Author Topic: Transhumanism  (Read 3857 times)

Karyuu

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Re: Transhumanism
« Reply #15 on: May 29, 2006, 09:45:02 am »
Karyuu, I'm quite surprised that You are so enthusiastic about this topic :o.

Sci-fi/tech junkie :D Reading Dan Simmons did that. His portrayal of the future with its TechnoCore, farcasters, dataspheres, is as absolutely delicious as it is mindnumbingly frightening, but it's something I think I would embrace more than distrust. I don't consider using technology to "change" humankind cheating any more than using medicine to "cheat" disease, or death. People already have implants that allow them to live longer than they would otherwise, do things they couldn't do otherwise, etc. It's just taking it a step further, and I think the possibilities are worth seeing, and experiencing.

Personally I can't wait to walk somewhere with a chip stuck someplace, take a deep breath, and go, "Ahhh, the bandwidth is good here!" ;)
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Nividia Stormlance

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Re: Transhumanism
« Reply #16 on: May 29, 2006, 10:34:24 am »
Karyuu, I'm quite surprised that You are so enthusiastic about this topic :o.

Personally I can't wait to walk somewhere with a chip stuck someplace, take a deep breath, and go, "Ahhh, the bandwidth is good here!" ;)

At that time we will all be small roboflies ::)
« Last Edit: May 29, 2006, 10:36:53 am by Nividia Stormlance »
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hitancrias

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Re: Transhumanism
« Reply #17 on: May 29, 2006, 12:16:38 pm »
When the vacuum cleaner was invented, it became popular in no time. It turned out that the vacuum cleaner didn’t safe time however, because the social standards about how clean a floor should be raised.

I think that goes for body enhancements to the same extend. Where’s the fun if everybody can jump twice as high as is possible now? It will be funny for a week, granted, but not much more. Things like body implants sound too radical to be done for temporal coolness.

Even though I think ‘human enhancement technologies’ can be pretty dangerous, I don’t think it should be forbidden. People should be free to choose what they want with their lives and their bodies. However, the danger is that, in time, it gets impossible for people -not- to choose for body implants.

Right now, there are clubs where you can buy a VIP-chip and have it injected in your arm. click You can pay your drinks with the chip, and it also allows you to get to VIP rooms, where only people with implanted chips have access to. Not too much a problem right now, but what if nearly all clubs became 'chip only' or gave a lucrative discount. And what if shops did the same? It's not that unlikely: payment is faster and easier with an implanted chip and maybe even safer.

A little scenario: 2060. People can have robot arms which are coordinated nearly as good as normal arms and are much stronger. 95 % of the people has two or more additional robot arms, because nearly all tasks can be done more efficient that way. Some jobs require having them, not having them is seen as a handicap. It turns out robo implant arms are best accepted by the brains at a young age. Having them installed at a later age also gives more medical complications. The result: Parents will have the robo arms installed when their children have the right age, to minimize the risks. At that time, choice is gone.

Having said that, it's way too early for legislation or policy about this topic, as it's impossible to predict in which direction it will develop. It will be fun to watch the possibilities grow. But on the long run, technologies like these can have a huge influence on the society. It's important to be aware of that, so we can decide what we want, and how to organise things so that everybody stays free to accept it or not.
Hitancrias. Herbalist. Explorer.

operand

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Re: Transhumanism
« Reply #18 on: May 29, 2006, 04:07:45 pm »
Some people here are missing the point. Being a transhumanist doesn't mean to be able to jump higher than other people or to have
shopping chips in your arms. A transhumanist is someone who advocates the use of technology for human improvement.
And trust me, by improvement nobody means being able to jump higher. Through technology (nano, genetic and A.I.) we will be able,
if all goes ok, to manipulate (speed up, enchance qualitatively) our brains, manifacture stronger bodies for ourselves so we wont burn from space radiation while exploring, become resistant to all diseases etc...

Ofcourse, I don't want to loose my humanity either but I don't see how improving myself ('cause humans aren't perfect) would make me do so. Don't forget that we're constantly evolving, so what's called humanity today isn't the same as humanity a thousand years ago
and will not be the same humanity in a thousand (although things will change in a fifty to hundred years from now). Maybe we look the same as our medieval ancestors, but we lead radically different lives. Evolution speeds up- just like the expansion of the Universe and Moore's law. Soon it will be up to us to model our destiny and take the evolution in our own hands. Now, THAT is nature.

*edit*

And I forgot to mention: the beauty of transhumanism is that it advocates respect for those wishing to remain unenchanced unlike many neo-Luddites who promote hatred for those that are different.
(Karyuu I'm glad I got you interested. Make sure to read the Transhumanist FAQ on the www.transhumanism.org webpage)

Please avoid posting two or more successive posts before others have replied. Just edit your last post to add new information. Thanks! --Karyuu
« Last Edit: May 29, 2006, 07:34:34 pm by Karyuu »

Watcher

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Re: Transhumanism
« Reply #19 on: May 29, 2006, 04:21:24 pm »
Quote
manifacture stronger bodies for ourselves so we wont burn from space radiation while exploring




Quote
Skin of Metal and A body that will never age!

Just an example of what you are saying could get out of proportion.

operand

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Re: Transhumanism
« Reply #20 on: May 29, 2006, 04:49:09 pm »
Look Watcher... future technology will allow us to build bodies that look the same as the ones we have today but profoundly improved. I doubt that we, as humans will take up such crude bodies such as on your picture. If you want an interesting read on human body changes and improvements check this article: http://www.kurzweilai.net/meme/frame.html?main=/articles/art0551.html

Hassan i Sabbah

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Re: Transhumanism
« Reply #21 on: May 29, 2006, 05:57:32 pm »
Hooray for General Ludd!!
 \\o// \\o// \\o// \\o// \\o//

Grimnir42

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Re: Transhumanism
« Reply #22 on: May 30, 2006, 12:07:47 am »
Did I hear mention of "the world's most dangerous idea"? Hitancrias has the right concept; we love to push ourselves to our limits, and if we use technology to extend those limits, it will be an easy break for a short time before we rediscover challenge, excitement that takes us to the brink of death, all that good stuff in life.

Remember, there are a lot of different approaches to enhancement, because as very complex beings, there is a lot that could be altered. There are alterations that are outrageously stupid and wrong, for instance The Guilt-Free Soldier. Guilt is an important behavior regulator. Transhumanism is about extending our humanity, not detracting from it, and so the neural stuff is the danger zone. The Center for Cognitive Liberty is a good place to go for that sort of thing, and in the AI department, the Singularity Institute may too become very significant.

Of course, most of us prefer mody modification, to jump higher, or to soar! To be the like the Ousters of Endymion, gliding on the solar winds, not destroying our ecosystem but extending it to other worlds, warming the cold vacuum of space itself...

Remember Clark's [first] Law: "Any sufficiently advanced technology is indistinguishable from magic." We have taken many steps towards becoming the Mages of Old. We can speak to each other instantly wherever we are [telepathy], we can level mountains, we can cure plague, we can create lightning.

If this technology isn't encouraged, it will be pushed underground, developed in the hands of questionable people. Anyone who has read their fantasy books knows some basic principles
1) There shouldn't be a [techno-magically] powerful elite (we should distribute the opportunity democratically)
2) As magic can be dangerous there should always be a place where it isn't allowed (Luddite haven)
3)Some magic is good, some is bad, and most depends on the person using it (serious regulation is necessary, psychological testing etc.)


...I could go on for hours, so I'll stop here. I run a club at my university that discusses all of these things and much more. We recently had James Hughes speak on the current politics of Transhumanism (he is the Director of the World Transhumanist Association). It's nice to know we have a Buddhist leading this movement.

More websites for those interested, not all of which anyone will agree with:
http://www.changesurfer.com/
http://www.futurehi.net/
http://www.xeromag.com/extropy.html
http://www.cydaily.com/
http://www.betterhumans.com/
http://jetpress.org/
http://www.nickbostrom.com/
« Last Edit: May 30, 2006, 12:18:54 am by Grimnir42 »

StarsAndBars_1018

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Re: Transhumanism
« Reply #23 on: June 09, 2006, 02:38:17 am »
Transhumanism: n.)
  1. is the love child of the Heaven's Gate cult, and a nerdy hacker kid with too much time on his hands.
  2. bears a resemblance to Scientology.
  3. assumes that technology will overcome the human condition, something that thousands of years of philosophy, culture and civilization have NEVER been able to do.

This, as copied from the Encyclopedia of What-The-Heck-Is-This-Crap.

I consider myself a skeptic at best.
#43: Choose and judge your leaders, also called guardians, thus: Those who seek always to limit the power of government are of good heart and conscience. Those who seek to expand the power of government are base tyrants.

operand

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Re: Transhumanism
« Reply #24 on: June 13, 2006, 03:43:44 pm »
StarsAndBars_1018, please do some reading before posting such comments.

Baldur

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Re: Transhumanism
« Reply #25 on: June 13, 2006, 04:25:01 pm »
Transhumanism: n.)
  1. is the love child of the Heaven's Gate cult, and a nerdy hacker kid with too much time on his hands.
  2. bears a resemblance to Scientology.
  3. assumes that technology will overcome the human condition, something that thousands of years of philosophy, culture and civilization have NEVER been able to do.

This, as copied from the Encyclopedia of What-The-Heck-Is-This-Crap.

I consider myself a skeptic at best.
That's a flame at best...

WiseKran

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Re: Transhumanism
« Reply #26 on: June 15, 2006, 01:18:26 am »
The day people start looking like this...


Is a day I no longer want to be alive

Farewell Moogie, Farewell Draklar, Farewell Drey. you will be missed.

Karyuu

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Re: Transhumanism
« Reply #27 on: June 15, 2006, 01:20:27 am »
What are you talking about, that's awesome xD

To be born human and die a cyborg <3
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Robinmagus

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Re: Transhumanism
« Reply #28 on: June 15, 2006, 01:58:10 am »
Not a fan of technology. I'd much rather be in an actual forum like the romans than in front of a screen...

The only peice of technology I find necisarry is the plow..and shovel...maybe even axe. And a damn spell check. Necisarry? What the hell...
Talamir - DeT, Dark Empire, etc, etc, etc.

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Re: Transhumanism
« Reply #29 on: June 15, 2006, 01:59:56 am »
An interesting discussion this is.   Thinking about the pros and cons, I say, maybe.  I think its a bit early to decide one way or the other about this.  So I will keep an open mind until science advances to the point where more of these things are possible.

Also, anyone else read any of this and kept having pictures pop in your head of the show 'Ghost in the Shell'?  Or maybe either of the movies?  I guess I should find a link for those not fond of what GitS is.....here

And if Karyuu gets to be a cyborg, I want to be a kitty.  Now then, who's going to scratch behind my ears?