Problem with High scores

[Karyuu]

Originally posted by Suno_Regin
Well, ingame charts would be nice, though. Not these OOC charts, but in the arena, there should be some kind of recorded high score (recorded by the server, but there would also be some kind of NPC charter to ask questions about the highscore poster).

How would these in-game charts be explained, if we are still dealing with duel points? Who is keeping track of these duel points in the arena, and how are they counted? Can you provide an explanation that\'ll work at all?

Sengus: the AP system itself isn\'t going to remain as is. Can\'t state exactly what will happen because a) I\'m not 100% sure, b) I\'m not at liberty to say :P But there is no reason for the AP chart as well.

[noXide]

Originally posted by Suno_Regin
Noxide now has THREE seperate characters in the dueling scores. What he\'s doing, is logging on with his GM account, and his newbie accounts, and constantly challenging, accepting, and yielding, to gain so many points in so little time.

Hm I won\'t quote myself :/ I already said my GM had nothing to do with this, yet I\'m not surprised it slipped your mind. xP

Originally posted by Suno_Regin
Well, ingame charts would be nice, though. Not these OOC charts, but in the arena, there should be some kind of recorded high score (recorded by the server, but there would also be some kind of NPC charter to ask questions about the highscore poster).

Highscore of what?
Anything you obtain stat/point wise is OOC ><\' The skills/stat window: Sword=??, Light Armor=??, ...etc; OOC
To move DP from the web list to the arena on a wall, just like that... Is stupidity. It would need alot of thought. You can\'t just have a list on the wall ranking how many players you\'ve killed. How would your name make its way to the list ICly and for what reasons? You challenge a player - he accepts - whoever wins gets some sort of Dueling Exp, that\'s then updated on a wall in the arena...? Remembering that skill/stat/duel \"points\" are all OOC.

--Edit: Beat me to it xP

[Pestilence]

Are all OOC??

They shouldn\'t be. They should be tools to roleplay with. If you play a strong person I think you should make sure your strength is trained. If you play an alchemist as soon as it works you should train it in my opinion

As I said ofcourse the way you get these stats is pretty OOC, but it should be used IC so it should never be tottally OOC.

If you feel things like stats and such are tottally OOC I think you are at the wrong place as PS is a game where you roleplay. Meaning you should use the tools given to you to make it more realistic.

If you don\'t do that you could just as well take a piece of paper and go play D&D or something as you don\'t use Planeshift anyhow exept perhaps for an easy meeting place.

[Father Sengus]

No, but I think you got it all wrong Pestilence. People are not claiming that stats are OOC, but rather that the idea of making a list based on numbers is OOC.
If after a tournament, a list is made of the best duelists, based on the results of the fights, it is an IC list.
If duel points are automatically calculated and the computer creates a list of the best duelists based on that, the list is OOC.

Of course people should train their stats and skills in order to make a credible character, but the point here is not to think that numbers, like 50 strenght, is OOC.
You understand?

[Pestilence]

I understand the number itself is indeed OOC but it stands for something that is IC. I mean in RL you can also measure things like stength and give it a number.

The computer does this for you becuase you can\'t feel how stong your character is.

I\'m just saying that you should make it IC by saying someone is looking from the stages and keeping score or something with dueling for example or saying it\'s what the Hydlaa citizens are talking about when you ask them about a person or when you ask who the strongest man would be.

Having such a list doesn\'t have to be that OOC, only an OOC representation of what you should use IC.

[noXide]

Originally posted by Pestilence
Are all OOC??
They shouldn\'t be. They should be tools to roleplay with. If you play a strong person I think you should make sure your strength is trained. If you play an alchemist as soon as it works you should train it in my opinion

The points are all OOC, yes.
Stats&numbers are not used to roleplay with and are definatley not realistic. Sure you can RP your strength is trained well, or talk ICly about how Levrus helped you master the dark magics. As soon as you mention ranks/stats, the fact you can even open your skills list or have one - becomes OOC.
Your\'re then looking at the game from a players point of view, not your characters.

And you\'ve only thought about this from a tournament view point. What happens to all the murderers, that do not wish to be on the list - wouldn\'t be on the list, because it was done away from the community (noone saw it happen) Therefor such a list cannot work.

You can\'t give DP Exp to those that only duel under a watchful eye and not anyone else.

[Pestilence]

I disagree stats and numbers are used in roleplaying. It is an easy way to look who is stronger and it represents how you should roleplay.

As I said they are tools to roleplay.

For example when you play D&D your barbarian will have a lot more strength then the wizard normally. The number itself could be called OOC but it\'s data you use to see how one should act and if two try the same thing who succeeds and who doesn\'t.

It\'s a representation of what you can do and what not.

As for murderers haven\'t seen many of those but if thats your problem suggest you can only get dueling points at certain points in the arena for example.

[noXide]

Originally posted by Pestilence
As for murderers haven\'t seen many of those but if thats your problem suggest you can only get dueling points at certain points in the arena for example.

It goes from bad to the extreme xD
If you have certain DP areas, you\'ll have mass amounts of people dueling in these areas for one purpose - to obtain the points. Thus we have the same problem as this Duel Score table out of game caused, but now it\'s in-game.

Why would your character take a walk to this \"DP Area\"? Now we can say ICly we\'re going to Levrus to learn some more about the ways of magic (not I\'m going there to raise my Crystal to 30), how would this be done for the DP areas? \'oh no sorry I cannot duel you here, for I must duel in the chamber that awards me duel points\' -.-

So currently we\'re at the stage of moving the Duel Scores to a wall in the arena and making Duel Point obtainable areas, so people can access this list... Hmmm and this is all for the reason of? I mean why does my character need DP, will it help him/her later on in-game?

Anywho, it doesn\'t solve any problems that we have discussed with the previous scoreboard. It\'ll still be cheatable and promote OOC actions.

[Pestilence]

OK now your not even trying to understand Noxide.

RP reason: obvious thats the dueling arena. In previous ages if you challenged someone to a duel you would also propose a time and place and wouldn\'t start fighting were they were. Thats the difference between a duel and a brawl.

And does this mean thats the only place you could duel for RP reasons? No ofcourse not but then you just wouldn\'t aquire the fame that comes from winning in the arena as no offical people are looking and making notes.

As for OOC misuse of those DPs thats a different point altogether. I do agree such things shouldn\'t be allowed, but I see no real way to stop it.

[noXide]

There is no use for DP, if you can RP dueling anywhere, why have the DP? You still havn\'t answered my question.
Noone has given a good reason to keep DP. Other than use of points/scoreboard - \'look how many newbs I\'ve bashed in\'

This can all be role played, as you have so clearly stated.
If you wish to duel and become famous for it, do it in a role play fashion. You have to have DP to allow good RP duels? No.

As it stands now DP has no refrence to the world of Planeshift.

Originally posted by Pestilence
As for OOC misuse of those DPs thats a different point altogether. I do agree such things shouldn\'t be allowed, but I see no real way to stop it.

Yes, there is. Remove it and let the RPers - RolePlay thier duels. After all it\'s the RP that matters, not the unusable DP ;)

[Pestilence]

scrapping points isn\'t a solution that is canceling it.

As for what use it is. It\'s use is that in normal lives you normally life in the same timezone. That PS doesn\'t have that you could claim to be the best delist becuse you never met someone else who claimed that and perhaps would be easely beaten by him.

The lists are a way to make the community a whole eventhough we play in different timezones.

[noXide]

Heh the list won\'t give you that outcome. Just because they are #1 doesn\'t mean that they\'re the best/strongest fighter.
And someone 12 hours time difference isn\'t ever going to get the chance to fight this guy/gal... Only aim to gather more points.

So, now we have player A who is at #1, we also have players B,C,D,... Making it thier goal to gather DP to be on the list.

So, we\'ll have characters looking at a scoreboard, seeing:
Player A: 1230 DP
Player B: 1005 DP
Player C: 986   DP

And thinking... I need XXX amount of DP to wipe him off the list. OOC? I think so. This is exactly the issue that lead to this thread being made.

Even if the Scoreboard doesn\'t say; Player A 1230 DP.
We will still have major OOC actions to gain a place on it - random duel invites and cheating. This was the problem with the last... I\'m sorry but I don\'t see how this will change, at least not without alot of thought and time.

[Pestilence]

Well perhaps the DP isn\'t the best thing to make a list of but still remain with my point that scrapping the list is giving up and not a true solution.

Anyhow if according to you it\'s all OOC anyhow I don\'t see what the problem is with such a list. If people want to sped time on getting those points well *shrugs*

[Karyuu]

Originally posted by Pestilence
Anyhow if according to you it\'s all OOC anyhow I don\'t see what the problem is with such a list. If people want to sped time on getting those points well *shrugs*

If people want to be OOC, there\'s no rule forbidding them from doing so (with the exceptions of using parantheses in-game, not infringing on anyone else\'s roleplay, yadda yadda). But there is absolutely no reason to let completely OOC elements remain just to give people something OOC to concentrate on. Therein lies the problem - instead of striving on having a roleplay reputation in-game, they rely on silly charts to \"prove\" something.