The Team and the Community

[DermorianJeston]

... or the even more bothersome "the devs do everything and have no faults so shut up"...

Whats there to be offended about? If someone is just making claims that are untrue or they really have no idea, then nothing to get offended about.

I don't recall anyone saying that the devs have no faults and I certainly was not offended by anything anyone said. Annoyed? Yes.

So answer me this Valbrandr. What is so wrong with defending a group of developers, who give as much as they have, when someone comes along and shouts about how they need to do more and do it right now? Why shouldn't we be grateful for what they have given us, free of charge?

[Capprion]

you did not ask me but ill give you an answer. nothings wrong about being appreciative twords the devz. nothing at all.......i personally just hate it when people get on all 4's and pucker up thayer lips n await the devs to pull down thayer pants and bend over so they can give it a nice brown-noser kiss  its kind of sad pothetic and even if i was a dev it wouldnt like it much.

[Valbrandr]

I don't recall anyone saying that the devs have no faults and I certainly was not offended by anything anyone said. Annoyed? Yes.

So answer me this Valbrandr. What is so wrong with defending a group of developers, who give as much as they have, when someone comes along and shouts about how they need to do more and do it right now? Why shouldn't we be grateful for what they have given us, free of charge?

For one, who are you? How long have you been here? And what have you seen? I would say those are three good questions. So much has happened within planeshift and if you havent been here long you might just think that everything is just fine.  And i never said we shouldnt be grateful and that the devs dont work hard.  That has nothing to do with my arguement. What has happened in the past, even when valid points have been brought up.. someone within the community tells the person he/she is wrong or that they shouldnt question what happens here. And these are not even the devs or GMs or anything like that. Many are people who are just merely stopping in because the devs have made something nice here.

I made a statement earlier about the lack of community these days. And I beleive it has something to do with the older players feeling neglected in a way with the influx of new players.. which will continue to happen. But with the smaller amount of people before, we were a closer nit group that was an actual community. But that has kind of gone away. The Close nit group seems to be gone, replaced by people who are coming to PS as it becomes more like many of the finer polished MMOs. They are here to just play and have fun but not get involved personally with the game itself. When you reach this point we can have a better conversation.

In that community I spoke of, "we" had influence. If we felt strongly about one thing or another, there could be some reconciling... I am not saying we "forced" anyone to do anything.. but we had the power of influence before. Now because of the way the community has splintered, its not as prevalent of a voice.

Edit: Sorry didnt read it at first. Capprion- Agreed

[DermorianJeston]

you did not ask me but ill give you an answer. nothings wrong about being appreciative twords the devz. nothing at all.......i personally just hate it when people get on all 4's and pucker up thayer lips n await the devs to pull down thayer pants and bend over so they can give it a nice brown-noser kiss  its kind of sad pothetic and even if i was a dev it wouldnt like it much.

Surely you are not insinuating that I have done this? Can someone not show their appreciation without being called a brown-noser? I've never kissed anyones ass in my life and I dont plan to start now. I just appreciate the ability to be able to play this game in it's current state. If you read more into my words than that, then you need some serious help my friend.

For one, who are you?

Just a guy who got tired of listening to someone whine and moan about how this game isnt everything they thought it should be. Anyways, what does it matter who I am? Just because you have been here longer than me does not make your opinion any more valid.

How long have you been here? And what have you seen?... So much has happened within planeshift and if you havent been here long you might just think that everything is just fine.

See above. Again, what does it matter? To answer, I just recently found out about this game, but plan on hearing my opinion for a long time to come. Did you honestly expect that things would stay the same, when you have thousands of people signed up and hundreds that actually play on a daily basis? How could they possibly address everyone issues like before?

...someone within the community tells the person he/she is wrong or that they shouldnt question what happens here. And these are not even the devs or GMs or anything like that. Many are people who are just merely stopping in because the devs have made something nice here.

Perhaps you did not read my posts. I have said, and I quote, "Questioning things is essential, but you were not questioning, you were DEMANDING" ("you" of course referring to Datruth).

I made a statement earlier about the lack of community these days. And I beleive it has something to do with the older players feeling neglected in a way with the influx of new players.. which will continue to happen. But with the smaller amount of people before, we were a closer nit group that was an actual community. But that has kind of gone away.

I completly see where you are coming from. However, that does not mean that the older players should be able to make demands and be a general PItA. Things change man, and as more people become aware of this game, expect it to change alot more.

They are here to just play and have fun but not get involved personally with the game itself. When you reach this point we can have a better conversation.

Please forgive me if I took this out of context, but that second sentence sounds a bit elitist to me. Can you only have an inteligent conversation with long time members of this community?

I may have only just found this game/community recently, but that does not make my opinion any less valid.

Edited for language. --Karyuu

[Valbrandr]

Surely you are not insinuating that I have done this? Can someone not show their appreciation without being called a brown-noser? I've never kissed anyones ass in my life and I dont plan to start now. I just appreciate the ability to be able to play this game in it's current state. If you read more into my words than that, then you need some serious help my friend. Roll Eyes

Dont read into anything.. I never said that it was you. I was talking about it in general.

Anyways, what does it matter who I am? Just because you have been here longer than me does not make your opinion any more valid.

Actually it does in regard to my own statements. I believe that Datruth is new as well correct? But my original post would make more sense if you were here longer. We have went through alot in two years.

Please forgive me if I took this out of context, but that second sentence sounds a bit elitist to me. Can you only have an inteligent conversation with long time members of this community?

Elitist? wow full circle here. When "we" got here 2 years ago we had to fight for the very same things. You havent been here of course so you wouldnt know what has happened. You dont understand what has happened to the political makeup of PS because you just havent been here. Its not an attack or anything just stating the truth. 

Sorry to have to give the "when I was young" speech.. but when we got here there were a group of individuals who thought they were "special".. thankfully beause of this change, many of those people left. Most of the "oldbies" that are still here are the good people that were not the elitists.  And just to clarify, I am not an "oldbie", Im more or less a "Middlebie" ... With people like Jekkar, Lordbug, Zan and obviously many others. These are mostly people who got here toward the end of the MB days or the beginning of the CB days. My point is, is that you dont know me.

But lets get back on topic about the community and how its stayed the same/ changed in the time we have been here. I dont want the thread to close so soon .

[Karyuu]

Can I ask for concrete examples of the voice players had two years ago and the voice they have now?

[Datruth]

DermorianJeston:

1) We do not have hundreds logging in on a daily basis, get your facts strait.

2) I did demand, you're making me seem bad for being DEMANDING, but incase you didn't know, CERTAIN things have to be demanded, so don't say i was wrong in DEMANDING a voice for the players and player input.

How else can you achieve that goal, without demanding it, ask nicely?

So do you walk in front of a monarch and ask for his throne?

Please dermorian, read my stuff before you comment about me, it shows your lack of knowledge about my stance when you comment.

[Karyuu]

If you ask a monarch for his throne, you will get laughed at. If you demand it, you get your head cut off.

But we're not that savage ;}

You're in no position to demand anything. We love player input, but demands put you in another category entirely. We owe you nothing except the promise that we will put out work of the best quality we can achieve.

You want more merchants in Ojaveda? So do we. Can we make it happen immediately? No. What else is the problem? What is it that you want? Specifically, and none of that -I want the players to be heard- generality. What is it that you are specifically asking for the devs to listen about? We are here, and we are listening. What now?

[Datruth]

If you ask a monarch for his throne, you will get laughed at. If you demand it, you get your head cut off.

But we're not that savage ;}

You're in no position to demand anything. We love player input, but demands put you in another category entirely. We owe you nothing except the promise that we will put out work of the best quality we can achieve.

You want more merchants in Ojaveda? So do we. Can we make it happen immediately? No. What else is the problem? What is it that you want? Specifically, and none of that -I want the players to be heard- generality. What is it that you are specifically asking for the devs to listen about? We are here, and we are listening. What now?

I want you to give up the mentality listed above that has been underlined.


And i am getting my head cut off, just look at this thread, peoplle attacking left and right, and you yourself who starts to mudsling, you can't consider that kind of treatment proper or the way intelligent people should converse with one another.

[Karyuu]

Thanks, but no thanks. This is our game and we build it how we want. 100% satisfaction or your money back

[Datruth]

Thanks, but no thanks. This is our game and we build it how we want. 100% satisfaction or your money back

You have to admit, atleast this thread made people more active in the forums, just look at the priority it's getting by the players.

Wonder why?

Because the one lifeline of planseshift, THE PLAYERS, are listening to ideas and asking themselves, "Hey wait, why is that? Why can't I?"

IF all this was for nothing, i can atleast say, we know our positions, testers, and we know yours, Hard working Supreme rulers.

We should not Ask, nor demand for change, and if we have an idea... put in in the wish list...........

We should just play the game, no need to ask for change, change will come in time, as dictated by the higher ups.

Till then, Go to the gold mine and dig away.

[Karyuu]

This thread did not raise activity in the forum. All it did was make the devs notice it and reply with how much they dislike your approach. I don't think that's a win.

Yes, you do know your positions. Guess what, everyone knew before you, and we didn't get threads going -OMG I'm just a tester! Change that right now!- until you came along. This is the purpose of the community. Tester first, player second.

Are you unhappy about this? Maybe you should look for another game. This is how this one works. You can't expect yourself to waltz in here and change everything around.

And you still haven't answered my question: what is it that you specifically want the devs to do? You have a voice, and you are making general demands such as "listen to it". But what do you want? If the devs were building the game to your every whim, what would you ask of them?

[Datruth]

If you ask a monarch for his throne, you will get laughed at. If you demand it, you get your head cut off.


You're in no position to demand anything. We love player input, but demands put you in another category entirely. We owe you nothing except the promise that we will put out work of the best quality we can achieve.

I want you to give up the mentality listed above that has been underlined.

I want a way for players to influence the result of the game, to add input, to make it hand by hand with the devs.

You could start off with making the NPC's a bit smarter, stopping the fall off the world bug, and making 2 portals at the end of the death realm, one that leads to hydlaa, one to oja.

All i want is for you to listen to the players and implement what the majority wants.

Funny suggesting huh

[Valbrandr]

Yeah but I bet the majority would turn this into a power levelers paradise... The majority is not always right.. though it would be nice if they were . (in a perfect world)

[Santiago]

We should not Ask, nor demand for change, and if we have an idea... put in in the wish list...........

We should just play the game, no need to ask for change, change will come in time, as dictated by the higher ups.

Till then, Go to the gold mine and dig away.

He understands! Now that that's done, who is going to lock this?