Distributed Server

[Zerotek]

Hello PlaneShift people, I\'m new here obviously, I\'ve talked to some of you on the IRC before sinking away in the darkness, and I think this (PlaneShift) is a great idea, and I\'d like to support it in my own way.


Okay, now I\'ll share my idea for it to be reviewed...

Distributed servers for PlaneShift.  As PlaneShift grows, the server will become more strained, as I\'m sure you know, and will make the PlaneShift experience a less enjoyable one.

I imagine you already thought about this, and figured that you\'d have more servers later on.

But what I\'m thinking is that, possibly after the official release of PlaneShift, you\'d offer a world designer, and a server program.

Then, you\'d have a team of trusted inspectors, who would check for the certain criterias to be filled.

Is it a realistic addition to the PlaneShift world?
Does it have a story that matches with the continuity?
Does the server bandwidth qualify?
Is there a way we can link it to the main world?
Subjectively, what is the overall opinion from the inspector of the environment?
Etc.

If the new server is deemed worthy, it becomes \"Certified\", and is merged with the main world.

If not, we simply inform the applicant of what needs to be improved, and that he should try again, with a minimum time lapse (so as to not be flooded, this could be an automated process, queuing applicants)

After a server has been added to the world, the players could be notified of this area by some sort of daily announcement, maybe if PlaneShift would have a newspaper, or a MOTD, whatever.  It\'s not necessary to warn the players so much, but I believe it\'d be nice.

During the game, when players would first enter the new map, he would be warned of the download size, possible time for download, and given the choice of continuing, or returning to the main world.  Something like, \"This trip could take x amount of time, do you wish to travel down that road?\"

Given the map was popular enough, it could become part of the main distribution.  Less frequently used maps could be removed from it to keep the download size down.

If the game incorporates game masters, the owners of the server could be responsible for game mastering, or he\'d be responsible to find himself a game master.  If you want something like, excellence through competition, you could make it so there\'d be a rating assigned to the maps, and somewhere, like on the web site, you could check your map rating, which would push game masters and map designers to make their place the best.  But I realize that maintaining those stats requires some time and effort.

Certainly, the logistics of this are a bit tricky, but I assume you\'ll have an out-of-game police force, much like ops in the IRC, and the inspectors could be a subset of them.  This is an open-source project, with enough interest in your project, you won\'t need to worry about manpower, it\'ll flow in due time.  I come from a graphical MUD, which is kind of synonymous with an MMOG, called Furcadia, where their method of policing is through a group called Beekin Helpers, there\'s a certain status that comes with being one, and it\'s working very well, so I believe that if you can emulate that, it would probably work very well.

So, a short resume of the above, is:
I wish that in PlaneShift, there would be the possibility of user-made, user-hosted maps, who would require to pass certification before being made into an official map.  I see that eventually, you might have an out-of-game social class of talented people who will expand the PlaneShift world into something even more tremendous, it doesn\'t ruin the continuity, offers even more reasons for players to come back (you could have full-time explorers!), adds an important aspect to gaming, customizability, and remains with the spirit of open-source.

Thank you for reading, and I eagerly await your suggestions and criticism.

[Jessyn]

zerotek - certainly an interesting idea, but i don\'t think it would be feasible, for several reasons.  groups of people have tried it in NWN, without much success, because it\'s easy to hide \'tricks\' into a map, like certain combinations of actions give god like power, etc.  the only way to protect against such things would be to inspect all the code, which is, of course, impossible.  It\'s really too bad, coz that could be really interesting, and i would love to explore full time.  Anyone who wants to make their own world should probably contact the dev team....

Jessyn

[Zerotek]

Really?  Hmm...

What about if, the map designer and such, produces an easily readable report of what the map contains, which would be submitted with the application.

It would be in binary, encrypted, and only the inspectors would have the key, or, actually, it doesn\'t have to be encrypted, just serializing it into binary and having it read by a program is encryption enough, I believe.

The report would contain like, all the items, etc.

And I guess you could use that program to open the map too, and it would contain all the scripts used in the map, you wouldn\'t have to read all the dialog or something, you could just check certain things.  I don\'t know how maps are made in PlaneShift though, so I don\'t really have any ideas how possible that is.

[Kiern]

I don\'t understand why these people so interested in making their own maps and things don\'t just join the PS team and help them out...you accomplish practically the same thing and get to see some of your ideas (hopefully) become a part of Yliakum, it is a lot more realistic/easier than doing that  

Although I, of course, have no knowledge on how to make these things and how much work it takes and how hard it is to do them and why someone would want to instead being apart of the main team....am I missing something?


Also....I hate my modem

[Zerotek]

I think that joining a team is an intimidating prospect.

One thing that made Furcadia really popular, is the ability to make your own \"dreams\".

Of course, Furcadia and PlaneShift are very different.

But if you would have had to join the Furcadia development team to make your own part of it, I think the place wouldn\'t be as popular.

I guess I shouldn\'t be making the comparison though, as Furcadia\'s dreams are very volatile, and there\'s no main continuity per se...

But even if it\'s an open-source project, joining the team might scare some potentially good mappers away, and I believe it\'s a lot more hassle.

You usually have to screen the people before they start doing their work, and that person might have to wait a while before starting, and lose interest in his project.  You have to then give the person the tools, and help him figure it out.  You have to update credits...

While if you have it like I suggested, you simply have to verify what he made, you have no obligations to the person, the person can start when he wants, and he can form his own gang of people that make maps, his own group, which will help each other.

The only people the PlaneShift team has to manage are the inspectors.  It makes things a bit more decentralized, and autonomous.

But, personally, I think it\'s intimidating to join the PlaneShift team, because I feel like I owe the team something.  If I act as an independent contributor, I feel much more free, and comfortable.

[Vengeance]

The issues I see with this are:

a) Creative skills required to make a new zone with new creatures would be VERY difficult to have.

b) The Settings skills to define new quests, new reasons to explore, etc. are also more difficult than they sound.

c) Certification of content to make sure that the content submitted for approval was the same as the content actually running on the server seems impossible to me.

All this being said, there is NOTHING keeping someone from setting up their own PS world just as you say, but using their own content.  All the source code is public and you can do your own worlds to your heart\'s content.  Your server won\'t connect up to other servers, but if your own world is so compelling, who cares?

Good luck,
Venge

[Zerotek]

Sorry if I seem annoying by stubbornly defending my idea but...

a) Creative skills required to make a new zone with new creatures would be VERY difficult to have.

b) The Settings skills to define new quests, new reasons to explore, etc. are also more difficult than they sound.

I think you\'re underestimating the imagination of people, thousands of people GM games everyday, and the same imagination required to make a good D&D game can be used for this, with some added consideration for the fact that it\'s not a D&D game, but an MMORPG.  If the PlaneShift team can come up with quests, why is anybody else not able to also?

Example: I have 9 years experience with a myriad of RPG systems (D&D Classic, AD&D 2nd Edition, D&D 3rd Edition, Shadowrun, Rifts, White Wolf games (V:tM, WW:A, Exalted, H:tR, etc.), Dream Pod 9 games (Tribes 8, Heavy Gear), Call of Cthulu, Cyberpunk 2020 and a few small-time ones), 3 years experience leading a roleplay guild in Furcadia, called Leirune, where we developped a world from scratch, including a detailed religion, languages, cultures, different magic systems, cities, and invented plots on a weekly basis, and I created a list of items and equipment, as well as their stats for a web-based RPG based on old BBS DOOR games called Drakeville, and I\'m currently creating my own rule system, called ForGE (Forge Gaming Engine, which development is very slow...)

Now, I\'m not part of the PlaneShift team, and I know I\'m not the only one with experience like that, and I know there\'s many who are much better than me to create such things.  But all that would be required for the distributed server, is a background story for the area.  Possibly later you can have the owner of the place have plots, but that\'s if that\'s supported in PlaneShift.

The only problem that I can see is that the PlaneShift team seems like it wants to maintain full control of the official story and events all over the realm.  This is understandable, since they are responsible for their game\'s success, and any failure on the part of the added server could taint PlaneShift\'s reputation.
What I\'m proposing, COULD make it so that the owners of the added world controls the story there.  Notice the capital could.

Having the owners of the map be the game masters for their area or such, if there is such a thing as game masters in the final release of PlaneShift, could make for a world populated with even more quests then the PlaneShift team could do, but they would have to trust these people.

But that\'s only one part of my idea, you can throw out the independent game masters and still retain the distributed server idea.

Also...  Who said anything about new creatures?  The objects in these maps could all be the same objects from the main world, maybe with a few added textures. It does not require new creatures or any thing that would stretch game mechanics.

c) Certification of content to make sure that the content submitted for approval was the same as the content actually running on the server seems impossible to me.

I see no reason for it to be impossible.  I\'m not talking about certifying a server for what is going on there, like, \"This server is operating is behaving properly after watching them like, for a week\", no, that\'s not what I mean.
I mean to certify from the start, as in, \"You have the correct attributes to become part of the PlaneShift world.\"
They could be monitored, as in, if there\'s any complaints coming from these servers, they could be reviewed, and if the server is breaching his agreement with the PlaneShift team to maintain certain rules in his environment, you pull the plug on him, he is no longer certified, and no longer linked from the main world.  

So, in fact, you\'d certify him that he\'d have the required things to become part of the main PlaneShift world, and that certification would also represent that he agreed to operate under the determined rules.

All this being said, there is NOTHING keeping someone from setting up their own PS world just as you say, but using their own content. All the source code is public and you can do your own worlds to your heart\'s content. Your server won\'t connect up to other servers, but if your own world is so compelling, who cares?

Yes, I realize that, but my goal is not to make a new game with the PlaneShift engine, but my goal is to expand and improve PlaneShift.  It makes PlaneShift \'scalable\', in marketroid term.  It might seem like it also makes it \'decentralized\', but with the certification, and the contract, you have rules in place to maintain control, and the characters and such are still all in the official PlaneShift database and such.

If I would be to follow your suggestion, and make a new game,  it\'d simply fragments the players.  I remember reading somewhere in the site that the developers of this game are trying to prevent fragmentation.  Instead of having a world of 1,500 players online, you\'d have a world of 1,000 players online in some world, and 500 in another one.  You\'re also losing some marketing, \"Hey, come play this game!\" without ever a mention of PlaneShift.


If you are worried about having to sit down and think how to implement this idea, I would gladly provide you with clear and concise documents, on which you could improve if needs be, that would contain:

• An analysis on how to implement this feature
• General guidelines on becoming certified (the details would be determined at a later date)
• The contract of behavior

I\'d abstract from the actual technical details of implementing it, leaving that to the developers.

Oh, and I apologize for the word by word dissection of your message, I am certainly not trying to troll, but I am simply attempting to prove my point.  Thanks. :)

[Vengeance]

I don\'t see the point of creating new zones with all preexisting artwork and creatures.  Where is the sense of discovery in that?

If you simply want to do quest scripting, you should join the team, imo, and help us make PS a better game.

- V