure, it was dark, but you couldn?t really get lost as it was just one path.
When they expanded the death-realm, we weren?t newbies anymore, so it again was relatively easy for us to adapt and to find the new route to the exit.

Right now, new people have to face the big death-realm. It\'s a long run, and they get lost and often have to start over, because they often fall because they don?t see where they are going because they are not familiar with the camera-modes and it is dark. I can imagine it is really annoying. For us it might have been awesome to explore the new death-realm, but people who are new might rather want to explore the good looking city and the mechanics of the game first.

When I first heard people who said they were trapped down there for days, I could hardly believe it. But I?m afraid it?s true in some cases. When people make a new char or leave at all because of the death-realm is too frustrating, you know there is something wrong.

Since the average newbie is quite a bit shyer then the average long time player, maybe we also should actively approach people who seem to be lost.
There are souls to be saved!

[Howk Oga]

I joined only a few days ago and quickly found myself in DR. And that is where I probably understood how the game mechanics worked and relating to other characters. I received help from someone who realised I was new. Since then, I have ended up down there a number of times and have helped a dozen of new players to get out (which I usually approached wondering if they are doing alrigth), who have been really appreciative. in fact last night two were about to quit the game altogether, but after i gave them some help and tips on Planeshift they stayed on.

This is the first Rp game i have played and it has been difficult to get going but tons of fun now that I understand how it all works.

[Rumpnisse]

I was meaning to make some lengthy reply about the dynamics of drawing players into a new game - level of complexity vs ease of use, etc... but after tonight I\'m just packing it in, instead.

Oh, I did find my way around the Death Realm using the -fullbright settings. Once someone shows you how to do it and you actually *can see* the map then it isn\'t too hard. Although it would still be murder for a noob unless he just happens to find a kind soul when he dies. Most people who download PS probably uninstall after dying and never finding their way out of the DR, but hey, if that\'s the way you like it. I only stuck around for so long because I really wanted to find a nice mmorpg to play around with, so I was rather hellbent on giving it my best shot.

The thing that made me suicide my character and pack it in was the fact that I\'m still owning exactly 0 trias after three evenings of PlaneShift and I have no pickaxe for mining, nothing to kill rats with, nothing to really do exept impotently walk around trying to GET SOME SENSE out of the NPC\'s who just want me to rephrase everything endlessly... and I like to think that I can speak rather good english even though it\'s not my native language. Surely SOME quest should have dropped out of them by now.

The NPC\'s are morons. There is no documentation about how to get started (no REAL documentation). The forums provide you with some vague idea about what to do. But you\'re still left to fend for yourself 99.9% of the time. Sorry, but that just won\'t do. What\'s the USE of having a newbie forum section if it\'s filled with piffle? New players dont come here for \"some vague clue\" they come here for ANSWERS. Unless you are get someone to babysit you and walk you through the game every step of the way, this is just too hard. Couple that with the cumbersome in-game chat and you\'re up a certain creek without a paddle.

I have been trying my hand at this for three evenings now and I still have no idea how to actually GET STARTED. I have scouted out the location where I go to mine, but I can\'t mine without a pickaxe. I need some money. You can get money for killing rats, I understand after reading the forums. No use talking to Harnqvist because he\'s an idiot. I tried to venture into the sewers a few times to kill some rats. The rats were either \"impervious to attack\" or just killed me without my doing any damage. Apparently I need some sort of weapon to kill them. For a weapon I need some money. Sweet Jesus Christ, why do you PUNISH new players to this extent? Enough! Getting somewhere in PlaneShift without a personal in-game babysitter to hold your hand and tell your everything in person is impossible it seems. Doesn\'t that tell you that there\'s something fundamentally wrong here?

But I think you cater to a totally different crowd. The \"game\" aspect of this \"mmorpg\" is completely and utterly lacking. This is more of a \"3d roleplaying chat\" than a mmorpg. (and dont start splitting hairs, you know what I am referring to) Well, each to his/her/its own. Hope you have fun marrying each other in your 3d fantasy world. I think I\'ll go find a mmorpg that you can actually *play* a little bit as well.  Bye bye now & Take care.

[Karyuu]

Hiya, I believe that the term \"pre-alpha tech demo\" was mentioned enough times for it to be a sort of hint as to what to expect. This is far from a complete game, and definitely not newbie friendly, yes, unless someone has a lot of patience and determination. This is not even a \"game\" yet - most people do not consider it to be at that stage. So what you are saying is true. But considering that everything here is volunteered and the development team does everything in their free time, this is still pretty impressive.

First, you do not need a weapon to kill rats - you can fight using fists. Monsters are impervious to attack when NPCclient that handles such actions is down, so I\'m sorry that you caught it at a bad time once. If something kills you without doing any damage, it\'s likely a bug, some issue of lag, or perhaps you simply didn\'t notice the attack messages. I believe there are also rats of different strengths.

Second, there are FAQs in these forums just for beginners. They are stickied as \"Important,\" and deal with many of the questions new players tend to ask, such as what to actually do, where to find something, and how to ask for further help.

I\'m not blaming anyone for giving up, but I too would like people to understand that this is just a beginning, and throwing your hands up and saying how utterly hard everything is, without doing enough research outside of the game to understand what you must do inside of it, doesn\'t help anyone with anything. There are plenty of people who immediately jump in and have no problems finding what they want, even without others showing them. And there are those who can\'t understand a single command. But there is help, whether someone needs it or not - you can refer to the Help tab of your chat window, you can send a petition to GMs, you can ask questions on the forum, you can wander into the PlaneShift IRC channel and prod people over there. There is always someone available - as long as you don\'t have unrealistic expectations for a game at this stage of development, which I think is the basic problem.

The devs aren\'t yet working on making a watered down newbie-friendly beginning. They are working towards one with stable code.

[Izzy*dot]

*rolleyes*

I would like to cuuuuurse right now but I know you\'ll kick my butt for that, Karyuu
How can people be so harsh? Phew, unbelievable. It\'s like it has been said before, WHAT DO YOU THINK PRE-ALPHA MEANS?

No need to get on your horses, no need to break everything down, I agree there are lots of bugs, there are lots of problems...But hey, I got something new for you, Rumpnisse. Mainly, if something is not working, like the rat you can\'t kill.. IT\'S YOUR OWN FAULT. Got that? It\'s you, it\'s not planeshift, it\'s you. And you know what you do then? You get on to the forums and ask for help. Or ask in-game. So you say the newbie forum is filled with...\"piffle\". Uhuh. Well then mister Rumpnisse how come YOU didn\'t ask any questions then? I see, you know, you got only 2 posts on this forum. Hmmh... I guess if you had SOOOO MUCH problems, you should have asked aloooot of questions, cuz since the answers arent here (it\'s all PIFFLE), it\'s you who asks them.

No, be lazy. Give up. If you think like that, you\'re not even meant to be here.

Sorry for my ramble everybody else

[Araye]

Hey I see your point.  But I didn\'t quit, now I love to play.

Getting started is hard for some character types and can seem unfair especially when some races are started out with over 100 STR and END.  This makes it easy for them to walk into the arena and start killing mercenaries bare handed (as I can now) whereas it took me weeks of development before I could go up against them.

Since these certain races can kill bigger quicker, they are able to quickly raise the stats they suck in, whereas it took me forever.

I too was stuck in the death realm for three solid days.  I was very frustrated, but stuck it out because I could play this game on Linux.  Maybe because I am used to Linux and its development model I saw the game differently.  I don\'t know, but I\'m glad I did.

The key thing that changed the game for me was this:  I asked for help.  I swallowed my, \"I can do this by myself\" attitude and asked the next person that walked past me in the DR for help.  You know what?  They helped me.  I got out.

I quickly went back to my solitary ways however, but I knew that I could ask for help and someone would help me.

The next thing I learned was, join a guild.  I thought, \"I like being a loner, an outsider.  Yeah, that\'s me, dark and myterious\".  But a nice person, one that I had met earlier said, \"hey want to join my guild?\"

I was hesitant.  It was something new.  But after some thought I figured, \"I can always quit.\"

Guess what?  After I joined the guild, the chat box came alive and I suddenly had friends.  Instantly, talking about everything.  Answering all the questions I had and even some I didn\'t know to ask.  Tons of information.

So if you\'re new.  If you\'re lost.  ASK!  Then JOIN A GUILD!

We are more than happy to help.  I\'ve sort of made it my mission to help others.  /tell Araye help

If I\'m online I will help you.

Araye

Edited some typos

[Izzy*dot]

See, what Araye says is right. It\'s what I and many others will say too. Ask. It\'s not a sin to ask. And indeed, like Araye did, suck in that \"I don\'t need help\" attitude

Well, I said it a bit more...angry probably. But hey. Same message Oh and hey Rumpnisse, I guess there\'s no point in this thread since you\'ve probably already left, but in case you read this : SEE, THERE ARE HELPING PEOPLE HERE