I wanna see advisor-points!..

[zorbels]

I think it is a great idea.

But....

What if you did answer the question correctly and did well but the person still clicked no? Maybe out of spite or just because they didn't know any better.  Would you lose the advisor point? Also people would log on as alt just to ask themselves questions so they could click yes to every question .... maybe? Unless that can be prevented? 

[neko kyouran]

The alt thing, I think would be solved by a simple /report of either the asker, or the one doing the answers (probably be better if it was done on the one answering, or both).  A petition could then be made and the logs reviewed.  Should the gms/devs decide that this was going on, they can remove do what they feel neccessary to stop this person from doing this.  This would work, and it wouldn't be gm dependant since anyone on the advisor channel could so the /report command so it could be effectively monitored for "cheating" easily.

About putting the availability of awarding points into the hands of the one asking the questoins.  I like this idea, and I do believe it has come up before as a possible solution.  Here is what I see going wrong,  the new player asks for the solution to a quest, the advisor says sorry can't tell you, its against the rules.  the pop up box comes up, the new player selects no since he felt the answer given wasn't good, even though it was the right answer (but to the new player, the only right answer was the solution to the quest).  Now the advisor should get a point for helping as they did everything right.  But under this system they wouldn't.  So I propose an expansion on this idea:

Should the advisor not get awarded a point for helping and if they feel that they should for what ever reasons, the advisor should be able to dispute this.  I see this by allowing the advisor to mark thier session for review (by gms/devs)  in which, the gm/dev would be able to review the help session, determine if a point should be awarded, and hand it out if it was indeed earned.  This also wouldn't require a gm/dev to be on athe time, as if done right, once a session is marked for review, it can be stored somewheres to be looked at at a time when is most convient for a gm/dev. 

Tying that in with the auto logging of the /report command being discussed in the other thread, if all chat is logged like proposed in said thread, the saving of the help session would be very feasible, since the chat is being logged anyway. 

And thats my thoughts on that for awhile.

[AryHann]

I think Vengeance's idea was something that also Talad suggested when the points were removed from being visible.

It is a nice idea, but of course, flaws might happen so its design should be studied accurately.

[Kerol]

By hearing Vengeance' idea, I need to think at the ebay "reputation system".
It allows a "yes - neutral - no" but counting the "votes" not as +1, 0, -1 points but as three seperated statistics.
That would differenciate out the system a lot, amplifying the use for GMs (the current and only usage of the points), but if they were in open statistics again, one could really find out the quality of the advisors. This system however would make the mental impact of negative counting even bigger to what we have now, as people actually can see the negative ones (now those are kinda hidden). And with that a review/dispute option as suggested by kyouran would make even more sense.

I don't see Zorbels' fear of having alts as questioner and advisors to boost the points, as there is a big chance that another advisors takes over the session, plus /report by other advisors. In that context however I find it important to make it possible (maybe only for advisors) to see who is advising at the moment, a /advisorlist command.

[Darkblade]

Out of this thread, I insist on the /advisorlist command. After all, I do kinda want to know how many others are currently advisors, if I'm the only one, if there's fifty others.. Right now, you simply don't know.

[Syilph]

\o/ Vengeance! That is a great ideea!
And Zorbels, I don't think that loosing one or more APs would be such a great deal. If people advise to help others points don't mater that much or at all. When the APs were implemented I never bothered to look at those but I always got surprised by others coming to me and telling me that i'm the 1st or 2nd best advisor (points concerned). Besides I think that people who would not award the advisor that helped them the point, would loose intherest from that advisor so the next time they have a question, that will fall on deaf ears. So I think it is preety safe to asume that they won't do that unless the quality of the advice is really bad.

[zanzibar]

If people advise to help others points don't mater that much or at all.

I've overheard too many conversations with people bragging about how many advisor points they have... trust me, the points matter to some people.  Just look at why this thread was started.

[Osmo]

The only problem with a yes/no is that a lot of new people ask questions they should allready know, or for answers advisors can't give.

For example:

How do I get out of the DR?

Response:  It is best to ask a fellow player that is in the DR and to RP the current situation. 

The guy asking is going to answer NO, I didn't answer his question.  I didn't tell him out to directly get out of the DR.

But YES, I did advise him of the correction action to take.

Most people would just assume the advisor is just giving them the brush off, when in reality it is the correct thing to say.

This happened to me earlier today.  The guy responded with; "You are kidding right?"

I responded: "PS encourages RPing and you will find a helpful community of active RPers that can help you."

One of those correct answers, but not what the person wanted to hear.
It will be the same with the quest answers question.

[TestLab]

Limit how many points u can get a day ? No matter what answer you give (as the YES/NO will never be a right option). Then you can see who is doing it just for the points ... by checking how many times they've helped after their daily allowance has been reached (Just need stats logs and a couple of reports)

[zorbels]

If people advise to help others points don't mater that much or at all.

I've overheard too many conversations with people bragging about how many advisor points they have... trust me, the points matter to some people.  Just look at why this thread was started.

This is my thought exactly. I am not concerned, but I feel others would be.

As for my post, those were merely idea's that first popped into my head as I read Vengeance post. They are not fears of mine. Just simple questions that could be problems to this system. I couldn't care less if we had advisor points or not, as I do my helping player in the game in character. Not on the help channel.

[neko kyouran]

The only problem with a yes/no is that a lot of new people ask questions they should allready know, or for answers advisors can't give.

For example:

How do I get out of the DR?

Response:  It is best to ask a fellow player that is in the DR and to RP the current situation. 

The guy asking is going to answer NO, I didn't answer his question.  I didn't tell him out to directly get out of the DR.

But YES, I did advise him of the correction action to take.

Most people would just assume the advisor is just giving them the brush off, when in reality it is the correct thing to say.

This happened to me earlier today.  The guy responded with; "You are kidding right?"

I responded: "PS encourages RPing and you will find a helpful community of active RPers that can help you."

One of those correct answers, but not what the person wanted to hear.
It will be the same with the quest answers question.

I suggested a solution to this a bit earlier in the thread....

"About putting the availability of awarding points into the hands of the one asking the questoins.  I like this idea, and I do believe it has come up before as a possible solution.  Here is what I see going wrong,  the new player asks for the solution to a quest, the advisor says sorry can't tell you, its against the rules.  the pop up box comes up, the new player selects no since he felt the answer given wasn't good, even though it was the right answer (but to the new player, the only right answer was the solution to the quest).  Now the advisor should get a point for helping as they did everything right.  But under this system they wouldn't.  So I propose an expansion on this idea:

Should the advisor not get awarded a point for helping and if they feel that they should for what ever reasons, the advisor should be able to dispute this.  I see this by allowing the advisor to mark thier session for review (by gms/devs)  in which, the gm/dev would be able to review the help session, determine if a point should be awarded, and hand it out if it was indeed earned.  This also wouldn't require a gm/dev to be on athe time, as if done right, once a session is marked for review, it can be stored somewheres to be looked at at a time when is most convient for a gm/dev.  "

Edit:  @Zorbels, I wasn't implying they were.  Just trying to answer your questions with what I would think would be a decent solution to the situations you brought up.

[Janner]

Whatever you decide to do it should be made clear when you are allowed  to clam a session, at the moment every time i log in someone is claiming long and short answers, and the biggest culprit is a high GM. So i don't expect players to abide by the rules if a person in that position does it.

[zorbels]

Edit:  @Zorbels, I wasn't implying they were.  Just trying to answer your questions with what I would think would be a decent solution to the situations you brought up.

Umm .... I think we have a misunderstanding. My post wasn't directed at you or anything you said in your post. 

[Syilph]

What the death realm is wrong with claiming a session? The quality of that advice is what maters. IF you know the answer to a question claim it 10 times. It is better to claim a session and take your time typing a long and helpfull answer than typing a short answer for the sake of 1 AP.

PS: I think I'm not the GM Janner is talking about 

[Tarel]

Whatever you decide to do it should be made clear when you are allowed  to clam a session, at the moment every time i log in someone is claiming long and short answers, and the biggest culprit is a high GM. So i don't expect players to abide by the rules if a person in that position does it.

I am not that kind of GM too. I claim the questions, when no one else is answering them, or when advisors are not allowed to answer the question.
I personally don't care about advisorpoints and how much i got of them.
i can't see them too, like all players.
You can better give a good answer, when you claim a question and not claim a question, when you are only an Advisory Pointshunter and give crap answers.
This was a reason to remove the AP's from sight, to stop the AP-hunters.